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Could one of the developers explain the reason for disallowing crafting of magic items in PFS?
I know one of the reasons is some people would abuse the WBL cap by trying to sell crafted items but that could be defeated by not allowing the resale of personaly crafted items.
I feel that the no crafting rule really hurts the arcane casters by limiting their creativity and veristillity.
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Could one of the developers explain the reason for disallowing crafting of magic items in PFS?
I know one of the reasons is some people would abuse the WBL cap by trying to sell crafted items but that could be defeated by not allowing the resale of personaly crafted items.
I feel that the no crafting rule really hurts the arcane casters by limiting their creativity and veristillity.
All items would basically cost less since the time to create and chance of failure rolls could be abused / overlooked. I'm guessing it would mean everyone would take item crafting just to pay for materials only.
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Could one of the developers explain the reason for disallowing crafting of magic items in PFS?
I know one of the reasons is some people would abuse the WBL cap by trying to sell crafted items but that could be defeated by not allowing the resale of personaly crafted items.
I feel that the no crafting rule really hurts the arcane casters by limiting their creativity and veristillity.
You actually mentioned the fatal flaw, although you may not have realized it.
If you let one person have magic items at 1/2 price (the arcane caster creating his own stuff), it's fundamentally unfair when another person (a character without creation rules/feats) cannot purchase them for 1/2 price as well- not even from the first person 'at cost'.
And if you let the 2nd person buy magic items from the 1st, there's nothing stopping the 1st from NOT selling at cost (insist on full price, maybe some smaller profit margin) the 1st character again has an unfair advantage, in the form of extra wealth.
From what I've been led to beleive, item creation is harder than it's worth to balance in large organized games like PFS. They decided it's kinder overall to stunt the item crafting options (including craft skill, but mainly magic creation) than see the imbalance in the game economy displayed in practice in the past by similar games such as Living Golarion and Living Greyhawk.
Mind you, alchemists can still craft alchemical items. These can't be sold, period, but may be borrowed by other players for use in a scenario.
Kind of odd that alchemist would be allowed but other classes aren't...
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That's not really comparable.. alchemists' produce has a built-in expiration date.. it's not like they're passing around actual potions.
Their 'items' are just a different form of party buff :)
Ge wasn't talking about their extracts. Alchemists can make actual alchemical items like alchemist's fire, acid, weapon blanches, etc. using craft (alchemy)
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Ge wasn't talking about their extracts. Alchemists can make actual alchemical items like alchemist's fire, acid, weapon blanches, etc. using craft (alchemy)That's not really comparable.. alchemists' produce has a built-in expiration date.. it's not like they're passing around actual potions.
Their 'items' are just a different form of party buff :)
The difference is in scale. All alchemical items are pretty cheap, and are typically consumables. Giving alchemists extra alchemist fires won't break a power curve. However, if you give casters the ability to Craft Wondrous Items, you essentially double the amount of gold they earn per adventure, giving those casters double the magical items of other players who can't take the feat. It wrecks the balance of power. That is the primary reason, and its a good one.
That being said, I personally think that scribing scrolls could have been left in, and might have been what the OP was originally referring to. Nothing is stopping you from buying scrolls at full cost however.
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LazarX, I do not normaly play arcane casters in PFS I am playing my first a Magus. I was creating a high level caster the other night for fun not PFS and built a staff for him that cost around 175000gp for a single item and thought that was a over priced but thats just me.
deusvult, why don't the DEVS just make a list of prices for spell charges buffs resistences etc and don't have casters make items at 1/2 value that way it does not upset the WBL and say PC casters cannot make items for sale or use by active PC's.
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deusvult, why don't the DEVS just make a list of prices for spell charges buffs resistences etc and don't have casters make items at 1/2 value that way it does not upset the WBL and say PC casters cannot make items for sale or use by active PC's.
They kinda do, you can pay Prestige for otherwise-free castings of various, fairly powerful magics.
You can also pay 2 PP for 'free' 1st level wands.. arcane casters are going to get way more bang for their buck out of this than other characters.. even divine casters, but especially martial characters.
Another reason the crafting rules are not allowed is that they are rather wonky and vague. From all the threads I have read or posted in on this subject on these forums, I would say that if you were to gather 10 gamers together and have give them the crafting rules, you would end up with 10 different views on how things should work overall. The crafting rules are such a mess that even the Paizo folks have put off fixing them.
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deusvult, why don't the DEVS just make a list of prices for spell charges buffs resistences etc and don't have casters make items at 1/2 value that way it does not upset the WBL and say PC casters cannot make items for sale or use by active PC's.They kinda do, you can pay Prestige for otherwise-free castings of various, fairly powerful magics.
You can also pay 2 PP for 'free' 1st level wands.. arcane casters are going to get way more bang for their buck out of this than other characters.. even divine casters, but especially martial characters.
I always half-assumed that the 2 PP for a 1st level wand was to give parties an ample supply of Wands of CLW. At least that's how my players use it. It also allows the tables of players to shift, and doesn't force each group to have a cleric or an oracle (UMD).
Regarding the crafting, it slows games down severely in the mid to high tiers. When the party pools all their wealth, gives it to the crafter and they in turn craft gear for everyone, you'll quickly find that probably one session a month is nothing but shopping.
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Another issue with crafting magic items which has come up in previous organized play campaigns is that you have to keep a tight rein on the campaign time line. That is the reason that living geyhawk had time units - you had x units per year to adventure or craft items or be locked in jail or whatever. PFS does not want to keep detailed track of time, so they disallow item creation. Alchemists get such huge bonuses that they can generally whip out a batch of consumables over breakfast, so time is not an issue.
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LazarX, I do not normaly play arcane casters in PFS I am playing my first a Magus. I was creating a high level caster the other night for fun not PFS and built a staff for him that cost around 175000gp for a single item and thought that was a over priced but thats just me.
deusvult, why don't the DEVS just make a list of prices for spell charges buffs resistences etc and don't have casters make items at 1/2 value that way it does not upset the WBL and say PC casters cannot make items for sale or use by active PC's.
This is an organized play game. As such, while some special rules are necessary due to how organized play works, they want to stick as closely to the RAW as possible. Instead of crafting an entirely different item creation guide, they just indicate that the crafting cannot be done in organized play. Simple, easy, and elegant solution.
Secondly, there no time units in this campaign. They created them for Living Greyhawk, so you could spend time units to craft an item, train an animal, go an on adventure, what have you. But once you used all your time units, you couldn't play that character until the new year when your time units would replenish. It was a very convoluted system, and if I remember correctly, difficult to do correctly, easy to abuse, and not very popular. Without time units, how do you reconcile the time it takes to craft an item?
This has been answered for you in the past as well. Bringing up the same question every 6 months isn't going to get you a different answer.
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This has been answered for you in the past as well. Bringing up the same question every 6 months isn't going to get you a different answer.
Andrew, don't blame Lou for this one's reappearance, someone else (Snaake) resurrected an old thread.
Snaake,
We have had three different people working on the campaign, som eof the responsibility has been split out so the campaign has two leaders, and much of this is an old issue, predating the APG in part.
I am sure this is on Mike's overcrowded plate to take a look at, when it reaches the top of the list. Just not sure if it is above or below the new pregens....