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I'm in the Kingmaker campaign right now and trying to help a fellow player out. He's a rogue halfling. In the next couple levels I'll be grabbing the Craft Magic Arms and Armor feat. I'd like to be able to calculate the cost of a +1 Fey Bane Short Sword (small) made of Cold Iron.
Cold Iron Cost Information:
Weapons made of cold iron cost twice as much to make as their normal counterparts. Also, adding any magical enhancements to a cold iron weapon increases its price by 2,000 gp. This increase is applied the first time the item is enhanced, not once per ability added. A double weapon with one cold iron half costs 50% more than normal.
Two questions arise:
(1) Does this doubled cost double the cost of masterwork as well? A short sword is normally 10 gp and 310 gp if it is masterwork. Does a cold iron version cost 20 gp plus 300 gp -OR- 20 gp plus 600 gp?
(2) The additional 2,000 gp cost to add magical attributes, is that full price like the sword will be to purchase, or will it be halved by my Craft Magic Arms and Armor feat?
Thanks muchly!
Does this doubled cost double the cost of masterwork as well?
No. It just doubles the base weapon cost. A Cold Iron Longsword costs 330 gp to purchase.
The additional 2,000 gp cost to add magical attributes, is that full price like the sword will be to purchase, or will it be halved by my Craft Magic Arms and Armor feat?
"adding any magical enhancements to a cold iron weapon increases its price"
You provide raw materials costing half the price.
I'd like to be able to calculate the cost of a +1 Fey Bane Short Sword (small) made of Cold Iron.
First you need a Small Masterwork Cold Iron Short Sword. You can purchase one for 320 gold.
To start by adding the +1 Enhancement bonus, you need caster level 3 and two days. Each day you work on it you'll make a Craft (weapons) check, DC 8. (DC is 5+CL3) If you never fail, your total cost will be 1,000 gp in raw materials (plus whatever you paid for the base sword).
To enchant Bane, your caster level must be at least 8th. You also need to have prepared Summon Monster I for creation.
Bane is a +1 Base Price Modifier, so your total Base Price Modifier with be +2. (8,000 gp) You've already paid/enchanted the +1, so you only need the difference (6,000 gp) - this will take 6 days to create.
The skill check you'll be making is Craft (weapons). The DC is 13 (5+CL8).
You spend 500 gp each day/attempt, so if you never fail the check, your total cost to add Bane will be 3,000 gp.
Enchanting is complicated, so I could certainly have some errors in there. I recommend really studying the Magic Item Creation section, Creating Magic Weapons, and Magic Weapons.
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"adding any magical enhancements to a cold iron weapon increases its price"
You provide raw materials costing half the price.
I'm pretty solid on the item creation rules, it's really cold iron that is tripping me up. I can't quite tell what you mean by this answer though. Is the increased price to the raw materials? So instead of 2000 gp it would be 1000 gp plus whatever magical attributes are added?
I can't quite tell what you mean by this answer though. Is the increased price to the raw materials? So instead of 2000 gp it would be 1000 gp plus whatever magical attributes are added?
Sorry, Magic Item Descriptions:
Price is the cost, in gold pieces, to purchase the item, if it is available for sale.
Cost is the cost in gold pieces to create the item.
So:
Enchanting a Masterwork Short Sword with a +1 bonus costs you 1,000 gp. (Half of the 2,000 gp price)
Enchanting a Masterwork Cold Iron Short Sword with a +1 bonus costs you 2,000 gp. (Half of the 4,000 gp price)
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Excellent, thanks for the answers! I'm going to show my work bellow just to make sure I understand.
Short Sword (Small) 10 gp
Short Sword (Small) made of Cold Iron 20 gp
Twice normal cost
Masterwork Short Sword (Small) made of Cold Iron 320 gp
Twice normal cost plus 300 gp for masterwork quality
+1 Short Sword (Small) made of Cold Iron 2,320 gp
Above weapon plus half of cold iron enchant (2,000 gp) and half +1 enhant (2,000 gp)
+1 Fey Bane Short Sword (Small) made of Cold Iron 5,320 gp
Above weapon with half cost to add bane enchant (6,000 gp)
I'm going to show my work bellow just to make sure I understand.
+1 Fey Bane Short Sword (Small) made of Cold Iron 5,320 gp
Yep, looks correct to me.
And yeah, +3 will bypass cold iron & silver, but only (in this case) vs Fey. He might really hate fey, but still want to bypass demons and stuff.
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Wouldn't a +1 feybane weapon count as a +3 weapon versus fey, thereby counting as cold iron for the purpose of piercing damage reduction of fey?
So a weapon that has the Fey Bane enchant on it bypasses a Fey's damage reduction with the cold iron weakness? In other words, a +1 Fey Bane Short Sword made of normal metals will do exactly the same damage as a +1 Fey Bane Short Sword made of Cold Iron when fighting Fey?
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So a weapon that has the Fey Bane enchant on it bypasses a Fey's damage reduction with the cold iron weakness? In other words, a +1 Fey Bane Short Sword made of normal metals will do exactly the same damage as a +1 Fey Bane Short Sword made of Cold Iron when fighting Fey?
Yes. Unless the creature has a vulnerability against cold iron or regeneration that's only negated by cold iron.
Wouldn't a +1 feybane weapon count as a +3 weapon versus fey, thereby counting as cold iron for the purpose of piercing damage reduction of fey?So a weapon that has the Fey Bane enchant on it bypasses a Fey's damage reduction with the cold iron weakness? In other words, a +1 Fey Bane Short Sword made of normal metals will do exactly the same damage as a +1 Fey Bane Short Sword made of Cold Iron when fighting Fey?
Unless the fey specifically says it takes additional damage from cold iron, then yes, the damage will be the same.
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I now see how this works. I didn't know that some damage reduction can be overcome by a certain level of magical + enhancement. Reading through the Bane description it appears that a +1 Fey Bane weapon would meet the +3 enhancement bonus necessary to overcome a fey's cold iron DR. Thanks so much for weighing in! I'm not so worried about demons or any other cold iron benefits. Just want to kill these Kingmaker fey more easily :P
With the sole purpose of killing fey, I wouldn't need an item with fey bane to be made of cold iron, this will reduce the cost of the final item.
Masterwork Short Sword (Small) 310 gp plus +1 & Fey Bane enchants (8,000 gp normally, but 4,000 gp when crafted by a character with the Craft Magic Arms and Armor feat) equals...
+1 Fey Bane Short Sword (Small) made of normal metals 4,310 gp
Problem solved. Thanks, everyone. You're all great! :)
I believe you just make one skill check at the end (not a daily check) however your cost for failure then is all material used is lost rather than the 500 a day.
You are correct, I got confused by the days required by cost part and skipped the single skill check.
A plus one weapon is still only a plus one weapon. While Feybane adds it's effect damage, the natural damage of the weapon is still subject to DR unless it's made of cold iron. Otherwise by this logic any energy burst weapon would ignore cold iron dr as they would be "+3" vs anything.
Bane weapon property: Against a designated foe, the weapon's enhancement bonus is +2 better than its actual bonus.
+1 Fey Bane weapon is a +3 weapon vs Fey (and deals 2d6 extra damage)
Flaming Burst does not add enhancement bonuses to the weapon, it just adds extra damage dice.
You do not need to be a CL8 to create a Bane weapon. Rather, the average CL of a randomly generated Bane weapon is at least 8.
Then how do you determine the CL?
"The caster level of a weapon with a special ability is given in the item description."
Bane: Moderate conjuration; CL 8th; Craft Magic Arms and Armor, summon monster I; Price +1 bonus.
I don't think it's 3x the base price modifier because "If an item has both an enhancement bonus and a special ability, the higher of the two caster level requirements must be met."
I assume it's not the total bonus base price (+1 & Bane = +2 total, CL 6) or they would have said so.
... or Spellcraft. And note the effect of the weapon's CL on the crafting DC.
You are correct "If an item type has multiple possible skills, you choose which skill to make the check with." I got distracted by all the parenthesis.
Yep - but, again, that's just for a generic example. For a PC-created one, the PC can pretty much independently set the CL to whatever they want it to be.
So a caster level 5 wizard can make a +1 Keen Brilliant Energy Longsword? Just set the CL of the abilities to 1, and 1 is less than 3 (1x3 for the enhancement bonus) so no problem?
Is it actually specified anywhere that the CL listed in the special ability description is optional? It talks about the CL of we special ability in multiple places, but if it's not listed in the description, how do you know what it is? Why would they even talk about the caster level of special abilities if there effectively aren't any?
Wounding only requires a cantrip (bleed) but the 'generic example' is CL 10. Why in the world would the 'example' Wounding set the CL to 10 when all it needs is a cantrip?
I think those aren't generic examples, they're descriptions of the special abilities. When it says CL 7, must be chaotic, that's not because one guy once was cl 7 and chaotic, it's a requirement to enchant that ability. The special abilities are separate from the specific weapons section.
It would also make it really hard to craft +10 effective enhancement weapons. :)Considering that such represent the epitome of mortal crafting... it should be. It should be an acheivement that the best of the best... the most renowned weapons crafter of the world should have to put their utmost effort to accomplish. Not something that can be done by any inept employee at MagicMart.
Except that would end up as CL 30.
That's a "virtual" enhancement bonus... it's still not a +3 enhancement weapon.
It says "the weapon's enhancement bonus is +2 better than its actual bonus" it doesn't say "the weapon has an additional +2 attack and damage" or anything to suggest that it's not, in fact, +2 better.
A plus one weapon is still only a plus one weapon. While Feybane adds it's effect damage, the natural damage of the weapon is still subject to DR unless it's made of cold iron. Otherwise by this logic any energy burst weapon would ignore cold iron dr as they would be "+3" vs anything.
Traditionaly Feybane weapons ARE made from cold iron for this reason.
That doesn't hold up -- the bane ability specifically states it raises the enhancement bonus -- and an enhancement bonus of +3 overcomes DR/cold iron or silver.
Greater magic weapon specifically points out that it is an exception to this, so unless the ability somehow references working just like greater magic weapon then it will bypass DR from an increase in enhancement bonus.
Same for the paladin, magus and arcane duelist bard (for three examples).
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That's a "virtual" enhancement bonus... it's still not a +3 enhancement weapon. so DR stil applies if it's not made with the traditional cold iron material.
Bane weapon property: Against a designated foe, the weapon's enhancement bonus is +2 better than its actual bonus.
+1 Fey Bane weapon is a +3 weapon vs Fey (and deals 2d6 extra damage)
The inability to pierce higher tier damage reductions is a limitation of greater magic weapon, not virtual enhancement bonuses in general.
The inability to pierce higher tier damage reductions is a limitation of greater magic weapon, not virtual enhancement bonuses in general.That's a "virtual" enhancement bonus... it's still not a +3 enhancement weapon. so DR stil applies if it's not made with the traditional cold iron material.
Bane weapon property: Against a designated foe, the weapon's enhancement bonus is +2 better than its actual bonus.
+1 Fey Bane weapon is a +3 weapon vs Fey (and deals 2d6 extra damage)
And actually it's not an virtual enhancement bonus -- it would actually be better to write it in the 'old style' of advanced D&D:
Short Sword +1/+3 versus Fey...
Against Fey it isn't a +1 weapon -- it is a full on +3 weapon.
Note, instead, the Spell Storing weapon quality:This is a caster level as a prereq. Thus, to create a spell storing weapon - even a +1 spell storing longsword, which is just a +2 equivalent weapon - you need to be 12th-level.
CL 12th; Craft Magic Arms and Armor, creator must be a caster of at least 12th level;
That requires a level twelve spellcaster, not a CL. A master craftsman can create an enhancement with a caster level (CL) requirement, but not an item that requires a specific level of spellcasting. 12 ranks and a buddy to cast Fireball, and he can make a Flaming weapon. But using his ranks as CL doesn't meet the req for spell storing.
They are exactly the same as the listings in any other magic item. They follow the same rules, and are "stock examples."
But they're not items, and it doesn't say that anywhere.
Rules say there is a caster level that must be met for a special ability. ("the higher of the two caster level requirements must be met") So there must be a way to find out what that caster level is. The only place the CL is mentioned is in the list of special abilities.
If you can arbitrarily set your caster level to 1 for any special ability, why would the rules state (twice!) that you use whichever is higher?
The DC to create a +1 Dancing Vorpal Longsword should be higher than a +1 Flaming Longsword. If you get to choose your ability CL, they're both DC 8. I don't think that's intended, and I don't think that's what the rules say. Without a rule citation, dev post, FAQ, or anything, I remain unconvinced.
What caster level do you have to be to make a pearl of power for a 3rd-level spell?
Minimum caster level for casting 3rd level spells.