My group has been playing together for a little over 20 years. We have one player who has “uncanny” luck with the dice. Many of us believe he is cheating, but we do not want to call him on it and cause an incident.
He uses clear 20+ dice that you can’t really read from across the table. Sometimes I will go around the table to look at the rolls. I call it “jinxing the roll”. So he will roll and remove the die before I get to him. The last (and possibly only) saving throw he failed was when I was watching.
I want to balance things out without making it obvious – at least not obvious right away.
My thoughts are:
- Most or all enemies will make their saves vs. his spells – he is a wizard.
- Enemies will cast mostly non-save spells at his character.
- His character will be attacked more often with weapons than spells.
- Whenever feasible I will make the rolls for him – secret saves and skill checks.
I am looking for other suggestions of ways to balance things. Trust me that no one in our group wants me to confront him about this.
we had a guy in our group like this we called him " chris" he would blatantly just say he rolls 20's even though he was cheating.
what i would do was roll his rolls for him behind the screen and use that instead of his cheating rolls with him it was not all the time but he never seemed to hit the monster or make the save. ...
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
My group has been playing together for a little over 20 years. We have one player who has “uncanny” luck with the dice. Many of us believe he is cheating, but we do not want to call him on it and cause an incident.
He uses clear 20+ dice that you can’t really read from across the table. Sometimes I will go around the table to look at the rolls. I call it “jinxing the roll”. So he will roll and remove the die before I get to him. The last (and possibly only) saving throw he failed was when I was watching.
I want to balance things out without making it obvious – at least not obvious right away.
My thoughts are:
- Most or all enemies will make their saves vs. his spells – he is a wizard.
- Enemies will cast mostly non-save spells at his character.
- His character will be attacked more often with weapons than spells.
- Whenever feasible I will make the rolls for him – secret saves and skill checks.I am looking for other suggestions of ways to balance things. Trust me that no one in our group wants me to confront him about this.
He's likely cheating, and it needs to be confronted as he's only cheating himself, and I can somewhat understand him doing so.
simple suggestions; Tell him if he removes or touches the roll before you get to it, it's a natural 1, and that the numbers on the dice get recolored, i.e. Sharpe the numbers or fill the number indents with black crayon, to increase the number visibility, or he uses new dice with a better contrast.
RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Hi, Dren.
Without more information (why do you not want to confront him? why do you even want to play with this guy?) all I can say is "roll the dice yourself."
Here's the wrong way to handle it: assume he's going to make all his rolls and saves, and scale up the threats to the party to match the actual (as opposed to theoretical, based on fair dice) capabilities he's exhibiting. Other PCs will die, and the other players will get mad at him for raising the party's hazard level.
Better, here's a silly little tableau you can perform: get two players who are just as fed up as you.
PLAYER 1: (rolls a 5, in view of the problem player) I rolled a 15, plus modifiers, that's a 26.
PLAYER 2: Dude. That was a 5, not a 15. I am white hot with rage!
YOU, THE GM: All right. Let's call that an honest mistake. From now on, everybody rolls in the open and leaves his result to be seen. If not, I have the right to roll the dice myself.
Quit being a wimp; simply tell him to use dice that aren't clear, and no spindown d20s. Your "workarounds" involve counter-cheating and generally just making his life hard. Just be honest; it works more than you think.
I see your point, I really do.
However we don't have any proof other than his uncanny luck. To make him change dice would mean accusing him of cheating - without proof.
Also - many of us use clear 20+ dice, we like them, and they are not easy to find anymore.
I have spoken to the others about this, and without proof confronting him will only lead to bad feelings and lost friendships.
|
But you're willing to take to cheating yourself to counter it. Basically you're saying that you are willing to ruin the game.
I'd just let it stand; maybe quietly ask players to pay attention to all dice he rolls (even if they can't just having them look that way will keep him honest). If it means that much to him to "win", and you don't want to confront him, let it be and just let him make his saves. Keep honest yourself; eventually if the other players get fed up they will confront him.
Hi, Dren.
Without more information (why do you not want to confront him? why do you even want to play with this guy?) all I can say is "roll the dice yourself."
Here's the wrong way to handle it: assume he's going to make all his rolls and saves, and scale up the threats to the party to match the actual (as opposed to theoretical, based on fair dice) capabilities he's exhibiting. Other PCs will die, and the other players will get mad at him for raising the party's hazard level.
Better, here's a silly little tableau you can perform: get two players who are just as fed up as you.
PLAYER 1: (rolls a 5, in view of the problem player) I rolled a 15, plus modifiers, that's a 26.
PLAYER 2: Dude. That was a 5, not a 15. I am white hot with rage!
YOU, THE GM: All right. Let's call that an honest mistake. From now on, everybody rolls in the open and leaves his result to be seen. If not, I have the right to roll the dice myself.
We play with him because there is a lot more to this individual than the fact that he cheats on his rolls. We have all been friends and playing together since high school or longer.
I have thought of having other players watch him, or introducing a rule that we watch each other roll. The problem is that this would be a very unusual move for our group. For years we have been using the honor system, I can't change that without an explanation.
The clear dice, how well are the numbers colored or are they transparent?
If they are transparent, order that black crayon be used to fill the number indentation and if the numbers are colored, use a black marker like a Sharpe and overwrite the older color in numbers.
Actually you do have an explanation, his dice are defying dice probability and that some of his actions "So he will roll and remove the die before I get to him. The last (and possibly only) saving throw he failed was when I was watching." indicate cheating.
|
Tell your party you want to handle rolls a little differently than you have been.
Tell them you want to:
1) Use opaque, high contrast dice (no white numbers on clear dice)
2) All rolls in the open (except some of the Gm's rolls)
3) All rolls have to be verified by the player to the left (excepting some of the GM's secret rolls), an unverified roll is a failure
Out of curiosity, you don't tell him the DC he needs to beat (or AC he needs to hit) when you request a roll do you?
-Skeld
"That is why you fail."
I am looking for other suggestions of ways to balance things. Trust me that no one in our group wants me to confront him about this.
Thanks Yoda, but that is not terribly helpful. :-)
|
Well, you cannot prove it. Unless you conceal a high resolution camera above the gaming table, which is stupid and mostly unviable.
So, if you suspect cheating, treat him as guilty until proven innocent.
If he removes the die from the table before you come over to see his roll, that is an obvious sign of cheating.
I understand that you don't want to hurt his feelings, but if the game is suffering because of it, or you, which from your first post i see that you do, you should tell him to stop cheating or run him out of the game.
Cheating player is a problem player, and problems should be solved.
I have fixed those problems in my games. I have bought all my friends dark colored dice with white numerals on them and we use those in my games.
Or, you can get that player extra large dice. I hear that those aren't too expensive.
But don't cheat against him, that is the worst way to fix the problem. because he will not stop cheating until you stop him.
The clear dice, how well are the numbers colored or are they transparent?
If they are transparent, order that black crayon be used to fill the number indentation and if the numbers are colored, use a black marker like a Sharpe and overwrite the older color in numbers.
They are transparent non-colored 20+ dice. We all have some and nobody colors them in because then they look crappy.
For me to issue a house rule about which dice we use, or how they are colored in would be highly unusual, and the reasons would be obvious.
|
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
We play with him because there is a lot more to this individual than the fact that he cheats on his rolls. We have all been friends and playing together since high school or longer.
I have thought of having other players watch him, or introducing a rule that we watch each other roll. The problem is that this would be a very unusual move for our group. For years we have been using the honor system, I can't change that without an explanation.
If the thought of even implying to your group that the player is cheating bothers you more than any of the solutions suggested here, then you're obviously not fed up with it enough to confront him and deal with your problem.
Right now, you're just sort of kinda thinking about dipping a tow in to test the waters. When you're really good and fed up, you'll dive in a fix this. You already know how, you just haven't committed to it yet.
-Skeld
Well you could do the inverse of most D20 assumptions. Instead of having them roll a Saving throw do like 4th edition and use their save mods add it to 10 and that's the Reflex Ac. At least I think 4th did something like that I don't personally play, I recall one of my friends discussing it with someone else. That way you make the rolls and it's still not accusing people of cheating.
|
|
I am looking for other suggestions of ways to balance things. Trust me that no one in our group wants me to confront him about this.
I would talk to the player about using a different die that you can read from across the table.
There's a guy I used to play with who likewise had uncanny luck. Rolled more 20's than should have been possible. The part that's amazing is I know he's not cheating, unless there's a way you can roll a die that makes it land on 20 more often than normal. Any die, mind you. Not always his own. There are such players and they make fearsome DMs.
I'm an average by extremes roller -- I either roll above a 15 or below a 5 -- rarely in between. So either I succeed wildly or I fail horribly.
The clear dice, how well are the numbers colored or are they transparent?
If they are transparent, order that black crayon be used to fill the number indentation and if the numbers are colored, use a black marker like a Sharpe and overwrite the older color in numbers.They are transparent non-colored 20+ dice. We all have some and nobody colors them in because then they look crappy.
For me to issue a house rule about which dice we use, or how they are colored in would be highly unusual, and the reasons would be obvious.
Actually I have seen transparent non-colored 20+ dice crayoned before, and it looks Ok, when it is done right.
My thoughts are:
- Most or all enemies will make their saves vs. his spells – he is a wizard.
- Enemies will cast mostly non-save spells at his character.
- His character will be attacked more often with weapons than spells.
- Whenever feasible I will make the rolls for him – secret saves and skill checks.
OK so the common opinion seems to be that what I have in mind is just as bad (if not worse) than what the player is doing. Are we talking only about the first of my ideas above, or do you dissappove of all of them?
Here is what I am considering as an alternative. I introduce a rule that we watch each other roll. When he asks me why, I will tell him I suspect some players of cheating, but I won't be specific.
It will cause a stir in the group, but I think we will get past it.
|
|
If you think he is cheating it is likely he probably is.
The problem is - now that you ask here for answers it is even worse if he ever reads this thread as if you would have confronted him. Just think about that for a moment. All it takes is someone in the group or knowing him to read this here and ask - is this you.
What options are there?
You can use statistics. I did this to show one player had more luck as winning the lottery - with 5 different characters in a row.
The problem is - with a game at a table it will likely take a long time to get enough data.
Cheating on your account to balance it out won't work as you railroad him and while you stop his cheating aka low rolls turned high you also stop his success - true high rolls that should actually mean something.
In the end - confronting him will be the best way forward.
Now - this isn't a simple matter. Try to do it in a non-confrontational manner. Think about the bits you like from the player what he is doing well. Soften the blow by adding these into the confrontation. Tell him that it spoils the atmosphere and fun for others.
Also ensure that you treat everyone in the same way. Are you actually sure he is the only one who is cheating on your table. When I did my review I was shocked to find a second player cheat as well and I had never expected it.
This is one of the toughest things a GM has to handle. But shying away won't help. My group still plays on and I'm pretty sure the numbers are now correct (or close enough that I have no suspicions). But believe me - this wasn't a simple decision I took.
The only other advice to GMs - I wouldn't go online for help. You can as well shout out from the rooftop. I just hope your player never reads the Paizo pages and will never do. A better way is to ask fellow GMs whom you regard highly in private for their advice.
Thod
|
|
.......................................................................
Two things come to mind for me.
First, how big of a deal is it when you get a Player that cheats like this, really? I know in some styles of gaming, where RAW is a big deal and there's a strong atmosphere of technical playing, this is absolutely a big deal. But not for everyone. And if you guys have been playing for years, why has it become problematic only recently?
For groups whose playing style is less about keeping it RAW and technical, letting the Player with the weak ego and low self esteem cheat is not really a big deal. About three years ago I had a Player join one of my games that cheated his dice rolls, especially initiative (there was even one time we caught him getting an Init score higher than what he could've gotten rolling a 20! He accidently counted wrong, of course.)
But who cares. Let him enjoy something in life and stroke his weak ego and fool his low self esteem.
But who cares? It wasn't hurting the game. He was having fun; I was having fun; the other Players were having fun. So he cheated some of his rolls, big deal. I still dropped his PC from time to time to neg HP, still put the fear of DM in him at the table occasionally. And in situations in a combat where I determined it was important to have integrity, I asked him to make sure he rolled in front of us and not grab the die as soon as it stopped rolling.
.... Second, if you do feel it is a big deal and your other Players are unhappy about the cheating Player, here's something you might do, in addition to asking him to roll where someone else, DM or Player, can see the result -- instead of telling him the AC or Save he needed to reach and allowing him to tell you what he achieved, have him tell you what roll he made and then, without telling him by how much he succeeded or failed, tell him if he succeeded or failed. If he doesn't know what AC he's shooting for it's a little bit harder for him to cheat.
Also, consider this, a roll cheater will often go from cheating on his rolls to cheating on his PC sheet. All the sudden his attack becomes +7 instead of +6. Next thing you know his Ref Save is +5 instead of +4.
How fun is it, really, to police your Players' PC sheets?!
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Don't fight fire with fire, you'll regret it.
You've got to talk to this kid, politely, about your suspicions. Maybe in private. It'll be tough, but the fact that you and others suspect him and aren't saying anything is hurting your game and your friendship in ways you can't account for.
Most players I know, myself included, went through a cheating phase. It's a considerable milestone for gamers to develop the maturity to enjoy risk. Don't deprive this player of that chance to mature by counter-cheating of all things.
Tell him the truth. Be honest, and respectful. Offer to roll GM-stuff in the open too, if that's acceptable to you. You need to treat this as a social problem among friends.
Don't fight fire with fire, you'll regret it.
You've got to talk to this kid, politely, about your suspicions. Maybe in private. It'll be tough, but the fact that you and others suspect him and aren't saying anything is hurting your game and your friendship in ways you can't account for.
Most players I know, myself included, went through a cheating phase. It's a considerable milestone for gamers to develop the maturity to enjoy risk. Don't deprive this player of that chance to mature by counter-cheating of all things.
Tell him the truth. Be honest, and respectful. Offer to roll GM-stuff in the open too, if that's acceptable to you. You need to treat this as a social problem among friends.
Well said Evil Lincoln,
I have no words for how well that was put together.
If you think he is cheating it is likely he probably is.
The problem is - now that you ask here for answers it is even worse if he ever reads this thread as if you would have confronted him. Just think about that for a moment. All it takes is someone in the group or knowing him to read this here and ask - is this you.
What options are there?
You can use statistics. I did this to show one player had more luck as winning the lottery - with 5 different characters in a row.
The problem is - with a game at a table it will likely take a long time to get enough data.
Cheating on your account to balance it out won't work as you railroad him and while you stop his cheating aka low rolls turned high you also stop his success - true high rolls that should actually mean something.
In the end - confronting him will be the best way forward.
Now - this isn't a simple matter. Try to do it in a non-confrontational manner. Think about the bits you like from the player what he is doing well. Soften the blow by adding these into the confrontation. Tell him that it spoils the atmosphere and fun for others.
Also ensure that you treat everyone in the same way. Are you actually sure he is the only one who is cheating on your table. When I did my review I was shocked to find a second player cheat as well and I had never expected it.
This is one of the toughest things a GM has to handle. But shying away won't help. My group still plays on and I'm pretty sure the numbers are now correct (or close enough that I have no suspicions). But believe me - this wasn't a simple decision I took.
The only other advice to GMs - I wouldn't go online for help. You can as well shout out from the rooftop. I just hope your player never reads the Paizo pages and will never do. A better way is to ask fellow GMs whom you regard highly in private for their advice.
Thod
Thanks for the advice. Before sending my original post I did consider that my friend might read this. If that happens then so be it, but I don't think he will.
However I am prepared to deal with him directly if he reads this and asks me about it, but he won't because that would imply he thinks he is suspect.
If other members of the group read this, they will know exactly who I am talking about, but they won't say anything. As I mentioned above, no one in our group wants me to confront him and call him a cheater.
Part of this game just involves being adult.
This. In so many ways.
Some people are really risk-averse. That's the heart of the cheating problem.
Consider a luck point or action point system. Lower the stakes a bit. But above all, talk to him about this. The game involves risk, or why roll dice at all?
My group has been playing together for a little over 20 years. We have one player who has “uncanny” luck with the dice. Many of us believe he is cheating, but we do not want to call him on it and cause an incident.
He uses clear 20+ dice that you can’t really read from across the table. Sometimes I will go around the table to look at the rolls. I call it “jinxing the roll”. So he will roll and remove the die before I get to him. The last (and possibly only) saving throw he failed was when I was watching.
<snip>I am looking for other suggestions of ways to balance things. Trust me that no one in our group wants me to confront him about this.
If it's bothering other players that he's cheating, why is it so bad to confront him? I understand that you don't have evidence, but if other players are bothered by his cheating, you can probably get them to watch him a bit closer for a while. Have the players sitting next to him secretly keep a tally sheet of every time they catch him bumping his rolls up and maybe even tallying how often they really can't read the die. Even with clear dice, they may have a decent chance of seeing the numbers rolled. They certainly have a better shot than you. And if he does seem to be cheating a lot, go on to confrontation.
It don't have to be really hostile or anything, just a sit down with him and ask "Man, why is it so important for you to cheat at so many die rolls?"
Edit:
Evil Lincoln's idea of using an action point system may be helpful. It provides a legal way to "cheat" and, by invoking the action point, it actually gets everybody watching the dice for the excitement. That makes it even harder to cheat on the action point result.
Don't fight fire with fire, you'll regret it.
You've got to talk to this kid, politely, about your suspicions. Maybe in private. It'll be tough, but the fact that you and others suspect him and aren't saying anything is hurting your game and your friendship in ways you can't account for.
Most players I know, myself included, went through a cheating phase. It's a considerable milestone for gamers to develop the maturity to enjoy risk. Don't deprive this player of that chance to mature by counter-cheating of all things.
Tell him the truth. Be honest, and respectful. Offer to roll GM-stuff in the open too, if that's acceptable to you. You need to treat this as a social problem among friends.
I see where you are coming from. But none of us are kids, we are all in our 40's and this has been going on for years. I do roll in the open sometimes, but that is more for drama purposes than any trust issues.
If I confront him I expect he will be insulted, and it will hurt our friendship more than the cheating does now.
It just bothers me that I can pretty much count on him making every save I throw at him - unless it is some super-high DC. And no, I don't tell the player the DC's.
The other members of our group just live with it, as I have been. It has just started to bother me more lately, and I wanted to do something to balance things out. But I can see that is was a bad idea.
|
|
Part of this game just involves being adult.
I have to disagree a bit here.
When I was in elementary school and played with other kids, we all cheated and made stuff up as we went and it was still fun. Heck, 30 years and I'm still playing.
For some gamers, like (I think) most of us on the Boards, here, part of this game is being an "adult." But not everyone plays or wants to play like you and I do. And that's okay.
There's nothing wrong with a group (most often not adults) that plays "childishly."
I had a player who was cheating and other players knew about it, but didn't do anything. As a result now everyone has to roll in a shoe box and if anyone puts there hand in before i see the die, its an auto-fail. Its harsh, but it works.
.......................................................................
Two things come to mind for me.
First, how big of a deal is it when you get a Player that cheats like this, really? I know in some styles of gaming, where RAW is a big deal and there's a strong atmosphere of technical playing, this is absolutely a big deal. But not for everyone. And if you guys have been playing for years, why has it become problematic only recently?
For groups whose playing style is less about keeping it RAW and technical, letting the Player with the weak ego and low self esteem cheat is not really a big deal. About three years ago I had a Player join one of my games that cheated his dice rolls, especially initiative (there was even one time we caught him getting an Init score higher than what he could've gotten rolling a 20! He accidently counted wrong, of course.)
But who cares. Let him enjoy something in life and stroke his weak ego and fool his low self esteem.
But who cares? It wasn't hurting the game. He was having fun; I was having fun; the other Players were having fun. So he cheated some of his rolls, big deal. I still dropped his PC from time to time to neg HP, still put the fear of DM in him at the table occasionally. And in situations in a combat where I determined it was important to have integrity, I asked him to make sure he rolled in front of us and not grab the die as soon as it stopped rolling.
.... Second, if you do feel it is a big deal and your other Players are unhappy about the cheating Player, here's something you might do, in addition to asking him to roll where someone else, DM or Player, can see the result -- instead of telling him the AC or Save he needed to reach and allowing him to tell you what he achieved, have him tell you what roll he made and then, without telling him by how much he succeeded or failed, tell him if he succeeded or...
Good points all - in this and your other posts. You hit an interesting point, I don't really mind if he occasionaly cheats on a roll. It is the fact that he never fails a saving throw that has really been bothering me lately. He is a wizard, and he even makes all of his Fort saves.
The last save he failed was a Will save against a succubus domination. Man I had some fun with that.
Part of the problem is that it is even hard for the other players to read his rolls. He rolls right in front of himself, and he sits at the end of the table. Another player would have to lean over to obviously look at his roll.
Only by making it a house rule will I not have to call him a cheater. None of us feel that "uncanny luck" is enough of a reason to confront him. We have been joking with him about it for years, but none of the DM's have ever wanted to call him a cheater without real proof. And he has not been caught yet as far as I know.
|
RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16
|
Dren,
You're all in your 40's, and this guy has been cheating for years.
Why?
Does he think the adventures are so unfair that he thinks he has to cheat in order to keep up with the game?
Does he just not respect any of the other players? Does he want to be better than they are, so he has his PC make all the saves and rolls that theirs can't?
Are the stakes too high, from his perspective? Is he afraid that if he blows a single save, his character will die, and he'll never have fun again?
Does he cheat in other ways? If you're running a commercially-available adventure, does he buy it and read ahead? Does he use out-of-character knowledge to his PC's advantage?
If you really don't want to confront him, secretly ask the player's next to him to watch his rolls.
The other easy answer is to just make a new table rule. If you don't see the die, it doesn't count. Then if he rolls and picks it up. He gets to roll again.
I'm very glad I don't have this sort of problem in my game.
Okay, I've got a pair of solutions for you.
First, buy the cheating player some new dice that you're confident you can read. Then be insulted if he won't use them. Pout. Seriously, sell the idea that he's rejected a gift from you that you put a lot of thought into and that it would mean the world to you if he actually used them.
Second, buy a felt-lined dice-rolling box. Basically put it on the table in the middle and spout off how awesome it is, keeping the clatter down and keeping dice from hitting the floor all the team. You need to convey that this is a good thing and that you payed way too much for this item to let it go to waste. Pout.
Basically if you refuse to confront, the only remaining option is to outmaneuver. You want visible dice rolled in the open. How do you get that? Spend some money and apply liberal amounts of guilt.
don't call him a cheater, that sets things in motion that cannot be undone.
I would try to play at a table where everybody can see everybodies rolls. If that is not possible, tell him that you need his advice from time to time and he should sit to your right.
Or tell him that dice should roll for at least a foot or something so that they don't just "fall".
Besides this, I don't know what you call uncanny luck. Some people are lucky, some people have techniques that help, some cheat. I've personally witnessed one player to announce the wrong result on purpose, we changed looks, it was pretty clear he wouldn't do it again, and he only did it because it was a very important roll for him. I didn't bring it to the DM, as I don't want him to mistrust someone.
Also, asking a player to use a different dice might be quite personal. It is a solution, but not everybody will accept it.
If you believe that it will hurt the friendship more than the cheating, but the cheating is bothering you, you may want to consider buying everyone a new set of dice, if possible with color combinations that are meaningful for each individual.
Or have everyone go to the store and get a new set for a special occasion.
It is challenging to handle when you don't think that discussing the apparently problem with him is a viable method. I will echo others in that you should'nt GM cheat against him.
First, buy the cheating player some new dice that you're confident you can read. Then be insulted if he won't use them. Pout. Seriously, sell the idea that he's rejected a gift from you that you put a lot of thought into and that it would mean the world to you if he actually used them.
Second, buy a felt-lined dice-rolling box. Basically put it on the table in the middle and spout off how awesome it is, keeping the clatter down and keeping dice from hitting the floor all the team. You need to convey that this is a good thing and that you payed way too much for this item to let it go to waste. Pout.
Some of these ideas might work, but lying isn't much better than cheating for the general health of the game or the friendship.
Buy dice and a dicebox for the table. Do it because "you want to see everyone's rolls".
First, buy the cheating player some new dice that you're confident you can read. Then be insulted if he won't use them. Pout. Seriously, sell the idea that he's rejected a gift from you that you put a lot of thought into and that it would mean the world to you if he actually used them.
Second, buy a felt-lined dice-rolling box. Basically put it on the table in the middle and spout off how awesome it is, keeping the clatter down and keeping dice from hitting the floor all the team. You need to convey that this is a good thing and that you payed way too much for this item to let it go to waste. Pout.
Some of these ideas might work, but lying isn't much better than cheating for the general health of the game or the friendship.
Buy dice and a dicebox for the table. Do it because "you want to see everyone's rolls".
I have to address this particular piece of advice since it has come up often in this thread. We all have a large collection of dice of varying styles, colors, shapes, and sizes collected over the years.
If I suggested that my group only roll only certain dice, or the dice I buy for them - they would look at me like I grew another head.
We don't give that kind of power to our DM's. A DM can ban a certain die if the die is unusual in some way, and we feel it may not roll randomly. But none of us want our DM's to control the style, color or size of the dice we use.
If I did that, the other players would know it was because of the "lucky" player, and they would feel it was unfair to them.
My conclusion is that I must make it known that I suspect cheating. That is the only way I can introduce a dice-watching or a "roll in the middle of the table" house rule. But to spare our friendships, I will not name any individuals.
|
|
OK so the common opinion seems to be that what I have in mind is just as bad (if not worse) than what the player is doing. Are we talking only about the first of my ideas above, or do you dissappove of all of them?
My thoughts are:
- Most or all enemies will make their saves vs. his spells – he is a wizard.
- Enemies will cast mostly non-save spells at his character.
- His character will be attacked more often with weapons than spells.
- Whenever feasible I will make the rolls for him – secret saves and skill checks.
I have to say all of them. I echo what many have already said: specifically targeting him is NOT going to solve the problem. The issue today is social, not mechanical. Therefore, a game mechanics approach simply represents hurdles for your friend to jump through. He will cheat more and bad feelings will inevitably develop.
If he really is a good friend of many years, then talk to him and treat him like an adult. Don't feel bad about it; you're helping him to become a better player. If he threatens to pull a Gone with the Wind, would you still think he's a good friend? On the other hand, if you don't want to ruin your friendship over a silly game, then let it be. I just hope this cheating behavior doesn't creep into other social activities such as splitting a bill. THEN you have a big problem.
|
|
It is the fact that he never fails a saving throw...
Yeah, I have to admit my own past, here.
As DM I roll under the table (I don't like that screens hide me from the table and Players.)
Now, I rarely fudge rolls but will do so if the encounter I designed was too hard or too easy, or if a Player's been exceptionally UNLUCKY or, yeah, sometimes too LUCKY. But generally I don't fudge. Especially d20 rolls (except Initiative which I almost never allow my dice to decide).
Then, about 3 years ago on the Boards, here, someone posted that his DM's monsters seemed to always make Saves. Miraculously. Always. (It wasn't one of my Players.)
And I took a look at how I DM and realized that I was guilty of that to some extent. From my own memory I saw that my monsters pretty much always made Fort and Will Saves -- the save-or-get-pwned kinda Saves. Sure I'm mostly honest on Ref Saves for the monsters but Charm and Suggestion and Bestow Curse and such would seemingly not work against my monsters.
I don't know that any of my Players had ever noticed that; I'd not had a PC that used lots of those kinds of spells (Fireball is more common for my Players, I guess.).
Nonetheless, the Thread really got my attention and I've since been more honest on Saves for my monsters.
| 3 people marked this as a favorite. |
Nonetheless, the Thread really got my attention and I've since been more honest on Saves for my monsters.
Players are not the only ones who can mature into a genuine enjoyment of risk. Your story sounds much like my own.
As a young GM, it was all about my story. My story was sacrosanct, and the dice were just smoke and mirrors to add a sense of risk.
As a less-young GM, I've decided that the ability of the dice to make me surprised by my own story is the most worthy aspect of the whole hobby.