Question About Saves


Rules Questions

Scarab Sages

Here's an example:

star archon wrote:
Explosive Rebirth (Su) When killed, a star archon explodes in a blinding flash of energy that deals 50 points of damage (half fire, half holy damage) to anything within 100 feet (Reflex DC 29 half). The save DC is Constitution-based. The slain archon reincarnates 1d4 rounds later as an advanced shield archon.

(Emphasis added)

My question is very simple: what the heck is that line doing in the ability description? If it's a reflex save then it will be dex-based, right? Or does it use your base reflex save but instead of dex it uses your con modifier?
I've seen this sort of thing all over the place in the Bestiaries and elsewhere, and I must say that it's quite convoluting...

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Eragar wrote:

Here's an example:

star archon wrote:
Explosive Rebirth (Su) When killed, a star archon explodes in a blinding flash of energy that deals 50 points of damage (half fire, half holy damage) to anything within 100 feet (Reflex DC 29 half). The save DC is Constitution-based. The slain archon reincarnates 1d4 rounds later as an advanced shield archon.

(Emphasis added)

My question is very simple: what the heck is that line doing in the ability description? If it's a reflex save then it will be dex-based, right? Or does it use your base reflex save but instead of dex it uses your con modifier?
I've seen this sort of thing all over the place in the Bestiaries and elsewhere, and I must say that it's quite convoluting...

That line's telling you what ability score modifies the saving throw's DC. In this case, the star archon's Constitution modifier increases the save DC.

It's not something you need to ever know unless the monster's relevant ability score (in this case, Constitution) changes.

As a general rule, all special attacks possessed by monsters that grant saving throws use the following formula to determine the save DC:

10 + 1/2 the monster's Hit Dice + the appropriate ability score modifier

Shadow Lodge

It's the same thing as 'The wizard's spell save DC is Int-based'.

An increase in Con will increase the save DC of that ability.

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