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Every time I run a fight with a Dragon it's always a cake walk for my players. The problem is that Dragons are usually presented as solitary creatures so my players usually massacre them in short order due to action economy. A decent ranged combatant in the group and the odd mage or sorcerer and a Dragon gets pummelled mercilessly
I've threatened and killed PC's many times in the past with all sorts of creatures but when it comes to Dragons they barely survive a round.
Anyone else find Dragons a tad weak?
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I've noticed this effect time and again.
Dragons are solitary cratures, but they shouldn't be encountered before young adult or older age category;so they likely have minions or allies.
The difficulty in faicng the dragon should be mainly to it because of minions/allies/traps/dead ends in the lair etc.etc......and the GM must also control how much rest he allows the PCs to have.
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you're running them wrong.
Dragons should have multiple minions, traps, lackeys, buffs, items and enchantments well before players get there.
If you are running them as combat brutes they will get tooled.
Use the dragon's intelligence.
Spys should alert a dragon well before players get close so hired thugs, bounty hunters etc will be in the way.
Then hit and run tactics. As easy as dropping rocks from thousands of feet up to as devious or hiring a wizard to be in the lair on the day the players are due to arrive (without letting the wizard know) and coving him with an illusion...
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Every time I run a fight with a Dragon it's always a cake walk for my players. The problem is that Dragons are usually presented as solitary creatures so my players usually massacre them in short order due to action economy. A decent ranged combatant in the group and the odd mage or sorcerer and a Dragon gets pummelled mercilessly
I've threatened and killed PC's many times in the past with all sorts of creatures but when it comes to Dragons they barely survive a round.
Anyone else find Dragons a tad weak?
try messing with the dragon's feats and prepared spells, try prebuffing. try kiting, grapple all that stuff.
a smart dragon doesn't sit there and let the archer shoot him, a smart dragon should use a flyby grapple to bite, chew and swallow the archer at a safe distance with his superior speed and exploit his spells to the greatest advantage. when the archer is unconscious, you flyby projectile spit him at the arcane caster to damage both using the falling damage plus weight damage. a medium humanoid body deals like 2d6+1.5 str before factoring falling damage when used as a projectile. cleric will have to save the archer while you prepare to do the same to the arcane caster next round until you have to harm the cleric.
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It's perfectly legitimate for a dragon to say, "That guy who's shooting arrows at me and that guy who's casting spells at me both have to go." The dragon can just focus fire those guys done, either by himself or using his minions (who should be present).
The first thing I look at in a stat block when I am GMing is the mental stats. That determines how the monster plays out the entire battle.
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One note -- dragons cast as sorcerers, not as wizards, so we really should not be talking about their "prepared spells". In this case, the dragon's spells known have already been selected -- so it might be better to work out the most creative ways to use them.
What APL modifier do you run them at? Running a solitary dragon against a party gives an action economy ratio of 4:1 or worse. Additionally, players often know when they're going to encounter a dragon, giving them the further advantage of preparation. As stated previously, give dragons the benefit of their intelligence. Maybe they've heard through the dragon grapevine that this party has been slaughtering their kin like livestock, so they've taken precautions. Dragons are the iconic big bad, there's no point running them against a party unless they can put a reasonable hurt on the PCs.
One note -- dragons cast as sorcerers, not as wizards, so we really should not be talking about their "prepared spells". In this case, the dragon's spells known have already been selected -- so it might be better to work out the most creative ways to use them.
prepared spells, known spells. there isn't much difference when it comes to monsters. unlike with players.
For reference I run AP's. And tactics? That would require the dragon to last more than one round.
flyby grapple and run, complete with swallow and damage. combined with traps and minions as you wish.
well in kingmaker 6 i gave
i find the various Codex books are very good for running dragons
dragons often have quite good to hit but poor damage & the worlds worse touch AC
I hope Paizo give it lots thought if the AP where the big bad of each mod is draconic ever arises.
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http://spoonyexperiment.com/2012/09/11/counter-monkey-circle-strafe/
Think like a dragon when you pit them against your characters.
Never engage in melee combat if you can help it. If you're outside, you have the advantage. Get into the air and circle the party at the maximum range of your breath weapon, blasting them every chance the dice let you. Dragons aren't stupid, so their FIRST target should be any and all spellcasters and anyone with a ranged weapon; Wind Wall and Spell Resistance should cripple your characters even further. Dispel Magic anyone stupid enough to try flying up to you and then listen for the satisfying crunch as their bones shatter on impact.
You could take a page or two from how 4E deals with solo monsters
Ramp up the hit points
Let them have two turns in a round
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Every time I run a fight with a Dragon it's always a cake walk for my players. The problem is that Dragons are usually presented as solitary creatures so my players usually massacre them in short order due to action economy. A decent ranged combatant in the group and the odd mage or sorcerer and a Dragon gets pummelled mercilessly
I've threatened and killed PC's many times in the past with all sorts of creatures but when it comes to Dragons they barely survive a round.
Anyone else find Dragons a tad weak?
Is this issue unique to running dragons or something you have with running solitary monsters in general?
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For reference I run AP's. And tactics? That would require the dragon to last more than one round.
Can't speak to APs, as I haven't run any. Don't know how much leeway you have in modifying them to make the dragon an acceptable challenge, or even more believable.
As for combat challenges, I can only suggest things I've done. Abuse terrain horribly. Dragon lairs are specifically chosen and shaped to be safe places for the dragon and their hoard. The area should lend itself to the dragon's favored combat style, whatever that is.
For example, one with a burrow speed would likely have claustrophobic chambers isolated from each other by long stretches of solid dirt pack, some of which could be collapsed with little effort. Difficult terrain and cover would be plentiful, since attackers have a hard time arranging defensively, can't close in effectively, and take a big hit to ranged attacks (cover is effective against ranged touch), while the dragon ignores most of the penalties by attacking sandworm style. Pop in, devastate, pop out- it's like Spring Attack, only horrible.
A flying dragon might make a large chamber, devoid of useful cover- say, a chasm with bridges spanning it- so it can swoop about under the cover of illusion spells and harry the party with flyby attacks, while most of them are trapped on a small space with little mobility to work with. It is immune to paralysis and sleep (being a Dragon), so it would take some skill to knock it out of the sky (and an item of Feather Fall would give it more time to recover). It might even place some cover with specialized traps on it, to lure in flying attackers. Traps of Dispel Magic on said cover have the potential to knock down attackers relying on spells of flight.
Standing water is another terrain modification useful to most dragons. Many of them can effectively ignore it, while knee-deep or hip-deep water can seriously limit party mobility without providing much in the way of protection to them. Depending on how you have electricity interact with water, lightning breath weapons and attack magics can become even harder to avoid when the party is hindered like that. If the party is using spells to move normally or exit the water (say, Freedom of Movement or Spider Climb), those are spell slots or scrolls not doing other horrible things to the dragon (which can also be dispelled early on by clever dragons or their minions anticipating such things).
As others point out, though, well-considered minions are orders of magnitude more helpful. A dragon might have a few draconic minions specifically to complicate terrain effects, strip off magic defenses, or act as damaging distractions. Minions placed in the area around their lair can scout potential invaders, not only providing warnings, but also give some specific details about their attack method that could affect tactics (one has a dragonbane greataxe, one is carrying a holy symbol of X deity, they arrived by using magic to fly up the mountain, etc).
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If you're used to 3.5 D&D, you may find the PF dragon CR system a little jarring. 3.5 lowballed dragon CR on purpose to make dragons more of a challenge; PF went with trying to give its dragons more typical CRs for their power level. As a result, a CR 12 dragon in PF is considerably weaker against an APL 8 party than a CR 12 dragon in 3.5 would have been.
Dragons are pretty damn powerful and you can always have an older one attack the party if you just want a down and dirty combat. As others have said, remember the dragon's spellcasting ability and intelligence. Those spells make dragon tactics incredibly variable and it can be easy to throw a party off guard with an unexpected situation. Turning invisible to fly into melee range on whoever looks good at ranged combat, casting fog cloud centered on the party archers, dimension door or teleporting away to self-buff and then sneak up invisibly to remove party buffs with dispel magic or waste party resources with an illusion are also favorites.
Also, if the party is too good against solo monsters, give the dragon a mate.
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Minions. Forcing the party to burn resources slogging through the kobold lair and it's piles of devious traps before they ever even get to the dragon is a great way to even the field. A dragon of any great age has probably even cultivated it's minions to help in creating a decent defense so it won't be disturbed, so minions with class levels are well within the realm of possibility.
Then they've got to face a beast that's probably been around the block a few times, heard them crashing around and took the time to buff and set up a few surprises for the people wandering into its home.
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When I'm running an AP or a pre-written module, I certainly have the same problem. APs tend to have dragons as stand-alone encounters, creatures who are arrogant and don't feel the need to have organized followers or minions. Since you mention that your running APs, most advice about using minions is fairly useless.
For my own homebrew campaign, dragons are intelligent, have armies, guards, run kingdoms, build alliances, etc, but most pre-written adventures treat dragons like they have an intelligence of 2 rather than what they truly have. Or maybe I'm running them wrong in which, I'd like to be enlightened.
Which AP are you running that had a dragon?
Off the top of my head, I can't even recall if there was a dragon in Legacy of Fire, Serpent's Skull, or Jade Regent, which are the only other games I have (or am currently) run. I can't comment on Kingmaker or Council of Thieves as I'm playing those.
Since you said you're using the AP's, don't be a afraid to alter them, change the layout of it's lair, anything to give it an edge. Read the evil overlord's list, find out what classic mistakes and tropes you are falling to and consciously avoid them. Exercise some GM Fiat and let the dragon get the first attack.
Most of all, be the monster. A dragon wouldn't think twice about munching the cleric with 1hp, so munch him. Have a few minions, maybe even a couple of younger dragons that could engage in hit and run tactics. Have the dragon cast an illusion that makes it appear as a comely elven wench that the dragon is going to sacrifice to it's dark god and then have it attack the party in their sleep if they are munching a dragon in one round.
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http://spoonyexperiment.com/2012/09/11/counter-monkey-circle-strafe/
Think like a dragon when you pit them against your characters.
Never engage in melee combat if you can help it. If you're outside, you have the advantage. Get into the air and circle the party at the maximum range of your breath weapon, blasting them every chance the dice let you. Dragons aren't stupid, so their FIRST target should be any and all spellcasters and anyone with a ranged weapon; Wind Wall and Spell Resistance should cripple your characters even further. Dispel Magic anyone stupid enough to try flying up to you and then listen for the satisfying crunch as their bones shatter on impact.
1. When Dispelled Fly acts like Feather fall. It is in the spell text. So no shattering.
2. Spoony's players forgot resist energy was a spell...fire protection was a 2nd level in 2nd AD&D. They seemed stupid to buff up but not use that.
3. Fly spell maneuvers better than Dragon Flight.
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I don't even use dragons until they are at least capable of casting 4th level spells. I also try to use them in open terrain so they can take advantage of being able to fly. The dragon has yet to lose, well except for the Jabberwock, and that was due to the critical deck.
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"The dragon has yet to lose" is not something to be proud of. This isn't a game of Players vs. DM. It's a collaborative game of all players working together to have fun.
"The dragon has yet to lose" is not something to be proud of. This isn't a game of Players vs. DM. It's a collaborative game of all players working together to have fun.
True. But the fun is in the working for the victory. Of course the dragon will loose - it's a challenge for the party to overcome. But cakewalking everything is just as not-fun as being steamrollered.
Cheers
Mark
I don't even use dragons until they are at least capable of casting 4th level spells. I also try to use them in open terrain so they can take advantage of being able to fly. The dragon has yet to lose, well except for the Jabberwock, and that was due to the critical deck."The dragon has yet to lose" is not something to be proud of. This isn't a game of Players vs. DM. It's a collaborative game of all players working together to have fun.
While dragons are supposed to be challenging, obviously, and it is certainly reasonable to have a situation where the party needs to cut their losses and run... this is also a game where the monsters do exist solely for being taken down (although it could be an NPC that you statted out in case the party did something stupid and challenged something never meant to be taken down)
I am more questioning the unbroken win streak, more than anything myself. A VERY good win to loss ratio? Sure that is fine.
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Frankly - it always seems silly to me that dragons run around naked - not wearing any of the gear from their horde etc. For a CR 13 dragon - a ring of protection +2/AoMF +1/cloak of resis +3 isn't much wealth (a small fraction of their horde), but that and a casting of Mage Armor (most have standard) and Resist Energy to their weakness (most have standard) makes them quite a bit scarier.
If they know the group is coming have them case Shield too. How often is the archer going to hit when they have +10 AC? (Even if you don't like the idea of them wearing gear - +8 AC from Mage Armor/Shield.)
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For monsters that you want to be solo encounters, I recommend giving them a Simple Mythic template.
Agile is my favorite. Dual Initiative always surprises players and goes a long way towards making an encounter feel more epic.
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Dragons are spellcasters and not stupid. They've heard of resist energy and protection from energy. That's why they choose their attack spells to rely on different energy types then they breathe. They also figure out ways to reduce or eliminate their vulnerability if they are of the fire or cold subtype.
Dragons collect treasure. Adapting some of that for their own use is intelligent.
Disguise self and dragons breath spells will have them preparing for a different type of dragon. If you appear to be metallic, many parties will talk to you.
False lairs/hoards with traps are good. If they think they've found your hoard, they often scoop up all of those cursed items.
A couple of class levels can give a dragon a few things you wouldn't expect. Monk and barbarian are obvious choices, but there's lots of things that can be useful with a dip.
Dragons that can take human form can round a corner, shift and move into a place people wouldn't expect. Dragons that don't do this innately can use polymorph.
As stated previously, the Alarm spell is easy to do and prevents that surprise round ambush.
Kobolds worship dragons and they are useful for setting up the traps that you design. Train one to run away at the first sign of trouble to sound the alarm.
Set up a trap that is only moderately concealed. Connect that to a much harder alarm trap so that you are signaled when the first trap is disabled.
Permanency can set up some very useful spells on your lair. Almost every spell on the object/area list can be used to protect your lair.
Antimagic Field hurts your enemies more than it hurts you. Triggering one to go off in your flying escape route is very effective. When a fly spell is negated by antimagic, then they don't get the feather-fall effect. Wings don't get negated.
Golems and undead make great minions. They have a different set of vulnerabilities, so a party geared up for dragons may be suboptimal.
When you have dimension door, you can make a lair that is easy for you to get to but requires them to slog through nasty traps. With a bottle of air or necklace of adaptation, you can make one cut off from the outside. Unless they know where it is, they can't pop in.
Spend feats on initiative to avoid getting jumped completely.
Initiate conversation to give your minions time to prepare. In some cases, they don't need to kill you. Sometimes it's better for all concerned for them to pay you something for you letting them pass.
Lawful evil dragons can make deals with devils. You get a few cool perks in exchange for some favors, but the best is regeneration. If you can survive in any condition, you'll be restored in a few minutes. Collapse the whole cave - you'll dig out, and they'll be dead and buried. And if you intend to go dracolich or ravener, then you never have to pay the final price.
Every time I run a fight with a Dragon it's always a cake walk for my players. The problem is that Dragons are usually presented as solitary creatures so my players usually massacre them in short order due to action economy. A decent ranged combatant in the group and the odd mage or sorcerer and a Dragon gets pummelled mercilessly
I've threatened and killed PC's many times in the past with all sorts of creatures but when it comes to Dragons they barely survive a round.
Anyone else find Dragons a tad weak?
you're probably not giving them their horde of magic items...
oh and that archer? sunder his bow, the string has hardness 0 and you go off the weakest material when sundering. even if it's magic the HP and hardness will be very low.
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1) A dragon shouldn't be APL appropriate. Make them APL+3 or higher, and if they need a boost, throw on a template.
2) Try mythic! If you can, take a look at the mythic dragons that are presented in Mythic Adventures or Legendary Games' Mythic Dragons. If you want dragons to be powerful, these will help.
3) Minions and traps! What everyone else has said is very true. Dragons are top-tier intelligent predators, and they will use intelligent means to protect their stuff. If a player has thought of it, you can bet the 300-year-old dragon has, too.
4) Bigger, faster, stronger. Use combat maneuvers! Ever been bull rushed off a cliff by a dragon? If it can soak the AoO, it will probably win the CM check. Dragons fly at up to 200'. That's 800' with a run. Strafing tactics work wonders, and you can bet that a dragon will learn how to line up a strike and get out of Dodge. Flyby attack is your friend.
5) Four feet on the ground means you lose. No dragon in its right mind will ever actually land to fight. If the dragon has absolutely no choice but to melee (why? Fly off for a couple of rounds while your breath weapon recharges. Cast a long-range spell or two while you're at it), it will fly out of reach (it is a huge dragon, right?) and rip at one target with impunity.
6) We have you now! So, you caught a dragon in its lair. Big mistake. It knows every inch of that place, and has at least one (and probably two or more) exits it can easily fit through. Further, no dragon would make its lair a cramped living space, so you can expect the dragon to have enough room to take flight. At which point it uses that crazy insane Fly skill bonus it has to maneuver wherever it wants. Not to mention that it knows what to break to make the ceiling fall in. So what if it takes the dragon a week to recover its treasure? It lives over a thousand years. It's got time.
7) Use that treasure! So the dragon has an Amulet of Natural Armour in its hoard? It's probably wearing it. Glove of Arrow Snaring? Excellent choice, Mr Draco Horibilis. Wand of Stoneskin? Now you're just being mean. Okay, the Wand of Greater Invisibility is worse. Sure, dragons are hoarders, but they're also intelligent, sentient killing machines. They will use magic items at least as cleverly as PCs do.
In short, if you treat a dragon like a brute with some spells, it will die like a brute with some spells. They're more like the monk: able to move wherever they want to line up their awesome.
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While dragons are supposed to be challenging, obviously, and it is certainly reasonable to have a situation where the party needs to cut their losses and run...
Except in endgame encounters, retreat should always be a viable option. Characters shouldn't necessarily be able to beat something just because they encounter it, sometimes surviving it is the best you can do. If you play a dragon smartly, it should be VERY long odds for the party. An ancient red dragon, as an example, should essentially never be taken by surprise, should be extremely well prepared, and should never fight in a situation where they don't have the advantage. Any limitations they have in spells known should be made up for in scrolls. The dragon should always have things like dispel magic, anti-magic field, and mage's disjunction. A dragon would know that dedicated ranged fighters are their worst enemy, so they targeted dispel magical bows, prepare things like blink, entropic shield, and grasping hand. Wall of Force can divide the ranged fighter or the mage long enough to allow the dragon to murder the crap out of them. Hostile juxtaposition can also wreck havoc, particularly if the dragon is flying when it uses it (nothing like having the badass archer shoot himself). Limited wish, 'nuff said. They can lead with a projected image that can soften up the party as well as get them to burn spells/abilities before the dragon actually enters the fray. Maze can remove pesky characters from combat no save. Waves of exhaustion can totally ruin a party's day. The power words can be utterly devastating if the dragon has a good idea of how strong given characters are (a wizard at level 17 with max HP and a Con of 22 can only have 204 HP...a dragon would probably know this in less abstract in-game terms). And so on, and so on. A fair fight with a dragon should be very tough; and dragons never fight fairly.
Usually when I use dragons, I give the party ample opportunity to avoid the fight. 9 times out of 10 they are choosing to bring the fight to the dragon, and they have to understand that they stand a very good chance of failure. It's on their head at that point. If you play them well, dragons are essentially demigods.
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Codex Draconis books have some good advice on preparation (which would vary from one kind of dragon to another (a Red wouldn't prepare like a Blue, etc.)), along with multiple builds for every age category.
They do have a theme about certain age categories (when they're old enough to be fairly rich and powerful, but not old enough to be able to match high level parties) when dragons get a bit paranoid and get rid of their horde in exchange for gear, and Ioun Stone crowns are cool...
Um. most every dragon has a 200+ movement speed and flyby attack. Just have the dragon constantly do flyby attacks with it'd breath weapon.
You would be suprised how hard it is for parties to deal with that.
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Um. most every dragon has a 200+ movement speed and flyby attack. Just have the dragon constantly do flyby attacks with it'd breath weapon.
You would be suprised how hard it is for parties to deal with that.
When that happens it makes me miss the 3.5 Tower Shield rules. A character with a magic'd up tower shield could put it in full cover 'position' and just ready an action every turn to move in front of said breath weapon.
It could totally shut down the dragons with line breath weapons and severely hamper those with cones. I forced a youngish blue dragon (not old enough for significant spellcasting) down into melee with that tactic.
Usually when I use dragons, I give the party ample opportunity to avoid the fight. 9 times out of 10 they are choosing to bring the fight to the dragon, and they have to understand that they stand a very good chance of failure. It's on their head at that point. If you play them well, dragons are essentially demigods.
Well, as long as they are fairly optional, then making them overpowered is a fine approach.
And if they are the end game...the party had better be at a level where they are ready to knock at least a couple teeth out of a demigod anyway.
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First off, whether written by paizo staff or not, single monster encounters are exclusively a bad idea. They are iconic, they are often dramatic in books and movies. In the game, they are a dumb choice. Period. Any steps you take to make a single enemy encounter work out would have been even more effective by simply having 2 slightly weaker monsters/enemies. You are working against the way the game functions (without significant house rules or alternate rules) by puting a single enemy in an important encounter. Just dont do it.
Dragons dont need to be alone. They can have minions, a mate, children, whatever. And not just throw away mooks. There should always be at least half the party's number in worthwhile dangerous enemies in any fight that is supposed to be a challenge. You can sprinkle in mooks too for flavor and set dressing, but against a party of 4 there should ALWAYS be at least 2 significantly threatening enemies in every meaningful encounter. If an ap has a single enemy encounter, change it. If you want to put a dragon in your homebrew game, give it a mate, some children or a bunch of potent kobold priests or something.
After you have done that, remind yourself that the game, and especially the AP is designed around a standard 15 point buy unoptimized party. What does that mean?
1. The base assumption is the party will consist of: A character who fights (fighter), a character who sort of fights and casts divine spells (cleric), a character who sort of fights and is skillfull (rogue) and an arcane spellcaster (wizard). If your party instead includes a druid, summoner, magus, and bard, you have alot more offensive power in that party then the base assumption. Adjust for situations like this.
2. The game doesnt expect heavy optimization. If your group scoures soucebooks for the 'best' options, particularly around combat, they will perform above the expected level. That isnt a bad thing per say, but it requires adjustments.
3. The game expects 4 character. I know it says 4-5 characters, but an extra character makes a huge difference in the party's capability. Use 4 as your baseline, and again if you deviate, adjust accordingly.
4. The game, particularly adventure paths assumes a 15 point buy. Higher then that can give substantial advantages to the player (especially at low levels), again if you deviate from this you are going to need to adjust published adventures and make note of it when assigning encounter crs for homebrew games.
Basically for each of the above factors you should up the assumed APL by one (or one per player in the case of 3) for each one you deviate from in the player's favor (or reduce it for a small party or deliberately unoptimized characters etc). But there is a caviote here. For everything but #2, you shouldnt adjust encounters by making individual enemies stronger, but by adding more enemies to the encounter, particularly when accounting for extra players.
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Of course, while you can have end boss style dragons...sometimes, includes dumber "IMMA A REAL MAN, WATCH ME CUT OFF ITS HEAD!" style dragons.
But usually have it be lesser species. Like wyverns. Or Linnorm for 'mystically tough, but still rather straight forward' type.
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"The dragon has yet to lose" is not something to be proud of. This isn't a game of Players vs. DM. It's a collaborative game of all players working together to have fun.
Hello Necromancer. What was the purpose of this?
Also don't make assumptions you don't sit at my table.
What's your dragons's strategy and tactics? A dragon should always have the advantage in a fight. If they don't, they should fly away.
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I normally have then fight in an area where they can fly, and I have also jumped/ambushed a few parties. Most of the time however it is the flight that is the issue, and they try to intimidate the PC's into walking away. Of course I know it won't work, but dragons are arrogant so I play it up sometimes.
I have only run two dragons in an enclosed area. One of them did well, but still died. The other was destroyed in a very one-sided combat.
I also tend to have them prebuffed, and depending on the optimization of the group I might change their spells and feats out.
Linnorms are perfect if you want something badass but not overly cunning. Then again, the OP was about dragons not being tough enough...
Well, you could always throw more. Fighting off a horde of dragons has a certain visceral satisfaction (a barbarian standing over a pile of dead dragons is practically the second flag of the Land of Linnorm Kings).
And it doesn't need you to face a perfectly planned plot throwing dozens of spells at you. You don't necessarily have to have the dragon overlord of Tucker's Kobolds for a good fight. Just more hp piles and action economy backed by a tough body can do the job well enough at times.
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I have only run two dragons in an enclosed area. One of them did well, but still died. The other was destroyed in a very one-sided combat.
I made the mistake of running a black dragon in its lair once, I didn't know how to run it properly (it was my first game DMing). I think the fight lasted two rounds, mostly because two of the party members were a Paladin/Vassal of Bahamut and a Warmage being backed up by a Rogue-Shadowdancer and a bow Ranger. It was just stupid how quickly this dragon went down. That's when I started reading up on D&D (now Pathfinder, obviously) dragons more and actually really evaluating strategies and abilities.
The only other time I did enclosed encounter was actually kinda amusing, I homebrewed a dragon wyrmling swarm (I guess they'd be considered a troop, now that they've made "swarms" for bigger creatures) that jumped them in a series of tunnels.
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In the vein of "Simplest answer is always the best", here's the simplest answer I can find, plucked right out of the RAW with no houserules and no dragon modifications:
Step 1—Determine Average Party Level (APL)
Determine the average level of your player characters—this is their Average Party Level (APL for short). You should round this value to the nearest whole number (this is one of the few exceptions to the round down rule). Note that these encounter creation guidelines assume a group of four or five PCs. If your group contains six or more players, add one to their average level. If your group contains three or fewer players, subtract one from their average level. For example, if your group consists of six players, two of which are 4th level and four of which are 5th level, their APL is 6th (28 total levels, divided by six players, rounding up, and adding one to the final result).
Step 2—Determine Challenge Rating (CR)
Challenge Rating (or CR) is a convenient number used to indicate the relative danger presented by a monster, trap, hazard, or other encounter—the higher the CR, the more dangerous the encounter. Refer to Table: Encounter Design to determine the Challenge Rating your group should face, depending on the difficulty of the challenge you want and the group's APL.
Table: Encounter Design
Difficulty Challenge Rating Equals…
Easy..............APL –1
Average.........APL
Challenging...APL +1
Hard.............APL +2
Epic..............APL +3Step 3—Build the Encounter
So, following the above guidelines, if you have a party with an APL of 8 and you want an average (read: boring) dragon fight, have them fight a CR 8 dragon. If you want it challenging, make it CR 9. If you want it hard, make it CR 10. And if you want it EPIC!!!! make it CR 11.
But, as useful as this is, these numbers work much better for groups of monsters than they do for solo monsters. For example, using the same APL 8 group mentioned above, an encounter with a group of four CR 7 dragons will make a much better "Epic" encounter for them than a solo CR 11 dragon will.
If you don't like flocks of dragons (makes them feel more common - you encounter flocks of stirges or harpies or hippogriffs, but dragons are iconically loners, not counting Danerys' brood, of course), then bump up the CR one or two higher for that solo dragon. But handle with care, it's easy to quickly get them to be too challenging; they can go from boring to TPK before you know it.
But wait, there's more!
If you just pick the dragon that truly is "Epic" for your group's APL and then have it stand there like a lump and get steamrolled by your group, it still won't be epic. That's where the many fine suggestions in this thread about dragon tactics come into play.
Keep it mobile, don't be afraid to grab/grapple one PC and carry him away for a midday snack - dragons gotta eat, you know, and they totally get the "divide and conquer" strategy.
Don't be afraid to use hit-and-run tactics (dragon flies in from his distant lair, blasts the group with his breath weapon a few times, then flies home to lick his wounds (with the help of a nice wand he has), then comes back later that same day, then again that night while the PCs try to camp.
Don't be afraid to kill a PC or two. Have the dragon and his minions pick on the weakest PC (most dragons are smart enough and experienced enough to know which that will be) and eliminate him. Dead. Then maybe lick his wounds or maybe keep fighting, taking out the next weakest. Always staying mobile, never easily trading his one set of actions for the party's many.
Your players may grumble about dead PCs, but, really, all but the most jaded grognards should enjoy having dangerous and lethal dragons in their game - that's too iconic and too epic to grumble, even if yours is the dead PC.