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First of all, this is for PFS, so 20 point by sticking to the PFS rules. It'll be starting at level two thanks to GM credits and working its way to level 12. It's more a rough sketch and a build that I need cleaned up.
I'm trying to make an unarmed swordsman. What I'm looking at is Kensai Magus for the int to AC, but for the additional defense a 1-2 level dip in MoMS is looking good too. I'm also wondering if duelist is worth it. The weapon choice is bugging me a bit too. Right now I'm using a temple sword, but the question is, do I crit fish as a Magus, or is the spell progression so weak I should go with Falcata? If I pick these, I can't go duelist. If I dervish dance with scimitar, I burn two feats, and can't piranha strike, and I'd probably lower strength more, and lose out on power attack.
So here's what I've got so far.
MoMS(2) Kensai (x) Duelist (?) Garuda-Blooded (Plumekith) Aasimar true speaker alternate ability.
Stats:
Str 15
Dex 16 (14 +2)
Con 12 (I'm ok with putting 10s on Con even, but unarmored melee character I'd like at least a 12, but the goal is to not get hit)
Wis 16 (14 +2)
Int 14
Cha 7 (yes I dump stats, especially charisma, but with something this MAD I need the points)
Feats: these are something I'm very unsure of, because I just don't know the feats.
Style feats: Snake and Crane are what I'm looking at. With a 2 level MoMS dip I get Crane Style and Crane Wing for the deflect an attack and possible fighting defensively. Snake style gives me the immediate action sense motive AC. If I wanted more offensive output I could get the retlaliatory feats as well, but snake is limited to unarmed strikes.
My big question for feats is what is the proper balance between offense and defense?
I'm sorry if this is long and confused. This is still a fledgling build that needs a ton of help.
TL;DR What do I add to the build and take feat/class-wise to make a cool, fairly effective unarmored swordsman.
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Honestly, I'd strongly advise against Magus/Monk, as it makes you intensely MAD. Additionally, having a high Str (or Dex, if you're going Dervish Dance) and Int as a Magus is far more important than getting Wisdom for the Monk AC bonus.
Really, the build you posted is not going to do well at all. Your Int is low, which means low DCs on your touch spells, your Con is really low with almost no AC to back it up, both your Dex and Str are low, which will make it harder to hit/damage things, and it's really just all over the place.
I would strongly suggest taking a look at Walter's Guide to the Magus for some info.
Im playing a magus kensai/bladebound
That with the silk armor is all you need.
I'm playing the following build as a hexcrafter magus
Tengu Magus
Replace Blade Training with Claws (which effectively gives IUS for free)
STR 15, DEX 16, CON 11, INT 15, WIS 14, CHA: 8
0th: Desperate Focus
0th: Reactive
1st: Deflect Arrows
3rd: Dodge; Arcane Accuracy
4th: Feral Speech, +1 CON
5th: Crane Style, Extra Arcana: Familiar
6th: Arcana: Flight Hex
7th: Crane Wing
8th: +1 INT
9th: Feat ??: Arcana: Evil Eye Hex
10th:
11th: Spell Recall, Crane Riposte
I will have the requisite 3 ranks in Acrobatics needed to turn "Fight Defensively" into -2 to hit, +4 to AC by 5th level.
My GM let me swap out Magic Weapon and Greater Magic Weapon for Magic Fang and Greater Magic Fang. GMF is going to be eating a lot of my spells, but lets me take an Amulet of Mighty Fists as things other than enhancement bonuses.
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With your temple sword, why not try a monk (Weapon Adept)? Two-Hand flurry your way making Musashi proud!
This was the first build I was considering, but I didn't feel like making a pure monk. I'm not entirely sure why. I think I prefer imagining him more Duelist style, like the old 3.5 duelist, even if he is casting a few spells. If I could find a weapon that didn't kill my feats and fit in the duelist requirements, I'd probably go duelist too, but as of now I probably won't. And since I am probably staying Kensai, I already get weapon focus, making me lose stunning fist (which frankly does nothing for this build) and evasion for perfect strike, which doesn't add up.
I'm playing the following build as a hexcrafter magus
Tengu Magus
Replace Blade Training with Claws (which effectively gives IUS for free)
Pardon me, but I'm going to be frank here. I don't see how this has any relevance at all to an unarmored SWORDSMAN. Not to mention, hex crafter doesn't stack with kensai (although I really wish it did). Also, I said I wanted this PFS legal, which would not allow houseruling the GMF.
As for the other responses, Nunsca, thank you, I know it's probably better in the end, but especially short term, which is when I'm most vulnerable, the +3 wisdom combined with mage armor, probably with a wand, is going to fit better than an armor that won't impede but will need to be enhanced to +3 just to compete with mage armor (although silk armor will always be there, even in an ambush).
Honestly, I'd strongly advise against Magus/Monk, as it makes you intensely MAD. Additionally, having a high Str (or Dex, if you're going Dervish Dance) and Int as a Magus is far more important than getting Wisdom for the Monk AC bonus.
Really, the build you posted is not going to do well at all. Your Int is low, which means low DCs on your touch spells, your Con is really low with almost no AC to back it up, both your Dex and Str are low, which will make it harder to hit/damage things, and it's really just all over the place.
I would strongly suggest taking a look at Walter's Guide to the Magus for some info.
I understand the build is MAD, which was one of my fears, but I'm confident I've minimized it. Yes there's no 18s, and no it can't compete with a 2H fighter in terms of damage, and they (the fighter, not the enemies) can still probably hit me, but that's not the big thing for me. I don't plan on using too many spells with DCs. Most touch spells don't have a DC, and is why a touch is required instead. I know full well how to make a Magus, and I generally consider myself very good at building characters. I posted a rough sketch up here to try and get some opinions to make it a bit more functional, and some advice on how heavy I should go damage (power attack), to hit, or defense (dodge and such). I don't feel that a 12 con is bad, personally. Most likely my Magus favored class points will go into HP. The only time I've ever had a PFS death is when my character played up, a level 2 in a 3-4, and we encountered a pretty hard fight with a large(or medium, I can't quite remember) air elemental. I got surprise, and then won initiative, downing my character in the first combat before I could act (for the record, my 4th level character would have died too). At 2nd level I have a 16 AC, generally bad for a front liner yes, but I can deflect one attack, and fighting defensive, which will hurt my attacks, boosts it more. At 4th it's an AC 18, 22 with mage armor up, which is pretty good. Add in feats like dodge and it's pretty solid.
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Honestly, if you are not planning on using spells with DCs, I don't think Magus is really a good idea. It's just not built to fight straight up.
I think a Lore Warden going into Duelist might be more what you're looking for, combined with Dervish Dancer. But the Magus is built around delivering spells through their weapon.
I'm not saying you can't make this work, but I think it's going to be really tough and likely not worth the effort.
Also, remember that Magi don't actually get Mage Armor on their spell list, so you need a feat or having someone else casting it on you to get it.
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Honestly, if you are not planning on using spells with DCs, I don't think Magus is really a good idea. It's just not built to fight straight up.
I think a Lore Warden going into Duelist might be more what you're looking for, combined with Dervish Dancer. But the Magus is built around delivering spells through their weapon.
Most of the touch spells that I've seen, like shocking grasp or frostbite, don't require a DC. The only reason why I was making it a magus at all was the kensai seemed to fit the unarmored theme. Lore Warden still uses armor. I guess I could always just wear armor under clothes, but it seems to be defeating my overall goal. I do understand that goal is difficult to achieve and have effective, though.
Also, remember that Magi don't actually get Mage Armor on their spell list, so you need a feat or having someone else casting it on you to get it.
This is a shock to me. I guess I just assumed it was on the list, silly me. I may have to always use this character with another arcane caster, or possibly find a way to have UMD work with my dumped CHA. Shield is a possible alternative, although the shorter uptime will certainly burn more wand charges.
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Lore Wardens are generally very High-Dex characters, so you could totally pull off the unarmored bit with them, though probably not as reliably as a Kensai could.
I think Magi get Shield, but that's a minute per level buff, as opposed to Mage Armor's hour/level. Magi don't get Mage Armor because the default assumption is that they'll be wearing armor, since all the other Magi archetypes can cast while wearing at least light armor.
Potions of Mage Armor might be a useful stop-gap for when you aren't playing with someone who could use a wand of it.
Dot.
Isn't the aldori swordlord the perfect class to take if you want to be a Swordman?
With a dip into kensai you'd add some magic and thus more options to the build, in addition to a point of AC or two.
Start wich kensai for ewp duelling sword and wp duelling sword, taking dodge as starting feat, then go to Aldori. Take your fighter bonus feat for weapon finesse if you want to go that route.You will not have crane style untill level 3 but that is only one level you have to play without it.
For 3rd level you could take another level kensai for spellstrike or go on with Aldori to get those abilities as soon as possible.
In the beginning you might need armor with this build but later on you'll do fine without it.
At level 8 (kensai 1/aldori 7) fighting defensively will give you +4AC at no penalty to hit, doing a full attack with the duelling sword will give you +2 AC at that level, +1 for dodge, +1 from kensai int to AC so you'll have armor like full plate without max dex and armor check penalty.
And the best is it stacks with worn armor. So for tough fights you can add say +5 for a +1 chain shirt.
I didn't add in dex to AC in the example above.
I would like to second the swordlord achetype. Mine is built with 2 levels of Monk (MoMS, Hungry Ghost, Sacred Mountain) thrown in. While I do use light armor, my AC is in the 30s by level 7-8 fighting defensively at all times (with no penalty) and using Snake Style/Fang and Crane Wing/Riposte to up my AC, deflect attacks and strike back at enemies who miss me.
BTW, if you DO make a swordlord, don't fall into the trap of trying to make a finesse build. Just use it as a two-handed, power attacking weapon and remove one hand at the end of your turn to get all your defensive abilities.
I'm trying to make an unarmed swordsman.
The true master of the sword does not even need one.;-)
TL;DR What do I add to the build and take feat/class-wise to make a cool, fairly effective unarmored swordsman.
Ah. Ok.
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The true master of the sword does not even need one.;-)I'm trying to make an unarmed swordsman.
No Sword Style!
TL;DR What do I add to the build and take feat/class-wise to make a cool, fairly effective unarmored swordsman.Ah. Ok.
Spellcheck doesn't like me or unarmored. I must not have caught that one oops.
And thanks by the way, I'd forgotten about the sword lord, even though I used to want to make one. It's definitely a better bet than kensai, and will work for duelist, along with the PrC if I do go finesse.
In my high-tier PFS group, we've got a guy who went sword-lord/finesse build...and after the first fight GMs either ignore him or make sure some effect that takes him out of the fight is thrown his way.
Same way my Magus character tends to only ever get shot at once in PF games once they realize he's got Deflect Arrows. After that, he's never targeted for the rest of the scenario.
I cant speak of pfs legal because i dont play pfs, however, in the past ive gone sohei-1/kensei-X and its worked very well for me, using an aldori dueling sword and taking the related feats to add to ac. This may be a different option from your temple sword to look into but it is feat heavy