Most of the people in the photos doing the manspread are pretty tall. You need to make your femur shorter than the height of the seat somehow and that means putting it out or putting it at an angle.
You keep saying this, but none of the pictures being shown does this statement make any sense at all.
Lets use the photo you linked.
What exactly is preventing him from sitting with his knees a little bit closer, say 8-10 inches apart?
Why should he? You're not fitting a second person into that seat anyway.
If he has his knees at should with apart his boots +feet +femur is a good for or 5 inches taller than than the height of the seat. If your thighs are directly in front of you like that, you're pushing against them into your midsection, not fun. If that makes no sense to you, try sitting with your legs together on a childs seat.
I'm just glad this manspreading madness hasn't invaded Finland yet.
I'm just glad this manspreading madness hasn't invaded Finland yet.
Wait till you see whats trending in oregon
Only taking up one seat though. Must be a girl.
Maybe Finland has bigger seats? After all, the Finns are right at the top of the average height ranking...
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Why should he? You're not fitting a second person into that seat anyway.
If he has his knees at should with apart his boots +feet +femur is a good for or 5 inches taller than than the height of the seat. If your thighs are directly in front of you like that, you're pushing against them into your midsection, not fun. If that makes no sense to you, try sitting with your legs together on a childs seat.
Yeah, you're clearly seeing things ONLY as you want to see them to make sense for your argument.
You can argue this with someone else, cause I have no interest in you making stuff up that I can see aren't true.
La Principessa likes to talk. A lot. Made me buy a cellphone and everything.
Anyway, when I was still in Brooklyn, she was talking about some dude in New Jersey, a steward in the International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers (IBEW), and some of the difficulties that she's been having trying to recruit him to the revolutionary vanguard party. She tends to go on, and on, and on, at length, and I tried to quickly interject something about telling him about the work my NH commie club has been doing in solidarity with striking Communication Workers of America (CWA) and IBEW workers at FairPoint here in New England and she flipped out.
[Paraphrase] How dare you interrupt and speak over me?!? Rant, rant, rant. It's rude, self-centered and obnoxious. And you have to ask yourself, "would I be interrupting if it were a man speaking?"
So, I bit my tongue, apologized and listened to her rant for another five minutes. Then she winded down and started talking about something else entirely. Then she started talking about whatever was going on on Facebook. Finally, she says, "Oh wait a minute, what were you trying to say?" So I tell her and she brightens up. "Oh, I totally forgot, that's an excellent idea!" Yeah, I f$$!ing know.
Anyway, got back to NH and asked Mrs. Comrade about it. "Oh no, Doodlebug, you do that to men, you do that to everyone."
See? I may be a rude, self-centered, obnoxious jerk, but I'm not a rude, sexist, self-centered, obnoxious jerk.
Last night on the phone, la Principessa tried to interrupt and speak over me. I called her on her shiznit and she replied, "You. I'm so gonna get you."
Can't wait!
Btw, if you would like to help support striking phone workers of both sexes instead of arguining interminably on the internet about trendy liberal yuppie feminist bullshiznit...
For workers revolution!
Meet the ‘Radical Brownies’ – girl scouts for the modern age
Which reminds me of a video: For Communist Youth Leadership!: The Musical Interlude
RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 32
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"All passengers must produce a validated ticket upon request." That coyote ain't going far on the Hudson-Bergen Lightrail.I'm just glad this manspreading madness hasn't invaded Finland yet.Wait till you see whats trending in oregon
Only taking up one seat though. Must be a girl.
They rarely check for tickets on the Portland trains.
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"All passengers must produce a validated ticket upon request." That coyote ain't going far on the Hudson-Bergen Lightrail.I'm just glad this manspreading madness hasn't invaded Finland yet.Wait till you see whats trending in oregon
Only taking up one seat though. Must be a girl.
How specicist of you to assume the coyote doesn't have a ticket! Check your privilege, human!
(BTW isn't this kind of thing how we got wolves to evolve into dogs in the first place? Are we doing that again?)
Just got off the phone with la Principessa. Was talking more about manspreading and she told me that, some time ago (don't have a link, alas), the NYPD used to go around ticketing Metro passengers for putting their feet up on the seats.
Except that they only did it late at night when they were assured of getting exhausted immigrant kitchen workers on their way home.
I so love it when the liberal yuppie feminist gentrifier agenda coincides with the agenda of the armed fist of the bourgeois state.
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Second, the issue is one of excessive spreading, not to mention dudes taking up space in more ways than just manspreading. In that linked article, there is a blog mentioned called "Men Taking Up Too Much Space On The Train," which is either the source of this trend's blooming attention or a ready documentation of it. It is at least 50 pages long at 10 posts per page.I don't know. I looked through some of those photos and, before I got bored, I realized that there were many, many photos of dudes only taking up one seat, but, apparently, running afoul of the mores of yuppie feminists who apparently think everyone should sit with their knees pressed together because...well, if I were to guess, because that's the way they sit in college-educated, upper middle class, yuppie (white?) circles.
"Oh, look there's a picture of a dude who's obviously coming from the airport and he has his luggage next to him! What an oppressor! And there's a dude sprawled asleep! How dare these lower-class riff raff with their exhausting menial jobs interrupt my commute to the investment banking firm!"
Down with liberal yuppie feminist gentrifiers!
For mass investment in public transportation and women's liberation through socialist revolution!
While I can certainly appreciate a good critique of white, middle-class/yuppie feminism, I am disappointed in your assertion that this is an issue that's more important to investment bankers than lower-class women who have to take public transit.
Unless I'm somehow mistaken, and I didn't realize that only upper-class women are physically capable of crossing their legs. I don't fault someone for sleeping on the train if they're exhausted from a job that pays too little, or because they have nowhere else to sleep. But I think it's weird that you seem to be ignoring the male yuppies taking up space (and even if they have bags, that's what the space under the seat is for, or you can just use your lap) and the possibility of exhausted women who don't take up extra space.
Second, the issue is one of excessive spreading, not to mention dudes taking up space in more ways than just manspreading. In that linked article, there is a blog mentioned called "Men Taking Up Too Much Space On The Train," which is either the source of this trend's blooming attention or a ready documentation of it. It is at least 50 pages long at 10 posts per page.I don't know. I looked through some of those photos and, before I got bored, I realized that there were many, many photos of dudes only taking up one seat, but, apparently, running afoul of the mores of yuppie feminists who apparently think everyone should sit with their knees pressed together because...well, if I were to guess, because that's the way they sit in college-educated, upper middle class, yuppie (white?) circles.
"Oh, look there's a picture of a dude who's obviously coming from the airport and he has his luggage next to him! What an oppressor! And there's a dude sprawled asleep! How dare these lower-class riff raff with their exhausting menial jobs interrupt my commute to the investment banking firm!"
Down with liberal yuppie feminist gentrifiers!
For mass investment in public transportation and women's liberation through socialist revolution!While I can certainly appreciate a good critique of white, middle-class/yuppie feminism, I am disappointed in your assertion that this is an issue that's more important to investment bankers than lower-class women who have to take public transit.
Yeah, well, my communist schoolteacher girlfriend agreed with me, so you'll forgive me if I am not concerned about your disappointment.
And, as I already said, I cross my legs like a girl and I'm not an upper-class woman.
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Yeah, well, my communist schoolteacher girlfriend agreed with me, so you'll forgive me if I am not concerned about your disappointment.
And, as I already said, I cross my legs like a girl and I'm not an upper-class woman.
Uh, good for you, I guess? I mean, I certainly appreciate that you don't 'spread, but I don't really see what it has to do with a wider trend? Does this avatar make it seem like I'm personally accusing everyone of something?
I guess my question is: what makes you think that the condemnation of manspreading is largely the concern of (white) upper-class feminists?
At least smurf-spreading isnt a trend.... Yet:D
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So if most manspreaders are men with a lack of common courtesy, that makes it not a gendered issue because...?
If you're calling it "manspreading," you've defined it as gendered issue, just as much as if I focused solely on women with overlarge pocketbooks on public transport and called it "pursespreading."
Discourteous people have taken up more than their fair share of space on public transportation, since the invention of public transportation, and the answer to that has always been to say, "Hey, it's crowded today, is that seat taken?"
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Yeah, you're clearly seeing things ONLY as you want to see them to make sense for your argument.
If you have no counter argument other than a baseless ad hom then you have no argument. If your need for political correctness goes so far as to deny such basic concepts as two objects not occupying the same space at the same time and human anatomy then the only value I can hold for your opinion is a warning sign that says "Wrong way".
You are not fitting a second person onto the seat next to him.
You do not sit strait on a seat thats lower to the ground than your tibia is long. Who should I believe? Your mind reading skills or the feeling in my kidney?
TRY IT. Sit on a seat. Legs up on something while strait in front of you. Your thighs go into your stomach. This is a fact. Its not arguable, its not mutable, its not a concept too hard to understand and its not a reality you can dismiss with how you feel I "Want" to see them. Its reality.
I could not make a straw-man of Political correctness this bad. It's a unique combination of ignoring reality and assigning a patriarchal conspiracy to the most frivilous and innocuous of activities imaginable.
Any time feminists try to tell me that there's something going on that I can't see issues like this start running through my head.
Still waiting on those 300 pages of women taking up too much space in transit that you promised me, BNW.
Have you tried saying "Please" manners still count right?
also it never hurts to add more Smurfs:-pedit: man that Smurf is pissed:-p i assure you his mood does not reflect my own, and I'm not arguing mechapoet i just think manners need not fall by the wayside as we grow as a society:-)
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Still waiting on those 300 pages of women taking up too much space in transit that you promised me, BNW.
I don't think BNW has the same amount of free time as countless tumblr feminists who are determined to point every single disagreeable act in the world as a something that only men do...
I've been using subways all my life. I do it everyday. For every obnoxious man there is an equally obnoxious woman.
When you have buses with two-seat rows, the ugly method is to sit in the aisle seat with your bag in the window seat. To combat this effectively, all everyone has to do is target that bag seat for preference, even if the entire rest of the bus is empty. Always remember to say thanks when they move, too.
i hold my back pack in my lap, if its that crowded.
I don't think BNW has the same amount of free time as countless tumblr feminists who are determined to point every single disagreeable act in the world as a something that only men do...
I've been using subways all my life. I do it everyday. For every obnoxious man there is an equally obnoxious woman.
Well I DO but the bracket bracket spoiler link bracket thing gets boring after a while.
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It's pretty clear that BNW is just covering up for his manspreading friends.
Look at that insensitive bastard... Taking 2 seats... I bet he's related to wolf too.
I think it's funny when people refer to tumblr or tumblr feminists as if one website holds one monolithic viewpoint.
I think it's less funny, and more annoying, that it's only ever referred to in this way in order to be dismissive.
Well, men often get grouped as holding one monolithic viewpoint and/or behavior... So why should tumblr feminists be treated any differently? Why is generalizing a relatively small portion of the population worse than generalizing half of the whole human race?
Besides, calling them "tumblr feminists" is an easy way to differentiate them from women who actually care about gender equality. And you clearly understood what I meant, so the term achieved its purpose... Mission accomplished.
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I've been riding subways, trains, and busses all my life, for every woman that hogs three seats, I've seen more than a hundred men do the same.
And I've also seen quite a few courteous enough to yield their seats to someone who needs them more, like the elderly, or someone on a cane.
I've seen more men sitting with spread legs than women, due to very obvious reasons. But being inconsiderate to other passengers? That's pretty much the same all across the board... Turns out that s*%&ty people are born with all sorts of genitalia.
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I think it's funny when people refer to tumblr or tumblr feminists as if one website holds one monolithic viewpoint.
I think it's less funny, and more annoying, that it's only ever referred to in this way in order to be dismissive.
Well, men often get grouped as holding one monolithic viewpoint and/or behavior... So why should tumblr feminists be treated any differently? Why is generalizing a relatively small portion of the population worse than generalizing half of the whole human race?
Besides, calling them "tumblr feminists" is an easy way to differentiate them from women who actually care about gender equality. And you clearly understood what I meant, so the term achieved its purpose... Mission accomplished.
So what I'm understand from this is two things:
1) You want everyone to generalize equally? You recognize that a generalization of men is false when it's asserted, so that makes your own generalizations fine? I think you can do better.
2) Well, if I didn't understand what you meant before, I do now. So "tumblr feminists" don't really care about gender equality? They're not "real" feminists? Would you care to No True Scotsman harder?
Funny thing. When I sit in the formal way men are supposed to cross their legs, they take up more space than when I manspread, and my junk is more crunched.
The ventilated non-squished well-being of my jimmies objects to the attempted polemization of having a natural inclination to keep them that way.
I see it as simply a matter of bad manners. No sexism here.
1) You want everyone to generalize equally? You recognize that a generalization of men is false when it's asserted, so that makes your own generalizations fine? I think you can do better.
Nope. But if you're going to generalize, then don't complain when others do the same.
2) Well, if I didn't understand what you meant before, I do now. So "tumblr feminists" don't really care about gender equality? They're not "real" feminists? Would you care to No True Scotsman harder?
Feminism is supposed to be about equality. And I wholeheartedly support that goal. There are many feminists who want the same and actually work to make the world a fairer place...
...Then there is tumblr feminists.
They don't really care about gender equality. They are more worried about being seen as martyrs and victims than actually doing anything to make sure everyone has the same rights, obligations and opportunities.
Their idea of feminism is doing stuff like harassing a scientist because he used a shirt with picture of sexy women... Or maybe taking overall lack of manners in public transportation, labeling it as a gender issue and pretending only men are inconsiderate to other people.
Tumblr feminism might be real feminism. But it's not a feminism I can respect.
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Yeah, you're clearly seeing things ONLY as you want to see them to make sense for your argument.
If you have no counter argument other than a baseless ad hom then you have no argument.
You haven't yet actually provided proof of anything you've said. You keep making claims and stating opinions, but you haven't really provided proof.
To this point, you sound like a petulant child who is threatening to misbehave further unless his demands are met. I'm not wrong either. You make those very threats on the last post of the previous page. You point your righteous indignation at other people being inconvenienced by you and threaten to double down on the behavior in an attempt to bully your way to a victory.
This is not an ad hom. This is a fact. You very much made that threat yesterday.
Everything else just sounds like rationalization coming from you now. There's no point in arguing with someone who will do whatever mental gymnastics are required to rationalize their point, because they'll never stop doing it and it doesn't matter what I say, because it will always be rationalized.
You haven't yet actually provided proof of anything you've said. You keep making claims and stating opinions, but you haven't really provided proof.You make those very threats on the last post of the previous page
Apparently the price for embracing Epistemic nihilism is the loss of a sense of humor.
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Whenever I see people dismissing feminists on the internet as not 'real', or not respectable, feminists, I'm reminded of the way that activists have been dismissed as attention-seekers throughough history.
It's possible to come to a different conclusion than the 'tumblr feminists' without dismissing their seriousness.
There may be biological reasons for some folks to spread out. It does not apply to the vast majority of those I see spreading those lower wings.
unless you are checking the meat and two veg of everyone you see, I am going to place this firmly in the bs category.
Just got off the phone with la Principessa. Was talking more about manspreading and she told me that, some time ago (don't have a link, alas), the NYPD used to go around ticketing Metro passengers for putting their feet up on the seats.
Except that they only did it late at night when they were assured of getting exhausted immigrant kitchen workers on their way home.
I so love it when the liberal yuppie feminist gentrifier agenda coincides with the agenda of the armed fist of the bourgeois state.
long, long time ago. I think you would have been too youNG to do it in the street or anywhere else.
There may be biological reasons for some folks to spread out. It does not apply to the vast majority of those I see spreading those lower wings.unless you are checking the meat and two veg of everyone you see, I am going to place this firmly in the bs category.Seriously? Is this really a thing? Men really can't sit with their legs together?
How come I, who am a man for the record, possessing the relevant parts, have never noticed?
I'm not exactly a small person and I do tend to sprawl out when I can, but if it's crowded, I am still quite capable of making room without fuss or trouble. It might be less comfortable than sprawling, though not really for any reason related to my genitals, but not so much that I'd put other people out for my comfort.
there's a difference between not spreading out and pinching your genitals. In my experience it depends on the type of train you're on.
I'm not exactly a small person and I do tend to sprawl out when I can, but if it's crowded, I am still quite capable of making room without fuss or trouble. It might be less comfortable than sprawling, though not really for any reason related to my genitals, but not so much that I'd put other people out for my comfort.
My legs don't go that way. Putting them together while sitting down actually takes a bit of effort and is a good bit of pressure down south.
On the other hand i can sit indian style no problem (doing it now in fact) and can scratch behind my ear with my foot.
Uh, good for you, I guess? I mean, I certainly appreciate that you don't 'spread, but I don't really see what it has to do with a wider trend? Does this avatar make it seem like I'm personally accusing everyone of something?Yeah, well, my communist schoolteacher girlfriend agreed with me, so you'll forgive me if I am not concerned about your disappointment.
And, as I already said, I cross my legs like a girl and I'm not an upper-class woman.
It was in response to this: "Unless I'm somehow mistaken, and I didn't realize that only upper-class women are physically capable of crossing their legs."
I guess my question is: what makes you think that the condemnation of manspreading is largely the concern of (white) upper-class feminists?
I thought Citizen K(e)rensky's answer was sufficient for this one. If not, I can come back to it.