Here's what I assume happened during the design and/or development of this discovery:
Original Author: "Ok, so I got this order from Paizo to write some really weird, $%#^ed up $%^t in Ultimate Magic for the alchemist. Hmm...tentacles! Yea! How can I make it interesting?... Grab attack! That's something very few player options grant, and it has a very good effect too. But perhaps it's too good. It's basically Super Greater Grapple, since it lets you do damage and grapple for free. How can I balance this so that the alchemist isn't able to grapple with no AoOs, a +4 bonus, and doing damage too every single round of combat against medium or smaller enemies for the price of one discovery?"
Original Author: "Oh I know! I'll make it not able to be used like other natural attacks. That way the alchemist will have to reduce their normal attack routine by one to use this, messing up their damage potential for the ability to do some minor damage and grapple. This will also help reduce the alchemists ability to stack many natural attacks, since feral mutagen is already pretty powerful."
And so it happened.
A year later, there was a minor flare up on the forums about how this worked, and then a developer came by and explained how it works, since it's a bit wonky as compared to other things.
The End.
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Allow me to rephrase: Why is this discovery so terrible?
Your editorializing doesn't make me inclined to answer you.
Just because you don't see a way to exploit it for extra damage doesn't mean the discovery is "terrible" or even a bad choice.
Just because something isn't an optimal choice for some PCs doesn't mean it's a bad choice.
And, mind you, this discovery wouldn't have to be worded the way it is if the PF rules weren't so weird about combining or differentiating unarmed strikes and natural attacks, but that boat has sailed.
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on a sort of related note, if you don't mind clearing something for me Sean K Reynolds.
When you have a full attack option like two weapon fighting, how does adding additional attacks, like claws/bites, and then other options like ring of rat fangs etc work.
Duskblade and I had a monk argument awhile back and I was a bit stunned to think somehow a fighter could pull out three more attacks than a monk can just because of natural attacks from items and racial features.
I think it went something like greater two weapon fighting + claw and maw + toothy for 8 attacks or something silly at lvl 11 or around there.
Man, look at the cool things you can do with Vestigial Arm and or Tentacle:
Arm: carry a extra weapon of a different DR type, or a readied potion or wand or rod. Use a shield and also two weapons. You can have cold iron, silver, magic and adamantium all ready to use. Same with piercing, bludgeoning & slashing. Ranged AND melee.
Tentacle: allow the alchemist to use one hand to wield a weapon, the tentacle to hold a potion, and the third hand to throw a bomb. Or if disarmed, have a ready made nasty little surprise. Have fun smacking rust monsters. If attacked by something small and weak, like a stirge- use the tentacle to Grab- which is a free grapple.
In both cases: use your main arms to wave around and distract while your tentacle/arm is doing something behind your back.
And the cost? A class feature on the level of a rogue talent.
This is roleplaying and combat option coolness of the first order.
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When you have a full attack option like two weapon fighting, how does adding additional attacks, like claws/bites, and then other options like ring of rat fangs etc work.
Core Rulebook, page 182, Natural Attacks, paragraph 3:
Duskblade and I had a monk argument awhile back and I was a bit stunned to think somehow a fighter could pull out three more attacks than a monk can just because of natural attacks from items and racial features.
If the fighter had a bite attack and two wing attacks or something like that, that would be "three extra attacks", but they're not really "extra" attacks, and not really three of them. Because if the fighter wants to use clawed hands to make claw attacks, he's using that hand for claw attacks instead of a manufactured weapon attack, so that's no net increase in the number of attacks per round.
So in most cases it's not "three more attacks," it's one (a bite or an offhand claw) or two (bite and an offhand claw), but remember that the fighter (or any character) could instead attack with a manufactured weapon in one hand (such as a short sword) and make an unarmed strike with the other, so whether the fighter is doing
short sword/claw
or
short sword/unarmed strike
isn't a big deal.
As for the monk, well, that's from the weirdness that the monk can use any part of his body to make unarmed strikes. You don't even have to decide what body part you're using. A human monk making 3 unarmed strikes per round could be doing
bite/kick/punch
or
bite/punch/punch
or
kick/kick/headbutt
and so on. And with that in mind, it makes sense that a monk with a natural attack like a claw or bite shouldn't get additional attacks per round in combination with natural attacks, because we're already counting a claw-hand as a weapon and a bite/headbutt as a weapon, just as we are for a fighter. The monk could be fighting with
bite/kama/claw
or
bite/kama/unarmed strike
or
kick/kick/kama
or
kick/unarmed strike/kama
but he's still limited to 3 attacks per round (or whatever it is for his level). When your whole body is a deadly weapon, saying "oh but I also have deadly claws and a deadly bite" doesn't make a difference because you already had deadly punches and a deadly headbutt.
As for "toothy" and "maw or claw" (which is what I assume you mean when you say "claw and maw"), I'm not sure how you're combining those because toothy is a half-orc racial trait, maw or claw is a tiefling racial trait. And even if you could combine them, and used maw or claw to gain 2 claw attacks, you're still having to use your claw-hands to make claw attacks, which means you're not using them to make weapon attacks, and you'd only be getting a bite attack from one source (even if you had something like the animal fury rage power, it's not giving you extra mouths, so you are only making one bite attack per round).
Much of this weirdness is inherited from 3E and how it drew a wiggly line between the definition and use of unarmed strikes and the definition and use of natural weapons.
I forgot about grab.
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I wouldn't let a fighter make claw/claw/bite plus knees and kicks any more than I'd let a fighter make rapier/dagger plus knees and kicks, or punch/punch plus knees and kicks.
The rules don't let you keep on adding attacks as you think up appropriate body parts to attack with, and it doesn't let you use those extra attacks just because your hands are full. The rules say you can make one attack per round, or two with TWF, and iterative attacks according to your BAB. The rules don't care if your unarmed strike is a punch, kick, or headbutt, it just cares that you get only one additional attack if you're using TWF.
If the fighter can normally use lefthand/righthand, and is instead using leftclaw/rightclaw, he can't start making kicks, knees, and headbutts in addition to those claw attacks "just because he's not using unarmed strikes."
Let's not make inappropriate comments, please.
The rules don't let you keep on adding attacks as you think up appropriate body parts to attack with, and it doesn't let you use those extra attacks just because your hands are full.
I don't think anybody here is suggesting making more UAS attacks than justified by BAB/2WF. It's just that the RAW is clear that you can add (all) natural attacks on top of iterative attacks, as long as no 'limb' conflict exists. In other words, you # of attacks is determined by ALL of your BAB/2WF + all natural attacks, with a POTENTIAL subtraction IF your iterative 'weapons' conflict with natural attacks, but depending on what natural attacks you have and what 'weapons' you choose to use, that doesn't always apply. By that RAW, I don't understand what is more controversial about claw/claw/bite+kick(iteratives) vs. gore/wing/wing/tail+fist(iteratives). Exactly what combinations of natural weapons and iteratives ARE you in favor of?
I'm not sure what exactly you would change about the RAW to match your idea...?
Is there some numeric limit on the number of natural attacks you can combine with iteratives?
What about kick/kick/bite/tail/wing/wing?
But you can't use the kicks if instead of wings you have claws?
Incidentally I think applying the 2wf penalties to iteratives when you are also making natural attacks probably would have been a good idea. Requiring a higher DEX (vs. 100% STR optimizing which synergizes w/ lots of nat attacks and no 2wf) and an extra feat to minimize the penalties seems about par for course.
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1) So, the Tentacle must replace a possible Manufactured Weapon attack, Unarmed Strike, or Natural Attack?
2) Just looking to get it clear, as long as it is replacing a possible attack, then it fine?
3) Also, even if attacking with the Tentacle alone, and you have no other natural attacks, it is treated as secondary?
Well, needless to say, I'm confused (officially).
From what I have understood (in regard to the rules), it is possible to combine natural attacks and manufactured weapons (or unarmed strikes) so long as you are willing to accept that all 'primary' natural attacks are reduced to 'secondary' natural attacks.
In other words, if you have a BAB of +6/+1, you can make 2 attacks with your 'manufactured' weapon or unarmed strike, and then if you have (lets say) a bite attack, you can also make that attack as well (at a -5 penalty at half strength of course), making this a grand total of '3' attacks.
Is this not correct?
@ Sean
For the sake of argument, lets say I have a Tengu fighter who also picked up the 'claw attacks' as a racial trait.
Therefore, at level 1, my tengu has 3 primary natural attacks (2 claws and 1 bite that deal 1d3 damage). Now, lets say for my first level feat I take improved unarmed strike and two-weapon fighting. At level 2, I also take the multiattack feat as well.
Now, from what I understand, my full round action for a 2nd level tengu fighter with the above feats and racial traits would look something like this:
2 unarmed strikes (both using my feet) that deal 1d3 damage with a -2 penalty to hit.
+
2 claw attacks and 1 bite attack that deal 1d3 damage with a -2 penalty to hit (these attacks are considered 'secondary natural attacks' of course).
In short, my total number of attacks basically equals out to be five (because I am using a different limb for my unarmed strikes, and therefore I am still able to utilize all of my natural attacks as per the rules).
Is this not the correct method (because this is what almost EVERYONE on the forums assumes that you can do)?
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1) So, the Tentacle must replace a possible Manufactured Weapon attack, Unarmed Strike, or Natural Attack?
2) Just looking to get it clear, as long as it is replacing a possible attack, then it fine?
3) Also, even if attacking with the Tentacle alone, and you have no other natural attacks, it is treated as secondary?
Here's something I find even more strange: if the 'tentacle attack' can be used in place of an unarmed strike (and the 'tentacle attack' is considered a natural weapon mind you), then from what I can tell...you can essentially make 3 tentacle attacks if you have a BAB of +11 (basically instead of making 3 unarmed strikes, you make 3 tentacle attacks instead).
Now, here's another interesting issue:
Lets say you want to combine your 'unarmed strikes' with the 'natural attacks' gained from feral mutagen (2 claws and 1 bite). However, you instead replace your 'unarmed strikes' with a 'tentacle attacks'.
Which basically (from what I understand thus far) equals this...
You can make 3 'tentacle attack' (which I assume are at your full strength modifier) in place of your 3 'unarmed strikes' + 2 claw attacks + 1 bite attack (which will all be considered primary attacks because you are ONLY using natural weapons).
From what i understand, the above method should work because you are obviously using a different body part for each of your natural attacks, and thus you are not required to sacrifice any of them.
But, as I said before, I'm starting to get the impression from Sean that natural attack don't exactly work this way (and neither does the 'tentacle' discovery either). If so, could you please explain why?
Again, I do apologize Sean if I'm not understanding you correctly, and I really do thank you for your patience.
I think he was just saying that just because you can come up with new body parts to attack with doesn't mean you get to ignore the normal limits on attacks.
If you've already used up all the attacks you can get, from TWF and whatever else, you can't just say "I get to kick too!"
In any event, I think he just answered the "Can you TWF with just unarmed strikes?" question that pops up now and then.
Maybe Im just reading too much into it. But two of his posts ago, he mentions punch punch plus knees and kicks, with the implication that you can't just add the knees and kicks to the punch / punch, sinceyou're already TWFing the punchs, and you can't just add more attacks past the normal limit.
Man, it must be weird to have people dissect your every post. How long did it take for that to become "normal"?
You do not receive additional natural attacks for a high base attack bonus. Instead, you receive additional attack rolls for multiple limb and body parts capable of making the attack (as noted by the race or ability that grants the attacks). You can make attacks with natural weapons in combination with attacks made with a melee weapon and unarmed strikes, so long as a different limb is used for each attack. For example, you cannot make a claw attack and also use that hand to make attacks with a longsword. When you make additional attacks in this way, all of your natural attacks are treated as secondary natural attacks, using your base attack bonus minus 5 and adding only 1/2 of your Strength modifier on damage rolls.
Okay, the above quote basically explains how I am combining my unarmed strikes with natural attacks. Now, as for the whole 'two-weapon fighting' with unarmed strikes issue, I would like to refer to another quote...
Greater Brawler Rage Power - Benefit: While raging, the barbarian is treated as if she has Two-Weapon Fighting when making unarmed strike attacks.
From the above quote, it appears to be perfectly legal to combine unarmed strikes with two-weapon fighting. Furthermore, being able to 'kick' with an unarmed strike is not limited only to just monks. Under the description of unarmed strikes, it specifically states that you can make a punch OR a kick.
Also, seeing as how natural attacks are not restricted by your BAB (in other words, if you have 2 claw attacks, you can attack with both of them regardless of your actual BAB...so long as you don't attempt to attack with those 'hands' using any other weapon), it would make sense (per the rules) that you can combine them with your unarmed strikes (two-weapon fighting or not).
Again, according to what I understand of the rules, you are NOT exceeding your BAB by using this method, since the number of natural attacks you can make DOES NOT depend on your BAB (as per the rules). The only restriction a 'natural attack' has is that you must be able to use the limb to make the attack, and if you do, you are not allowed to make any other attack using that same limb.
But again, if I am wrong with my interpretation, I would be more than happy to have some correct me (and if you do, please point out how all this stuff actually works instead).
Man, it must be weird to have people dissect your every post. How long did it take for that to become "normal"?
ROFL
Maybe there should be an "Ask SKR ANYTHING (except rules)" thread in the off-topic forum, just to give the man a break.
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I think the natural attacks section just is there for beastiary entries etc for the gm to be able to know what he can or can't do.
According to the rules you quoted you don't factor your BAB at all when you're doing natural attacks to determine if you're getting additional attacks, you only use your natural attacks.
Feats like two weapon fighting etc reduce the penalties for it is all, it doesn't increase the number of attacks you can make, or increase the number of natural attacks.
So if you can find a way to get a ton of natural attacks, those will all work, but you don't get to combine your BAB attacks, and two weapon fighting attacks with natural attacks.
You can substitute them for any particular attack, just not add them into an attack routine.
You kind of truncated what you were quoting so that it looked more supportive of your view. let me provide the whole quote.
Natural Attacks: Attacks made with natural weapons, such as claws and bites, are melee attacks that can be made against any creature within your reach (usually 5 feet). These attacks are made using your full attack bonus and deal an amount of damage that depends on their type (plus your Strength modifier, as normal). You do not receive additional natural attacks for a high base attack bonus. Instead, you receive additional attack rolls for multiple limb and body parts capable of making the attack (as noted by the race or ability that grants the attacks). If you possess only one natural attack (such as a bite—two claw attacks do not qualify), you add 1–1/2 times your Strength bonus on damage rolls made with that attack.
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Some natural attacks are denoted as secondary natural attacks, such as tails and wings. Attacks with secondary natural attacks are made using your base attack bonus minus 5. These attacks deal an amount of damage depending on their type, but you only add half your Strength modifier on damage rolls.
You can make attacks with natural weapons in combination with attacks made with a melee weapon and unarmed strikes, so long as a different limb is used for each attack. For example, you cannot make a claw attack and also use that hand to make attacks with a longsword. When you make additional attacks in this way, all of your natural attacks are treated as secondary natural attacks, using your base attack bonus minus 5 and adding only 1/2 of your Strength modifier on damage rolls. Feats such as Two-Weapon Fighting and Multiattack can reduce these penalties.
Lantzkev, you can combine manufactured weapon attacks with natural attacks. The part you bolded only says that you do not receive iteratives WITH natural weapons. Just because you have a claw attack and BAB 6 doesn’t mean that you get a claw attack at +6 / +1. You should keep on reading the natural attack area to see how it works when combining with manufactured / unarmed strike attack routine.
I think you're misinterpreting what he's saying. An alchemist level 2 with feral mutagen may make all 3 attacks, 1 bite, 2 claws, as long as he doesn't use his claw hands for something else.
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you mean
Creatures with natural attacks and attacks made with weapons can use both as part of a full attack action (although often a creature must forgo one natural attack for each weapon clutched in that limb, be it a claw, tentacle, or slam). Such creatures attack with their weapons normally but treat all of their natural attacks as secondary attacks during that attack, regardless of the attack's original type.
I see nothing even in the bestiary that says you get more attacks than you would get with a full attack option, all it says is that you can use the natural attacks provided that natural attack isn't occupied with a weapon.
Which meshes just fine with what SKR said.
CRB and Bestiary are saying the same thing, there's nothing in either that contradict or illuminate differently.
There is nothing in CRB or Bestiary that indicates if you have natural attacks, you magically get more attacks than two weapon fighting or a full attack option from a high BAB would provide. All the natural attacks rules spell out is that you may use a natural attack in lue of a manufactured weapon, and usually at a minor penalty.
The one thing that is clearly spelled out though is that you can make as many attacks as you have natural attacks. Nothing however says you can make as many attacks as you have full attack attacks and natural weapons combined.
No permission to do something = can't do it in this game.
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I think you are confused lantkev.
You can totally attack with all your iterative manufactured attacks, then your natural attacks, as long as those manufactured attacks do not use the same limb as the natural attack.
If I have two claws and a bite, I can attack with two Boot Blades, two claws, and a bite.
I can do this at first level.
Even Sean says you can do it: http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2mhfx&page=2?Prehensile-Hair-skill-use#66
You add it to your normal attack routine.
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yeap, how does that contradict what I've said?
Blackbloodtroll, do you have a quote from rules that state what you're saying? everything in the natural attack rules merely give you permission to either a) use all your natural attacks or b) substitute your natural attacks for your normal attack sequence.
Nothing lets you add them on top of your normal attack routine.
IE at lvl 1 you can't do 1 weapon attack + the bite + the claw + the claw
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so, you just linked me to the d20pfsrd site, to exactly the same entry I quoted from the PRD here... again there's nothing there that lets you add the two and get more attacks than your normal attack routine.
Try using quotes, because that entry in its entirety has no apparent support of your statement.
Creatures with natural attacks and attacks made with weapons can use both as part of a full attack action (although often a creature must forgo one natural attack for each weapon clutched in that limb, be it a claw, tentacle, or slam). Such creatures attack with their weapons normally but treat all of their natural attacks as secondary attacks during that attack, regardless of the attack's original type.
So if your BAB is +6/+1 and you have teeth and claws (say on a dragon disciple) you can Sword +6 / Sword/ +1/ Bite +1 (-5 and half strength for being a secondary attack) because your hands are busy swinging the greatsword you can't use your claws, but your head is free to chomp away.
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Full Attack
If you get more than one attack per round because your base attack bonus is high enough (see Base Attack Bonus in Classes), because you fight with two weapons or a double weapon, or for some special reason, you must use a full-round action to get your additional attacks. You do not need to specify the targets of your attacks ahead of time. You can see how the earlier attacks turn out before assigning the later ones.The only movement you can take during a full attack is a 5-foot step. You may take the step before, after, or between your attacks.
If you get multiple attacks because your base attack bonus is high enough, you must make the attacks in order from highest bonus to lowest. If you are using two weapons, you can strike with either weapon first. If you are using a double weapon, you can strike with either part of the weapon first.
All the rule is saying there is that you can use a natural attack in that full attack option unless the natural attack is holding a weapon, and that any natural attacks used this way are treated as secondary.
Again, there's nothing that lets you attack more than the full attack option provides.
...I am being followed again :P
Hmmm, answer me this Lantzkev...can you explain how a minotaur's full attack looks like this then:
Melee greataxe +9/+4 (3d6+6/×3) and gore +4 (1d6+2)
Well gee...a minotaur's BAB seems to allow 2 attacks...oh wait...but he can also make a gore attack in addition to that one as well.
And what do you know...a gore attack is a natural attack...in this case...it counts as secondary because he's using it with a manufactured weapon.
Gosh golly...I wonder how he gets '3' attacks if we are following 'your' explanation.
Should I continue to throw other examples of this combination as well...I mean...I've got all the bestiaries at my disposal. ;)
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...I am being followed again :P
Hmmm, answer me this Lantzkev...can you explain how a minotaur's full attack looks like this then:
Melee greataxe +9/+4 (3d6+6/×3) and gore +4 (1d6+2)
Well gee...a minotaur's BAB seems to allow 2 attacks...oh wait...but he can also make a gore attack in addition to that one as well.
And what do you know...a gore attack is a natural attack...in this case...it counts as secondary because he's using it with a manufactured weapon.
Gosh golly...I wonder how he gets '3' attacks if we are following 'your' explanation.
Should I continue to throw other examples of this combination as well...I mean...I've got all the bestiaries at my disposal. ;)
Try to avoid the condescending language please Dusk. At the end of the day, we're talking about a game. No reason to be rude to others. Thanks! :)
I do apologize if my sarcasm and humor don't translate well across the net :)
So when you read it, I assume you're reading that it gets all those attacks every time it attacks, rather than it can full attack with two attacks, using the great axe or gore or some combo there of.
When a creature must choose between two sets of attacks during a full-attack action, the statblocks always write "or".
See the babau demon, for instance: It gets either two longspear attacks and a bite attack, or two claw attacks and a bite attack.
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I don't think creatures are going to be a good way to argue for or against this though. I do see the three attacks, but again there's nothing in the rules that tell players to do this.
as an aside, it's still in parallel with a pc that would be using two weapon fighting, or slightly behind if you factor improved two weapon fighting (ie max of 4)
Creatures in bestiaries that have two-weapon fighting along with natural attacks also get to use both as part of a full-attack.
I agree that attack blocks should have been better explained in the "Monster Introduction" section of the Bestiary (particularly the fact that a comma means "and").
"but you don't get to combine your BAB attacks, and two weapon fighting attacks with natural attacks.
well, we can look at the rules that say:
You do not receive additional natural attacks for a high base attack bonus. Instead, you receive additional attack rolls for multiple limb and body parts capable of making the attack (as noted by the race or ability that grants the attacks). You can make attacks with natural weapons in combination with attacks made with a melee weapon and unarmed strikes, so long as a different limb is used for each attack.
Note ADDITIONAL. That means in addition to, not 'in place of'.
You receive additional weapon/UAS attacks for a high BAB, but that isn't affected by this rule.Creatures with natural attacks and attacks made with weapons can use both as part of a full attack action (although often a creature must forgo one natural attack for each weapon clutched in that limb, be it a claw, tentacle, or slam). Such creatures attack with their weapons normally but treat all of their natural attacks as secondary attacks during that attack, regardless of the attack's original type.
You are attacking with weapons NORMALLY, which means getting the number of attacks you normally would...
You just can't use a claw in a hand that you already used for a weapon attack (or specifically, merely HOLDING a weapon).Nothing about using Natural Weapons affects the iterative attacks themselves.
If what you believe were true, the rules would say something like 'natural attacks subtract from the number of iterative attacks you can make'. But that is never stated. The natural weapons are referred to as ADDITIONAL attacks.
THe Core Rule Book originally stated that 2WF penalties applied to all attacks when combining natural weapons with iteratives, but that was confirmed by Paizo to not be the case (intent) and the Bestiary rules were correct (and didn't have that wording).
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I wouldn't let a fighter make claw/claw/bite plus knees and kicks any more than I'd let a fighter make rapier/dagger plus knees and kicks, or punch/punch plus knees and kicks.
The rules don't let you keep on adding attacks as you think up appropriate body parts to attack with, and it doesn't let you use those extra attacks just because your hands are full. The rules say you can make one attack per round, or two with TWF, and iterative attacks according to your BAB. The rules don't care if your unarmed strike is a punch, kick, or headbutt, it just cares that you get only one additional attack if you're using TWF.
If the fighter can normally use lefthand/righthand, and is instead using leftclaw/rightclaw, he can't start making kicks, knees, and headbutts in addition to those claw attacks "just because he's not using unarmed strikes."
creature rules are not player rules. Likewise the quote
You do not receive additional natural attacks for a high base attack bonus. Instead, you receive additional attack rolls for multiple limb and body parts capable of making the attack (as noted by the race or ability that grants the attacks). You can make attacks with natural weapons in combination with attacks made with a melee weapon and unarmed strikes, so long as a different limb is used for each attack.
is saying you don't factor BAB when you're using natural attacks, you just use all that you have. If you have say 4 claws and a bite at lvl one... you could use all four claws and a bite using this rule, but you wouldn't add a regular weapon attack + 5 natural attacks.
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The natural attack rules are the same for monsters and players (unless specifically trumped):
Primary Natural Attacks use your Full BAB and do Full Strength Damage
Secondary Natural Attacks use your BAB -5 and do 1/2 Strength Damage
If you only have 1 natural attack, and it is a Primary Natural Attack, it does 1 1/2 Strength Damage
You may make all your iterative attacks, or you make make all your natural attacks, OR you can combine your iterative AND Natural Attacks.
If you chose to do this though, EVERY natural attack is typed as a Secondary attack, taking the -5 penalty to hit and the 1/2 Strength to damage.
Furthermore, if a limb with a natural attack is currently occupied by a weapon, the creature must elect to either drop the weapon and make the natural attack or forgo that natural attack and use the weapon.
For example:
A creature with a BAB of +10 has a bite, 2 claws, and a longsword. This creature also has a 20 strength:
His attacks look like this:
2 Claws +15 (1d4+5), 1 Bite +15 (1d6+5); OR Longsword +15/+10 (1d8+5), 1 Claw +10 (1d4+2), 1 Bite +10 (1d6+2).