Hey all, back with a few questions as I read the Core Rulebook for the second time. If you missed my first rules questions post, I'll tell you I've been playing D&D since the early 1980s, but didn't play much 3/3.5 and the little I did play was over 10 years ago.
Anyway, on with the questions.
Rounding: Occasionally the rules ask you to round a result or value. Unless otherwise stated, always round down. For example, if you are asked to take half of 7, the result would be 3.
This I understand, pretty simple.
Damage rolls when using a melee weapon or a thrown weapon, including a sling. (Exceptions: Off-hand attacks receive only half the character's Strength bonus, while two-handed attacks receive 1–1/2 times the Strength bonus. A Strength penalty, but not a bonus, applies to attacks made with a bow that is not a composite bow.)
Based on the rounding rules above, it would seem that the 1-1/2 times the Strength bonus advantage would come into play only with modifiers above +2. In other words, Strength 13 with a +1 modifier, multiplied by 1.5 would yield 1.5, which you would then round down to +1 to damage. Strength 14, with a modifier +2, would yield a total of +3 to damage. Is this correct?
Multiplying Damage: Sometimes you multiply damage by some factor, such as on a critical hit. Roll the damage (with all modifiers) multiple times and total the results.
Note: When you multiply damage more than once, each multiplier works off the original, unmultiplied damage. So if you are asked to double the damage twice, the end result is three times the normal damage.
The Strength rule in the PRD led me to Damage, which is where another rule has me stumped. Could someone give me an example of what it means to "...double the damage twice, the end result is three times the normal damage."? I simply don't understand this at all, hopefully it's not ridiculously obvious.
I tried some searchfu on the forums here but couldn't find the answers, my apologies if these are obvious questions that come up with every crop of fresh faces. :)
Based on the rounding rules above, it would seem that the 1-1/2 times the Strength bonus advantage would come into play only with modifiers above +2. In other words, Strength 13 with a +1 modifier, multiplied by 1.5 would yield 1.5, which you would then round down to +1 to damage. Strength 14, with a modifier +2, would yield a total of +3 to damage. Is this correct?
Correct.
The Strength rule in the PRD led me to Damage, which is where another rule has me stumped. Could someone give me an example of what it means to "...double the damage twice, the end result is three times the normal damage."? I simply don't understand this at all, hopefully it's not ridiculously obvious.
Using a lance during a mounted charge (double damage), and critically hitting (triple damage). The end result in this case would be 4 times the normal damage. So 4d8 damage instead of 1d8x2x3, or 6d8 damage.
Based on the rounding rules above, it would seem that the 1-1/2 times the Strength bonus advantage would come into play only with modifiers above +2. In other words, Strength 13 with a +1 modifier, multiplied by 1.5 would yield 1.5, which you would then round down to +1 to damage. Strength 14, with a modifier +2, would yield a total of +3 to damage. Is this correct?
That's right; modifiers of +2 and above. It works out fine in the long run.
Could someone give me an example of what it means to "...double the damage twice, the end result is three times the normal damage."? I simply don't understand this at all, hopefully it's not ridiculously obvious.
It's worded badly. Say you roll 15 for your damage, and two separate effects double the damage you're to do.
What you DON'T do is double twice: 15 x 2 = 30, 30 x 2 = 60
Instead you TRIPLE the original number instead: 15 doubled twice instead becomes 15 x 3 = 45 damage
It's to stop doubles and triples and so on from getting stacked to ridiculous levels: they're additive, not multiplicative. This also means that the order in which you apply them doesn't need to matter.
You are correct about how 1-1/2 str bonus works. As for the "double damage twice", every so often it is possible to have two separate effects that each would double the damage, such as a paladin scoring a critical hit while using Litany of Righteousness. Basically, what that rule is saying is that you should think of effects that double damage as actually adding 100% damage. So, in the example above, the paladin would crit for +100% damage and the litany would give him +100% damage, for a total of 300% normal damage, or equivelent of x3 damage. If he were using a greataxe, which has a base crit multiplier of x3, the crit would add +200% to the +100% of the litany for a total of 400% damage, or x4 damage. Hope this helps!
Or a mounted paladin charging with a lance (x2), and critically hitting (x3), while affected by Litany of Righteousness (x2). That ends up at 5x normal damage. If the multipliers weren't reduced, then that would be 12x normal damage.
Here's a neat trick about the "new" rules... If you have a character that isn't proficient in shields, and doesn't use magic (like a Rogue), you can STILL give them a shield. All you have to do is have it made of mithral, meaning a Heavy Steel Shield made of mithral is 1020 gp.
Since there's no armor check penalty, there's no penalty for not having a proficiency in a heavy mithral shield. Neat, huh?
(this was meant for the OP)
It's the result of something not getting directly ported over (at least so far as I can find yet) from the 3.5 PHB.
pg. 304 at the beginning of the "General Guidelines and Glossary" the second section which is entitled "Multiplying":
Quote:
Sometimes a special rule makes you multiply a number or a die roll. As long as you're applying a single multiplier, multiply the number normally. When two or more multipliers apply to any abstract value (such as a modifier or die roll), however, combine them into a single multiple, with each extra multiple adding one less than its value to the first multiple. Thus a double (x2) and a double (x2) applied to the same number results in a triple (x3, because 2+1=3).
Near as I can tell there is no such section in the PF SRD Glossary.
Thanks for the answers all, I understand clearly now. Kayerloth was able to crystallize the multiplication rule for me, and that made all the other posts very clear. Thanks also for the confirmation on my understanding of the 1.5x damage from Strength thing.
Here's a neat trick about the "new" rules... If you have a character that isn't proficient in shields, and doesn't use magic (like a Rogue), you can STILL give them a shield. All you have to do is have it made of mithral, meaning a Heavy Steel Shield made of mithral is 1020 gp.
Since there's no armor check penalty, there's no penalty for not having a proficiency in a heavy mithral shield. Neat, huh?
(this was meant for the OP)
Interesting! Probably all sorts of tricks like that once you know the rules, eh? :)
Oh, one more thing regarding damage. Could someone provide an example of this?
Exception: Extra damage dice over and above a weapon's normal damage are never multiplied.
A fiery weapon deals 1d6 fire damage on a hit. This damage is not multiplied on a critical hit.
Vital Strike.
Also the extra 2d6 damage from a Bane weapon. And in addition to the Flaming weapon property mentioned by bugleyman, the Frost and Shock properties as well.
Perfect examples, thanks bugleyman, Azaelas Fayth, and Nefreet!
Welp, there is a few little things, but they don't really kick in until later.
Try having a 3rd level going to 4th Sorcerer or Wizard put that level into Fighter. Put the extra feat into Arcane Armor Training. You end up with lots more hp, +1 BAB, a +2 Fort, and the ability to wear light armor and not have a spell failure chance. Put a adamantine chain shirt on the caster. Now you have 4 armor ac, suitable for enchantment, and DR 1. You no longer have to cast Mage Armor several times a day, and you can't get caught NOT wearing armor, since you can sleep in it.
A Holy enchantment is really valuable on weapons, since most monsters seem to be Evil aligned.
A ring of sustenance is the best item for spellcasters, since they have to have 8 hours sleep to get their spell slots back, this item reduces it to 2 hours, which means they can take a longer shift on night watches. It also means you don't have to rest for 10-12 hours a day and so more time for travel and adventuring for the entire party.
Fortitude is the most used saving throw, but failing a Will save(Will is the rarest save out of the 3) tends to really suck the most, since you lose some control over your character.
Always spend the first few levels spending feats on closing holes in your defenses, since it's easiest to die in the first 3 levels. Also, you get Raise Dead later on, but until then you are vulnerable.
The core classes most groups have, or have variants of, are Wizard, Cleric, Rogue, and Fighter.
I dunno, what would you want to know?
I dunno, what would you want to know?
You've given me a pretty interesting list of things to consider already. I usually have a hard enough time remembering all the rules (I'm the DM) without getting into all the various tricks one can use to really round out a character. Always nice to see stuff like you've posted, as it usually opens my eyes to stuff I never even considered. Thanks!
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... I usually have a hard enough time remembering all the rules (I'm the DM) without getting into all the various tricks one can use to really round out a character ...
What I usually recommend is someone come here to the advice forum, post their basic idea for a PC (along with whatever plans they have so far), then ask for advice on what to do with it or how it sould be more effective at X.
The only thing you have to remember is to take the advice and really consider it yourself.
I recently had a player very fed up with his PC. It wasn't quite unplayable, but was definitely less useful than the rest of the party who don't really optimize all that much.
After a long discussion he said the build was recommended by 'everyone' on the boards. I went and looked at the thread. It is one of the very many where some builder shows "Look what this has at level 20!" But we are currently playing at level 6 and our campaigns tend to end around level 12 or so. The proposed build didn't even get much of it's good stuff until early teen levels.
The other thing to watch out for is to make sure that the build covers ALL of your needs, not just straight-up combat.
So when I ask for advice, I always try to be as specific as possible:
"We are only 3rd level now, so it has to be effective at low levels."
"This campaign is kinda low on combat, so I have to have social and investigative skills or abilities."
"GM said we can only use the CRB and APG"
"Our party is outlaws so I can't be too slow or obvious. Sneaking and/or disguise is very desireable."
"GM loves horror checks so I need a decent-good will save."
"We sometimes get separated so I can't be too squishy."
Basically anything you want in the character you need to tell the people giving you advice. Other wise you might end up with a glass cannon, 1 trick pony, that can't do anything until level 15+.
Other than that, you can get some great advice! =)
Good points Kydeem de'Morcaine, I'll be sure to keep these ideas in mind if I ever post any potential characters for evaluation by the community. Of course that would require someone ELSE to DM for once, but I can always dream, right? :)
Yeah, see, I almost ALWAYS tell players to construct their characters defensively in the lower levels, since you can die really easy. One really common thing is to look at your class saving throws.
Normally, you have one or two that tend to suck rocks, not just because your attributes aren't great, but also because your class doesn't do much for them. Like Clerics and their Reflex save. So, I tell lower level Clerics to take Lightning Reflexes, because even if they have a good Dex to begin with, their class isn't gonna increase it much.
I like to tell players to, upon leveling, take feats that respond to what has been happening during the game. If they find they are failing Initiative rolls tons of the time, and especially if they are playing a primary spellcaster like a Sorcerer, to take Improved Initiative. See?
I don't like those idiotic twits that are all over this forum, designing characters in a vacuum, creating super combos that obviously don't work if you don't have all the feats you need, and leave your PC vulnerable to stupid little things like a lack of hit points! Stop trying to make invincible characters, and instead make ones that SURVIVE well!
Now, all primary spellcasters are going to need the following eventually: Spell Penetration, Greater Spell Penetration, Combat Casting. See, spell resistance really sucks to get past, and it starts being common once you get into the double digits of levels. And lots of times, if the DM is running premade dungeon crawls, the players don't have much room to maneuver. That means you are going to be casting spells right next to enemies, and that means them getting a free attack unless you cast defensively. Since you get so few spells each day, best to make sure the ones you have always work!
The Cleric that doesn't take Selective Channeling (healing in combat), the Druid that doesn't take Natural Spell, the specialist Wizard that doesn't take Spell Focus and Greater Spell Focus in their favored school of magic is an idiot. The warrior type that doesn't take Dodge if they aren't using a shield isn't all that bright, either. Almost all Rogues end up using a rapier with Weapon Finesse and Weapon Focus, Dodge and Mobility.
I dunno, I don't know what more I should tell you. You gotta be specific as to what you want to know. Best thing to do is to go through and make PC's yourself, and try to figure out what they really need by examining their options and what sort of game environment they are in. If dungeoncrawling, ensure they can deal with short range combat, if doing the standard wilderness gaming, ensure they are good at long range combat or at least have the option to try it (a bow for a melee Paladin, for instance).
Oh, you are going to want to get yourself a wet erase mat with a grid on it, some wet erase markers (stick to black, no reds or other colors as they tend to stain) and some random (no duplicates) minis of some kind, plus a magnetized battleboard. That thing is too damned useful to ignore. I think Pathfinder has some cardboard minis you can get lots of for really cheap in the long run.
There is ONE thing I think will save you a lot of grief. You have to be firm as to what you will and won't allow from the get go. No hemming and hawing. If you won't allow Monks, because you think it ruins the ambiance, don't allow them to whine about it. Trust me, this really helps! Also, be certain that the players know that sometimes you might fudge die rolls in order to make the game more exciting/dramatic. And frequently when someone has a case of really bad luck, claim you suddenly had an eye spasm and to reroll. Fudging goes both ways, and the players should know you aren't there to make them miserable, but instead to give them as much laughs and drama as possible.
I dunno, I don't know what more I should tell you. You gotta be specific as to what you want to know. Best thing to do is to go through and make PC's yourself, and try to figure out what they really need by examining their options and what sort of game environment they are in.
I've been doing this, to get a feel for creating a character and for working through some encounters. Definitely a good plan.
Oh, you are going to want to get yourself a wet erase mat with a grid on it, some wet erase markers (stick to black, no reds or other colors as they tend to stain) and some random (no duplicates) minis of some kind, plus a magnetized battleboard. That thing is too damned useful to ignore. I think Pathfinder has some cardboard minis you can get lots of for really cheap in the long run.
Yep, I have a dry-erase battlemap, PC/NPC/monster pogs, all that good stuff. All set there.
There is ONE thing I think will save you a lot of grief. You have to be firm as to what you will and won't allow from the get go. No hemming and hawing. If you won't allow Monks, because you think it ruins the ambiance, don't allow them to whine about it. Trust me, this really helps! Also, be certain that the players know that sometimes you might fudge die rolls in order to make the game more exciting/dramatic. And frequently when someone has a case of really bad luck, claim you suddenly had an eye spasm and to reroll. Fudging goes both ways, and the players should know you aren't there to make them miserable, but instead to give them as much laughs and drama as possible.
Haha, no worries there! I've been a DM since the early 1980s, so I'm pretty well-versed in the ways of players. :) I'm also pretty good at knowing when the press the party and when to ease up on them. I've GM'd about every game you can think of, but this is my first crack at Pathfinder.
So far the party is shaping up like this (6 total players, but someone is usually missing so party will be 5 generally) so it should be interesting:
Dwarf Barbarian
Half-Elf Paladin
Half-Elf Cleric
Human Rogue
Elf Ranger
Elf Sorcerer
You are definitely warrior heavy, and Sorcerers suck compared to Wizards. This is after much mucking about with Sorcs.
What kind of game environment are you putting them into? Traditional dungeon crawls? If so this is a bad mix for that.
And get rid of all those half elves. As a race they suck. Same goes with having an Elf Sorcerer, no Charisma bonus. A gnome or halfling works better for them. Perfect race for your typical Cleric is a straight up Aasimar, no changes. Bennie to wis and cha, some energy resistance, darkvision, nice skill bonuses.
Rogues should ALWAYS have darkvision, so they can scout and not have to carry torches, especially when dungeoncrawling. One race that cracks me up, and make the perfect Rogue, are goblins. +8 to Stealth, +4 to Ride, +4 to Dex, -2 to Strength and Charisma. Oh, and they move as fast as regular Medium creatures, plus they have darkvision. Give them a Medium dagger, and they are all set.
Typical Barbs should have a big bennie to Str and Con, so I don't think a Dwarf works great for them. I suggest an Oread (human with some earth elemental blood in them), Orcs (stat adjust sucks overall, but really nice feats), Hobgoblins. Also, you want to use Dwarves for classes that like heavy armor.
Paladins want a high Str and Cha. Better race would be Suli, Nagaji, and one of the Aasimar variants, even a straight up Human is better for that class.
A group THAT big and nobody took a Bard? They and Clerics are great at pumping up the other characters, plus bards tend to be good at a lot of variety.
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I'm going to cheerfully disagree with Piccolo about your party.
* Don't sweat races/class optimization too much. You can have a 16 in your class's prime stat and do fine; Race might push it to 18, which is nice, but it's okay if you don't.
* Half-elves are a pretty decent race actually. +2 to any stat is big. The other racial abilities are nice; Skill Focus isn't as great as a free feat (Human), but combined with Half-Elf Keen Senses, it can be a +5 to Perception from the start, which is really quite nice to have. RP potential is also good; having "a way in" with both humans and elves is nice. A half-elf cleric with skill focus: perception can reliably cast buff spells in the surprise round, which is nice. A half-elf paladin can increase Strength, expect to participate in the surprise round, and doesn't trade in movement speed the way you'd do with a Small race (important for a frontliner).
* Dwarf barbarian: I can see the flavor you're going for here. Dwarf barbarians have potential to Just Keep Going; good saving throws against pretty much everything. If you go for Superstition as a Rage Power, you're a BBEG caster's absolute nightmare. You won't do the maximum damage possible for a barbarian, but the chance of you failing a save vs. Dominate Person is very small, which will be appreciated by your party!
* Human Rogue: while you lack darkvision, you can eventually get that through magic items or some prestige class (it's nice to have). The important thing is the bonus feat at first level, since rogues have some trouble getting started without it. Also, as a rogue it can be a big advantage to look like the most normal race; blending in is good.
* Elf sorcerer... this is the only one I somewhat dislike, because elves just make more sense to me as wizards. The whole "I have centuries to study" idea promotes wizardry, as well as the Intelligence bonus. On the other hand: sorcerers need very few material possessions, which meshes nicely with elven desire for lightweight and freedom from burdens. Consider going for a lot of ranged touch spells to take advantage of your Dexterity bonus.
* Elf ranger: this one makes obvious sense, especially if you like archery.
* weird races that Piccolo mentioned.. I don't like the circus freaks approach to party building, or being totally shoehorned into perfect race/class combinations. Avoid really bad combinations, but as you can see above, the non-obvious combinations can work well in their own ways.
* weird races that Piccolo mentioned.. I don't like the circus freaks approach to party building, or being totally shoehorned into perfect race/class combinations. Avoid really bad combinations, but as you can see above, the non-obvious combinations can work well in their own ways.
Hell yeah, +1 internet for you!
Nah, those Goggles of Night are INCREDIBLY expensive. Better to just have that straight out of the gate. Human Rogues suck, methinks. When it comes to Rogues, there really is no one best race. The class is very much the grab bag of skills, so you really have to decide on what you want to get good at. Typically Rogues like to have high dex and int for the backstabbing assassin type/fencer. Only thing I can suggest is that it's nice to get a bonus to Int, other than that it's up to you what you like. Darkvision IS, however, a must.
Only thing half elves are really better for is lots of multiclassing. Otherwise they are kinda a waste. Those Keen Senses are better applied to a straight up Elf.
Really, even a half orc is better than a half elf, at least the former gets darkvision.
Aasimar really aren't all that weird, they are just standard humans with some angelic blood in them. Orcs, Hobgoblins and Goblins have been a staple of D&D since forever, hey.
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Three things:
1) about your initial question, the damage multipliers isn't applied to what you rolled with the weapon dice(s), but multiplies the number of dice(s).
To make a clear example, a character with 18 strength confirming a critical with a longsword sword deal 2d8+8 hit point of damage, not (1d8+4)*2.
2) I suggest you to start using only the Core Rulebook or at most the Advanced Player Guide (plus the setting books, if you want to play on Golarion), with the latter books and more setting books the number of options increase dramatically and it will overwhelm you.
3) I don't think the sorcerer is a weak class, but if you are using the Advanced Player Guide a human sorcerer has a big advantage, it has a alternate favorite class bonus:
Add one spell known from the sorcerer spell list. This spell must be at least one level below the highest spell level the sorcerer can cast.
trading 1 skill point or 1 hit point to get a extra spell is a big boon for the sorcerer.
Lots of information here, I'll have to dig into it later today. Just did a quick read this morning. I should mention that we are only using the Core Rulebook classes/races to start with, and that we are doing the Shattered Star AP.
I don't know shatter star, but with 6 PC's they should be fine even if not too well built. I also let new players rebuild pretty often as they find things don't work as they expected, aren't survivable, or just aren't fun.
IF it is alot underground, the human rogue may have some difficulty.
Just as a note: a very common opinion on these boards is that rogue is a weak class. If someone is trying to be a scout, they should do ranger. If they are trying to be face and skill monkey, they should do bard. I personally don't think it is as horrible as many will tell you. I have seen several people play rogues and have a blast with them. Especially since you have a large party that already has weapon combat covered.
Something I forgot to mention before. PF is much more single class than 3.x was. In 3.x it almost seemed like you had to multi-class and/or take a prestige class just to stay effective (I know that's an exaggeration, but that is what it felt like to many of us). But PF really rewards staying with one class. I especially discourage multi-classing with new players.
Have fun and don't sweat the build optimization.
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And I finally found where PF does have the bit about Multiplying, they just put it at the very beginning rather than the very end where the 3.5 PHB placed it. It's under "Common Terms":
Multiplying: When you are asked to apply more than one multiplier to a roll, the multipliers are not multiplied by one another. Instead, you combine them into a single multiplier, with each extra multiple adding 1 less than its value to the first multiple. For example, if you are asked to apply a ×2 multiplier twice, the result would be ×3, not ×4.
This concept was one of the hardest things for me to understand; I'm a visual learner, and I had a difficult time visualizing this concept. Ultimately, I looked at it as each multiplier consists of one base roll plus a number of extra rolls. For example:
x2 = base roll + extra roll
x3 = base roll + extra roll + extra roll
x4 = base roll + extra roll + extra roll + extra roll
In the event of multiplying multipliers, the base rolls do not stack, but the extra rolls do—just count how many extra rolls you get and combine that with one base roll for the total number of rolls.
So, in a crazy x2 with a x3 with a x4 situation, you will have:
base roll + extra roll + extra roll + extra roll + extra roll + extra roll + extra roll
for a total of seven damage rolls.
Hopefully this explanation helps people down the road.
Yeah, the multiplier thing catches a lot of people out.
One way of looking at it (for the mathematically inclined) is not as a multiplier, but as an increase in % of damage.
Normal attack: 100%
X2: 100% + 100%
X3: 100% + 200%
X4: 100% + 300%
etc
When using more than one "multiple" add together the +%, then add the 100% normal damage.
Personally, I think the terminology should have been changed to "+1" instead of "x2", which does exactly the same thing, and makes the maths follow the rules of, well, maths.
Yes, it probably would have been a lot clearer to many folks if they had just said and extra roll of the original damage rather than x2 or 2 extra rolls of the damage rather than x3. But that is what it means.
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Yes, it probably would have been a lot clearer to many folks if they had just said and extra roll of the original damage rather than x2 or 2 extra rolls of the damage rather than x3. But that is what it means.
You add all the static bonuses too. I am sure people would read "a extra roll" as a roll of the dices only. Actually even now some people read it that way.
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You add all the static bonuses too. I am sure people would read "a extra roll" as a roll of the dices only. Actually even now some people read it that way.
Yes, I should have clarified that in my explanation: the base roll or extra roll includes the static number added to the damage roll (I.e. 1dx+y).
So, the final result of my example above would be 7dx+7y and definitely not 7(1dx+y), because unlike calculus, the two are not the same.
So, the final result of my example above would be 7dx+7y and definitely not 7(1dx+y), because unlike calculus, the two are not the same.
Nitpick: that's elementary algebra, not calculus.
I don't like the circus freaks approach to party building, or being totally shoehorned into perfect race/class combinations. Avoid really bad combinations, but as you can see above, the non-obvious combinations can work well in their own ways.
Yea, I let players roll up characters as they see fit...we can make most anything work.
I suggest you to start using only the Core Rulebook or at most the Advanced Player Guide (plus the setting books, if you want to play on Golarion), with the latter books and more setting books the number of options increase dramatically and it will overwhelm you.
This is my exact plan. Start with the Core Rulebook, Bestiary, and Shards of Sin, and go from there. Once we get a few levels in we can start looking at expanding the rule set.
I also let new players rebuild pretty often as they find things don't work as they expected, aren't survivable, or just aren't fun.
I definitely had planned to do this, because we'll all be learning the system. We have some very experienced players and some very new players:
Dwarf Barbarian - playing D&D since the 1980s
Half-Elf Paladin - played 4E only
Half-Elf Cleric - playing D&D since the 1980s
Human Rogue - playing D&D since the 1980s
Elf Ranger - played 4E only
Elf Sorcerer - played 4E only
Have fun and don't sweat the build optimization.
Agreed, I never worry about build optimization. Fun optimization is more my thing. :)
Thanks to the rest of you for further insights on the rules I asked about, much appreciated.
Still reading through the book, I have a question about Barbarian Rage.
While in rage, a barbarian gains a +4 morale bonus to her Strength and Constitution, as well as a +2 morale bonus on Will saves. In addition, she takes a –2 penalty to Armor Class. The increase to Constitution grants the barbarian 2 hit points per Hit Dice, but these disappear when the rage ends and are not lost first like temporary hit points.
Does this mean that the Barbarian receives the increased HP from both the Constitution increase and 2 hit points per hit die?
For example, say I have a 1st level Barbarian with a Constitution of 16. The morale bonus to Constitution brings his Constitution up to 20. Does he gain +2 HP for the Constitution increase and 2 hit points from his Hit Die, for a total gain of 4 HP? Or does he simply gain 2 HP from the hit die?
I did a little searching on the Innertubes, but got enough conflicting answers to decide to simply ask here.
It is 2 HP per die and they aren't temporary or "Excess HP" that disappear once they are consumed. Wounds suffered that are counted against those 2 HP per HD still remain. This means Barbarians coming out of their Rage may just drop over dead depending on their CON score and how many HD they have.
Example: Barbarian of level 8 with 14 CON Rages and gains 16 extra HPs while in his rage. Say he goes from 60 HP to 76 HP. During the battle he gets knocked down to 1 HP and then ends his Rage. Those 16 extra HPs go away and take him to -15, more negative than his CON and he drops dead instantly.
The sentence is simply for ease of reference.
Just the info I was looking for, thanks Seppuku.
Sorry Azaelas Fayth, not sure I follow which sentence you are referring to.
The problem for Barbarians is that they tend to catch a LOT of hell, being the charging sorts and not having much armor, along with the -2 AC that rage induces.
Therefore, encourage the Barb to have a few cure light potions on hand in case the cleric can't get to him fast; take the Dodge and Toughness feats. Endurance would allow him to sleep in a Adamantine breastplate, while Diehard will keep him awake in the negative hit points long enough to slug back those cure potions.
If the guy playing the sorcerer doesn't have a potion of invisibility tucked away for emergencies, slap him.
Also, a good idea if the sorcerer gets pounded on a lot, is to put his 4th level into Fighter, and take Arcane Armor Training. (This also takes care of all the prerequisites for the feat, along with providing an extra feat slot.) That means the sorcerer can switch Mage Armor out for something else, like Shield or Protection from Evil, and AC upgrades are cheap. Plus, a increase in Fort save, bigger one in hp, and a +1 BAB helps a lot! Now, yes it does result in the sorcerer giving up a level of spellcasting, but this also means you don't have to spend the first round of every combat casting Mage Armor, and you can sleep in the armor. I suggest a Mithral or better yet, a Adamantine chain shirt.
Those half elves really are a bad race for most of those classes. Sigh. Oh well.
yeah, but we have no clue what the guy playing the barbarian would want as the focus for his PC. Therefore we can't count on those 2 archetypes being a good solution.
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you don't have to spend the first round of every combat casting Mage Armor, and you can sleep in the armor.
With a spell lasting 1 hour/level I don't see why you need to do that.
After the first levels 1-2 casting will protect you for most of the day.To the OP, remember that drinking a potion in combat generate an attack of opportunity.
Mage Armor doesn't last 24 hours a day, even at 20th level. You can still be caught napping, and it takes a few rounds when combat begins to get up all the defensive spells.
The first levels are the ones we end up spending most of our game time in, as most groups don't last long enough to get up to the teens.
Plus, enchanting a bit of armor is relatively cheap compared to wondrous items.