Don't worry folks, no long rants this time, just a quick question.
I was always under the impression that the reason elves made such good wizards were:
1. +2 Intelligence
2. Elven Magic trait
and that was about it. Now with the ARG, Duergar have the option to exchange their spell-like abilities for the Deep Magic trait, which is remarkably similar to Elven Magic. Granted they don't have a bonus to Int, but at least they got 1 out of 2, plus a bunch of other deep dwarf goodness. Does this make them a good(ish) choice for wizards? Or are they still at or worse then 'meh'?
The Elven magic trait does not help with spells per day or save DCs, so by itself it is only a minor help to wizards. I would say that duergar with the Deep Magic feature would make marginally better wizards than races with no bonus or penalty to intelligence.
Also, elves have one substantial penalty to being good wizards -- their constitution penalty, which reduces their already low hit points. Races that lack that penalty or, better yet, have constitution bonuses make more survivable wizards.
What makes elves great wizards?
- +2 Intelligence
- Elven Magic trait.
- Greater ability to percieve their work and pay attention to detail +2 perception
- Crazy long lives to master their schools of magic
- Longstanding tradiions of magic, making advanced magic more accessible to other elves.
Likely other points, but these were what I could come up with :)
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As a Duergar, you can wear a Armored Kilt and Mithral Lamellar Cuirass together without ill effects.
You can also pick up some Fogcutting Lenses, and as you are immune to poison, stand right in the middle of a Stinking Cloud.
Also, walking around in Darkness causes you no great distress, so a Duergar is a very defensive Wizard.
So, in other words, only slightly better then a regular dwarf (i.e. not that great), but much more survivability?
More importantly, is it possible to make an 'optimal' duergar wizard?
While I've provided a few options to make dwarves more attractive arcane spell casters in my campaign, dwarves seem to me to be the better fit for an arcane role.
Arcane spells are frequently portrayed as an art or a science. It has theory, and is governed by rules. It is frequently referred to as "craft" (spellcraft, witchcraft.) These are all dwarven concepts. This is also empirically backed up. "The dwarves of yore made mighty spells,
While hammers fell like ringing bells" (The Hobbit.) The pointy eared ones seem to be overstretching to get a claim on both wizards and druid-y powers. So, I say go for the Duergar mage!
While the +Int is an incredible bonus to offensive casters, a caster that focuses on buffs, non-save battlefield control and summons doesn't have as large need of it (though it's still good). I think a Duergar wizard might work great - as the troll says, a defensive wizard. Focus on buffs, non-save battlefield control such as Darkness, Fogs, and Summons. With your great defensive capabilities, short-range spells aren't nearly as dangerous as for more glass cannony wizards.
EDIT: While it's hardly logical in regards to fluff, i can see a duergar empyreal sorcerer make great success. Might have to reflavor empyreal though.
Deep Magic is decidedly superior to Elven Magic. +2 to dispel checks (which are otherwise pure caster level-versus-caster level) is quite valuable, especially with greater dispel magic, while +2 to identifying items with spellcraft skill checks is fairly marginal.
Int feeds both DCs and bonus spells, so a race with an Int bonus is still a more optimal wizard than a duergar. Deep magic does place a duergar ahead of every other race that doesn't have an Int bonus, though.
For caster druids (Treantmonk's Wild Mystic approach), though, the Wisdom bonus plus Deep Magic makes duergar the top race, period.
Statistically Duergar are just overpowered compared to any race, not just the Elves.
They're a good pick for sure.
Also, Elves have more than just the Elven magic now that they can get a +2 to initiative or to Concentration.
Ah-ha!! So it's true, we duergar are superior!! Suck it drow/elves!! MWUHAHAHAHAHHAHAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! *busily starts drawing plans for world domination*
Ah-ha!! So it's true, we duergar are superior!! Suck it drow/elves!! MWUHAHAHAHAHHAHAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! *busily starts drawing plans for world domination*
The super gnomes (With the unpronouncable name) are also great contenders with their extraordinarily high spell resistance.
I don't really think bonus spells are THAT big of a deal, actually. The difference between an Int26 and an Int24 at high levels is one 8th level and one 4th level spell. A good bonus for sure, but not a dealbreaker. The DC bonus is fantastic if you're an offensive caster, but if 3/4 of the spells you cast doesn't have saves, those 5% aren't that important. Sure useful, but not a dealbreaker either.
On the other hand, since Deep Magic is mostly useful for offensive casters, it's not that useful on a defensive caster. I could see it used for ray spells such as energy drain or a super focused damage dealer.
A duergar can make a very competent wizard. But I don't see it outperforming elves or humans. But if the concept of a duergar wizard sounds appealing to you, go for it. It will not be a waste of time.
Now that I think of it, con bonus + good in armor + bonus vs spell resistance might make it a good Magus.
Statistically Duergar are just overpowered compared to any race, not just the Elves.
Oh? Care to justify that?
I mean, I'm not one to say the Race Builder was particularly well-done, but there's a reason duergar came out in the same general 8-to-11 range as the core races, not 14 like aasimars, 24 like svirfneblin, or 41 like drow nobles.
The main reason that duergar are not overpowered is that, unlike drow and svirfneblin, duergar do not get all of the goodies that dwarves get in addition to their Underdark based enhancements. If they still got the full set of dwarven racial abilities as they did in 3.5, then they would be overpowered -- but they lose a lot of dwarven racial abilities in the Pathfinder version.
The main reason that duergar are not overpowered is that, unlike drow and svirfneblin, duergar do not get all of the goodies that dwarves get in addition to their Underdark based enhancements. If they still got the full set of dwarven racial abilities as they did in 3.5, then they would be overpowered -- but they lose a lot of dwarven racial abilities in the Pathfinder version.
What do they lose that would matter to a Wizard?