Multiple Questions


Rules Questions

Liberty's Edge

Hey all - been playing Pathfinder for a few sessions now. A couple of questions--

1) Is there such a thing as sonic damage anymore? Our Mystic Theurge keeps trying to throw sonic fireballs w/ energy admixture.

2) Are there any one-handed 'orc weapons'?

3) Is there a list of deities with a bit more information than the sidebar in the core rulebook?

4) (this one may be opinion) Is it normal for the rogue to be behind the rest of the party in combat at level 8? He can negotiate, sneak, track, lie, steal, and has Scent, but he seems behind in the butt-kicking. He maxed out the 'dirty trick' feat string, but it seems like most monsters at this level are too big for attacks that hit CMD.

Thanks in advance!

Grand Lodge

1) The 4th-level Bard spell Shout does sonic damage. There may be others. Not sure about the admixture aspect.

2) Not that I'm aware of.

3) You can check the entries in the Golarion wiki online.

4) Sounds like the rogue has focused on utility combat abilities instead of damaging ones. Such a build would be expected to be less effective on a pure damage basis, but it's up to the group to decide if the other aspects of his playstyle make it worth it. As for monsters being too big for combat maneuvers, that depends on the campaign. Some of the toughest enemies I've faced in campaigns have been medium sized - liches, rakshasas, illithids, etc.


Yes there is sonic damage, in fact there are certain creatures (crystalline ones come to mind) that have a weakness vs it.

The spell Shout deals sonic damage.

"Orc" weapons. The orc double axe, can actually be weilded one handed, just treat it like a battle axe.

Half orcs get weapon familiarity falchion and great axe, because they are orc favored weapons. Orcs tend to use scimitars alot too. but there is only one weapon with 'orc' in the name.

Pathfinder wiki can give you more on deities.

It depends on how you build the rogue, but I don't understand what you mean by "behind". What else is int he party?

Big monsters have better CMD/B and worse touch ac have the caster shoot rays at them instead.


dnjscott wrote:


1) Is there such a thing as sonic damage anymore? Our Mystic Theurge keeps trying to throw sonic fireballs w/ energy admixture.

Yes, cheeze is still there. :P

dnjscott wrote:


2) Are there any one-handed 'orc weapons'?

No. If by "orc weapon", you mean, "stuff half-orcs get for free", there aren't any official one-handed orc weapons.

dnjscott wrote:


3) Is there a list of deities with a bit more information than the sidebar in the core rulebook?

There are several lists in Pathfinder Campaign setting books. There is a whole book about the gods, called Gods and Magic. The Inner Sea World Guide (which is the main Campaign Setting book) has some info, and there are really detailed articles in the APs.

If you're loath to just blow money on something, there is stuff on the gods in the Pathfinder Wiki, too.

dnjscott wrote:


4) (this one may be opinion) Is it normal for the rogue to be behind the rest of the party in combat at level 8? He can negotiate, sneak, track, lie, steal, and has Scent, but he seems behind in the butt-kicking. He maxed out the 'dirty trick' feat string, but it seems like most monsters at this level are too big for attacks that hit CMD.

What is that rogue like? And what is the rest of the party like?

Rogues aren't martial characters. They have combat abilities, but they're not as good as fighters or other warriors. Their abilities are conditional, you have to work to make them work, and sometimes, they don't work at all.


1) Yes there is sonic damage. But everything I’ve seen in PF only allows you to change the one of the four ‘basic’ energy types (acid, cold, electricity, or fire) to another ‘basic’ energy type. See PF Admixture.

4) Generally yes. Rogues are part combat/part skills which is always (all other things equal) going to be behind full combat classes. In this instance though, where the rogue is focused on a combat maneuver that requires good strength and above average intelligence (on top of the need for good dexterity), in a campaign where most enemies have particularly high CMDs, the gap is going to widen beyond the ‘normal’.

Liberty's Edge

Pendagast wrote:
"Orc" weapons. The orc double axe, can actually be weilded one handed, just treat it like a battle axe.

Note that this is an interpretation and is not universal. The alternative interpretation is that a double weapon can be used one handed if it is a size category smaller than the user; such as a Medium half-orc using an orc double axe built for a Small creature. The question is discussed periodically; such discussions can be searched for. I'm not attempting to insert another generation of the debate into this thread, just pointing out that the difference of interpretation exists. :)


dnjscott wrote:


1) Is there such a thing as sonic damage anymore? Our Mystic Theurge keeps trying to throw sonic fireballs w/ energy admixture.

Yes there is, but if your player wants to change energy type with the admixture school power called Versatile Evocation, he can't because with that power you can only change one of the 4 "basic" types to any of the other 4 "basic" types.

Liberty's Edge

The rogue does pretty well, really - we are playing City of Spears

Spoiler:
and he was able to help a lot against the apes.
The sneak attack is nice, when he can flank, which is usually the case because we have a Summoner / Shadow Dancer and so a lot of flanking partners - he fights with a rapier. .

It's more of a toolbox issue - The rest of the party is a Mystic Theurge, a Ranger with a bow, an alchemist, a Paladin (with a Pegasus mount), a Summoner, and an Oracle.

So almost everyone else in the party can fly, self-buff, hit an area effect, and deal out large handfuls of dice in damage. Even the Ranger has entangle and arrows, which allows a lot of battlefield control, not to mention various 'save or sucks'.

Seems to compare poorly to 'arrange yourself on the opposite side of another party member and get bonus dice'. Eh, like I said, may be opinion.


Gee, we do't have a rogue at all (haven't had one in about a year) and we are managing flanks all the time just for the +2 bonus to hit. doesn't seem hard to get flanks.
Then again, at lower levels, when you don't have full attacks... I guess it's different.

It'd be nice have extra damage dice on a flank.

Handing out a paladin mount that can fly is hardly "standard" especially for your level.


dnjscott wrote:

he fights with a rapier. .

A lot of them use two weapons at once. Twice the sneak attack extra damage opportunity.

Contributor

Added a spoiler tag above!

Liberty's Edge

So...

1) Yes, there is sonic but admixture doesn't cover it.

2) Check the wiki.

3) No.

4) Yes, it depends on opinion.

Thanks, and sorry about the spoiler...

Scarab Sages

If your rogue is feeling blue
and you don't know what to do
you should do the thing all rogues like.

Let him rob a golden chest
hide the loot within his vest
and let him disappear out into the night.

Then later in the day
He can sell that loot away
But keep the sword of subtlety for LIFE!

... might be a little tired...

Shadow Lodge

1) Yes, but Admixture doesn't work for Sonic unless you're trying to translate a 3.5 feat, then maybe.

2) No, unless Orcs of Golarion has some. Don't remember, and I don't have the book handy.

3) The original Campaign Setting book, the Inner Sea World Guide, the Wiki, and one or two books about deities specifically.

4) Rogues aren't butt-kickers by default, so somewhat yes. By default, your Paladin, Ranger, and Alchemist should be the biggest Butt-Kickers in the group you described. The MT and Summoner will probably be running Control with some butt-kickery from the Eidolon, the Oracle Support/Control/Butt-kickery depending on Mystery. Note: I'm guessing at party roles in combat.

Rogues fall somewhere between Support and Butt-Kickery, but they rely on not being a primary melee to function at their best unless you're running particular archetypes. Rogues are really designed around the Skill-Monkey/Backstabber ideals mechanically. If you're trying to build a Rogue that does something else, you kinda have to work for it.

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