New DM / Party going to Thistletop - What gear?


Advice

Grand Lodge

I'm a new DM (haven't played an RPG since WFRP 2nd edition over 20 years ago)running ROTR for a new group (my best friends). We are currently using the Beginner Box rules with the intention of converting at lvl 5, which should be around the same time we start the Skinsaw Murders. I'm slowly adding new concepts to them as i do have the Core rule book too.

After a pretty successful and enjoyable first session the group has killed (a way to easy) Tsuto and have decided to bypass the catacombs and after returning Ameiko, head for Thistletop.

Like i said we are all new to this so was just wondering what sort of gear the group should have/need? And what kind of things are available in Sandpoint. Would they be able to stock up on potions of cure light wounds etc? The reason i ask this specifically is that it is only a group of three and they are playing the Fighter, Rogue and Wizard so don't have any real healing.


Grab a wand of cure light wounds if you can. Potions are okay, because anyone can use them at any time, but the wand will come in handy right after a fight and is cheaper overall. A single potion of CLW is 50gp, and provokes an AoO when used in combat, while a 50-charge wand of CLW is 750gp and doesn't provoke an AoO if used in combat. Its only downside for your party is that only the rogue can use it, and he requires a DC 20 Use Magic Device check to activate it. However, if someone dipped a single level into Cleric or Paladin then they would be able to use it without fail.

That's not to say you shouldn't keep a potion or two on you just in case, because a failed check for wand activation in combat is just as deadly as a possible provoked AoO.


There's definitely a couple places to pick up potions. I believe there are two rival apothecaries/alchemists in town. There are also smiths and leatherworkers and the like for gearing up with armor and weapons. They won't need magical gear, but some potions might help.

Questions:

1.) Are you running the classic ROTRL or the new Anniversary Edition? In the case of the later, there's an entire chapter about the town of Sandpoint near the end which has useful information about the businesses in town.

2.) Does your rogue or wizard have ranks in Use Magic Device? If they do, you could always place some cheap wands as treasure (maybe with depleted charges). A simple wand of cure light wounds with only half a dozen charges remaining could help. If they don't have any ranks you could allow them to re-format their characters, adjusting their skills accordingly.

3.) Have you considered creating a DM-PC to round out the party? I'm not saying it's necessary, but you could always have a cleric join up with them on their adventure. It could be fun. Can be a mostly passive character that doesn't make a whole lot of decisions, leaving the critical ones to be made by the PCs.


Thistletop might be a little hard for them if they are skipping the Catacombs. They should probably be about 3rd-level before entering Thistletop. If they aren't, consider a quick detour along the road--something to level 'em up. Maybe some goblins, or bandits, or something.


You can get swarmed pretty easily at Thistletop. Several encounters run into each other and a large number of foes can gather really quickly.

Make sure they realize that and consider running away, if necessary.


Good advice, Gerald. There are dozens of goblins in the Thistlewood, and not to mention a boss. His hit-and-run tactics, combined with the overwhelming numbers, could lead to a TPK (total party kill).


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

My group is in the middle of thistle top right now and they are almost the same make up. My group was rogue, summoner, and paladin. I had the ekf ranger go with them since she has a grudge against Bruthazmus and she also has a wand which has been instrumental in keeping them alive. Though the rogue bit it right out front versus the mess there.

Grand Lodge

Thanks a lot for the responses, i really appreciate any advice. I have rolled a cleric of my own whilst I was getting to grips with the rules so I think I'll let him accompany them to try and keep them alive :p before starting ROTR we ran the dungeon from the beginner box,which gave them a good reason for being in Sandpoint for the Swallowtail Festival - as well as giving some xp so they are almost lvl 3.

After an easy start I'm really looking forward to pitting them against some half decent bad guys ;)


Sounds awesome. The Beginner's Box is a great prelude to the adventure. Good luck with your game, Daniel.


Daniel Williams 954 wrote:
...it is only a group of three and they are playing the Fighter, Rogue and Wizard so don't have any real healing.

For this party, I'd highly recommend them picking up a (several?) wand(s) of infernal healing for healing up between encounters. The wizard can use it no problem (or the rogue with UMD). Its better than a wand of CLW (10hp/charge vs. 2-9hp/charge), and besides, no one can use the latter without UMD anyway.

Otherwise, Thistletop can be tough. Try to drop some hints that they should try to be at least moderately sneaky getting in, and that once inside, they should be ready to retreat if necessary.

Spoiler:
Its suicide to barge in the front door and face tank everything in there. Very easy to get swarmed.

Even the encounter out front with the druid and its animal companion can be pretty deadly at low levels as well, even more so if they aren't quick about it and/or make tons of noise and bring extra simultaneous encounters down on top on themselves (that's true both inside and outside the fortress).

There's also a certain nasty invisible monster in there that we were pretty much incapable of fighting. After we failed to notice it in its room, and it proceeded to one-shot the summoner's eidolon, we ran away ;-) That said, our party was probably the least versatile and most vulnerable party I've ever been a part of. All direct damage melee types, even the summoner and his eidolon. Seriously a terrible party. It would probably have been doable with some debuffs/CC, but *shrug*, there was no way to stand there and trade blows with whatever that thing was.


"Almost 3rd level" is exactly where you should be going into Thistletop. If you're a party of 3 instead of 4, you need to either add an NPC (your cleric or Shalelu the ranger or whoever) or weaken some of the encounters.

No particular gear is required. If you have a cleric with the party, you don't really need a wand of Cure Light Wounds (though -- sigh -- yes, they are pretty handy. I can't stand the damn things, myself, but they're hard to avoid.)

I'll add to what other posters have said -- while no individual foe in the upper levels of Thistletop is that powerful, the encounters can run into each other. PCs can definitely get zerg-swarmed by the goblins if they're not thoughtful. Try to communicate this to them early on.

Doug M.

Grand Lodge

Thanks again for the sound advice. I'm running the next session tonight so i'll post on here to let you know how it goes.


I ran the next session and the group have got through the goblin tunnels, defeated Gogmurt and hit level 3.

It started with them returning Ameiko to Sandpoint and then some preparation for their next adventure. I hinted heavily that a wand of CLW might be essential and i also gave them a few potions of it too as a gift for saving the Cathedral.

The first encounter with the 10 refugees started with the fighter rolling his obligatory '1' but after that he put cleave to great use. The overwhelming numbers meant that the wizard couldn't avoid melee combat and was reduced to 2 HP, which meant my cleric had to reveal himself (I planned on only using him for heals and have him hide during combat) to keep him alive.

This didn't bode well for the 'real' fights but luckily the trend didn't continue. Next they took on 4 goblin dogs which started the encounter tethered with frayed ropes. I made a roll for each dog to see if they could break the leash which added a tension to the fight that the players enjoyed.

The players made sure to bring as little attention to themselves as possible, which meant that the rogue was able to sneak up on the sleeping leopard and nearly kill it with one blow. The leopard woke with a whelp but somehow (ridiculously low perception roll) Gogmurt didn't hear and his pet was dispatched without him knowing.

The group then moved on to Gogmurt's lair with the druid entangling them all at the entrance, after he'd took a fireball in the face. Gogmurt started using produce flame as the fighter and rogue slowly broke free from the vines. Once they did the fighter luckily crit the druid and reduced him to 3 HP before he had a chance to escape, the goblin broke down and spilled the beans.

And that's where we left it with the players levelling up their characters.

As i said in my original post we are very new to this so if anyone has any advice or notices something we're doing wrong, that'd be great.


Valenswift wrote:
As i said in my original post we are very new to this so if anyone has any advice or notices something we're doing wrong, that'd be great.

Sounds like things have gone well so far. Your party certainly handled things to this point FAR better than mine did. As I mentioned, my party was laughably narrow in scope. Cue comic shop guy from the Simpsons: "worst party ever".

Sounds like ya'll are having fun.


MTCityHunter wrote:
Valenswift wrote:
As i said in my original post we are very new to this so if anyone has any advice or notices something we're doing wrong, that'd be great.

Sounds like things have gone well so far. Your party certainly handled things to this point FAR better than mine did. As I mentioned, my party was laughably narrow in scope. Cue comic shop guy from the Simpsons: "worst party ever".

Sounds like ya'll are having fun.

That's the most important message I have got from these forums, to have fun. We are certainly doing that and my friends have all asked to look at the core book so they can delve a little deeper in to their characters (they started with the pre-rolled in the beginner box).

And I'm sure your party will improve :p


If You're Having Fun, You're Doing It Right.

Otherwise, a couple of thoughts. See if you can foreshadow Nualia a bit. Either have her put in an appearance (/not/ in combat... more like, mysterious hooded woman glimpsed ducking down an alley, type of thing), or have a captive talk about the "priestess of the Demon-Mother" down on the bottom level, and/or drop some backstory about the fire and whatnot. Nualia works best if she's been foreshadowed a bit, but the players don't realize who she is (i.e., she's the supposedly-dead daughter of the late priest).

Oh, and if they don't kill Lyrie, I wrote a short adventure that brings her back later, towards the end of the second module. Google "The Lyrie Scenario" and it will pop right up

Doug M.


Valenswift wrote:

That's the most important message I have got from these forums, to have fun. We are certainly doing that and my friends have all asked to look at the core book so they can delve a little deeper in to their characters (they started with the pre-rolled in the beginner box).

And I'm sure your party will improve :p

Unfortunately, that particular campaign ended up burning out. our GM that was running it kind of lost interest. Id love to go back and finish it sometime...or restart it, either way. I've had much better balanced parties since then though, ;-)

Anyway, yeah, I agree that the adventure paths in general could all do with a bit more foreshadowing.

Glad to hear ya'll are enjoying yourselves.

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