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@hustonj: there's no need to be nasty. OP has a legitimate question here; he and his GM wonder what the RAW is and are looking for advice.
I can't find the answer at a glance, but consider the following:
Suggestion doesn't mention the subject forgets that you did anything, but really all that happened was that you said "Hey, dude, X sounds like a good idea!", whereupon dude thinks "Yeah, X does indeed sound like a good idea." So he knows you made the suggestion, but the idea sounded pretty reasonable at the time.
Hypnotism specifically mentions that creatures that fail their saving throw forget that you put a spell on it. It also mentions that you use "gestures and droning incantation" though, which might be more noticeably magic use than just making a suggestion to someone.
So this isn't really clear. The general description of the Enchantment school doesn't say whether people remember you altered their mind.
So looking at the general rules for spellcasting.
A spell's components explain what you must do or possess to cast the spell. The things you do to cast the spell might alert people to the fact that magic has been used. Verbal and Somatic components are both noticeable. In the case of Suggestion you could argue that since it's only a Verbal component, the component might only be making the suggestion, no other weird latin chanting. So that casting a Suggestion or just making a mundane suggestion don't look/sound any different. A bystander wouldn't know the difference.
A creature that successfully saves against a spell that has no obvious physical effects feels a hostile force or a tingle, but cannot deduce the exact nature of the attack. This implies that anyone who fails the save (affected by the Suggestion), is not aware that something odd happened.
AFAIK there's no rule that you notice when a magical effect you weren't aware of, that was previously affecting you, ends.
So how would people notice when a Suggestion ends? Since Suggestion only works if you make a somewhat reasonable suggestion, it's not all that likely. They remember that Bard Boy made a suggestion to them, and that it seemed like a good idea at the time. In hindsight, it might not have been such a great plan, but they don't automatically know they were enspelled. They might decide not to trust your advice in the future, of course, since you gave them bad advice.
If they really sat down to think about why their life went down the drain lately, they might realize it all boils down to listening to you. Also, if they knew that some people can influence the mind with magic, they might connect the dots.
On the other hand, people have a strong urge to rationalize their own behavior, even if it wasn't all that smart. "Yeah, in hindsight X turned out badly, but at the time it was really the reasonable thing to do."
Does the target automatically know it has been under the effect of Suggestion? No but it's fairly likely if not done carefully.
At the very least they will know that you* suggested the course of action since you need to Facinate (requiring them to hear, see and pay attention to you) them first to use Suggestion that in turns require that you tell them to do what you want to compulsion to do.
With that knowledge it is up to the GM to determine if they suspect the person who told them to perform the deed, keep that suspicion to themselves, forget that you mentioned it or if they still blame themselves for it.
*Unless you are disguised at the time of casting, then they might blame whoever you where disguised as.
So get a disguise and get the target(s) well and truly drunk (drunk people consider stupid, dangerous and otherwise bad ideas to be more reasonable than sober people do). They also might forget about you in the morning while the compulsion still is left in effect.
As far as the original request to find something to help against the GMs ruling I can think of only a very very loosely related rule about Streetperformer Bards Gladhanding, note that this isn't a spell like ability like Suggestion but one without fancy letters in brackets, that improves the attitude of the target one step for a minute only to lover it by two steps afterwards indicating that they realize what happened.
You'd probably have a better chance arguing that it traditionally shouldn't leave any traces considering how popular Compulsions are among evil wizards, witches and other dark forces that prefer to work behind the curtains.
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@hustonj No matter how you try to justify it, you really weren't being helpful. Especially your first post where you just assumed he was looking for support against his GM and slammed him for it.
You'll note that he says "Were[sic] looking for rules as written" which implies that both he and his GM are looking for the information.
Maybe if you hadn't used snarky language and instead said something like "Check out www.d20pfsrd.com and search for compulsions" then you may not have come off as unhelpful and troll-like.
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You can't use Suggestion to make someone do a ruinous deal; You influence the actions of the target creature by suggesting a course of activity (limited to a sentence or two). The suggestion must be worded in such a manner as to make the activity sound reasonable. Asking the creature to do some obviously harmful act automatically negates the effect of the spell.
Selling something at a significant loss isn't reasonable. You could invent some good reason; "if you invest now, you'll make triple profits. It's a sure thing" could work, especially on a greedy person when you look prosperous. Suggestion is good to get ponzi schemes started.
After the Suggestion ends, people don't necessarily notice that some magic affecting them ended, or that free will has been restored to them; nowhere does it say so. Your suggestion isn't magically enticing anymore, so someone might change his mind.
That doesn't mean he realizes you used magic to convince him the first time though; he might just as well think you're just a very smooth talker with very trustworthy sky-clear blue eyes. In a world where people get Diplomacy skill checks with a +20 bonus, it's not guaranteed that magic was used. (Bards could certainly get there without magical compulsion.)
It doesn't change the fact that you suggested an idea, and if it turned out badly, then next time the subject knows you gave him bad advice. Maybe you did it on purpose, maybe not; maybe you were trying to help in good faith but things just worked out differently than you expected. Either way, some trust is lost.
But he doesn't know for sure you used magic, unless he somehow used Detect Magic or somesuch. He might deduce that spellcasting bards might have used magic, but that's not the same as knowing. They might have also used an obscenely high Diplomacy skill to talk you into something.
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I'm just going to post in every single Rules Question thread telling anyone who asks a question to go away. Why ask the internet about rules when GMs exist? Obviously anyone asking a rules question is a slimy munchkin jerk who deserves to be insulted.
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Yeah, I also don't think you should take off people's heads when they inquire about a GM's ruling.
GMs make mistakes now and then. Shocking, I know, but it's really true.
They sometimes make rulings that run counter to RAW, and thereby render certain abilities way weaker than the developers intended them to be. Not always out of a conscious decision to change RAW, but out of ignorance or misunderstanding.
In such a case, doing research as a player and bringing it back to the GM isn't morally reprehensible. Then the GM has the option to intentionally diverge from RAW.
@hutonj: Actually, Occam's Razor doesn't state that it is meant to mislead, you may be using it incorrectly and at any rate Occam's razor only helps to formulate a hypothesis and is not used for final and accurate results.
I see no reason why he can't be asking the forums for advice on both his and his DM's behalf, much as he mentioned in his first post. Maybe it is just me but I prefer to believe in people unless there is evidence which makes me reevaluate my position.
Yeah, I also don't think you should take off people's heads when they inquire about a GM's ruling.
GMs make mistakes now and then. Shocking, I know, but it's really true.
They sometimes make rulings that run counter to RAW, and thereby render certain abilities way weaker than the developers intended them to be. Not always out of a conscious decision to change RAW, but out of ignorance or misunderstanding.
In such a case, doing research as a player and bringing it back to the GM isn't morally reprehensible. Then the GM has the option to intentionally diverge from RAW.
Exactly, DMs can't be expected to remember everything and queries like this will help both DM and player better understand the game.
Of course when I run games I tend to have a "don't let knowledge of the rules or lack thereof get in the way of a good game". I'm sure there are many others out there with the same mentality.
One important thing to note about spells with verbal components, such as Suggestion: the verbalization isn't just said in a conversational manner:
Verbal (V): A verbal component is a spoken incantation. To provide a verbal component, you must be able to speak in a strong voice.
So when one cast a Suggestion spell, it's not "Hey, why don't you give me a 50% discount on that jeweled scabbard?", but rather "GIVE ME A 50% DISCOUNT ON THE JEWELED SCABBARD!"
Even in the event the spell succeeds - and assuming ignorance of Spellcraft among witnesses - it's obvious something unusual is going on.
This is where the Silent Spell feat would come into play with a Suggestion: you still need to verbalize the suggestion, of course, but you wouldn't have to do it "in a strong voice".
As the long-time player of a fey-bloodline sorcerer myself, it's seldom easy to use charm and compulsion spells in a social setting. Silent and still spell feats are invaluable of course - casting a spell is pretty obvious, and will almost always be interpreted as an attack (which it is). The real answer to the concern about whether a compelled Suggestion is memorable or not is yet another spell: Modify Memory :)
Well, it even goes so far as to say "A verbal component is a spoken incantation", which is probably even more * noticeable* than the strong voice.
Fans of Dr. Strange know what *this* means... "By the fey voices of the First World, whose essences compel and jealously linger in the shadows of the Real, do I suggest to thee: GIVE ME A DISCOUNT!"
That kind of thing... you know, an incantation :)
There is a reason why Silent Spell is the courtly enchanter's best friend!
More crunchily, I suppose "verbal spellcasting" - a strong voice - must lie somewhere between "conversation" (DC 0 Perception check) and "a battle" (DC -10 Perception check); regardless, it's pretty noticeable.
(Maybe not "Gilbert Gottfried" or "Sam Kineson" noticeable, but something clearly beyond polite speech... a strong voice, as one might issue an imperative (which is exactly what is happening in the case of Suggestion) with. But no, not "yelling", necessarily.)
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I can see where you're coming from, I just don't agree. In the case of Suggestion, I think the "incantation" is probably just the words of the suggestion itself, so that bystanders might not be able to hear that it's anything other than a honey-tongued bard talking.
"Strong voice" is about what you'd use when addressing a board meeting; a bit more maybe than casual conversation, but not at the level of a battle. It can still be disguised as something mundane;
"Hey man, long time no see! Remember when we did (thing)? That was a blast. Hey, I really need to ask you for a favor, please? Just help me out man, for old times sake. I'll get the money back to you next week, promise!"
... so that's why I wrote that opinions differ on what exactly that "strong voice" means.
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This is a sort of issue that you'd have to ask the GM about before the first time you try it.
If someone makes a save against a spell and sees you cast a spell, then at the very least they could safely assume that you tried to cast some kind of spell on them; if they make Spellcraft for it, then they'll know what you tried to cast on them.
If they fail their save but make Spellcraft, they'll know you cast Charm Person or Suggestion, which could make for hilarity as the target resigns herself into doing what you say because you cast a spell on her to make her listen to you. That's why Silent or Still spell is helpful for making it less obvious what you're doing, and avoid any potential Spellcraft checks.
Of course, you could always augment your spell with a Bluff or two.
"Yes, I cast a spell on you; I always give a blessing of Iomedae/Norgorber/Razmir to my friends!"
"No, I was certain that was the Jump spell I gave you. Why don't you hop over that chasm and back to prove it?"
It's a Jedi Mind Trick.
Did any Stormtroopers ever come back questioning what they just allowed/did? Nope.
(Edit - But no, there is no RAW supporting either side. It's gonna be up to the GM.)
The problem is Silent Spell (for him) is Bard Spells can't be made Silent.
However spellsong lets you hide bard spells with a perform check.
Suggestion however is incredibly crippled if the intent was for the caster to make a big obvious showy time casting it. It really does read to me like a Jedi Mind trick.
"These aren't the droids you are looking for."
"Hey these aren't the droids we were looking for!"