Casting ray spells in a grapple


Rules Questions

Liberty's Edge

An unusual situation came up in a game I'm playing in that hopefully the community might be able to offer some insight on.

If a caster is grappled and they wish to attempt to cast a spell without somatic components (such as a stilled scorching ray) they obviously need to roll the requisite concentration check of 10+Grappler's CMB+Spell Level to successfully cast the spell.

However, assuming the concentration check is successful, the caster gains a number of rays (ranged touch attacks) against the grappler.

Would these ranged touch attacks be against the grappler's lower touch AC (-4 to Dexterity due to grappling)?

Does the grappler's CMD somehow come into play against this touch attack?

Can you even target a creature occupying your same square with a ranged attack? A ranged touch attack?

Could you target this ranged touch attack against another creature who is not grappling you, assuming you take the dexterity penalty to your ranged attack roll?

Rules citations and blatant speculation is appreciated!

The Exchange

As far as I'm aware there is nothing stopping you casting a ray at the grappler.

The target would indeed have a -4 dex penalty for being grappled but the touch attack roll would also have a -2 on the attack roll for the same reason.


From memory of the grappling rules (which may very well be wrong, somebody please correct me if I am):

The ray would target the grappler's lower AC. However your attack would be at a -2 penalty from the grapple and an additional -2 penalty on account of the penalty to Dex from the grapple, so the target will be more difficult to hit than normal.

CMD shouldn't be a factor in this situation.

You can target the same square as yourself with a ranged attack. Note that the target will be threatening you, so the target will get to take and AoO when you fire (at the standard penalties for grappling of course).

The ranged attack can go elsewhere, but you still take the penalties and the grappler will still get to take his AoO's.

Overall probably not the best choice.

The Exchange

Yes, I forgot the -2 t attacks, you're right there.

However you can't take AoO when grappling so you won't provoke from the grappler. However you will still provoke from any other enemies adjacent to your square.

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