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1: Crossing a Bridge
2: Casting floating disk
3: Spending 10 minutes casting major creation to create a 1000 lb rock
4: You wait 10 hours for the floating disk to wear off or cast dispel magic to dispel your own floating disk
5: 1000lb of rock drops 3 feet onto a bridge and likely does NOTHING. Because from 3 feet, 1000lb isn't going to deliver enough force to bust a bridge unless it's some rickety rope bridge.1: I'm with ya
2; I'm with ya
3: Ok then
4: alot of gm's just let you dismiss beneficial spells.
5: Look up impact force. 1000 lb's gets a lot of force, very quick. aka dropping half a small car onto a bridge does a lot unless its a very big bridge.F=1/2 M * V^2
acceleration=32 feet/sec^2
V= 32*t
Change in height 3 feet, initial velocity 0, standard acceleration
0= (1/2)*-32*t^2+0*t+3
3=16*t^2
3/16=t^2
t=3^.5/4 or if you prefer just shy of half a second or so.So V = 16 Ft/s. A lbm=lbf so
F=500*(16)^2=500*256 and you know where thats going or if you prefer metric5400 KN approximately. And for perspective lifting 1 kg (a little over 2 lb's) 1 meter (a little over 3 feet) is 1 KN
Pretty sure your maths is wrong Tomas.
For starters, 1 N = 1 kg*m/s^2 under SI units.
So 1000lb works out to be about 500kg (actually less but im rounding up)
Acceleration is the change in speed over time. It starts at 0m/s. At 1 metre of height(3 feet, again with rounding) it will reach a speed of roughly 1 metre/sec since this is roughly 1/10 of 10 metres which is the value by which speed changes every second on earth. (Not sure about Golarian but I believe it's similar). Unfortuanately it also takes only 1/10 of a second to do that. So acceleration becomes 10m/s^2 (or teh value of gravity)
So, when force = mass X acceleration
You get F = 500kg X 10m/s^2
That means only 5000 newtons of force, or 5 KN. Hardly enough to break a bridge, but probably enough to crush someone lying on the ground.
By the way, the formula 1/2*m*V^2 is used to calculate the amount of Kinetic energy, not force.
In this case, 1/2*500kg*(1m/s)^2 = 250 Joules of energy. The 1m/s comes from its final velocity.
Sorry mate, but the maths just doesn't staack up.
If teh bridge is so flimsy it cant hold the combined weight of around 6 well built people in armour (around 500kg I reckon) then it probably wouldve fallen down before folks reached it anyway.
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Ha, that's exactly what I was thinking for you :). Sorry about that, I wasn't planning on using the physics maths for just that reason.
If we want impact force for a falling object we use
F = m*G*h/s (mass, gravity,height and stopping distance). This is the same as yours btw, since Gravitational and kinetic are essentially the same with little drag as would happen in this instance.
For the intents of this, lets assume a stopping distance of 0.1 metre.
This gives a value of 49000 Newtons, or 49KN
I guess if we make stopping distance 1cm (not unreasonable since its a bridge, and the boulder won't roll far so we can ignore non perfect transference) we start getting in the ballpark of 500KN. This is pretty close to your original answer, so guess I stand both corrected and humbled. I also appoligise for the original tone of post above. When I read over it again I realised it sounded condescending. Not intentional, just poorly worded.
This is what happens when you make assumptions about someones level of maths on a forum. I bow to your better physics my friend
/bow.
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@Original Poster:
Most GMs expect the players to interact with the scenes (as opposed to just stealth, steal beer and run). That's basic improv, you don't just ignore or negate what's happening, you interact. This is why your GM is baffled. Now to be fair he is dropping many of his hooks quite clumsily in front of you but that can be attributed to many factors.
Essentially when you make a character, don't build someone who only looks out for his own interests, because that's incredibly boring and hard to hook. It basically means the GM needs to imperil you personally to get you to interact with adventures the GM writes. Try playing a character who says "Yes" or "Yes and".
Take the barfight, you needn't have asked the GM how well you knew the guy you could just say: "Hey that's my friend and he needs my help!" and jump into the brawl. Or even: "Hey, I know that guy and he owes me a beer!" and then jump in and protect the guy long enough that he can buy you a beer.
When you see a wizard being dragged down the street you say: "Yeah, and I am going to find out where they're taking him." Then follow the officers surreptitiously. Basically instead of "do nothing" or "walk away", try saying yes and jumping into the action. Because you know... it's kind of why we have the game.
Disclaimer: I am in no way judging your play style, and your character choices. I just notice a pattern of the GM offering and you not taking. In addition it may be important to talk to your GM about the kind of hooks that WILL bait your character into action.
Did you ever see Bill and Ted's Excellent Adventure?
If you did you'd know that twinkies give Ghengis Khan a huge sugar rush so he can kick ass. Imagine what it could do to Player characters?
I actually have a Barbarian who Rages by eating a Twinkie... I am planning a Viking that does the same thing.
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About 37 years ago my friends were playing an all night session of AD&D. Our DM decided he would roll out his newest dungeon for us, at this special occasion. We were first level and mucking about until we came to a small room, 10 foot square, that had a sliding door. Inside it was bare except for a metal panel with a bunch of buttons. We all piled in and my character hit the bottom button. Our DM looked like his teeth nearly fell out. He stammered, "Are you SURE you want to do that?"
We arrived at the bottom on another plane, hell- to be exact. Standing there was an elegantly dressed man with a large black mace with a huge ruby at the end. He introduces himself as "Asmodeus". My character asked if he was interested in a soul. At that point my partner grabbed my character, pulling him back into the 10x10 room and hit the top button. The door closed as the dude was yelling something unintelligible. We got out of the "elevator", and, thinking we had escaped ran out of the dungeon only to find him standing in the cave entrance.
"You promised me a soul!" He yelled at me. I stammered, remembering he was Lawful Evil. "Well, Sir, your lordship, um, I only asked you if you would be 'interested' in a soul! I never promised you a soul." He teleported away, but left blackened footprints permanently in the stone of the cave entrance.
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I had a player that wanted to start a shoeshop... I didn't see that comming... So I later had the antagonist burn it down... Plenty of player statisfaction when they finally managed to kill him (he kept running away when the players got to close). In his final lair i put an emty tresure chest - and next to it alot of bills for mercenaries the antagonist had sent after the party... (they were ahead of WBL)...
Imperial Units are annoying... I still find it funny that a Foot is simply the average length of the feet of the Men coming out of Churches in a single city.
Seen a dm get baffled when through my char, I wanted to rp and do weird stuff instead of magic item shopping.
I'm not here for the economics.
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Forgive me, but how does one do damage with Major Creation?The obvious way would be to create "a sphere, total volume 9 cubic feet, of a single rare metal with a density between that of gold and platinum"
Given that there are four elements you'll get (Plutonium, Neptunium, Rhenium, Roentgenium) , three of which will cause a massive nuclear explosion, there'll be a lot of damage output. Naturally, if you end up with Rhenium, simply cast it again, specifying "a sphere, total volume 9 cubic feet, of a single rare metal with a density between that of gold and the previous metal I created".
That's something that an aspiring alchemist, attempting to transmute gold into platinum, might do by accident...
I'm no scientist...but I'm pretty sure Plutonium doesn't "Just explode." I'm pretty sure you actually have to yknow...smash the atoms.
Now, if you can make an atom smasher with Major creation, it might be possible, but I think that might be beyond the spell.
I don't see it on your skill list. Neuroscience and cyborg technology is also not there or available.
:D
PC goes to great lengths to create a nuclear bomb in Pathfinder.
Fights a Balor immune to fire.
Now let's hope for the balor he's also immune to force/sonic damage (blast wave) and radiation poisoning.
When comparing Golarion to the real world the only possible conclusion for everything is "A wizard did it!"
I mean, it's pretty clear science doesn't apply with all the cross-species cross-breeding going on (if they're truly just races I'm looking forward to my Gnome|Cloud Giant cross-breed). So yes, maybe things like potassium don't exist, or oxygen for that matter since I can't remember it being specified what people breath it's always listed as "air" or even "water". Carbon probably doesn't exist either, since it isn't specified anywhere.
The problem is the imagery that is created is based on what we know and our minds and those are pretty much rooted in organisms built on the same standard building blocks. You can say the humans don't need potassium but a human being without that isn't a human being. Once again, the only solution is "A wizard did it!" but that basically is the same as saying it's nonsense (which it actually is, but that's beside the point)
EDIT: Oops, I think I strayed a bit far off topic.
On-topic I have to say the weirdest look from my GM I got was when I received a wish from him and proceeded to wish for all Orcs in existence to be turned into perfectly ordinary penguins.
Mithril could be Aluminum or some alloy thereof.
Playing with the properties of items can be great fun. As is turning high ac monsters into useful armour and weapons.
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If you need to do calculus or physics equations in your game..you're wrong. Just eyeball it and make a decision. If I want to do unnecessary math I'll go play Hero system.
Actually, we're not wrong at all. You're just the wrong fit for our table.
Sometimes I set problems and traps that can't be solved by a skill roll. My friends all have degrees of some form or another. As dm I would often throw in stuff that tapped into their knowledge system as a player, not a character, and let them use this to solve situations.
It's what I called player stimulus rather than "player rolls a dice".
Given that most, if not all, the players at my table enjoy mental puzzles and tasks, I would not consider this wrong.
If you want to simplify the game, feel free. Please don't paint the rest of us in your simplistic approach though. There are many ways to play this game, and many ways that players gain enjoyment from a situation. Some folk just want to roll dice and move on, others like to solve the situations themselves. It is afterall a game for the enjoyment of you and your friends, and that means you can do what you want with the system to make it fun.
Cheers
I've got one. The game we're in has taken a decidedly dark turn. The kind of dark turn that makes public executions into festival events and you're afraid of the different cotton candy flavors.
The party has only just arrived in this time period(we fell asleep in a tunnel that basically put us into stasis) and manage to get an old, nearly abandoned castle all to oursleves.
My character is a changeling(the 3.5 version) child who, due to recent events, has developed another personaility to deal with the fact everythings going bat$#!% evil. So now she goes around as a very beautiful adult and acts like it. She's also very evil. So what is the first thing she does with this gray, grim, and dingy castle?
She paints it PINK. Because pink is the new evil.
On-topic I have to say the weirdest look from my GM I got was when I received a wish from him and proceeded to wish for all Orcs in existence to be turned into perfectly ordinary penguins.
Did the half-orcs become a race of flightless bird-men?
We were playing a campaign of evil PCs, during a "Mexican Standoff" (that ended peacefully) I invited one of our enemies to visit my local temple. I was playing a Cleric of the local CE God of Destruction. Upon visiting it, the NPC commented that it was very messy, and asked if we ever had a janitor come in. I replied, without a pause, that we had eaten one the previous week. Oddly my character was a great chef in the game.
The same character got himself hired to cater a gathering at a feast for the local God of War. The GM was big into giving granted powers to the clerics, one of mine was the ability to use Dissension's Feast once a week. I used it while cooking their feast. Surprisingly they asked me to cook their next feast, but to not use the Dissension's Feast, their feasts were rowdy enough without my help.
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@Kmal2t,
Again your dismissive tone is somewhat offensive. The problem above took me less than 2 minutes to solve. It took longer to type this paragraph to you. So "getting bogged down" doesn't really happen.
As for describing the medical details of cloud kill, that's exactly the type of descriptive details we put in our games. After a heal check, I can describe the body as having died of asphyxiation, with obvious signs of bleeding from the throat and mouth and the slight astringent odour of Ozone and Chlorine in the air. If a player works this out to be an effect similar to the chlorine gas attacks of WW1 and then figures this to be a Cloud Kill or similar effect, then I'm going to reward them for it, as opposed to making them just roll for it.
The detail that can go into a game is only limited by the experiences of the players that participate. My players enjoy it when the things they have learned in real life actually apply to the game. I have significant knowledge in Biology and Ecology, so as much as possible I include facets of those in my games so players feel a sense of connectedness to the world. Obviously I apply the principles of our world ecology, or physics, or chemistry or geology and set them through the lens of th game world, but this adds a layer of consistancy many people in the games I've dm'ed really enjoy.
For my kids and nephews, who are all less than 9 years old, I run a 4th ed game where I set problems they have to solve through reading, math or science knowledge of their level. They love it! It makes them feel great when they can solve a problem and show us all what they've been learning.
By all means roll your dice and let that solve the problems your characters face. I understand for many that is the ultimate in verisimiltude. But for myself and the groups of folks I run with, we like a little more depth than that in our games.
Obviously, your milage may (and in your case apparently does) vary.
Cheers
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I'm not trying to take away from what you're saying of including an element of intellectual challenge into the game..I could just foresee that causing issues of slowing the game to a crawl when people disagree on how the physics problem was solved (like on here) or having conflicting diagnoses of an ailment etc. If you can keep a good game pace while doing that then good on you. It's definitely meshing player knowledge and char knowledge significantly (and making int scores less valuable in some respects), but I can see how that could work for some people.
Thanks, and I do agree about the meshing of knowledge. I guess that stems from our history of gaming coming from Dragon Warriors, then to 1st ed Warhammer Roleplay then on to Earthdawn before we came across 3.0 DnD.
Those games never had the problem solving "Roll for success" or "Roll for clues" that DnD has now, so we had to do more of this applying player knowledge etc.
We tend to solve the problem out of character, then have the most likely character to actually know the answer in game say it. Not exactly immersive, but it works for us.
Again, thankyou for the much nicer tone of response. I sometimes find it hard to read the tone of a posters message on the forums, and we all know how that can work out :).
Cheers
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Usually, I find that when I play a PC, the DM gets messed up once they think they have me backed into a corner, or when they are certain someone MUST respond in a certain way to a given situation. The more danger my PC is in, the more befuddled the GM is when I pull a rabbit out of my hat, so to write. One DM compared me to a damned Super Saiyan. Just when he thought he had me dead to rights, I "pull more power out of my butt".
There is always a means of escape.
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There is always a means of escape.
Sort of. Often, I have to MAKE one.
Classic example: Once I was playing a game of Robotech, and I was a VT pilot. I did something so lunatic the GM STILL talks about it.
Basically, I really really peeved off a huge horde of Zentraedi battlepods by humiliating one of their leaders repeatedly (kept shooting out his ride from underneath him). Woulda flicked them off, but didn't know their culture that well.
This would normally mean my death. Me, I just egged them on, more and more, while the GM told me that the SDF-1's main cannon was going to fire directly in my area. Even used a Southern twang for calling them out and played "The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly" theme song on the comm line. At the last minute, I rode my engines for all they were worth, juking as much as possible. Just barely outside the blast, I still took damage.
I landed my VT while it was smoking and nearly red hot. Paint job was gone. But I had wiped out a record number of battlepods, all in a desperate attempt to slow the Zentraedi overwhelming numbers down.
See what I mean? The GM thought I was bonkers.
Mithril could be Aluminum or some alloy thereof.Yeah, I suppose it's theoretically possible they have naturally existing alloys that are lighter and stronger than steel. Not likely, but possible. Our planet just didn't happen to form with any, I guess.
The skymetals are harder to write off.But why bother? Why try to cram it all within the same scientific rules we live in, when it so obviously doesn't?
There are a couple of known, readily available metals in the earth's crust that are stronger than steel. The most commonly used one, which is what the SR-71 Blackbird spy plane was made from, is titanium.
An alloy of titanium (aluminum or magnesium would be good candidates) could very well be a reasonable facsimile of "mithril".
Up until about 60 years ago aluminum was exceedingly expensive because there was no cost effective way to mine and purify it. Titanium is still very expensive to mine and purify. So it would stand to reason that in a PF world (assuming elements as we know them even exist) the ability to mine, purify and alloy aluminum and titanium to create a super light, super strong metal would be a closely and carefully guarded secret.
Considering Lycanthropy is a Mental Condition yes. An Aluminum or Titanium weapon does kill a lycanthrope. As does a steel weapon.
Ironically, Silver is the worst material to make ammunition out of.
Considering Lycanthropy is a Mental Condition yes. An Aluminum or Titanium weapon does kill a lycanthrope. As does a steel weapon.
Ironically, Silver is the worst weapon to make a weapon out of.
Nah, silver is harder and stronger than copper or gold.
Fixed it.
The main reason is Silver ends up pitted and is horrible for its Accuracy.
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I remember gamer friends who would include things like statues made of pure sodium and random tanks of propane and stuff in their games, but it always rubbed me the wrong way. I guess I'd just prefer that wizards in my fantasy game conjure horrible monsters from other realms and throw infernal fire from their hands, rather than summoning up a bunch of Californium-249 or whatever and killing everybody with radiation burns.
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Our group played all the way through the Realm of the Fellnight Queen module only to agree to realease her evil armies into the world in return for her and her minions forever leaving their home town unmolested.
So yeah, they saved the town and doomed the world. One of the PCs, a ruthless shadowdancer, even married the Fellnight Queen to seal the deal. Another PC, disgusted at the actions of the rest of his fellows, stormed out of the Queen's castle. He later came to lead the resistance against her forces out of personal shame for allowing it all to happen.
A far cry from the expected "kill the BBEG, stop the invading forces of darkness, and save the world" trope.
Best game ever.