How can you get dark or lowlight vision with a human that is viable (maybe even in PFS) as prerequ for feats except by shadowdancer?
Goggles of Darkvision!
Isn't there a darkvision spell? Can it be made permanent?
I know there is the Racial Heritage feat but I don't know what tricks one could pull off to get darkvision or low-light vision. The feat itself won't get it for you but there may be traits or other feats that open up options.
Magic items (and permanent spells, I suppose) do count toward prerequisites, but if you ever lose the item or spell, you can't use whatever it until you regain those prerequisites.
Aspect of the beast seems a good way, although 2 levels ranger is a heavy cost.
Becoming undead is probabaly not on the list for most^^
Goggles of darkvision are of course cool, but also expensive and i search something to get early game.
Orc bloodline sorcerer seems also ok.
Racial heritage seems best here at the moment, since you can just take it as a feat.
Thanks guys!
Racial Heritage won't actually give you low-light or darkvision. You may have to find other ways to make it work. It just might open up options that you were unaware of.
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Racial Heritage won't actually give you low-light or darkvision. You may have to find other ways to make it work. It just might open up options that you were unaware of.
Yes i know, but if i read it right you can count as having darkvision like the race you have heritage of, therefore having access to an otherwise blocked feat.
Racial Heritage won't actually give you low-light or darkvision. You may have to find other ways to make it work. It just might open up options that you were unaware of.Yes i know, but if i read it right you can count as having darkvision like the race you have heritage of, therefore having access to an otherwise blocked feat.
You'll want to run that by the GM. In my games it wouldn't fly. You either have darkvision or you don't. What are you trying to accomplish besides getting darkvision? Maybe we can help with that.
I´m researching ways to qualify for the moonlight stalker feat chain as human.
Step 1) Ignore the rules.
OR
Step 1) Be a half-orc or dorf.
And yes. You actually need darkvision. None of that racial heritage cheese.
My GM let us take racial heritage and grab a races stat adjustments, I had to talk common sense in to him. He still allowed people to grab racial weapons though, ie human raised by elves has the Bow and Sword proficiencies.
Dorf is a dwarf i guess.
The question is specifically how to get darkvision or low-light vision as a human. Not other races.
I also know darkvision goggles.
Just want to check if there are other possibilities i don´t know.
And when i look at racial heritage, what else should it be for?
I´m researching ways to qualify for the moonlight stalker feat chain as human.
In that case you actually need more than darkvision or low-light vision. It won't be enough unless you actually have one of them as the result of a racial trait, as the racial trait itself is what the Feats require; many of the methods mentioned previously in this thread will not qualify you for the feat chain because they do not grant the extra sensory methods as a racial trait.
And when i look at racial heritage, what else should it be for?
It allows you to benefit from abilities and items that can only be used by a particular race. This beneficial aspect isn't something that comes up often, and I cannot think of any way that it would enable you to obtain darkvision or low-light vision as a racial trait.
Additionally, it makes you vulnerable to items and abilities that target a specific race. An example might be a ranger's favored enemy ability. This aspect of the Feat will likely come into play more often, and a smart GM running a recurring intelligent villain will exploit it from time to time. As a result, consider carefully if you wish to take this Feat.
The Shadow Heritage Trait grants you low-light vision. I just can't remember where it's at. I have it in Hero Lab but I'm not sure which product it's from. It's a Background Trait found with Divine Heritage and Magical Heritage. If you can find that resource, you will have what you need.
Drow? Is that an option? Fetchling?
Drow? Is that an option? Fetchling?
Srooy Cheapy, but no. Your help is appreciatet though.
I´m writing up a guide for ninja and rogue builds.The question here is only about how a player choosing a human as player character can get into the moonlight stalker feat chain.
Ahh. There's enough oddity over using class abilities to qualify that it's possible that the Ninja Trick (Darkvision) could work. This discussion between JB and SKR shows that JB doesn't think this should be the case.
Although if the human has to dip to get it, perhaps it's not the best idea to go for that feat chain.
Thanks for the link.
I know its not best with human, but it can be done, so i want to list it and show possibilities for players that want to play a human.
I see my guide more as recommendation of things that make some sense and as a gathering of possibilities. Not only about optimization.
Ninja Trick (Darkvision) wouldn't work; it doesn't grant Darkvision as a racial trait.
The Shadow Heritage Trait grants you low-light vision. I just can't remember where it's at. I have it in Hero Lab but I'm not sure which product it's from. It's a Background Trait found with Divine Heritage and Magical Heritage. If you can find that resource, you will have what you need.
I believe that's d20 Modern content, though it could have been republished.
That's where it's from. I have that turned off in Hero Lab but it looks like it's showing up somehow. I should let the author know. Thanks.
How can you get dark or lowlight vision with a human that is viable (maybe even in PFS) as prerequ for feats except by shadowdancer?
I´m researching ways to qualify for the moonlight stalker feat chain as human.
I just built a ninja that did this. I don't know how easy it would be to do in PFS, as you'd need to finish two feat chains by level 11-12, but it still may be worth laying out:
1) Skill Focus (stealth)
2) Eldritch Heritage (Shadow Bloodline), Cha 13, Lvl 3. Grants a shadow touch attack that's pretty crummy, but a sneak attacker can put it to situationally good use.
3) Improved Eldritch Heritage (3rd level ability: Nighteye, grants darkvision), Cha 15, Lvl 11
You'd also need to take Blind Fight and Combat Expertise before 11 so you could get the Moonlight Stalker chain up and running asap. If you can manage to get TWO feats at 11th level (via tricks/talents or a level of fighter) you can get both IEH and MS at that level to squeeze into the tail end of PFS play.
So you'll need an Int 13, Cha 15, and 6+ feats to pull it off, but Humans can be Moonlight Stalkers too!
If traits are allowed, just take the Adopted trait and choose a race with Darkvision/low-light vision.
Benefit: Select a race trait from your adoptive parents’ race.
That just lets you grab a trait that's otherwise specific to a given race, not a racial ability like darkvision.
RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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Ah... Confusing since the Core book lists things like Darkvision under Racial Traits (see pg 21).
You're not the first to miss the difference between Race Traits and Racial Traits. ;)
@The OP: Why so stuck on being human? A half-elf can in some cases be better, and comes with low-light vision. Half-elves are especially good for characters that need a boost to Will saves (Dual-Minded alternate racial trait from the APG) or for 3/4 BAB classes who want an exotic weapon proficiency at 1st level (Ancestral Arms alternate racial trait from the APG).
Haha Mike J, that would be a nice and easy way :)
Too bad it doesn´t work.
Eldritch Heritage seems a working way too.
However level 11 is pretty late for that somehow.
Eldritch Heritage seems a working way too.
Actually this doesn't work, either. Nighteye may grant darkvision, but not as a racial trait. As such, it would not qualify you to enter the moonlight stalker feat chain.
Right. I just overlooked that racial trait thing so far. Guess there is no chance for humans to get that feat chain then. Not even with shadowdancer.
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Hehe, demonic ninjas, nice one.
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If traits are allowed, just take the Adopted trait and choose a race with Darkvision/low-light vision.Benefit: Select a race trait from your adoptive parents’ race.
That just lets you grab a trait that's otherwise specific to a given race, not a racial ability like darkvision.
I'm not certain I totally agree. I understand what your saying, but I do not see where the books actually delineate this. Further, Magic Resistant is allowed as a choice via adopted, and it's rather difficult to explain why another race could possess this via adopted by dwarves, but it's allowed; so why NOT darkvision?
Magic Resistant: Some of the older dwarven clans are particularly resistant to magic. Dwarves with this racial trait gain spell resistance equal to 5 + their character level. This resistance can be lowered for 1 round as a standard action. Dwarves with this racial trait take a –2 penalty on all concentration checks made in relation to arcane spells. This racial trait replaces the hardy racial trait.
I know this doesn't help with your rules-knowhow, but imagine if you could take racial abilities with traits. Who wouldn't take the human bonus feat then? Would you agree the trait to be still be worth half a feat?
If traits are allowed, just take the Adopted trait and choose a race with Darkvision/low-light vision.Benefit: Select a race trait from your adoptive parents’ race.
That just lets you grab a trait that's otherwise specific to a given race, not a racial ability like darkvision.
I'm not certain I totally agree. I understand what your saying, but I do not see where the books actually delineate this. Further, Magic Resistant is allowed as a choice via adopted, and it's rather difficult to explain why another race could possess this via adopted by dwarves, but it's allowed; so why NOT darkvision?
Magic Resistant: Some of the older dwarven clans are particularly resistant to magic. Dwarves with this racial trait gain spell resistance equal to 5 + their character level. This resistance can be lowered for 1 round as a standard action. Dwarves with this racial trait take a –2 penalty on all concentration checks made in relation to arcane spells. This racial trait replaces the hardy racial trait.
That's not something you can get via adopted, too.
as far I know race trait doesn't equal racial trait, it means you can pick a trait that is usually not for your race, like Warsmith (Dwarf)
Benefit: You gain a +1 trait bonus to damage rolls against creatures and objects made primarily of clay, crystal, earth, metal, or stone. Knowledge (engineering) is a class skill for you.
The problem here is that both these traits and the racial traits use the word "trait", I would rather call one of these "merits" to avoid misunderstanding
I keep referring to racial traits as "abilities" myself, hoping it will catch on.
the problem with that is the existence of attributes (often called ability score) and class abilities, so yea, the basic 2 traits you can have I would call merits, taken from World of Darkness, as far I know that word isn't used yet in 3.x/Pathfinder
I am not English, so I DO know how confusing it can be if multiple things are having near identical names
It's just that the English language makes one infer merits to be something positive, which, say in the case of Gillmens Water Dependency, is misleading. How about just "racials"? :D
no no, I talk about calling traits (like Magical Knack or Suspicious) merits, not the racial traits
Take a one-level dip into summoner (synthesist) and you'll have darkvision whenever you're fused with your eidolon.
I just don't know why obtaining low-light vision is so difficult to obtain, especially for a ranger/barbarian/rogue human character. Let it be a feat.
