Idea - a coordinated group?

[Rycaut]

So just had the semi-idle thought about getting together with a bunch of fellow regulars at our local PFS game nights and building a party that is designed to synchronize together.

Instead of trying for some ideal balance my thought experiment is "what feats/classes/races" could we take that get better and stronger together?

Obviously Teamwork feats become far more useful and potent if the whole party takes them (or if the whole party are Cavaliers or Inquisitors or other archetypes focused on teamwork feats)

But what else becomes stronger when you know you can usually rely on your allies having complimentary feats or abilities?

Archetypes that grant typeless bonuses are one possible approach (freebooter rangers?)

Halflings with their various jinxes/luck granting are another. As might be witches (I don't think however a PFS party could form a coven) or bards (though their performances wouldn't stack with each other) or certain clerical domains.

I could see an all Halfling party being fairly fun (with some cavaliers on dogs etc)

What else?

[Yiroep]

Have everyone be a tiefling with Fiend Sight twice, so all of you can see in magical darkness, and then when you have deeper darkness just use it in every single battle. You basically can become a bunch of "dark stalkers" that way, and any dark stalkers that fight you are going to be very, very sad (not to mention a LOT of other things that will be even more sad).

Everyone be a class that has some sort of eidolon/companion/familiar and flood the battlefield? That sounds kind of not fun, though.

[Reshar]

Don't forget to add a bard to the group...

[Artanthos]

Have a bladebound kensai with butterfly sting/scimitar and a barbarian with a scythe.

Have 2 fighters with fauchard + seize the moment. For extra fun, add a dervish dance cleric and a dervish dance bard(feat, not archetype), each with seize the moment.

[Chalk Microbe]

If you do that, I would suggest running these as home games.

Or ask your store coordinator if they want to supply you and your 5 friends with a GM every gameday.

[Furious Kender]

I have ran for coordinated groups at cons before. They are no trouble

[Rycaut]

Well I'm usually the DM and generally I don't have a problem with a coordinated group. For one it helps ensure that likely every player will be involved more often.

I like the party of Tieflings with Fiend Sight. I was hoping to see ideas like that over simpler two character combos like the butterfly sting & barbarian with scythe which while effective isn't really a whole party being coordinated.

[Yiroep]

There are tons of other coordinated things you can do that don't involve the full party, especially with a witch. Have the witch have great initiative and evil eye stuff, and then have another character with great initiative do save-or-sucks. Perhaps combine that with spell comboes, slow + hold person/monster = a very hard to escape hold, and then maybe have a rogue coup-de-grace spam.

Maybe have a Thundercaller bard stun things and have rogues go in sneak attack, eventually getting Dastardly Finish to kill off stunned things.

And while that's going on, have a reposition fighter to line up those baddies for an area spell, or into a pit. The new feat Tactical Reposition is awesome for combined party dynamics.

[Matt Haddix]

I saw a group that all had fogcutting lenses and would absolutely murder things while under cover of obscuring mist.

[Yiroep]

Matt Haddix wrote:

I saw a group that all had fogcutting lenses and would absolutely murder things while under cover of obscuring mist.

There's also the strictly better, same price Goz Mask except head slot instead of face.

[Ameriko "The Mist"]

Yiroep wrote:

There's also the strictly better, same price Goz Mask except head slot instead of face.

And 1 level of oracle of waves to do it for freeeeee :D

[Nimon]

You mentioned Teamwork feats so I would say a Cavalier would be a good choice, a Honor Guard of the Dragon Order would really add some nice Aid Another bonuses too.

[Yiroep]

Honor Guard/Tactician "Helpful" trait Cavalier, be a halfling and take Blundering Defense, get a mount with the "aid" trick and make it eventually adopted by halflings via extra traits (you adopted it, after all), maybe a level dip or a few in monk as well as bard, getting Banner of the Ancient Kings eventually to count as a level 5 bard for +2 inspire courage and also the +2 flag bonus, and then buy tons of benevolent weapons and armor for both you and your mount! You're an aiding machine!

[Rycaut]

Again I'm less interested in single character or pair of character builds than I am in concepts that would work for a full party. So not just "teamwork" feats but what would a party of characters built to leverage teamwork feats look like? Possibly all cavaliers (perhaps with an inquisitor) or possibly just built with teamwork feats.

My thinking as well is that there are likely a few concepts that if everyone in a party sacrificed say a first or third level feat might result in a highly effective party. Basic version a everyone takes the Lookout teamwork feat. I'm sure however there are superior group bios suggestions.

[TwilightKnight]

Just remember that PFS scenarios are typically written with the average (or slightly above) party in mind. While a well-built, class ability/feat/skill/etc-synchronous group can be a lot of fun to play, you will more than likely have trouble finding challenging encounters. You could easily increase, though aid/buff effects, your modifiers to +25, +50, even +100% of what is average at your level making mechanical challenges (combat, social, traps, etc) nearly auto-successes. Might not be as fun as you hoped over time.

[Ron Lundeen]

Around here, I've seen a group of three witches that travel together. They all have the sleep and misfortune hexes and scythes (to coup de grace sleeping foes), so they make pretty short work of many--but not all--encounters.

[Curaigh]

'Tis almost a single person trick, but coordinating a bunch of reach-weapon martial types or bull rushes types with my entangle would be fun. Entangle is a fun spell but can get a lot of groans from the table if melee types don't have reach/ranged options so coordination would be nice.

[Finlanderboy]

A Gnome Sorcerer with spell focus illusion that uses color spray
A Gnome Heavens oracle with spell focus illusion that uses color spray
A Gnome Cleric of whimsy with spell focus illusion that uses color spray
A Gnome Wizard with spell focus illusion that uses color spray

Then the non-oracles can dip into heavens oracle.

Then one rogue to coupe de graz.

An idea my friend brought to me.

[Benrislove]

Finlanderboy wrote:

A Gnome Sorcerer with spell focus illusion that uses color spray

A Gnome Heavens oracle with spell focus illusion that uses color spray
A Gnome Cleric of whimsy with spell focus illusion that uses color spray
A Gnome Wizard with spell focus illusion that uses color spray

Then the non-oracles can dip into heavens oracle.

Then one rogue to coupe de graz.

An idea my friend brought to me.

and lose to a zombie :)

[Funky Badger]

1 Fighter
4 Spontaneous casters

Each spontaneous caster has (at first level) a buff spell which they use on the fighter, and a direct damage spell they use on the baddies.

Rock and roll.

More invasive version.

Everyone takes 1 level of diviner, and Lookout.

Everyone always takes full-round actions during suprise rounds now, as long as they are adjacent with each other.

[Altus Lucrim]

Something that I've seen be exceptionally effective is if two friends who frequently play together make characters that complement each other and take care of one aspect of combat. For instance a gunslinger and an Alchemist, they work together because they both target touch armor and do lots of ranged damage, and all you really have to ask for is a good tank.

[Caderyn]

Benrislove wrote:

Finlanderboy wrote:

A Gnome Sorcerer with spell focus illusion that uses color spray

A Gnome Heavens oracle with spell focus illusion that uses color spray
A Gnome Cleric of whimsy with spell focus illusion that uses color spray
A Gnome Wizard with spell focus illusion that uses color spray

Then the non-oracles can dip into heavens oracle.

Then one rogue to coupe de graz.

An idea my friend brought to me.

and lose to a zombie :)

Not if the Sorcerer is undead bloodline as then he counts the zombie as a human for the purposes of mind effecting spells like color spray

[Rycaut]

Generally I find that more recent scenarios in PFS are quite challenging. And remember that season 4 is designed for parties of 6 (with rules to adjust difficulty downward for parties of 4). Furthermore I'm not thinking about a group that is fully optimized. Rather a group that uses elements that are less frequently seen such as teamwork feats to do things otherwise hard to do.

[WalterGM]

My gf's first worlder summoner is going to invest in a wand of prayer or several luckstones to doll out between the party so that her summoned pugwampis only debuff the baddies.

Our current combination of "butterfly sting + high crit multiplier weapon" is my duelist and her kensai magus with a flying blade. I think that currently she rolls something like 33d6 + 3d8 thundering + like 84? It gets dumb.

Curaigh wrote:

'Tis almost a single person trick, but coordinating a bunch of reach-weapon martial types or bull rushes types with my entangle would be fun. Entangle is a fun spell but can get a lot of groans from the table if melee types don't have reach/ranged options so coordination would be nice.

A higher level druid can pull this off nicely. entangle + plant growth to jack up that DC, and give everyone a communal air walk or freedom of movement on your frontliners. If you fly over them and drop your gale aura, it becomes really difficult for any baddies to get out of your soon to be kill box.

[Quindo]

Bob Jonquet wrote:

Just remember that PFS scenarios are typically written with the average (or slightly above) party in mind. While a well-built, class ability/feat/skill/etc-synchronous group can be a lot of fun to play, you will more than likely have trouble finding challenging encounters. You could easily increase, though aid/buff effects, your modifiers to +25, +50, even +100% of what is average at your level making mechanical challenges (combat, social, traps, etc) nearly auto-successes. Might not be as fun as you hoped over time.

These groups can always attempt to play high tier to provide more challenge.

Me and a group of other players had just played through gods mouth heresy and BARELY managed to avoid a Party Kill on the last combat. (every one but the cleric and wizard unconscious for 8 rounds or feared for 2 rounds)

However, we decided to play silent tide after we leveled all the characters up. we had 2 lvl threes, 3 lvl twos, and a lvl 1. We played high tier and it was actually challenging due to the time constraints in the combat. But because we all knew the other players styles and mechanics we were able to easily beat it due to it being a season 0.

By playing high tier, provided the PC's do not die, will end up giving the team a even larger advantage once they get to the 9-11 tier. However, if too many of the PC's die then the other characters become weaker.

[Yiroep]

Thread necromancy!

Thought of another idea. An entire party of half-orcs with sacred tattoo (+1 Luck Bonus to saves, replaces Orc Ferocity), and have a First World summoner who summons pugwampis. Everyone in the party is immune to their aura because they all have luck bonuses!

[Zach W.]

Cavalier of the Shield (Honor Guard) With Combat Reflexes+Bodyguard+Shield Wall

This individual is of course the tank of the party and will use Shield Wall, tower shields, and bodyguard to help those in combat stay alive.

Cavalier of the Dragon (Luring Cavalier) Ranged Comabt/support Enfilading Fire Teamwork Feat

Ranged physical combat specialist and support. Due to the Dragons Challange ability not helping him in melee, he can freely challange to grant his allies the bonus, and take advantage of their flankings.

Paladin (Holy Tactitian) (combat bruiser/support)

Close combat support and damage dealer.

Roge Knife Master (DPS)

Sorta says it all in what the class is.

Magus Bladebound (standard barer)

The standard barer aspect is optional here but this class provides arcane casting and if all part of the same faction, they can take Banner Barer feat from Inner Sea World Guide to provide +1 to attack and damage to everyone.

Cleric

Standard cleric.

[Jiggy]

How about a table full of melee types with Outflank, Combat Reflexes, Gang Up, and some keen weapons?

All but the last guy move up to the enemy and ready an action to attack once they're all adjacent to the enemy. Last guy gets there, and everyone attacks. Thanks to Gang Up, they all count as flanking. Thanks to Outflank, they all get +4 instead of +2 for said flank. Thanks to keen weapons, they all threaten on a 15+. If any one of them confirms, then thanks to Outflank everyone else gets an AoO. Thanks to being a party of six (ideally), that's five AoO's, so decently likely to get another crit. Thanks to Combat Reflexes, that whole debaucle can happen multiple times per round.

Ideally, the weapons would be +1 keen agile rapiers or +1 keen scimitars with everyone also having Dervish Dance.

[nosig]

Everyone running an Alchemist... Different Archtypes maybe, but picture the monter steps out and 6 bombs hit it... or even beside it.

Or worse yet, Undead monster steps out and 6 flasks of holy water that do 1+INT splash damage. Something like 6+24 to 30 damage on the first turn... and that's if they all miss.

[Luthril]

Here is a crazy idea... Wizard, Rogue, Paladin, Cleric...and whatever else you want... sit around and design them together. Cover all your bases. The classics never get old.

[Yiroep]

Luthril wrote:

Here is a crazy idea... Wizard, Rogue, Paladin, Cleric...and whatever else you want... sit around and design them together. Cover all your bases. The classics never get old.

What? No! That's preposterous! Whoever does that anymore? You need to have some gimmick or your party isn't cool! </sarcasm>

[nosig]

Luthril wrote:

Here is a crazy idea... Wizard, Rogue, Paladin, Cleric...and whatever else you want... sit around and design them together. Cover all your bases. The classics never get old.

I'm currently in the middle of an EotT game, we were a Wizard, Cleric, Ranger (archer), and Fighter (melee) when we went looking for more PCs. We settled on a Bard and an Druid to fill the party out.

Races are a Dwarf, an Elf, two humans, a halfling, and a half-elf... Lots of fun here! But we're a coordinated group - with tactics that overlap and depend on each other. So far... No deaths. Only one Breath of Life needed so far... and mostly we have handled the encounters easily... mostly.

[Dazgrim]

6 Aasimar Paladins? All in heavy armour with greatswords.

[Rycaut]

I like the idea of a party of Lucky half-orcs and summoning pugwampis.

Only issue is that eventually it will stop being all that useful - so might be fun to find other synergies for such a party (half-orcs are a lot of fun and very flexible so I could easily see a whole party of them being fun to play)

[Doctor Smite]

Jiggy wrote:

How about a table full of melee types with Outflank, Combat Reflexes, Gang Up, and some keen weapons?

Our PFS group of Hellknights does this but with Fauchards and paired opportunist as well ... plus some shared teamwork feats to complicate things further. We have fun but I think we hurt judges brains... it gets too complicated.