
Angelo Fortunato |

Angelo Fortunato |

Out of curiosity, and as a token of my interest, I made a little list of complete-ish submissions.
Me - Angelo Fortunato, M Archon-Blooded Synthesist 1/Monk (Maneuver Master) 1; Synthesist 2/Ranger (Trapper) 1; Synthesist 6/Ninja 4
Pezmerga - Jeska Green, F Demon Spawn Bard (arcane duelist)/Fighter (rondelero) 6
Theinyore - Apphonse Gregori, M Half-Elf Soulknife 5/Aegis 5; Elocater 1/Aegis 6
Rocan - Arama Blackclaw, M Oread Druid (Lion Shaman)/Rogue (Scout) 6
Stiehl9s - Rost'Nomn Itael, M Aasimar Mighty godling 6/dark tapestry oracle 6
I need to pick traits now too.

Hawktitan |

I created a gestalt fighter ranger. Specializing in bullrushing, and TWF sword+board - or as I like to call it: Help I need more feats! :)
Chaotic Good
Human Fighter (Two-Weapon Fighter) 6 / Ranger 6
Medium
Deity - Cayden Cailean
Init +5; Senses Perception +10
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Defense
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AC 25, touch 14, flat-footed 22 (+7 armor, +3 shield, +3 Dex, +1 natural, +1 deflection)
hp 78 (6d10+18)
Fort +9, Ref +10, Will +6 (+2 vs. fear); +2 trait bonus vs. illusion; +4 vs enviornment and suffocation
Defensive Abilities bravery +2, defensive flurry
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Offense
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Speed 30 ft.
Melee +1 Heavy Shield Bash +9/+4 (2d6+12/x2) and
. . +1 Shortsword +8 (1d6+5/19-20/x2)
Special Attacks twin blades +1
Ranger Spells Prepared (CL 3):
1 (2/day) Longstrider, Feather Step (DC 12)
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Statistics
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Str 21, Dex 16, Con 14, Int 12, Wis 12, Cha 7
Base Atk +6; CMB +11 (+15 Bull Rushing); CMD 25 (27 vs. Bull Rush)
Feats Boon Companion, Combat Reflexes (4 AoO/round), Double Slice, Endurance, Furious Focus, Greater Bull Rush, Improved Bull Rush, Improved Shield Bash, Improved Two-weapon Fighting, Power Attack -4/+8, Shield Slam, Two-weapon Fighting, Weapon Focus (Shield, Heavy), Weapon Specialization (Shield, Heavy)
Traits Indomitable Faith, Reactionary, Skeptic
Skills Acrobatics +0 (-4 jump), Climb +6, Escape Artist +0, Fly +0, Handle Animal +7, Heal +5, Intimidate +2, Knowledge (dungeoneering) +10, Knowledge (geography) +5, Knowledge (nature) +10, Perception +10, Ride +4, Stealth +9, Survival +10 (+13 to track), Swim +6 (+10 to resist nonlethal damage from exhaustion), Use Magic Device +4
Languages Common
Combat Gear Potion of enlarge person, Wand of cure light wounds, Wand of cure light wounds; Other Gear +1 Mithral Breastplate, +1 Bashing, Shield Spikes Heavy steel shield, +1 Shortsword, Amulet of natural armor +1, Belt of giant strength +2, Cloak of resistance +2, Handy haversack (1 @ 11.2 lbs), Ring of protection +1, 560 GP
SQ track, wild empathy
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Special Abilities
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Bravery +2 (Ex) +2 to Will save vs. Fear
Combat Reflexes (4 AoO/round) Can make extra attacks of opportunity/rd, and even when flat-footed.
Defensive Flurry +1 (Ex) +1 AC vs. melee when making a full-attack with both weapons.
Endurance +4 to a variety of skill checks. Sleep in L/M armor with no fatigue.
Greater Bull Rush When bull rushing, foe's movement provokes AoO from your allies.
Improved Bull Rush You don't provoke attacks of opportunity when bull rushing.
Improved Shield Bash You still get your shield bonus while using Shield Bash.
Power Attack -2/+4 You can subtract from your attack roll to add to your damage.
Shield Slam Shield Bash attack gives a free bull rush on a hit.
Skeptic +2 save vs. illusion.
Twin Blades +1 (Ex) +1 to hit and damage when making a full attack with both weapons.
Wild Empathy +4 (Ex) Improve the attitude of an animal, as if using Diplomacy.
Wolf
N Medium Animal
Init +3; Senses low-light vision, scent; Perception +10
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Defense
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AC 19, touch 13, flat-footed 16 (+3 Dex, +6 natural)
hp 60 (+12)
Fort +7, Ref +8, Will +3 (+4 morale bonus vs. Enchantment spells and effects)
Defensive Abilities evasion
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Offense
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Speed 50 ft.
Melee Bite (Wolf) +8 (1d6+4/x2)
Special Attacks trip
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Statistics
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Str 15, Dex 17, Con 15, Int 3, Wis 12, Cha 6
Base Atk +4; CMB +6; CMD 19 (23 vs. Trip)
Feats Furious Focus, Power Attack -2/+4, Weapon Focus (Bite)
Tricks Attack [Trick], Attack [Trick], Attack Any Target [Trick], Come [Trick], Defend [Trick], Down [Trick], Guard [Trick], Heel [Trick], Stay [Trick], Track [Trick]
Skills Acrobatics +3 (+11 jump), Perception +10 Modifiers +4 to survival when tracking by scent
Languages
SQ attack [trick], attack any target [trick], come [trick], defend [trick], devotion +4, down [trick], guard [trick], heel [trick], stay [trick], track [trick]
Other Gear Amulet of mighty fists +1, You have no money!
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Special Abilities
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+4 to Survival when tracking by Scent +4 to Survival when tracking by Scent.
Attack [Trick] The animal will attack on command.
Attack Any Target [Trick] The animal will attack any creature on command.
Come [Trick] The animal will come to you on command.
Defend [Trick] The animal will defend you.
Devotion +4 (Ex) +4 Morale bonus on Will Saves vs. Enchantments.
Down [Trick] The animal will break off combat on command.
Evasion (Ex) No damage on successful reflex save.
Guard [Trick] The animal stays in place and prevents others from approaching.
Heel [Trick] The animal will follow you.
Low-Light Vision See twice as far as a human in low light, distinguishing color and detail.
Power Attack -2/+4 You can subtract from your attack roll to add to your damage.
Scent (Ex) Detect opponents within 15+ feet by sense of smell.
Stay [Trick] The animal will stay where it is.
Track [Trick] The animal will track a scent.
Trip (Ex) You can make a trip attempt on a successful attack.
Backround to follow

Arama Blackclaw |

He is explaining his choices per level, the following should be more obvious
Angelo Fortunato, M Archon-Blooded Synthesist 1/Monk (Maneuver Master) 1; Synthesist 1/Ranger (Trapper) 1; Synthesist 4/Ninja 4
Total: Synthesist 6/ Monk (Maneuever Master) 1/ Ranger (Trapper) 1/ Ninja 4
Excuse me for taking the liberty to explain

Rigor Rictus |

Ok, so At present, it appears we have 8 completish applications. Please shout out if I missed you, as these are the characters I'll be reviewing for the module. Keep in mind I'm also still planning on a DMPC in order to be able to get in on the killing.
The main criteria I'm going for as opposed to the usual originality and character concerns, is actually survivability and contributory potential towards managing this module. Who's going to rack up the highest kill count and potentially live to the end of this...
(Entries listed by length of posting history.)
Jelani: Angelo Fortunato Summoner 6 (Synthesist) / Ninja 4 / Monk 1 (Maneuver Master) / Ranger 1 Trapper)
Luke_Parry: Raven Hawthorne Summoner 6 (Synthesist/Wild Caller) / Fighter (Lore Warden) 4 / Paladin (Divine Hunter) 2
Javell DeLeon: Darnak Monk 6 (Monk of the Sacred Mountain) / Fighter 6 (Brawler)
Stiehl9: Rost'Nomn Azahithael Mighty Godling 6 / Dark Tapestry Oracle 6
Hawktitan: Unnamed character Fighter 6 (Two Weapon Fighter) / Ranger 6
Pezmerga: Jeska Green Bard 6 (Arcane Duelist) / Fighter 6 (Rondelero Duelist )
Theinyore: Alphonse Gregori Aegis 6 / Soulknife 5 / Elocator 1
Rocan: Arama Blackclaw Druid 6 (Lion Shaman) / Rogue 6 (Scout)
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There are a lot of extremely powerful characters here. I'm tempted to include more than my original limit. The tricky part is that there are so many variables in whether this will work and how it will play out. 6th level characters vs. a 10th level module should be looking at a pretty quick TPK, and while that is still possible, the extreme power levels here could end up making it an accidental cake walk, which is definitely not what I was going for. We are severely lacking for Arcane amongst our applicants, and that could have some negative consequences, depending on the module. Martial seems to be the name of the game, even if a few use Arcane, Divine, or Psionic flavour to achieve it.
Any opinions on how we'll stack up against the challenge rating, and therefore how many PC's should be a good number? It's all guess work, but I'm figuring a few more guesses can't hurt.

Rigor Rictus |

On to more specific reviewing...
I'm hearing the theme from twilight zone in my head right now. The character I have been working on for my DMC is an Archon Blooded Synthesist 6 / Monk 1 (Zen Archer)/ Gunfighter 5 (Pistolaro). Both Synthesists, but then, so is Raven, so no biggy. It's the new CODzilla, so as I mentioned at the beginning, I was expecting a few of them. Yours is melee (as is Raven), and mine is range, so I hadn't thought much more of it until I got into the knitty gritty details of your build, but there are some eerie similarities. Same race, base stats (non-Eidelon) are almost identical, monk dip on both. In some senses I suppose it is natural to have found and used many of the same exploits when trying to build a cheese combat monster. I think I had mine set up as an Azata Blooded Mysterious Stranger, till I thought of the AC bonus and feat I could squeeze out of Monk with the dip. I switched to Garuda blooded, then to Archon when I decided to go whole hog dump stats. I suppose its a case of Convergent Evolution. At the same time it is amazing how different they'll play. Mine is complete range, and will suck if he gets stuck too close. In any event, if they end up grouped together, they're going to have to have some sort of separated at birth plot included.
Base Stats: Str 7(-4), Dex 7(-4), Con 17+2+1(13), Int 10(-), Wis 18+2(17), Cha 15(7). Points only add up to 29 by my count. Should have 30. I'd drop Cha to 14 and put Int to 12 or 13 (what I did) to get some mileage out of the extra.
Evolutions - Adds up to 12, with only 11 paid for. You have bite listed as costing (2), when it is usually only a (1) Evolution. Is that supposed to be Bite (1) plus Improved Damage (Bite) (1)? Or Bite+Bite to get 1+1/2 Str on Damage?
Amulet of Natural Armour - I had always thought they would not stack with Natural Armour (link). However, looks as though their is some room for interpretation, as a more recent thread says "yes". link
Wand of Rejuvenate Eidolon - Should be Lesser at that price point.
Pearl of Power - stipulates that it works for Prepared casters only. Is there a workaround for this I am not aware of?
In the end, he's awesome, the picture is sweet, and he'll shred in combat.
Here's my character so far by the way. Admittedly, he's still a little rough as I haven't had the chance to smooth him out and make sure everything adds up yet. Rotann

Rigor Rictus |

Base stats: I can't find your base stats (non-eidolon). Help me out?
Evolutions: You've purchased Claws again even though you had a set for free. I don't see extra limbs, so are they on your feet? With 12 points in Evolutions I assume you used the Half-Elf Summoner Favoured class option to get an extra one, yes? However, I don't see an Extra Evolution feat, so how'd you acquire the other 2 points?
I like the character in general; he seems pretty mean. I'll have to put off crunching any numbers until after you point me to your base stats though.

Rigor Rictus |

Feats: I don't even want to try to count your feats... with the bonus feats I awarded, plus fighter, plus monk bonus feats... I'll count 'em later.
Stats: Wisdom bonus should be +6, not +7. Same thing I mentioned to Jelani, if you drop your Wis to 22 (starting stat 17 +1 from level 4 bonus), you could prop your Int up a step to 14. You loose nothing and gain a few skill points and a language. Efficient, unless your anticipating hitting level 8 and want to go for Wis 24.
Natural Armour: History of Scars is an achievement feat, but I suppose that is fine, as long as it came out of your normal allotment of feats.
Guided: Always loved that weapon feature for wisdom based characters. I think it's technically 3.5 (though still Paizo), but I don't see any problem with it, or any reason why it shouldn't work on Amulets of Mighty Fists.
All in all, he looks good, and I love the flavour of a dwarven monk who smashes things into powder bare handed.

Rigor Rictus |

"Scion Talent - Channel Energy Rost can Channel Positive Energy like a Cleric of the same level - 3 x day @ 6d6"
As I read it, this should be @ 3d6, as that is what a 6th level cleric would do. It also allows you to choose the dependent stat, so why not choose CHA to get it 6x a day... Did you just reverse the numbers by accident?
Stats: What does the high Wisdom do for you? It doesn't appear to be attached to any of your abilities... Would a variant Aasimar lineage not serve him better? 4/6 offer Charisma bonuses.
Offensive options: Is he intended to use spells and mysteries as his main offensive options? I'd like to see a bit more on offense and defense as a part of his build.
All in all, this group could really use a guy like this as a healer and utility guy.

Raven Hawthorne |

Hope I get to rock out in the killathon!
Raven/Luke Parry - Shouldn't your claw damage be 1d6? 1d4 base, then to 1d6 for improved natural weapon evolution. What am I missing?
I took the improved natural attack *feat* twice as well ;-)
+2 to Str / Dex due to six levels of Summoner
+1 to Con due to 'extra ability point (eidolon)'
+2 Str due to spending two evolution points
+2 Str due to Belt of Giant Strength +2
+2 Cha due to Half-Elf bonus
+2 Cha due to Headband of Alluring Charisma +2
+1 to Charisma due to level 4
I think that about covers the ability points :-)
With regard to the Evolution points, I have taken the half-elf favored class option (as noted in the 'Racial' spoiler), giving me 1.5 extra evolution points. The 'Wild Caller' archetype also gives me an extra 0.25 evolution points per level (at the cost of not being able to take certain evolutions), for a net 1.5 evolution points at level 6.
Thus, I have a total of 12 evolution points at level 6 :-)
P.S. I had never heard of Hawthorne wipes...

Rigor Rictus |

Angelo Fortunato wrote:Hope I get to rock out in the killathon!
Raven/Luke Parry - Shouldn't your claw damage be 1d6? 1d4 base, then to 1d6 for improved natural weapon evolution. What am I missing?
I took the improved natural attack *feat* twice as well ;-)
Don't think you can take the Improved Natural Weapon Feat twice, at least not for the same weapon.
Special: This feat can be taken multiple times. Each time it is taken, it applies to a different natural attack.
You could increase the damage with the Improved Damage Evolution from 1d4 to 1d6, and then again with the Improved Natural Attack feat to change it from 1d6 to 1d8, but I think that would be the limit unless you actually changed your size category.

Rost'Nomn Azahithael |

Thanks for the heads up on the Channel. It is 3d6 and it will actually be 5 times day. 1 + 1/2 of Cha (5) = 3 + 2 for Extra Channel.
Im ashamed to admit that I didnt even see those alternate lienages til you pointed it out. Very cool. Let me dwell on these...
I'll review my spells but yes, I picture Rost as being both offensive and defensive. Defensive mostly through debuffs using his Mystery powers.
Really appreciate the review. Food for thought for sure.

Rigor Rictus |

Rigor Rictus:Base stats 7, 7, 14, 16, 14, 18; whilst wearing the suit, that becomes 16, 12, 13, 16, 14, 18.
+2 to Str / Dex due to six levels of Summoner+1 to Con due to 'extra ability point (eidolon)'
+2 Str due to spending two evolution points
+2 Str due to Belt of Giant Strength +2
+2 Cha due to Half-Elf bonus
+2 Cha due to Headband of Alluring Charisma +2
+1 to Charisma due to level 4
I think that about covers the ability points :-)
With regard to the Evolution points, I have taken the half-elf favored class option (as noted in the 'Racial' spoiler), giving me 1.5 extra evolution points. The 'Wild Caller' archetype also gives me an extra 0.25 evolution points per level (at the cost of not being able to take certain evolutions), for a net 1.5 evolution points at level 6.
Thus, I have a total of 12 evolution points at level 6 :-)
P.S. I had never heard of Hawthorne wipes...
Ability Scores: 7, 7, 14, 16, 14, 18 works out to -4-4+5+10+5+17=29?
If you had thrown your Level 4 Ability score bonus in there your end CHA should be 23. You could make it 22 by reducing your purchased CHA to 17, which gives you another 4 points. With the 1 pt you never spent you could then afford to increase your Con or Wis to 16. Your call.Evolution Points: It's been a while since I read Wildcaller, and I forgot about the extra points from there. That's all good then.
Evolutions: You never explained why you purchased claws when you already had a set for free?
Hawthorne Wipes is a reference to the show Community. One of the characters owns a Moist Toilette empire called Hawthorne Wipes.

Raven Hawthorne |

I was planning ahead to level 8, and hoping to pop the additional ability point into charisma then, but I can see the advantages of putting it into another stat.

Rigor Rictus |

We may make level 8, we may not. Hard to say. Either way, I leave that in your hands.
Your Improved Damage Evolution would only apply to one set of claws in that case, giving you a different damage rating for your hands and feet claws...
Any workaround I don't know about on the Improved Natural Weapon feat issue posted above?

Raven Hawthorne |

One of the eidolon’s natural attacks is particularly deadly. Select one natural attack form and increase the damage die type by one step.
However, if you wish to rule that it does not work that way, that is fine :-)
With regard to INA, mea culpa! I will reduce the damage dice down to 1d8, and find another feat ;-)
Edited to spoiler, so I did not spam the thread with my posts ;-)

Rigor Rictus |

To be honest, your build looks like a bit of a lightweight compared to the others I've already reviewed. He'd be awesome in a typical campaign, but here he's a bit outshadowed. Other than that comparison, he looks mechanically sound.
For your stats I'm getting 15+2, 17, 14, 12-2, 10, 14+2+2, which is 7+13+5+2+5=32. I'm thinking you forgot the -2 to Int on Demon Spawn. Considering the One-Shot status of this I'd also probably rearrange things to get rid of those odd numbers, but then, some others are hoping we'll get to level 8, so it is up to you.
Other than that, I couldn't spot anything needing explanation. She looks like she'd fill a few potential roles in the party, though as a frontliner she might not be able to keep up with the Synthesists. However, they are pretty dedicated to that role, and might need someone a bit more versatile to help them out.

Hawktitan |

To get a *second* set of claws (this time on feet), for a total of 4 claws (the maximum number of attacks allowed at level 6).
This does work even if some feel it is a bit odd. Thought I'd jump in.
Also I've created an alias for my ranger/fighter Drak Evren I made another pass over his crunch and I realized I was missing a language, favored enemies and favored terrain. I'll select Draconic for the language but I'd like to hold off on choosing enemies and terrain until I know what module we are playing. Although if I have to pick now I'll just select Evil Outsiders and Undead as 1st/2nd enemies and Underground as favored terrain. If you need a feat breakdown by level then let me know.
I also made a brief background and I will post some of my thoughts that went into creating the guy. This will be added to the profile shortly.
One final note - if you want an arcane guy I'll stat up a sorcerer/paladin or sorcerer/magus for some arcane juice.
edit-
I *think* you might be underestimating how good level 6 Shield Slam + Greater Bull Rush are in terms of control and number of attacks that I'll be giving other people. Especially with enlarged person potions or if buffed by friendly player - I think it would be pretty darn good. However I would be happy to stat out an arcane guy.

Rigor Rictus |

If you can point me to chapter and verse on that I'd appreciate it as it doesn't jive with what I remember.. Also, if you want to stat up an Arcane guy, that would be fine. A main issue with your Bullrusher was that I couldn't see many things he brought to the group that weren't covered by tougher characters already put forward. When thinking of something, give a strong thought to his survivability, which is likely to be a challenge. If you want him to be a meleeist, picture him going 1:1 with a Hill Giant; a likely encounter in one of the proposed modules.

Javell DeLeon |

I was looking for the +7 you were talking about and finally found it. Herolabs stacks the Wisdom bonus plus the AC bonus monks get at every 4 levels, which is +1. So that's where the +7 comes in.
And I was wondering about the History of Scars feat and if it would be okay if I picked it up AS IF I had already "achieved" it. I figured if not, then I could go with another feat.
And yep, it did come out of normal feat selection.
Speaking of feats, I've broken 'em down within his character sheet now to make it easier. It's a total of 16 feats(3 of them are free monk feats). :)
And just so you know, after breaking down the feat selection, I found I had to drop a feat because I only had 3 fighter bonus feats. I couldn't drop my bonus monk feats I took due to the fact I really didn't care for any of the others at this level. So, I dropped Stunning fist Adept and picked up Outflank for my 6th level fighter bonus feat.
And yeah, if I get selected, I planned on shooting for the 8th level +1 to wisdom for 24. I know it's no guarantee we get there, but I'd be sick at myself if we did manage it and I'm lookin' at a 22, when I know I could've been lookin' at a 23 to add my +1 to. :P

Raven Hawthorne |

Well, when fused with your eidolon, you use the Eidolon's physical stats - so your Con is your Eidolon's Con.
This is why there are cheesy Synthesist builds out there with Str 7 / Dex 7 / Con 7
Of course, if your suit is dismissed, it does mean that if your Con is higher than your Eidolon's Con, you will immediately gain a tonne of hit points (or lose a tonne in the case of the Con 7 Synthesist mentioned above).
If it helps, think of the suit like a potion of Bear's Endurance, or a poison that does Con damage - the former boosts your hit points, and the latter reduces them, even though your 'normal' Con score stays the same.
Also, fun fact: potions of Enlarge Person do not work on Aasimars, since they are not actually people (being Native Outsiders instead), unless you take the 'Scion of Humanity' alternate racial trait from the ARG.

Rigor Rictus |

Retreading the section on the synthesist, I can see how it could be read that way, but I think I would disagree with that interpretation. There is some ambiguity in the word choice, to be sure, and it could be read either way. I am always open to finding out about a rule clarification of which I was unaware, which is why I'd enjoy an official statement on the topic, if anyone can find one, or failing that, at least a developer opinion. I checked a few Synthesist threads, but at 900+ posts, they are not easy to navigate, and I've seen both points of view expressed. Unfortunately, opinions are easy to come by on those threads, but answers that reference an official statement are not.
I believe it is intended that your HP remain unaltered, and that Using the Eidolon's Con refers to determining its HP, and does not alter those of the summoner. Those HP are added to the Summoner's regular HP total as temporary HP, which as all temporary HP, are depleted first. If you run out of Temporary HP, your eidolon in banished. I think this interpretation is much simpler, and much less prone to abuse, such as the type you've mentioned.
However, as I mentioned, if I am wrong, I would like to know it so I can be aware of it in the future. I think in a regular game there is no such thing as a non-cheesy synthesist build, which is why the archetype is so reviled, and so often banned. I find it curious that after fixing the issue with Polymorph and Wildshape, where Druids could ditch their physical stats for another set, and thus make all their physical stats dump stats, they recreated the problem all over again with a new class. I think that were I to have Synthesists in an ongoing campaign, I would houserule that instead of using the eidolon base form stats instead of their own, Synthesists would use their own stats, which could then be modified by evolutions, a la Beast Form, etc.. Of course, this is not that kind of game, and I actually want to see over the top cheesy builds here, so I'll leave that rule for another time.

Angelo Fortunato |

Wow. Lots of posts overnight. Let me see if I can address the issues here.
Corrected Stats:Str 7(-4), Dex 7(-4), Con 18+2(17), Int 13(3), Wis 17+2+1(13), Cha 14(5)
Corrected Evolutions: That's bite II meaning I add 1.5x str to it. I'll drop one Improved Natural Armor evo.
Amulet of natural armor provides an enhancement bonus to natural armor. It doesn't provide a natural armor bonus, therefore it stacks. Same as Barkskin spell.
Wand was intended to be a lesser, typo. Didn't realize about the pearl, dropping it.
I will wait for Rigor's ruling on how to do HP. I've also always run it that your base HP are based off your stats, and your THP off the Eidolon's. I suppose I would want to change around my con and charisma and switch to an Aasimar variant that gets a Cha bonus if we do say you use Eidolon's con.
The potions thing is a good point though. Forgot I was an outsider.

Angelo Fortunato |

Now for a second post regarding how many PCs and how well we'll do. I ran several test combats at 5th level with a very similar synthesist build a while back. He could shred CR 8 or 9 encounters barely taking damage. The only thing that got him killed was a monster that could grapple him successfully. But he was alone and didn't have dimension door yet.
If we have two, or three synthesists in the party I think we'd be totally fine with a group of 6 PCs (including your DMPC). In fact, I think it'd be easy. I think we'd be fine with 4 PCs. But that excludes more people, I'd rather everyone get to have fun and you maximize all the enemies' HP or something.