Form of Flame - Flame Oracle Question


Rules Questions


I think- .. I'm COMPLETELY over looking something here.. (I hope I am- in all reality).. HOWEVER-

I need to understand WHY an Oracle would even use the Form of the Flame ability.

To my understanding, when the spell is cast, Any armor you are wearing meld into you (So if your wearing a Breast Plate and Shield, you'll be losing AC, even if you take in account for the Natural Armor and Dex bonus), You weapons meld into you... so you only get the burn ability and an unarmed attack, you can't even cast spells, if they have anything more than Verbal (seeing as Elementals don't have hands, per say).

So please-... tell me I'm incorrect, and that this ability has a good use? and also explain it to me.


They have an INT score and language so i suspect they can speak. They have a slam attack so they have arms and are dexterous enough to climb without climb speed or fly. Moreover there is nothing called out explicitly that they cannot cast (dragons can cast with claws for somatic) so i think they should be able to continue to cast spells in that form.

You could drop your weapons and re-equip them after you transform (wooden club may burn but a magical sword may just become a very hot magical sword)but yes, armour will meld and become unusable


Thomas Writeworth wrote:
To my understanding, when the spell is cast, Any armor you are wearing meld into you (So if your wearing a Breast Plate and Shield, you'll be losing AC, even if you take in account for the Natural Armor and Dex bonus), You weapons meld into you... so you only get the burn ability and an unarmed attack, you can't even cast spells, if they have anything more than Verbal (seeing as Elementals don't have hands, per say).

You lose armor and shield bonus to AC. You can't use material components without Eschew feat.

You gain: Speed 50, Bonus to Dex, Bonus to Natural AC, Darkvision 60', resist fire 20, slam attack with burn ability. At 11th, you gain a Con bonus, too.

Depending on size you may gain a size bonus or penalty to attack, AC, CMB, and Stealth.


Apraham Lincoln wrote:


You could drop your weapons and re-equip them after you transform (wooden club may burn but a magical sword may just become a very hot magical sword)but yes, armour will meld and become unusable

This- ... I could see a little.. I don't know how my DM would feel about it, however.

Does anyone know why an Oracle would WANT to turn into one of these for an Hour Per Level?

(Other than the epic mental Image)

Dark Archive

A nice addition would be the ability to cast fire spells without material components.


Mergy wrote:
A nice addition would be the ability to cast fire spells without material components.

Well- .. if your material component is fire, you got that covered :P


Thomas Writeworth wrote:
So please-... tell me I'm incorrect, and that this ability has a good use? and also explain it to me.
PRD wrote:

Elemental Subtype: An elemental is a being composed entirely from one of the four classical elements: air, earth, fire, or water. An elemental has the following features.

Immunity to bleed, paralysis, poison, sleep effects, and stunning.

Not subject to critical hits or flanking. Does not take additional damage from precision-based attacks, such as sneak attack.

Proficient with natural weapons only, unless generally humanoid in form, in which case proficient with all simple weapons and any weapons mentioned in its entry.

Proficient with whatever type of armor (light, medium, or heavy) it is described as wearing, as well as all lighter types. Elementals not indicated as wearing armor are not proficient with armor. Elementals are proficient with shields if they are proficient with any form of armor.

Elementals do not breathe, eat, or sleep.

There are lots of goodies in that list!

Elementals can be proficient with weapons, shields, armor, etc. This implies that they can use them.

You can cast as an elemental, or at the very least take the feat Natural Spell to remove all doubt.

EDIT: Technically, I should say "Natural Spell -like" feat.


Thomas Writeworth wrote:

Does anyone know why an Oracle would WANT to turn into one of these for an Hour Per Level?

(Other than the epic mental Image)

Hmm...lava-pool enviroment, elemental plane of fire-jaunt?


Rory wrote:

There are lots of goodies in that list!

Elementals can be proficient with weapons, shields, armor, etc. This implies that they can use them.

You can cast as an elemental, or at the very least take the feat Natural Spell to remove all doubt.

EDIT: Technically, I should say "Natural Spell -like" feat.

This does make me feel a little better. (However, you don't gain a lot of the 'immunities' and such till higher up with the Form of Flame ability.. but still not that bad.

Now I just need to convince my DM that I'm not nearly destroying every armor piece, and weapon I pick up :P


New Question then:

Is there a feat, or way, to prevent your gear from Melding into you when you use this ability?

Shadow Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Thomas Writeworth wrote:
Rory wrote:

There are lots of goodies in that list!

Elementals can be proficient with weapons, shields, armor, etc. This implies that they can use them.

You can cast as an elemental, or at the very least take the feat Natural Spell to remove all doubt.

EDIT: Technically, I should say "Natural Spell -like" feat.

This does make me feel a little better. (However, you don't gain a lot of the 'immunities' and such till higher up with the Form of Flame ability.. but still not that bad.

Now I just need to convince my DM that I'm not nearly destroying every armor piece, and weapon I pick up :P

It is kind of nice for when you are resting. Nice cozy campfire also an elemental that won't go out and is a very hard to detect sentry :)


Thomas Writeworth wrote:

New Question then:

Is there a feat, or way, to prevent your gear from Melding into you when you use this ability?

Don't wear them.


I mean more along the lines- that the gear changes to fit your new form. I think I recall a feat for druids like this back in 3.0 ... but I want to know if anything like this is in the current pathfinder rules.


There's the wild effect for magic armour that allows a druid to retain bonuses from armour in wildform shape. They can turn into fire elementals. I see no reason that an oracle also shifted into a fire elemental shouldn't be able to make use of it. It does count as a +3 enchantment tho so is rather pricey

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