Core Only Duelist?

[hoosierhayeslpe]

I am starting a new Rulelords campaign in a few weeks and the DM has offered a challenge to the group to stick to core-only classes, feats, and races, so as to speed up play (i.e. no "I just read about this spell last night, you don't understand how it works, but it will run the table"). There are some nice perks available for playing core-only, like extra feats and periodic rerolls.

One of the characters that I was exploring was fighter 6 / duelist x that was built around the scimitar feat that gives you dex to damage, but now that is out.

The duelist guide (see below) is a great resource, but relies heavily on feats outside of the core rules. Any advice for sticking to core?

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1xRicfKx_3l0G6C84gn8O3PjeMnMq3QnMsJ5_eJx CccM/edit?pli=1

[Matthew Morris]

Hmm...

Well core only basically begs the rapier. Depending on your goal, you might look at Rogue 8/Duelist X (you'll likely top out at 8/8 or maybe 8/10). Sneak attack will help counter the lack of damage augments.

1st level, Dodge
2nd level Finesse Rogue
3rd level WF Rapier
4th level Minor Magic
5th level Mobility.
6th level Major Magic
7th level Spring attack or Iron Will
8th level Bleeding Attack
Then go into Duelist.

By 15th level, you're looking at a +13 BAB, saves of +4/+10/+4 Lots of skills. Some people might quibble with the minor/major magic choices, I like the idea of having shield to add that +4 AC.

I'd take the favoured class bonus and put it in HP, since you're going to be blessed with skill points.

15 point build
S:12 D:15 C:13 I:14 W:10 Ch:8. (Might switch dex and int, can switch wisdom and charisma) Your will save will suck, but the skill points (10 per level, 11 if human) will help the cha penalty if you want to still be the face. You'll want to keep the dex high, and keep the int as close to your duelst level as possible, likely through items.

Far from optimised, but those are my thoughts.

[Bertious]

Strangly as far as i can see there is nothing stopping a Mithril Breastplate wearing Strength based Duelist with a Morning Star or Trident if you are looking for a different flavor. YOu can also multi class if you like say fighter 5 rogue 2 to pick up evaision and a talent but lets stick to fighter.

so 15 point buy human
Str 16 Dex 14 Con 12 Int 14 Wis 10 Cha 7

1st Power Attack, Dodge, Weapon Focus (Trident). +4 to hit 1d8+5(can be +7 in two hands) or throw for +3 to hit 1d8+3
2nd Mobility
3rd Weapon Finesse Armor Training
4th Weapon Spec +1 Str + 6 to hit 1d8+9 damage or throw +7 1d8+5
5th Spring Attack Weapon Training +8 to hit 1d8+10
6th Lunge or Combat Expertese
Duelist 1 Combat Expertese or Whirlwind Attack.

I'll be the first to admit it's not really in the duelist spirit but it is different.

[Oterisk]

The trident is actually a really good idea, but dual wield that with a net like an old school gladiator. Once the net is out of your hand, you will still get precise strike with the trident in your other hand. The entangled status will even out your two weapon penalty and will help your versatility quite a bit. They are also great for casting silence on and shutting down enemy spell casters. Once you have entangled your foe, spring attack works even better.

[hoosierhayeslpe]

Interesting idea about mixing up the weapons. I've been toying with a way to play a prospector (as in Old West, 49er prospector) in a game. A pick is a one-handed piercing weapon, right?

25 Point Buy- Str 18 (w +2 from 1/2 orc) Dex 14 Con 14 Int 15 Wis 10 Cha 8

Fighter 1- Dodge, Weapon Focus- Heavy Pick
Fighter 2- Mobility
Fighter 3- Toughness?
Fighter 4- Weapon Specialization- Heavy Pick
Fighter 5- Spring Attack
Fighter 6- Weapon Finesse

[Bertious]

The net is an interesting idea but you'd have to use it with non-proficiency. Not that that is a huge penalty on a ranged touch attack.