RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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I think most folks here are confusing 'oddball characters' with what the OP is trying to say. You can have the most crazy out of this world character you want.....just as long as it fits the setting. If you play in Golarion, don't expect to play a half-dragon jedi and if you play star wars - no elvish wizards.
It's a bit more than that though.
It's also a 'no Warforged in Greyhawk'* or no 'Kender in Golarion'** If your setting doesn't contain either, then you shouldn't be expected as GM*** to modify it to include such a thing.
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RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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Wow Matt, your construct character sounds remarkably like my 'shield guardian' character. (Warforged Fighter/Warblade created as a mage's bodyguard.) I'd like to play him again...
Well we learned that Warforged and Psionics interact weirdly... With no proficiency penalty and no ACP, an adamantine bodied Warforged makes a nasty psion base. Mix it with Shaper where you can self heal with repair damage more effectively than the cleric can...
Yeah, this was the shaper who had all his astral constructs appear to come from his chest. If I'd not lost the sorcerer he was a cohort too, I was hoping to get him to a level where he could Expanded Knowlege Metamorphisis and really play a transformer ;-)
As a GM, I prefer to make the PCs for my game. I come up with a character concept that sounds cool, build the character sheet, write up a short backstory, and then find a mini to fit. I then create another character with a similar role and story, but opposite gender. When it comes time to start the campaign, I lay out all of the minis and have the players pick a mini they like. Then they get to see the character sheet. So far all 8 of the players I've had in this current campaign have really liked the characters I've made. Not only do the players get a well balanced character with a good backstory, but I have no problem integrating the PC into the current storyline.
As a GM, I prefer to make the PCs for my game. I come up with a character concept that sounds cool, build the character sheet, write up a short backstory, and then find a mini to fit. I then create another character with a similar role and story, but opposite gender. When it comes time to start the campaign, I lay out all of the minis and have the players pick a mini they like. Then they get to see the character sheet. So far all 8 of the players I've had in this current campaign have really liked the characters I've made. Not only do the players get a well balanced character with a good backstory, but I have no problem integrating the PC into the current storyline.
*Blinks*
This won't end well.
I guess you've never played in a campaign like that before. I actually picked that up from another GM that used the same style for our gamestore games. My campaign's been going for about 5 years now so apparently I'm doing something right.
I guess you've never played in a campaign like that before. I actually picked that up from another GM that used the same style for our gamestore games. My campaign's been going for about 5 years now so apparently I'm doing something right.
To each their own, and if your game has been going for 5 years, then my hats off to you. But, I have to agree with Matthew Morris, in that I have only seen pregen characters work in short-lived, one-off scenarios like cons, parties, etc.
Even brand new players I've introduced to the hobby, typically have their own character idea in their minds before they've even learned the mechanics of the game(generally descriptions, not mechanics-specific builds). But, again, if it works for your group, then good on ya.
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I guess you've never played in a campaign like that before.
Nor would I play in such a campaign. If the DM handed me such a character sheet, I would ask him where my copy of the script is, because I need my lines and stage direction to play this character the way he wants.
I guess you've never played in a campaign like that before.Nor would I play in such a campaign. If the DM handed me such a character sheet, I would ask him where my copy of the script is, because I need my lines and stage direction to play this character the way he wants.
I'm currently in a strange game where we rolled up our characters as normal(albeit with severe race/class restrictions, unbeknown to me til I arrived), then the DM fast forwarded the timeline 10 years, had us awake from being brainwashed, and now we have to get our faces transformed and identities changed.
I never bothered handing the DM my backstory, because at this point, why bother? He's already transformed our characters into other people; I am not playing the character I rolled up anymore, just same stats.
I guess you've never played in a campaign like that before.Nor would I play in such a campaign. If the DM handed me such a character sheet, I would ask him where my copy of the script is, because I need my lines and stage direction to play this character the way he wants.I'm currently in a strange game where we rolled up our characters as normal(albeit with severe race/class restrictions, unbeknown to me til I arrived), then the DM fast forwarded the timeline 10 years, had us awake from being brainwashed, and now we have to get our faces transformed and identities changed.
I never bothered handing the DM my backstory, because at this point, why bother? He's already transformed our characters into other people; I am not playing the character I rolled up anymore, just same stats.
That does sound wierd and controlling.
I guess you've never played in a campaign like that before.Nor would I play in such a campaign. If the DM handed me such a character sheet, I would ask him where my copy of the script is, because I need my lines and stage direction to play this character the way he wants.
And I'd never invite you to play in THIS game, TOZ, because you've made it clear that it's not something you like. You assume I'd just blind side someone with that kind of information. No. The players I invited knew what they were getting into from the beginning and actually saw it as a change from the same old same old. One player immediately fell in love with his character and it's now his favorite of all time. I've played and ran plenty of games using the standard way as well.
That does sound wierd and controlling.
It really is. He even offered up a npc Alchemist to sell the party Cure potions at a slight discount, on the condition that at 6th level somebody in the party has to take the Leadership feat, and take this npc on as their cohort. I'm not so sure I'm returning to this game.
It really is. He even offered up a npc Alchemist to sell the party Cure potions at a slight discount, on the condition that at 6th level somebody in the party has to take the Leadership feat, and take this npc on as their cohort. I'm not so sure I'm returning to this game.That does sound wierd and controlling.
That's...creepy. What point would there be in taking Leadership if the GM is just forcing the NPC on them anyways?
Note you do have to be 7th level to take leadership in pathfinder.
That's...creepy. What point would there be in taking Leadership if the GM is just forcing the NPC on them anyways?It really is. He even offered up a npc Alchemist to sell the party Cure potions at a slight discount, on the condition that at 6th level somebody in the party has to take the Leadership feat, and take this npc on as their cohort. I'm not so sure I'm returning to this game.That does sound wierd and controlling.
I have no idea. At the moment, there are actually more npc's tagging along than there are actual PC's in the group.
The group has been gaming together for a long time, I'm the new guy. Everyone else seems ok with the DM's ideas, so I'm the odd one out. I've expressed a little concern and disappointment over some of these facets of the game, but this is their thing, so I think I'm just going to step aside.
As a GM, I prefer to make the PCs for my game.
Most players I know would never agree to that. I wouldn't either.
RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16
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I've played in campaigns where the GM had a strong hand in designing characters. (The current game in the rotating-GM project I'm playing is like that: the GM handed out cards such as "this character is older than the others, here's the mechanical effects" and "this character is good at hunting, here's the mechanical effects" and so on. We had to distribute the cards among the PCs.)
I am reminded of the original DragonLance series of modules; the party was strongly encouraged to play the PCs from the novels.
The mechanical advantages for the GM are obvious. She can design a character with this or that special ability, that would be gloriously imbalanced if it were an allowable option to all PCs.
I also don't put much personality into pregenerated characters as I did not create them. Also I don't get much choice on what I want to play.
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As a GM, I prefer to make the PCs for my game.Most players I know would never agree to that. I wouldn't either.
I've had a GM do this before, but only for one-shot sessions. It was alright, since it was only for one session. Never had it happen when it was a full campaign. Not sure I'd like that as a player. As a GM though, it would be tempting. But I know my players well enough...well, half of them wouldn't care, one of them would actually like it since she hates character creation and writing backstories, but the others would revolt and my head would be on a pike.
I guess you've never played in a campaign like that before.Nor would I play in such a campaign. If the DM handed me such a character sheet, I would ask him where my copy of the script is, because I need my lines and stage direction to play this character the way he wants.I'm currently in a strange game where we rolled up our characters as normal(albeit with severe race/class restrictions, unbeknown to me til I arrived), then the DM fast forwarded the timeline 10 years, had us awake from being brainwashed, and now we have to get our faces transformed and identities changed.
I never bothered handing the DM my backstory, because at this point, why bother? He's already transformed our characters into other people; I am not playing the character I rolled up anymore, just same stats.
That could've been a good story idea, if he had warned the group of what would happen beforehand, a story about clearing your name, finding out what happened in those ten years and what caused you to be brainwashed sounds cool.
The thing about there being more NPCs than PCs is really weird though.
As a GM, I prefer to make the PCs for my game. I come up with a character concept that sounds cool, build the character sheet, write up a short backstory, and then find a mini to fit. I then create another character with a similar role and story, but opposite gender. When it comes time to start the campaign, I lay out all of the minis and have the players pick a mini they like. Then they get to see the character sheet. So far all 8 of the players I've had in this current campaign have really liked the characters I've made. Not only do the players get a well balanced character with a good backstory, but I have no problem integrating the PC into the current storyline.
I've done parts of this many times to varying degrees of success.
Normally I'll make up a hook or concept to get them into the game and then let them fill in the details
for example; I need a paladin who is tracking down Sir So and So, a elf or half-elf would be preferable. Then they build the character
or
I'll build the character to fit their concept (I prefere this, because most of my players really suck at character crafting in all sorts of aspects. One guy who "loves building characters" can't build a fighter to sunder his way out of a wet paper sack, to the guy who takes 3 weeks to build a 2nd level rogue, while the other, can't be bothered to finish the end of a paragraph when building a character and will thus normally try and do things one is expressly forbidden from doing and so on...)
This is also preferable as I like game-crafting and I haven't run a game in years, in any system that I don't alter or add some mechanic or another to get a certain play experience or theme-feel, and so having altered things I'm in a better position to know how it might affect a PC and can plan accordingly in character generation.
but
I don't typically do both, and I wouldn't do it for a random gathering of people, but my friends and I have been gaming together for close to two decades and we trust each other to make sure the others are having fun, so pregens are not always out of the question, plus some of the best moments I've had in gaming is by taking a pregen and making it my own. I dunno, maybe it frees up brain-cells by not having to worry so much about the mechanical details and I can just let loose with the personality, or something...
So DM's, hold firm. Put setting first. You aren't cruel,You are setting limits. You aren't stopping creativity, you are demanding it. Creativity isn't getting everything you want just as you want it. Creativity is finding the options that exist with the tools you are given.
Does that mean I can't play Chippy the Steampunk Chipmunk Monk in your game (that would be my anthropomorphic chipmunk monk who multiclassed with synthesist summoner to get a functional steampunk outfit, potentially while adding the clockwork template from Green Ronin's Advanced Bestiary)? :)
I guess you've never played in a campaign like that before.Nor would I play in such a campaign. If the DM handed me such a character sheet, I would ask him where my copy of the script is, because I need my lines and stage direction to play this character the way he wants.I'm currently in a strange game where we rolled up our characters as normal(albeit with severe race/class restrictions, unbeknown to me til I arrived), then the DM fast forwarded the timeline 10 years, had us awake from being brainwashed, and now we have to get our faces transformed and identities changed.
I never bothered handing the DM my backstory, because at this point, why bother? He's already transformed our characters into other people; I am not playing the character I rolled up anymore, just same stats.
That could've been a good story idea, if he had warned the group of what would happen beforehand, a story about clearing your name, finding out what happened in those ten years and what caused you to be brainwashed sounds cool.
The thing about there being more NPCs than PCs is really weird though.
Right, I totally agree. The DM was really good too, he really did his homework with building encounters, building the setting, etc. The group got along really well, everybody was fun to game with, but the game itself was just not for me. All the things I like to play in a fantasy game were off limits, and the game basically revolved around goblins and guns. I'm not a fan of either. That, and the overbearingly heavy railroading the DM did. Felt like I wasn't even playing at multiple points.
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I guess you've never played in a campaign like that before.Nor would I play in such a campaign. If the DM handed me such a character sheet, I would ask him where my copy of the script is, because I need my lines and stage direction to play this character the way he wants.
I've done some one offs where the GM handed us sheets for things like microlite. Didn't do it for me, would not recommend.
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So DM's, hold firm. Put setting first. You aren't cruel,You are setting limits. You aren't stopping creativity, you are demanding it. Creativity isn't getting everything you want just as you want it. Creativity is finding the options that exist with the tools you are given.Does that mean I can't play Chippy the Steampunk Chipmunk Monk in your game (that would be my anthropomorphic chipmunk monk who multiclassed with synthesist summoner to get a functional steampunk outfit, potentially while adding the clockwork template from Green Ronin's Advanced Bestiary)? :)
Not without a hell of a back story.
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I've played in campaigns where the GM had a strong hand in designing characters. (The current game in the rotating-GM project I'm playing is like that: the GM handed out cards such as "this character is older than the others, here's the mechanical effects" and "this character is good at hunting, here's the mechanical effects" and so on. We had to distribute the cards among the PCs.)
I am reminded of the original DragonLance series of modules; the party was strongly encouraged to play the PCs from the novels.
The mechanical advantages for the GM are obvious. She can design a character with this or that special ability, that would be gloriously imbalanced if it were an allowable option to all PCs.
I've got a friend who is planning a Star Wars game in a similar way, but taking it further. He's planning on basically coming up with character roles or hooks beforehand, along the lines of "Your sister was killed when you were a child, your life's goal is to find her murderer" or possibly even things that involve professions, like "You are a smuggler who bought his ship on credit from a crimelord, the next payment is due soon and you have no cargo." Then the players choose between them and decide on stats and personality.
It makes it easier for the GM to tie the characters into the plot, as everyone has built-in hooks. On the other hand, I'm not sure that things will have as much of an emotional impact, where your character's big payoff is something that you had no hand in creating. Essentially, I think the approach is borrowed from video game design, with all of the same benefits and drawbacks.
I did something sort of similar when the Star Wars Saga Edition was first released; I was mega-excited about it and had a ton of character ideas. The game I was going to run only had 2 players at the beginning, so instead of having them worry about having to cover party roles, I rolled up a npc to fit every role(soldier, Tekkie/repairman, scoundrel, pilot, etc). The players then rolled up whatever they wanted, and were free to pick some of the npc's as extra teammates along the way.
As the game picked up more players, we phased the npc's out as the roles were filled. When we finally had enough players to round out the party, the npc's were made into story-only plot devices.
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There will always be that one player that doesn't really care about character concept, setting or context of the situation. They will build their character stat first, trying to exploit or flat-out abuse the system, without even being able to come up with a name for their Generic Fightar Dude XII. They will ask to play a completely exotic race for this or that ability, or ignore the plot hooks of the campaign that might offer some nice character concept they can play. Are they playing the game incorrectly because of this?
No.
There is no wrong or right way to play an RPG. If they want to play it like that, they should, and there is nothing you can say that objectively proves that they are doing it wrong. You might dislike them as you want, or decide it's not worth to play with them, but that's just you. Players and even groups like these will likely continue to exist. You may have a solid, experienced group of bros that share your exact same playstyle and love for in depth backgrounds, but most of us aren't in this situation. I've been roleplaying for 7 years, changed various group, and I still can't remember a time when there wasn't at least one of the following:
- a rollplayer that doesn't speak if not to declare his dice result;
- a powergamer that b&~@@es about balance when he rolls a natural 1;
- a rules lawyer that rolls always the cheesiest character possible.
I still had fun. I can't tell them to piss off and make the TRU ROLEPLAYER enjoy their game in peace. They have the same rights as mine, and I wasn't lucky enough to find a group where there wasn't a "That guy".You either live with this situation, or try to change them by making them more interested in what they are doing. Discuss their characters without being judgemental. Explain the idea behind YOUR character. Discuss the setting, pointing out all the cool stuff that you can play that isn't necessary uberpowerful. If you make them say "cool" about something that is not cheesy for once, about something that is a cool idea and not...
I think there is a proper way to play an RPG.
If your the GM you kick them out of the game. Simple as that. I have asked players to leave my game many times. Some of them come back. some of them don't. Either way it is great. I have no problem telling people why they don't work with my group. They have the right to play how they want. They do not have the right to do it in my game. They have the right to find a group that allows their play style.In all honesty, most players I say I will kick out, usually come around to the proper style for the table so they can stay in the group. There are plenty of goofy characters in my game, but they all have a good reason for it.
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In all honesty, most players I say I will kick out, usually come around to the proper style for the table so they can stay in the group. There are plenty of goofy characters in my game, but they all have a good reason for it.
To paraphrase a great movie line. "This is not 'Nam. This is Roleplaying. There are rules!."
It's a league game, smokey. These are the expectations of the table, you are part of a group.
Come with us on the journey or leave.
I try to mess around with the rules enough to let my players have whatever character they want, seeing as they're helpless when it comes to mechanics. I suppose the key thing is to offer up corollaries to their particularly outlandish ideas- Sure, your barbarian can have wings made of lightning, but only while raging and only for 2x rage rounds per flying round, etc.
I have a small stack of character sheets lying around that I make occasionally in my spare time, these are for people to pick up who are just sitting in for a session/new to RPGs/just died. They're all pretty silly, most of them are characters from movies, tv shows, Unforgotten Realms (of course Roamin is a lvl 11 Paladin!), a bear bard with max Disguise and Bluff to pretend to look human and speak Common, so on.
In our game, we have a rule where if you can't explain with a straight face why your character would be where they are at and go with the group as it exists, you can't play it.
It depends on the gaming system and the group.
If the gaming system and envisioned world is inherently comical, e.g., TOON, then it makes perfect sense that players be laughing while describing their characters actions.
On the other hand, some players have a knack for interjecting humor even into very serious contexts, and the rest of the group appreciates it. (Think of classic horror movies where something funny proceeds something grim, adding to the effect.)
in service,
Rich
http://zhalindor.com