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If you find a spell book on a corpse in a scenario OR are adventuring with another wizard, if time allows you can copy spells out of those spell books w/o purchasing a scroll to do so.
I know all that, that is covered under "spell found during a scenario".
That is not always possible, many times the only way you are going to get the spell you want is to buy a scroll.
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Spells in this book come from:1) the original 1st level Wiz starting spells
2) spells added as the Wiz levels (2 "free" at each level)
3) spells added as the Wiz gained access during an adventure and scribed.
4) spells added when the wiz purchased scrolls to gain access in order to scribe them.
Every Spell in the book is part of the price. The cost of scrolls do not come into the equation.
nosig,
I would say that since you get your starting spell book for free, that it would have a resale value of zero, just like anything else you get in PFS play that you do not pay for in gold. So in the future, maybe keep two spell books: the original one which you only add the free level-up spells to and one you only put in the spells where you pay gold to get them. The second book would at least have a valid resale value.
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I would say that since you get your starting spell book for free, that it would have a resale value of zero, just like anything else you get in PFS play that you do not pay for in gold.
Might I ask what you're basing this on? PFS goes by Core rules except where explicitly stated otherwise. Core rules don't care how the spells got into the book when determining the sale price of the book as a whole. So where are you getting this idea?
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does anyone know if there is any "official" guidlines for selling a wizards spellbook?
PFS Officially uses the Pathfinder RPG Core rules, unless otherwise noted in the PFS Guide, Alternate Resources or FAQ, Rules in the PFRPG are the "Official" Rules.
Since the price of a spellbook is not mentioned in any of the Above PFS sources above as being different then it is in the core book, you can be safe to assume that the PF RPG Core is the official rule.
Mike and Mark can decide later they want to go away from Core, but they can't blame you for going by the rules as listed in the core until they do.
This same can be said for any rule in PF RPG.
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Personally Id like to see the Spellbooks Start showing up on the Chronicles ... with a list of all spells in them ... IMHO this would do 2 things ...
A) Give the PC's an option to just outright buy the book
B) give an accurate list of what Spells are available in the Scenario and prevent GM's from missing the fact that a spellbook is available to avoid confusion
having the entry look something like this
Spellbook <insert Spell names here that are past 1st level> XXXX (XXXX = GP Value)
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As it sits now - she is likely to get YMMV problems from different judges. (sells it on a Cronical for one judge, then have a different one object to the value the next time she games.) She's not really that worried about it, but ... I just find it hard to beleave that she's the first to encounter this issue.
A GM does not have the right to dispute clear rules in the Core book.
That is like saying every GM will dispute with you if a Rogue gets the sneak attack ability.
I would say that since you get your starting spell book for free, that it would have a resale value of zero, just like anything else you get in PFS play that you do not pay for in gold.Might I ask what you're basing this on? PFS goes by Core rules except where explicitly stated otherwise. Core rules don't care how the spells got into the book when determining the sale price of the book as a whole. So where are you getting this idea?
Because the precedent has already been set with other items. You cannot sell anything for gold that you got with PP. A gunslinger can only sell their starting firearm for 22 gold, not half of what it is worth even if they have made it masterwork and enchanted it. Items crafted by alchemists may not be sold. You can't use crafting skills or feats to make things and sell them for a profit. You can't sell items found during a scenario unless you buy them first. You basically can't get something for nothing in PFS play, so why should you be able to sell a starting spell book, that you paid nothing for, for something?
1) 10 spells of 0 level and 5 - 1st level spells all gained when she was a 1st level wizard.
Why only ten? The Core Book says a wizard starts play with ALL 0-level spells in his spellbook. And it was clarified somewhere in these forums that this means for a new wizard character made today, that this would include all legal 0-level spells from all legal sources, not just the Core Book. So that is, at minimum, the 20 cantrips in the Core Book, plus any others that were legal at the time the character was created.
Edit: And yes, that would be my ruling as a GM. If you did not pay for it, then you cannot get any gold back on it, and half value for anything you did pay for, per the rule in the Guide about selling equipment for 50% of the value.
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You basically can't get something for nothing in PFS play, so why should you be able to sell a starting spell book, that you paid nothing for, for something?
Because your opinions on the matter don't trump the rules, that's why.
But if it makes you feel better, remember that unlike all your examples, in this case the PC is selling something without which they can't use their biggest class feature, effectively turning them into a commoner unless they replace it, at which point they're still at a net loss. So it's nowhere near comparable to any of your "something for nothing" examples.
But again, rules say "Core unless otherwise specified", and this isn't otherwise specified. Nothing else matters.
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And yes, that would be my ruling as a GM. If you did not pay for it, then you cannot get any gold back on it
And that would be an illegal ruling, and if I witnessed it, I would inform the player of the proper channels to report your cheating and get your "ruling" overturned.
You do NOT get to break the rules just because you think you know better.
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But again, rules say "Core unless otherwise specified", and this isn't otherwise specified. Nothing else matters.
This right here.
Mike and Mark can latter decide they don't want to go by Core, they may look into it because of this thread.
But they have not, so always you to go to the Core rules for the rules if not stated otherwise in the PFS Guide, additional resources or FAQ.
It is fine though to ask, "Hey this rule is similar to other things that are different for PFS, is PFS going to do something different then the Core?"
But unless they change it, follow the Core rules.
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Your wife's spellbook based in what you said was in it.
0 Level spells - 2.5 gp to purchase + 5gp to add = 7.5 per spell
1st Level spells - 5 gp to purchase + 10 gp to add = 15 per spell
2nd level spells - 20 gp to purchase + 40 gp to add = 60 per spell
Spellbok = 15gp
10 0 Level spells = 75 gp
10 1st level spells = 150 gp
7 2nd level spells = 420 gp
Spellbook = 15gp
Total = 660 gp
Total selling price = 330 gp
My math look correct?
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My math look correct?Stop being so hostile D'moon!
It is Math it deserves my Hostility!
It is starting to add up and making me old.
Next I will be forgetting things like Mike.
Then I will accidently post my Wife's age in the Forums.
Then I will have to buy her Jewelry to make up for it.
Then she will divorce me because I can't add up the money correctly to get the Jewelry.
Don't get divorced, Upgrade to a calculator.
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Your wife's spellbook based in what you said was in it.
0 Level spells - 2.5 gp to purchase + 5gp to add = 7.5 per spell
1st Level spells - 5 gp to purchase + 10 gp to add = 15 per spell
2nd level spells - 20 gp to purchase + 40 gp to add = 60 per spell
Spellbok = 15gp10 0 Level spells = 75 gp
10 1st level spells = 150 gp
7 2nd level spells = 420 gp
Spellbook = 15gpTotal = 660 gp
Total selling price = 330 gpMy math look correct?
Where are you getting those purchase prices?
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Umm I was always under the understanding Witches couldn't copy spells from a Wizard spell book. Did I miss an FAQ? The APG specifically spells out the 3 ways to get new spells and using a Wizard's spell book isn't listed like in the Alchemist class entry (just like an Alchemist can't learn spells from a familiar).
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Umm I was always under the understanding Witches couldn't copy spells from a Wizard spell book. Did I miss an FAQ? The APG specifically spells out the 3 ways to get new spells and using a Wizard's spell book isn't listed like in the Alchemist class entry (just like an Alchemist can't learn spells from a familiar).
Indeed, a witch's familiar can only learn a new spell from leveling up, from chatting with a fellow familiar, or from eating a scroll.
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To give strength to that, the Spellbooks in UM use those pricing rules as well.
Sorry about that. I am using the writing costs on page 219, sans cantrips in opposition schools. A character can sell the book for half that value.
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Umm I was always under the understanding Witches couldn't copy spells from a Wizard spell book. Did I miss an FAQ? The APG specifically spells out the 3 ways to get new spells and using a Wizard's spell book isn't listed like in the Alchemist class entry (just like an Alchemist can't learn spells from a familiar).Indeed, a witch's familiar can only learn a new spell from leveling up, from chatting with a fellow familiar, or from eating a scroll.
Okay just making sure. An early post made it seem like they could so I wanted to make sure I had it right.
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I've been following this with interest.
I've been mainly of the opinion with Enevhar - that you can't sell something that you get for free in PFS. In my view this includes the spellbook.
Here is another - possibly valuabe - item a wizard might sell (again only under very rare circumstances).
My Wizard started with a free MW quarterstaff (value 600gp). If we allow selling spell books, then he should be allowed to sell his quarterstaff for 50% as well.
Before someone says - this will never happen. Actually - approx. one level ago I did exactly this. My wizard upgraded from his quarterstaff to a Staff of Fire. As a level 7 Wizard I paid the 200 gp per level = 1400 gp and in addition he paid 18950 for the Staff of Fire.
I didn't take off 300 gp for my MW quarterstaff as I regarded this as a free item from the start (similar to gunslingers) and felt it would be wrong to sell it. But I've been wrong in the past.
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So you are aware, as of right now you could not enforce that opinion on a player, since it is not actually a PFS rule.
Dragnmoon - I know what you want me to tell. As GM I should not take rules into my own hands. And I think I'm far away from it.
But it got me thinking about bonded objects and I looked at the core Rulebook rules in a way to deliberately misuse them by doning a RAW interpretation.
Let's start what CRB says about the bonded object:
Wizards who select a bonded object begin play with one at no cost. Objects that are the subject of an arcane bond must fall into one of the following categories: amulet, ring, staff, wand, or weapon.
So according to the core rule book a bonded object is free and I can select different types. Now - I'm a discerning first level wizard and chose a staff. The cheapest I could find is the staff of charming. But hey - cost doesn't matter - it is free.
And I check the PFS rules - nothing there tells me there is a limit how much my bonded object can cost.So can you enforce your opinion that I misuse the rules showing up at your table with a staff of power as my bonded object? To be rules legal I take that one at level 1 as only then it is free and not covered by any PFS rules like fame (applicable for purchasing only).
Oh - and after a few scenarios when I used up the charges I just sell it.
Sorry for the rant - but please show me the PFS rule that disallows it and maybe you understand why your post riled me up.
As I wrote - it was my understanding that no free objects ever should be able to be sold for money to avoid distorting the wealth curve. Selling a spell book - especially under the circumstances - is just a rounding error and I'm fine either way.
But I would object against a level 1 player - buying a blank spell book, copying in the most valuable 10 can trips and his 7 level 1 spells - assuming INT18 - and then selling his normal book at profit and starting with 210 gp if my math is right (I base it on 32 can trips I found in all the different books. Couldn't find a rule telling me only the CRB can trips are in my spell book.)
Luckily there is a rule in PFS that would stop the above. But it also means if something isn't 100% clear that sometimes rulings might differ from table to table.
It is impossible for the campaign management staff to cover every possible situation or rules interpretation. As such, you may encounter rules combinations or questions during the course of a scenario that aren't covered in this book or the official Pathfinder Society FAQ. In these cases, the Game Master has the freedom to adjudicate the rules as needed to ensure a fun and fair gaming experience is had by all.