I know that posting this here will likely generate more guffaws that actual attempts to assist the person involved (who is not myself), but I told the one involved I'd ask for assistance since the one seems very insistent on getting through this on one's own.
Some of the things I've suggested have been the gold star calendar, where one gives one's self a gold star for each day the undesired activity is avoided and then there's a large reward for so many gold stars at the end of a month.
I did ask my spiritual adviser what I could inform this person, and he said that the most important thing was to make the one not be judgmental towards one's self. I've passed that on, but not sure how helpful it is.
The spiritual adviser seems to think (I believe) that this is a phase that one will grow out of.
Anyway, any suggestions would be welcome (although please remember to abide by posting guidelines).
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Assuming that by "Internet Adult Entertainment" you mean what I think you mean (and not, say, internet casinos), I believe the best course of action would be to find your friend an activity that eats up a chunk of the time and strength he would otherwise employ in the... say, "entertainment process".
Back in my wee years of early adulthood, when I had more free time than I should, "Internet Adult Entertainment" was soetimes something I defaulted to when sitting in front of a computer without anything else to do. However, once I started doing sports again (used to be a hammer/disk/ball thrower in school, but stopped when I entered university) and began working on some heavy time-consuming personal proyects, time dedicated to said "Internet Adult Entertainment" dropped dramatically. It was never really a problem for me, but I did notice a loss of interest in it for the most part.
So while I can't say I have never again enjoyed said form of entertainment (Catholic as I may be, I am but a man, and the Internet is oh-so-fast these days compared to the late 90's), I have so much other stuff going on that the good ol' multimedia-enhanced onanism is rarely something I put my mind into.
Thus, my advice would be to fill up time and spend strength with something else. Tennis, hunting, hiking, carpentry, even gardening. The idea is to minimize idle time and surplus energy when it's not going to get used on something less shaggadelic.
Also, if whoo-hoo before marriage isn't an issue (what can I say, I like my Catholicism), that is very likely a good venting option that should reduce the need for "Internet Adult Entertainment".
Hope it helps!
I concur with Mr. Van der Kroft. Also, if said friend is not physically inclined a hobby that requires skill for him to do well would be a good option. This would give them something to do that requires practice to gain the full enjoyment and thus work for and once he's there the habit and desire should be self sustaining. One example would be miniature painting.
Also, there is gaming (Say Pathfinder? *Wink*) or even WoW if you want quick results. Combine it with the gold star approach and you might have a good system.
While it is not, per se, internet casinos, I am informed that the related costs might as well indicate that it is.
I think, though, that we might be able to generalize the discussion to "undesired (often expensive) addictive behaviors".
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A drastic but potentially effective measure might be to have his home internet service terminated: after all, you wouldn't expect a recovering alcoholic to have a wet bar in his home.
If he needs to check his email (or whatever), then a library, coffee shop, or his place of work should suffice.
This does not work as well for work-at-home individuals or heavy NetFlix users, though.
Tough to know just what the issues are without knowing the person or knowing more about the person. I would certainly talk to a psychiatrist and psychologist if I had such problems (I have perhaps had similar problems), since it could be a struggle with an organic illness like OCD. If that is what it should probably be attacked from several different angles (behavioral, as others suggested, as well as possibly pharmacological). I have an organic problem with obsessive thinking which I can manage with some success or allow to dominate (give it room to flourish, so to speak), depending on the choices I make.
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I think we will try to target some of the underlying causes before targeting accessibility, but if the situation is dire enough, we'll have that option.
If self control is impossible, regardless of everything else we have tried, that might be the way to go.
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Well, I hope to just get some general advice first; if it becomes pertinent to have and discuss other information, we should probably take it to private message.
If self control is impossible, regardless of everything else we have tried, that might be the way to go.
Also, it doesn't need to be permanent. Cutting service for a month or two might be long enough for him to establish other habits.
While it is not, per se, internet casinos, I am informed that the related costs might as well indicate that it is.
If his problem is the expense, it might be possible to contact his credit card companies and ask them if they can block certain types of transactions.
If they can't or won't do that, you can ask that the cards be replaced (as if stolen) so that he gets new numbers (that he doesn't have memorized). Then lock the new cards in a hard-to-reach place or freeze them in a block of ice. The difficulty of accessing the cards might give him the time to realize he doesn't really want to.
I've struggled a lot with a cluster of related conditions (depression, anxiety, social anxiety, obsessive thinking) and I have a lot of experience with various modalities, lots of shrinks, and with IOP, so please let me know if I can help by sharing my knowledge. Maybe the toughest thing about emotional/cognitive/behavioral issues is that by their nature they often disincline you from talking about them and seeking the treatment you need for them.
I know that this person used to be an avid creative writer, so I have suggested to one to write about this experience, in as much vivid detail (not graphic, but emotional and mental) as one would like to convey, in an essay or story format.
I was told that that might take a long time.
I said, "Good".
I don't know if that was the right thing to do or not, but it feels like it would be a good opportunity to do some "busywork", and to get one's mind wrapped around the situation from a different angle (or several different angles).
Sounds like a depression from what I have understood. Depressed people don't often handle things well, and long-term planning and positive activities fold, replaced by immediate anxiety-reducing ones. Such as pr0n. Sadly, too, a depressed person will not be able to follow plans, setups and demands on him, making many of the classic strategies moot. If there is a change of appetite, insomnia, a change of behaviour - get him to a psychiatrist. Worst case scenario is you get a confirmation that he isn't depressed, which sounds like an ok deal.
I'm not judging. This person has asked for help. That's why I thought I would ask here.
While it is a lifestyle choice, this person wants to change this part of one's life, probably primarily for financial reasons. I respect that, and I will do what I can to help.
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Your friend, or whoever is going to be with him on this (and there should be somewone, really!), should be aware of one 'danger' of self treating behavioral addictions (and what you describe is one):
Most measures of self therapy (other activities, self awards for abstinence, etc.) may lead to a new behavioral addiction.
That is not inherantly dangerous, but even the most healthy activity (there are countless cases of people fighting behavioral addictions with physical activity, often running) can become a problem if it is done compulsatory (and disregarding physical limitations), so it should be kept in mind.
are you guys talking about masturbation ?
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That's a pertinent question, Grand Magus. Gambling and pornography are addictive for very different reasons.
Arazni, the person asking for help should certainly remain anonymous, but I can't really offer any advice without some specifics. Disclaimer: the only addictive substance I've managed to quit is nicotine, which was more chemical than emotional. I'm saying, my experience may not help very much because there's no adult entertainment patch out there.
Part of the problem is also related to brain chemistry. Viewing pornography while masturbating creates an association and serotonin combination that is pretty powerful. That conditioning can also greatly affect what does and does not arouse a person, making the removal of the trigger particularly difficult because arousal/climax becomes much more difficult without it.
If they are seriously addicted, the behavior is a compulsion and not a choice, they will probably need to take fairly severe measures to break it.
While it is not, per se, internet casinos, I am informed that the related costs might as well indicate that it is.If his problem is the expense, it might be possible to contact his credit card companies and ask them if they can block certain types of transactions.
If they can't or won't do that, you can ask that the cards be replaced (as if stolen) so that he gets new numbers (that he doesn't have memorized). Then lock the new cards in a hard-to-reach place or freeze them in a block of ice. The difficulty of accessing the cards might give him the time to realize he doesn't really want to.
Probably a bad idea.
Blocking access subscription based commercial providers is not going to stop him viewing pornography. It will only mean that he will start using free access material, which carries with it a whole range of additional problems, from malware to exposure to increasingly extreme imagery.
If he is going to 'fall of the wagon' and use pornography, it is better he use commercial porn. Its like any addition, you want them to undertake it as safely as possible.
That said, the most important advice. Get him to see a doctor, and get the doctor to give the advice. We are not the people to be giving this kind of advice to your friend.
The trick to fighting addiction is to look for the underlying cause of the addiction. Most addictions have two main reasons for their continued use: 1. The person initially found some kind of pleasure in doing the act 2. The person is experiencing some kind of mental pain (depression and anxiety are usually the big ones) that they do not feel like it will ever go away so they look for ways to numb it or not feel it for a little while. Added to this is the concept of tolerance where more and more of the substance/activity is required in order to get the same good feeling.
The first step is always awareness. You can't fix a problem if you aren't aware of it. Next comes willingness to change. Most people claim they want to change but the actual act of changing eludes them which makes it frustrating. Add to this having people who do not understand why you can't just "put it down" makes it even more difficult. Essentially, what is needed is for the individual to decide what is best for him to make a change and stick with it. Also it will be important that he has support of friends and family.
One last thing, always remember that relapse I apart of recovery.
I know that this person used to be an avid creative writer, so I have suggested to one to write about this experience, in as much vivid detail (not graphic, but emotional and mental) as one would like to convey, in an essay or story format.
I was told that that might take a long time.
I said, "Good".
I don't know if that was the right thing to do or not, but it feels like it would be a good opportunity to do some "busywork", and to get one's mind wrapped around the situation from a different angle (or several different angles).
This would be an excellent idea. For it to really hit home, perhaps you should make it an assignment rather than an option, and I suggest that you specifically ask that it be written from the character perspective of one or more other persons in the addicts life.
Accountability is key--AA works because of the buddy system. If this person lives alone, it's much harder--when you have others in the house/apartment, make sure the computer is where anyone nearby can see what's on the screen.
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Accountability is key--AA works because of the buddy system. If this person lives alone, it's much harder--when you have others in the house/apartment, make sure the computer is where anyone nearby can see what's on the screen.
Actually AA's success rate is vastly overblown. While I agree support groups can be healthy I mention it because I think it is necessary to start exposing how fradulent and cultish the organization is.
Similarly, a lot of anti pornorgraphy groups are similarly cultish and anti-sex. They would simply trade one neurosis for another.
It really comes down to the nature of the problem. If your friend's problem is financial, it seems like there should be enough free service to overcome that hurdle. (I hear adult entertainers complain constantly that the net is killing their industry.) Barring some bizarre fetish, there should be enough content.
If it is pathological, then self help ain't gonna cut it. He needs therapy. Obsessive behavior is difficult to overcome without professional help and possibly medication.
Accountability is key--AA works because of the buddy system. If this person lives alone, it's much harder--when you have others in the house/apartment, make sure the computer is where anyone nearby can see what's on the screen.Actually AA's success rate is vastly overblown. While I agree support groups can be healthy I mention it because I think it is necessary to start exposing how fradulent and cultish the organization is.
Similarly, a lot of anti pornorgraphy groups are similarly cultish and anti-sex. They would simply trade one neurosis for another.
It really comes down to the nature of the problem. If your friend's problem is financial, it seems like there should be enough free service to overcome that hurdle. (I hear adult entertainers complain constantly that the net is killing their industry.) Barring some bizarre fetish, there should be enough content.
If it is pathological, then self help ain't gonna cut it. He needs therapy. Obsessive behavior is difficult to overcome without professional help and possibly medication.
I find this quite interesting. The way you feel about AA is how I feel about the culture of therapy, 'professional help', and medication.
Fraudulent, cultish, and self-perpetuating.
-It's interesting how people are talking about pornography likes it's addictive. This is a mental addiction, not a medical addiction. Heroin Junkies, and Alcoholics suffer actually medical dangers when they stop taking the drug.
-However, the majority, if not all, the posters are saying "seek expert advice." That would seek all the advice one needs, or can really give.
A case like this may not require therapy. Therapy does not work for everyone. If this person is truly wanting to change then they should be able to do so with minimal setbacks. I would only suggest therapy when that fails and medication when everything has failed.
-It's interesting how people are talking about pornography likes it's addictive. This is a mental addiction, not a medical addiction. Heroin Junkies, and Alcoholics suffer actually medical dangers when they stop taking the drug.
-However, the majority, if not all, the posters are saying "seek expert advice." That would seek all the advice one needs, or can really give.
Marijuana and tobacco fall into this category, yet both are just as difficult to quit as alcohol. Please note that I didn't mention heroin, as that has an added effect when it comes to withdrawal.
Between being on the doorstep of 50 years old and a combination of meds that take away my interest in the Department of Luv, I no longer care about Adult Entertainment.
I hate that.
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Marijuana and tobacco fall into this category, yet both are just as difficult to quit as alcohol. Please note that I didn't mention heroin, as that has an added effect when it comes to withdrawal.-It's interesting how people are talking about pornography likes it's addictive. This is a mental addiction, not a medical addiction. Heroin Junkies, and Alcoholics suffer actually medical dangers when they stop taking the drug.
-However, the majority, if not all, the posters are saying "seek expert advice." That would seek all the advice one needs, or can really give.
My understanding is that nicotine is physically addictive; although THC is not.
I find this quite interesting. The way you feel about AA is how I feel about the culture of therapy, 'professional help', and medication.
Fraudulent, cultish, and self-perpetuating.
I'm conflicted about that, truthfully. I think medication is prescribed far too often, certainly, and therapy is offered as a default solution for every problem that was once considered a part of life.
On the other hand, I do believe some people have mental conditions caused by chemical abnormalities that need to be treated medicinally. And psychiatry, imperfect though it is, at least operates on a foundation of scientific inquiry. AA begins with a self-defeating mindset (You are diseased and will NEVER, EVER be better!) that creates a codependent relationship with the group and then has you grovel to a higher power that is paradoxically A)necessarily bigger than yourself and B)can be anything from Christian God to your dog. It's utterly asinine.
Don't believe the BS. Marijuana is just addictive as any other drug. Chemical addictions are miles harder to quit than having some mental addiction. Porn addiction can be bad as it leads to masturbation addiction. That leads to wimpy muscles, and tiredness. The Indians believed those that masturbate spill their soul power, wasting it. I suggest lifting weights, or taking a walk instead.
I actually like the Indians theory and I believe it.
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Accountability is key--AA works because of the buddy system. If this person lives alone, it's much harder--when you have others in the house/apartment, make sure the computer is where anyone nearby can see what's on the screen.Actually AA's success rate is vastly overblown. While I agree support groups can be healthy I mention it because I think it is necessary to start exposing how fradulent and cultish the organization is.
Similarly, a lot of anti pornorgraphy groups are similarly cultish and anti-sex. They would simply trade one neurosis for another.
It really comes down to the nature of the problem. If your friend's problem is financial, it seems like there should be enough free service to overcome that hurdle. (I hear adult entertainers complain constantly that the net is killing their industry.) Barring some bizarre fetish, there should be enough content.
If it is pathological, then self help ain't gonna cut it. He needs therapy. Obsessive behavior is difficult to overcome without professional help and possibly medication.
I find this quite interesting. The way you feel about AA is how I feel about the culture of therapy, 'professional help', and medication.
Fraudulent, cultish, and self-perpetuating.
One of the fundamental elements of AA is treating individuals as though they will always be addicts. In AA, no one ever gets better, they merely stave it off.
Actually medical and therapeutic methods work towards the day where you will no longer need the treatment.
Also claiming that forms of treatment which have to under go double blind placebo controlled trials for efficacy and safety before they can be licences, are fraudulent while one that requires no proof of efficacy or safety is not, is for the most part a little silly.
Structured activities is a strong step in the right direction.
I might suggest that he have a highly visible list of times when he can be online and activities/websites he allows himself to visit.
Say, only a 1-2 hours per day, plus work, and with a very limited range of sites they can visit. And those times can never be during the night - we're neither at our best or most upstanding then.
Perhaps he could use an access scheduler. Modem/routers can be configured to be operable only during certain times.
Also, any sort of activity that takes the focus off oneself; helping out someone else. Take food to the elderly, mowing lawns, volunteering at an art show. Internalization is the curse of a the modern culture - our views are formed through TV, and our thoughts routed through the internet. A little more face to face never hurt.
Addiction to porn is only a problem if it hurts that person in important parts of his life, things like if he's stopped going to work to watch porn. Your view may vary, of course, but I think the scientific consensus has been pretty clear for many decades now - masturbation is not dangerous. It most especially is not the reason for a degenerated spine, that's caused by syphilis, i.e. something you need to have sex with someone else to get. Believe it or not.
Thus, I will assume this is about someone who is otherwise not dealing with important stuff, such as work, sleep, family, hobbies. In that situation, the most likely and most common reason is a depression. The porn is typically just something that fills time. With a proper diagnosis, he can probably be treated for it within a month or so. The side effects are typically something people can handle.
Yeah, I know, medication is a big old hoax and all that, but seriously, do take a look at the standards pharmaceutical drugs are held to before speaking. Saying that it is always better to have talk therapy is uninformed. Therapy isn't even able to reach a depressed enough person due to concentration issues. And even if they could, extremely few schools of therapy have any sort of documentation on how well they actually work - unlike the antidepressants.
Marijuana and tobacco fall into this category, yet both are just as difficult to quit as alcohol. Please note that I didn't mention heroin, as that has an added effect when it comes to withdrawal.
There are multiple factual errors in this statement.
Don't believe the BS. Marijuana is just addictive as any other drug. Chemical addictions are miles harder to quit than having some mental addiction. Porn addiction can be bad as it leads to masturbation addiction. That leads to wimpy muscles, and tiredness. The Indians believed those that masturbate spill their soul power, wasting it. I suggest lifting weights, or taking a walk instead.
Mental addictions ARE chemical addictions. An addiction changes how your brain functions. Your brain uses chemicals to function, changing how it produces those chemicals causes something to become an addiction.
Other addictions have other side effects, like the DTs for alcohol, but once those pass, the brain changes are still present and must be conquered.
Don't believe the BS. Marijuana is just addictive as any other drug. Chemical addictions are miles harder to quit than having some mental addiction. Porn addiction can be bad as it leads to masturbation addiction. That leads to wimpy muscles, and tiredness. The Indians believed those that masturbate spill their soul power, wasting it. I suggest lifting weights, or taking a walk instead.Mental addictions ARE chemical addictions. An addiction changes how your brain functions. Your brain uses chemicals to function, changing how it produces those chemicals causes something to become an addiction.
Other addictions have other side effects, like the DTs for alcohol, but once those pass, the brain changes are still present and must be conquered.
I meant using a chemical substance addiction.
Okay, but being addicted to something means a physiological change has happened. Even if it's gambling, marijuana or pornography. Our brain is less under our control than we realize sometimes, compulsive behavior of any type is bad if it disrupts our lives.
Okay, but being addicted to something means a physiological change has happened. Even if it's gambling, marijuana or pornography. Our brain is less under our control than we realize sometimes, compulsive behavior of any type is bad if it disrupts our lives.
Gambling, in contrast to weed and porn, plays havoc with both the risk/reward interface and the intuitive learning process of the human brain. Compulsive marijuana or pornography use is bad, but doesn't seem to have the same level of suck-you-in-addictiveness.
Seeing as the original poster hasn't clarified what sort of internet adult entertainment is the issue, my point is of dubious value to the topic at best.
I smoked cigarettes for 21 years before I managed to quit using the patch. During that time I formed both a chemical dependance on nicotine and an emotional association with "having a cigarette". This is only my own experience, but I found the emotional association was child's play to ignore or refocus when using the patch to deal with my chemical dependance.
I guess I'm agreeing with you, Iron, that our brain is less under our control than we realize, but would like to add that a good 2/3 of our brain is our heart and our gut.
Agreed, each "vice" is a different animal.
Marijuana and tobacco fall into this category, yet both are just as difficult to quit as alcohol. Please note that I didn't mention heroin, as that has an added effect when it comes to withdrawal.There are multiple factual errors in this statement.
Please elaborate.
Marijuana and tobacco both have withdrawal symptoms for one. Tobacco is recognized in the DSM-IV (published in 1994) and since then multiple medical studies have shown similar symptoms in marijuana users who stop.