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Hi
Was wondering if the forum has any suggestions on a 20pt PFS build for the gunslinger? Take it to level 6 or 7 only should be enough.
Any tips / hints / out of the box suggestions also appreciated.
Hmmm. My first question would be do you want better odds of a hit, faster number of shots, concentrate on deeds, or somewhere in the middle?
One of the basic questions would be when, or even IF, you want to aslot in Point Blank Shot and Precise Shot.
Also, when and if you want to work the Rapid Reload tree, or settle for Alchemical paper cartridges?
How strongly do you feel about Grit? Do you want as much as you can get, or is it something to have one point, just to do an occasional quick clear when you misfire?
Pistol ot musket, and did you want to stay with that choice for the whole span of the character's career?
Also, do any of the legal Gunslinger archetypes sound appealing? A Guntank is going to have a totally different build than a Pistolero.
Also, pure Gunslinger, or are you willing to multiclass?
My own PFS Gunslinger is mainly 10s, with Dex 18 and Wis 16, Human, started with Point Blank Shot and Precise Shot, added Rapid Reload at 3rd level, and uses a musket.
Traits were Reactionary and one to make Diplomacy a class skill.
Acrobatics, Diplomacy, I forget his other skills.
Unfortunately, I am posting this at work, and don't have access to his character sheet, or build planning sheet.
If you dip alchemist I would suggest going vivisectionist.
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i've been looking at the musket master, rapid reload at 1st and at 3rd level if you have at least 1 grit you can reload a musket as a standard rather than a move, this is before the rapid reload feat so you actually end up reloading as move, use paper cartridges and you're reloading as a free action.
Regardless, as a human you should get point blank shot (and why wouldn't you) and precise shot.
As sphar said, a -4 isn't so bad for the gun slinger, but that's not why i'd take it, i'd take it to reduce a -8(for cover and into melee, which happens oh so much) to a -4
a dip into alchemist does sound good, dex mutagen and infusions of longshot(+10ft range increment for 1 min/level) for pistol using gunslingers would be very nice
EDIT:thanks Melil13
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Even if you spent the 12 gold for a Alchemical cartridge, paper (guessing this one is the one you mean to use). And then adding in Rapid reload you now get a free action to reload ... nods.
I was liking the Pistol class 2 but in the end i dont think you can pump out enough damage with any of these variants. I mean 12 gold a shot! Just for you to be as competent as other damage dealers?
I hear that i am wrong ... other say they can keep up just fine. I just want someone to show me how :/.
(Btw Skerek it was sphar not I :P i am a noob when it comes to Gunslinger)
It's not 12 gp a shot, it's 1.2 gp. Gunsmithing let's a gunslinger craft ammunition at 10% of the price (and lets them buy ammunition in PFS for 10% of the price).
That's a lot easier to keep up, considering a first level PFS module will net a PC 400-500 gp easily. By the time you can fire many multiple shots, you're rolling in dough anyway.
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Even if you spent the 12 gold for a Alchemical cartridge, paper (guessing this one is the one you mean to use). And then adding in Rapid reload you now get a free action to reload ... nods.
I was liking the Pistol class 2 but in the end i dont think you can pump out enough damage with any of these variants. I mean 12 gold a shot! Just for you to be as competent as other damage dealers?
I hear that i am wrong ... other say they can keep up just fine. I just want someone to show me how :/.
(Btw Skerek it was sphar not I :P i am a noob when it comes to Gunslinger)
Actually with the gunsmithing feat it's cheaper than that
Gunsmithing
....
Crafting Ammunition: You can craft bullets, pellets, and black powder for a cost in raw materials equal to 10% of the price. If you have at least 1 rank in Craft (alchemy), you can craft alchemical cartridges for a cost in raw materials equal to half the price of the cartridge. At your GM’s discretion, you can craft metal cartridges for a cost in raw materials equal to half the cost of the cartridge. Crafting bullets, black powder, or cartridges takes 1 day of work for every 1,000 gp of ammunition (minimum 1 day).
and for PFS
Gunsmithing does not grant the ability to craft firearms, ammunition, or black powder. Rather, it allows the purchase of bullets, pellets, black powder, and alchemical cartridges (with 1 rank in Craft [alchemy]) at the listed reduced price, but does not grant a discount on the purchase of any firearm. Resold items gained through this feat are worth half the actual cost paid, not half the regular market value for the item. No PC can purchase a gun without this feat, even if they possess the Amateur Gunslinger or Exotic Weapon Proficiency (firearm) feats.
read about that here
so that ends up being 6g a shot.
i think getting the most of the gunslinger class involves multiclassing, beyond 5th level (gun training, which allows you to add dex to damage) there's only a few things worth getting, Targeting is great at 7th and getting to 11th allows you to start taking the Signature Deed feat and gives you lightning reload. 15th gets you the evasive deed. you get death's shot deed at 19th level. and the 'capstone' ability for the gunslinger, True Grit is just the Signature Deed feat twice. All nice stuff, but nothing to boost your damage
The only reason i can see for going full Gunslinger is to get Death's Shot then use Signature Deed to make it cost no grit then try and get crits, every time you crit something it has to take a fort save or die, normally these death attacks are one a day or can't be made again if the target makes it's saving throw, but not this. just make sure you get Improved critical for you gun so that you can crit on a 19-20, Targeting could allow you to crit on a 17-20, but as a full round action, you're better off using 4 attacks with a 19-20 crit
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I would drop intellect down to 10 and bring constitution up to 14. As a human you'll still have 5 skill points/level, which is more than enough to max out a few skills and dip into a bunch of others.
I'm gonna echo what others have said and go for PBS and Rapid Reload at first level instead. You're making touch attacks remember, so you have an easier time than most. Shoot for the guys who aren't in melee, and try to avoid soft cover. Remember also that you're proficient with all martial weapons, so it wouldn't hurt to grab a nice melee so you can help flank when shooting is a less valid option.
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What should I be paying for each alchemical paper cartridge shot though in PFS?
as i said before, 6G, first mod will be a royal pain though, much gold at all
St 12
Dx 18
Cn 12
It 13
Ws 14
Ch 08
Also with your stats, don't worry to much about strength, unless you want to do a switch hitter type, you won't be using it much at all
Also with your stats, don't worry to much about strength, unless you want to do a switch hitter type, you won't be using it much at all
I think a gunslinger could be a lovely switch-hitter if only he could spare two feats for dervish dance.
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Something just occurred to me. It's completely legal for the gunslinger to take a dip into alchemist and get vestigial arm twice allowing them to duel wield muskets at a -4 penalty, combine that with the musket master and you can get a lot of attacks offOuch!
Thats just... ouch.
In any case I don't like the mutant option. Thats just a personal thing but I think that people should freak out when a three armed man walks into the bar... especially when he uses the third arm to drink with while the other hands are shuffling cards. In other words, the RP aspect is difficult for me.
I don't play in games where half Minotaur vampires etc are an option and anyone playing such an Alchemist in my games (I'd allow it of course) would have to deal with RP reprecussions of the extra arm. I put myself under that same rule.
That said... Bonus for creativity... but I think it would be one musket and one pistol as the musket is a 2 handed gun.
nope, if you look on page 202 on in the CRB, table 8-7 points out the TWF penalties;
Normal penlties: -6/-10Off-hand weapon is light: -4/-8
TWF feat: -4/-4
Off-hand weapon is light and TWF feat: -2/-2
using the feat and the fact that the musket is not a light weapon you have -4/-4, as i said, you need to take vestigial arm twice, you needed two extra arms to reload anyway, might as well make them bigger guns.
the two major problems with this build are:
misfires, although this is a problem for all gunslingers, when you are making 4-6 rolls with a misfire of 1-3... although a non-PFS game might allow metal cartridges which would lower it back down to 1-2
with the paper cartridges you're looking at 24-36 gold spend on ammo a round, (30-45 with metal cartridges)
i'm also thinking about a build that uses the double hackbut, potions of enlarge person and vital strike, drop gun, drink potion, pick up gun, 2d12+dex without being knocked prone, using vital strike, you're looking at 4d12+dex
I think a gunslinger could be a lovely switch-hitter if only he could spare two feats for dervish dance.
Also with your stats, don't worry to much about strength, unless you want to do a switch hitter type, you won't be using it much at allOooooh :)
This may be worth me having a think.
I am thinking now of a camel riding Bedouin with a musket :)
I was considering doing something similar for a bit of a switch hitter. For PFS play there isn't a whole lot I'm interested in after level 5-7, so I was thinking of going Monk(sensei) for the wis based unarmed strike and making a grizzled old vet type character. Biggest thing holding me back on it is the fact that the monk would be really important for the feel of the character, but I wouldn't want to drop out Gunslinger(Musket Master) until I'd done at least three levels, otherwise the reload is just too painful.
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instead of going the sensei you could get a shordsword/rapier with the agile weapon enchant, pick up weapon finesse and quick draw, or if you wanted to skip out on the quick draw, use a cetus with agile weapon enchant since you can use weapons while wearing the cetus, drop the musket and just start swinging, atleast you're still punching stuff that way
Something just occurred to me. It's completely legal for the gunslinger to take a dip into alchemist and get vestigial arm twice allowing them to duel wield muskets at a -4 penalty, combine that with the musket master and you can get a lot of attacks offOuch!
Thats just... ouch.
In any case I don't like the mutant option. Thats just a personal thing but I think that people should freak out when a three armed man walks into the bar... especially when he uses the third arm to drink with while the other hands are shuffling cards. In other words, the RP aspect is difficult for me.
I don't play in games where half Minotaur vampires etc are an option and anyone playing such an Alchemist in my games (I'd allow it of course) would have to deal with RP reprecussions of the extra arm. I put myself under that same rule.
That said... Bonus for creativity... but I think it would be one musket and one pistol as the musket is a 2 handed gun.
I'm playing a Numerian Alchemist as a tech priest from warhammer 40k currently -- I took the extra arms as his cybernetic implants (simply fluffing it differently) but yeah I don't expect people to be all 'woo neat about it' more 'HOLY F#@$%K what is that thing?"
That's why he wears long robes over the heavy armor, helps hide the extra arms... mostly anyways.
Something just occurred to me. It's completely legal for the gunslinger to take a dip into alchemist and get vestigial arm twice allowing them to duel wield muskets at a -4 penalty, combine that with the musket master and you can get a lot of attacks off
You can also shoot two handed firearms one-handed at a -4 (useful when grappled, though you cant reload).