While contrived, the idea of a dominate organisation attempting to actively restrain/regulate (with extreme prejudice) magic makes a lot of sense - for exactly the reasons many have discovered when magic is let to run rampant in their campaign worlds.Of course, many will argue it's a task that's doomed to fail -- which is great! It's from such scenarios we get..
....EPIC DRAMA!
I agree!
How many Kingdoms would be ok with the proliferation of weapons of mass destruction (Fireball wands etc) as well as arms and armours making the common folk possibly impervious to their agents? I woudl reason that there would be a VERY REAL restriction on the 'sale and creation' or Magic items... similarly even buying a suit of masterwork full plate should be a bit of a chore as smiths skilled enough to do so would quite likely be in the employ of the State.
Just the way I roll.
Can't have the peasantry get too far above their station now, can we?
I don't see why some NPC casters wouldn't want to be happily crafting magic items for sale in a magic shop or taking orders for specific items. Not all casters would want to adventure all their lives. I could imagine quite a few adventurers would have one brush with death too many and decide on a quieter life.
A wizard who wants to continue doing magical research - without the risk- would happily craft for cash and then use that cash to pay others to go do the research/copy out the ancient runes in the Lost City of Ra/get 10cc of blue dragon blood/other dangerous stuff etc.
Or a wizard who likes the good life could spend a few weeks per month crafting and live a very, very luxurious lifestyle. If they know teleport they could be a Pathfinder equivalent of a cashed-up retiree and travel constantly.
Your crafting skills never decline so you could craft as often as you like for as long as you like and comfortably - and safely- live whatever type of life you want.
Of course, there will be these guys. Will they be making magic items full time? Probably not. As you say, even a week of magic item production will yield a 3500gp profit (3+ months of extravagant living expenses). One decently powerful item (a solid month) and you're set for a whole year. So you can see why it can be hard to secure an item crafter's services; he may already be flush with cash. PC item crafters generally burn through their money as fast as it comes in. A settled down wizard? Probably has enough gear. Probably has the spells he needs (he's not leveling at any real speed). After a little while, he probably has his home's anti-theft systems in place (traps, golems, expensive spells).
Really, after not too long, him making you an item is doing you a favor, on top of the money you're paying him. Like you said, he'll never have to worry about his crafting skills degrading, so unless he has a pressing need for money over and above his one month (per year) of work, the rest of the year he can do whatever he likes.
if your PCs can cast 7,8,9th level spells then access to scrolls shouldnt be hard if they cant cast those spells themselves yet what do they need them for? its far too early.
I know ive said that several times now.
Better to pay low level wizards to examine and wizard mark all magic goods made/ entering the kingdom for tracking purposes. Still people will circumvent it to be sure, but it frees up those mage assassins to be generating taxable revenue in selling goods rather than taking from the states coffers to track down folks.
I liike, I liiiike..
..m'thinks a sting operation being setup sometime soon...
''Oh Shiiii!''
''What do we do what do we do what do we do?''
''Flush the Wands of Cure Light! Quick!''
Oh my god oh my god oh my...
Get a hold of yourself man!
''I can't I I I... I just downed 12 Cure Light Potions man!''
''...damn. You gonna be hurting tonight.''
*Pew pew pew*
<misc. screams of pain>
::
Better to pay low level wizards to examine and wizard mark all magic goods made/ entering the kingdom for tracking purposes. Still people will circumvent it to be sure, but it frees up those mage assassins to be generating taxable revenue in selling goods rather than taking from the states coffers to track down folks.I liike, I liiiike..
..m'thinks a sting operation being setup sometime soon...
''Oh Shiiii!''
''What do we do what do we do what do we do?''
''Flush the Wands of Cure Light! Quick!''
Oh my god oh my god oh my...
Get a hold of yourself man!
''I can't I I I... I just downed 12 Cure Light Potions man!''
''...damn. You gonna be hurting tonight.''
*Pew pew pew*
<misc. screams of pain>
::
glad someone likes my ideas.
Potions or wands of CLW, scrolls of Comprehend Languages or Endure Elements, +5 skill bonus items, level 1 pearls of power, cloaks or rings of protection +1... low-level non-weapon items like these are one of the ways churches and mage guilds make money, so they are easily available in cities.
+1 or +2 weapons and armor are also available in cities, but require some interaction to purchase; merchants may not want to be caught selling arms to known dissidents or bandits.
Major cities have merchants who deal in exotic stuff like Ioun stones, specific weapons and armor or carpets of flying. What they have in stock on a particular day will be random, but they're in contact with other magic dealers who might have the desired item.
If the PCs want something particular or unusual, they will probably have to have it commissioned. This could require a side-quest to find a willing crafter, or a crafter may require a quest as payment for making the item.
At high levels, exotic locations like Sigil or the City of Brass have markets where nearly anything can be bought, no questions asked, for coin or gems.
On a side note, if PCs are able to sell old magic items as they find better ones, it is only natural that they are also able to purchase them.
Of course, there will be these guys. Will they be making magic items full time? Probably not. As you say, even a week of magic item production will yield a 3500gp profit (3+ months of extravagant living expenses). One decently powerful item (a solid month) and you're set for a whole year. So you can see why it can be hard to secure an item crafter's services; he may already be flush with cash. PC item crafters generally burn through their money as fast as it comes in. A settled down wizard? Probably has enough gear. Probably has the spells he needs (he's not leveling at any real speed). After a little while, he probably has his home's anti-theft systems in place (traps, golems, expensive spells).
Really, after not too long, him making you an item is doing you a favor, on top of the money you're paying him. Like you said, he'll never have to worry about his crafting skills degrading, so unless he has a pressing need for money over and above his one month (per year) of work, the rest of the year he can do whatever he likes.
Which provides the perfect adventure hook. The crafter doesn't need to make something for the PCs. But he has always been after {insert incredibly rare magical component here} and no one has been able to find him one. So, if the PCs were to find him one, he would be prepared to craft the item they are after (for the right price of course).
That way the more expensive magic items aren't automatically available but if you make the PCs work hard enough to earn the right to have something made they should be able to get pretty much anything they need and can afford. The more expensive the item they want, the more difficult and dangerous the mini quest they have to perform.
It depends entirely on what they are asking for. Potions and scrolls? Sure, no problem. Wands and most magical weapons are usually quite unique in my games, and must be found or commissioned, even in areas that "should" have dozens of them just lying around on the shelves(which makes you wonder about the local economy). I do look forward to working with my wife(economics buff) on something a little better than what we currently have in D&D/Pathfinder economics.
Which provides the perfect adventure hook. The crafter doesn't need to make something for the PCs. But he has always been after {insert incredibly rare magical component here} and no one has been able to find him one. So, if the PCs were to find him one, he would be prepared to craft the item they are after (for the right price of course).
That way the more expensive magic items aren't automatically available but if you make the PCs work hard enough to earn the right to have something made they should be able to get pretty much anything they need and can afford. The more expensive the item they want, the more difficult and dangerous the mini quest they have to perform.
see back in 1e that was the way it was EVEN for high level spells, some of the components were just super hard to find.
however there never really was a hard and fast mechanic for making magic items. it was described as "rituals" but no mechanic given so , it never made any sense how magic items existed.
With 3e however they went the other way and made it too easy/accessible.
too many groups hand wave material components anyway and its just too easy to get what you need to cast said spell or make X magic item.
i remember 1e, when not many people wanted to play a druid because the need to keep fresh mistle toe around.
bring back that essence to the game, create a homebrew world if you have to to explain the "why cant i do this or that".
DM's TAKE BACK THE GAME!
make that magic user account for how many pinches of dried bat dung he has!
whether his spell book got wet, are those scroll tubes water proofed?
The U.S. Army Rangers still have a saying today "keep your powder dry" which goes back to the days of yore when one used powder and shot.
But even though that isnt a problem anymore, it still has the same meaning, "look after yourself and your weapon, and ill be seeing you again, don't and i won't".
bring back the perils of leaving ones door, bring back adventure.
not every curio in town will carry bat dung. its gross and stinky, you may find yourselves traveling a bit to some weirdo in the wilderness just to buy some bat dung (either that or risk getting caught breaking into the temple to raid their bell fry) only to find out its an ogre magi in disguise!
Do this early on, and fret over spell components, and you WON'T have issue when i comes to make magical items rare and wondrous and it will be FUN to go adventure for the materials needed to make the fighters werewolf slaying sword.
trust me.
bring back that essence to the game, create a homebrew world if you have to to explain the "why cant i do this or that".
Yeah! If the game isn't tedious, it isn't a real game!
Yeah! If the game isn't tedious, it isn't a real game!
Forgive me if I'm wrong, but weren't you also saying that nowhere in the rules do you have to roleplay either?
Hard is not the same as tedious, this isn't a tactical mini's wargame, its an RPG where things have to make...sense.
Yeah! If the game isn't tedious, it isn't a real game!Forgive me if I'm wrong, but weren't you also saying that nowhere in the rules do you have to roleplay either?
Hard is not the same as tedious, this isn't a tactical mini's wargame, its an RPG where things have to make...sense.
Like how random bad guys floating around the world all have magic items but no one seems to make or sell it anywhere? Even better - since we are going "old-school" - how are people supposed to go adventuring against creatures they can't hurt?
EDIT: And you are telling me keeping track of spell components isn't tedious? Yeah, go through the core spell list and look up all the "immaterial" spell components.
Like how random bad guys floating around the world all have magic items but no one seems to make or sell it anywhere? Even better - since we are going "old-school" - how are people supposed to go adventuring against creatures they can't hurt?
Goose and gander, the same applies to the bad guys as it does the players... to do otherwise would be stupid.
Similarly, the GM needs to plot and plan his creatures, and WHY they would be around doing what they are doing.
The players should have SOME challenge and not simply be spoon fed solutions - Oh an X? ok we go down to the Magic Shoppe and buy a few Z weapons ti kill it, or better, we pull out a couple of dozen spare Z items from our collective portable holes... no sweat!
They might even (shock horror!) have to do a quest for the item!
Lots of good stuff
The mob will be arriving at your door shortly to string you up on account of the trumped up charges that you are an "adversarial DM". Enjoy your stay in the infinite hell of RAW prison.
-Idle
Just a quick point on the argument of "Why would any government/kingdom/whatever allow WMD to be made and controlled by the citizenry":
Did it occur to the people making this argument that the governments aren't that strong, numerous or capable? Vast swaths of most worlds are complete wilderness where anyone with the moxie can set up shop and do what they want.
Besides when that very same citizenry could quite possibly do these things by themselves having the items around just isn't as dangerous -- this isn't like building a gun/bomb where it can't be done without the right materials and without having the device the people can't perform the acts. Casters exist and have the power to do these things without devices. If the people can already do it what's the point of trying to control the items they do it with? You aren't going to stop the acts in the first place and have little real means of preventing the items from being made.
Beyond these points I also point out that if the world already assumes these things are around then the fact they are around isn't so frightening. Much like the fact that people own guns now owning magical items isn't the oddball thing that is being suggested. People survive spells like fireball and magic missile, in most cases these spells are no worse than a mundane weapon (in fact in many cases the weapons are actually more dangerous especially when you are considering magical items as opposed to actual spell casting).
Having the magical items out and about actually makes spell casters less valuable since they can to an exist be replaced with the items available. Lesser mages can do more for you than the better ones could since the items will work the same no matter who makes them. People can have a chance to counter what the wizard might do with the magical items as well (or at least preempt the caster). Now the casters will generally have more tactical ability and flexibility but at least with the items present you have more means of doing magical stuff than simply having to have a caster present at all times.
Lots of good stuffThe mob will be arriving at your door shortly to string you up on account of the trumped up charges that you are an "adversarial DM". Enjoy your stay in the infinite hell of RAW prison.
-Idle
"adversarial"
By that i take it to mean that players in your campaigns write "adventuring gear" on their character sheets and try to use it to describe why they always seem to have rope and ten foot poles at their leisure?
If you dont track spell components then, essentially everyone gets a free "eschew materials" feat.
for players that think material components are tedious, then they can simply take that feat!
dont give it away for free!
maybe by taking that it will delay them getting the item creation feats, at least for a time.
adversarial? bah, imagine that, i made them buy spell components oh no, they might actually have to pay for a room at the inn next!
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Just a quick point on the argument of "Why would any government/kingdom/whatever allow WMD to be made and controlled by the citizenry":
Did it occur to the people making this argument that the governments aren't that strong, numerous or capable? Vast swaths of most worlds are complete wilderness where anyone with the moxie can set up shop and do what they want.
Besides when that very same citizenry could quite possibly do these things by themselves having the items around just isn't as dangerous -- this isn't like building a gun/bomb where it can't be done without the right materials and without having the device the people can't perform the acts. Casters exist and have the power to do these things without devices. If the people can already do it what's the point of trying to control the items they do it with? You aren't going to stop the acts in the first place and have little real means of preventing the items from being made.
Beyond these points I also point out that if the world already assumes these things are around then the fact they are around isn't so frightening. Much like the fact that people own guns now owning magical items isn't the oddball thing that is being suggested. People survive spells like fireball and magic missile, in most cases these spells are no worse than a mundane weapon (in fact in many cases the weapons are actually more dangerous especially when you are considering magical items as opposed to actual spell casting).
Having the magical items out and about actually makes spell casters less valuable since they can to an exist be replaced with the items available. Lesser mages can do more for you than the better ones could since the items will work the same no matter who makes them. People can have a chance to counter what the wizard might do with the magical items as well (or at least preempt the caster). Now the casters will generally have more tactical ability and flexibility but at least with the items present you have more means of doing magical stuff...
+1. I have some "magophobic" type countries in the homebrew, but they tend to be isolated and uninteresting to the larger powers.
Just a quick point on the argument of "Why would any government/kingdom/whatever allow WMD to be made and controlled by the citizenry":
Did it occur to the people making this argument that the governments aren't that strong, numerous or capable? Vast swaths of most worlds are complete wilderness where anyone with the moxie can set up shop and do what they want.
Besides when that very same citizenry could quite possibly do these things by themselves having the items around just isn't as dangerous -- this isn't like building a gun/bomb where it can't be done without the right materials and without having the device the people can't perform the acts. Casters exist and have the power to do these things without devices. If the people can already do it what's the point of trying to control the items they do it with? You aren't going to stop the acts in the first place and have little real means of preventing the items from being made.
Beyond these points I also point out that if the world already assumes these things are around then the fact they are around isn't so frightening. Much like the fact that people own guns now owning magical items isn't the oddball thing that is being suggested. People survive spells like fireball and magic missile, in most cases these spells are no worse than a mundane weapon (in fact in many cases the weapons are actually more dangerous especially when you are considering magical items as opposed to actual spell casting).
Having the magical items out and about actually makes spell casters less valuable since they can to an exist be replaced with the items available. Lesser mages can do more for you than the better ones could since the items will work the same no matter who makes them. People can have a chance to counter what the wizard might do with the magical items as well (or at least preempt the caster). Now the casters will generally have more tactical ability and flexibility but at least with the items present you have more means of doing magical stuff...
well now there was a time not that long ago when the bad guys actually made their own weapons and ammo.
Ned Christie, John Derringer.Not long ago it wasnt quite that easy to walk into the local hardware store and buy ammo. Back then there were soooo many calibres of weapons it was silly. Thats why the .44 WCF was such a good choice (Ned Christie's favorite) because it was the ONLY calibre for which both hand guns and long guns were made. So good ole Ned only needed one round to feed both his weapons.
This would be the equivalent of mages making their own devices/itmes and spells.
Those who felt "threatened buy guns" weren't any less capable of making firearms or their ammo, than local fantasy lawmakers would be of casting spells (theoretically anyone with enough intelligence could do either)
but they dont want to/cant learn so they feel "threatened". in real life they passed laws restricting the weapons, and access to materials for ammo to make it "more difficult" for these things to exist, which actually backfired, because they "lawful citizens" have less access to the weapons now than the criminals.
such laws passed in a DnD world would see many less LG casters and much more CE casters.
would be a curious world to adventure in though.
First, you can play pathfinder superbly without ever giving out a single magic item. Magic Items can me myths (extreme even for me) that wizards talk about. And you can play pathfinder superbly. How do i know this... well I have come close to doing it. A few scrolls and potions here and there. Luckily I play with a group that would scoff at causing blindness to wizards everytime they cast detect magic.
But wait... you could never play Rise of the Runelords or Council of Thieves without alot of magic items. Probaly right. I said you can play pathfinder superbly with little or no magic items. Now playing prepublished modules for a Golarion setting, that is difficult. If you want to be creative and write your own setting and adventures, you can play pathfinder fine without magical items.
Heck I thought I would have to ban the item creation feats. My players never took them because they prefer the 2E item creation rules. Though making such items has never been a part of our game. In rare cases there has been a series of adventures around collecting the components to build a magic item for a specific task. But we needed no subsystem or RPG mechanic for it.
Additionally, easy availability of magic items may not be good for many campaigns, like Ravenloft, or most pulp like settings. I try to GM a game in a setting of about 1000 BC with some exceptions with a stong mixture of Ravenloft/Lovecraftian/Elric/Conan/Lieber themes. I do like magic items, I just like them wondrous and rare... and sometimes with hidden surprises of danger.
I do stress that pathfinder rules can be played with very low amounts of magic items.
There is nothing to say it would have less LG casters -- they would simply follow the laws while being such. Also just because there could be less lawful casters doesn't mean there will be more CE casters.
Finally anyone can make wondrous items or magical gear with enough levels (7 with the soft maximum in pathfinder of 9 and general hard maximum being 12).
Finally if you mean "not long ago" to actually be over 100 years ago -- a time when you could still buy weapons and "making" ammunition required melting metal and pouring it into the mold you got with your gun that you could buy then yes it was "recent".
People still make their own guns -- this doesn't mean they must do so (or that they had to do so) which means your argument of such holds no water whatsoever.
Besides: Wizard to kingdom"Great you passed a law -- good thing I just moved 100 yards out of your kingdom. Oh wait you are going to come for me? Good thing I can cast cloudkill(stinking cloud/whatever you want) and you can't do anything about it since casting seems to be illegal in your country -- meaning you don't have casters. Besides you can't just march out into my new kingdom of getoveritpeople since that would be an illegal act of war."
If you can't outlaw casting how are you going to outlaw the items?
Again with the the point of "well that's great for your puny little country but what about the rest of the world?"
If you dont track spell components then, essentially everyone gets a free "eschew materials" feat.for players that think material components are tedious, then they can simply take that feat!
dont give it away for free!
maybe by taking that it will delay them getting the item creation feats, at least for a time.adversarial? bah, imagine that, i made them buy spell components oh no, they might actually have to pay for a room at the inn next!
Spell Component Pouch: A spellcaster with a spell component pouch is assumed to have all the material components and focuses needed for spellcasting, except for those components that have a specific cost, divine focuses, and focuses that wouldn't fit in a pouch.
The above item has been part of the game for a while. The whole point is that, you spend a few gold, and as long as you don't get captured and stripped of your gear, or have someone use some maneuver to strip it off of you, you have your spell components.
If you dont track spell components then, essentially everyone gets a free "eschew materials" feat.
for players that think material components are tedious, then they can simply take that feat!
dont give it away for free!
maybe by taking that it will delay them getting the item creation feats, at least for a time.adversarial? bah, imagine that, i made them buy spell components oh no, they might actually have to pay for a room at the inn next!
That's not really true. If you have a spell component pouch then there is no need to track non-costly spell components (the rules specifically say this).
The feat still comes in mighty dandy for when you are unable to get to your components (such as when pinned), or when you have them taken away from you (such as from being captured).
You're just over thinking things, which is causing you to want to over complicate the game with needless bookkeeping due to a misconception.
Seriously? You have the Geneva Conventions in your game?
Well just about every campaign world does, but it gets handwaved.
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Seriously? You have the Geneva Conventions in your game?Well just about every campaign world does, but it gets handwaved.
I wrote mine, canned worlds with 20th/21st century outlooks on warfare don't do it for me. I play to escape reality, not emulate it.
Yeah, no general in my world is going to pull up because his Aide de Camp told him "Sir, I'm sorry, but this area has been designated a "no looting and pillaging" zone under Article II, section 24 of the Elfrock Accords".
Besides you can't just march out into my new kingdom of getoveritpeople since that would be an illegal act of war."Seriously? You have the Geneva Conventions in your game?
As much as I have kingdoms with gun control laws (or unlikely magic item control laws). Besides most Kingdoms do have a law making it illegal for someone to invade their own kingdom -- I never said that it broke international law.
All I have left to say is, "If you outlaw magical items then only outlaws will have magical items."
Sure, but would the same General see a party passing by festooned with nifty items and then 'confiscate/comandeer' them for use in defeating X enemy?
Would the neighbouring rival duchy happily allow heavily armed groups to come wandering through their borders and into their hinterlands unmolested because they were 'just simple adventurers'?
So yeah I reckon it all has a bigger canvas to consider.
Sure, but would the same General see a party passing by festooned with nifty items and then 'confiscate/comandeer' them for use in defeating X enemy?
Would the neighbouring rival duchy happily allow heavily armed groups to come wandering through their borders and into their hinterlands unmolested because they were 'just simple adventurers'?
So yeah I reckon it all has a bigger canvas to consider.
Well that would be quite the set of encounters for high level PCs wouldn't it?
Could be a good reason to stay at home and avoid the headaches uh? Maybe the reason that the NPCs don't just handle things themselves.
Beyond that even if there is a bunch of duchies that don't like the idea how big of an area of control do they really have?
Most times we get to hear all about how "No one from the duchy can save us! You must help us by handling (threat type g here)!"
If they can't handle a dragon what makes them think they can handle the dragon slayers?
All in all I don't see a group at mid level as "heavily armed" for the same reasons the duchy probably isn't going to bother unless in dire need or the adventurers give a reason:
1. There is only so much a small group can do.
2. Numbers can win even with inferior equipment.
3. Too much hassle (as I pointed out before).
What I want to know is how are these governments going to stop them?
Everyone is assuming they would want to -- but how will they do it?
Also why would they want to? We don't actually stop people from buying guns -- even fully automatic guns or man portable heavy ordinance (I should know I have friends with both).
How would a backwater duchy with limited resources that has trouble with its own borders handle such a complex task as restricting magical items? Especially since most mages aren't going to be receptive to helping with that (since it impacts their livelihood)?
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Sure, but would the same General see a party passing by festooned with nifty items and then 'confiscate/comandeer' them for use in defeating X enemy?
Would the neighbouring rival duchy happily allow heavily armed groups to come wandering through their borders and into their hinterlands unmolested because they were 'just simple adventurers'?
So yeah I reckon it all has a bigger canvas to consider.
Depends on the general, the national origin of the party and if the war were general or just a couple of nobles having a pissing contest, really.
My players know better than to go near a marching army if they're not interested in problems.
There is another question... Do you want to.
If you restrict magic items, ban them, prevent their manufacture.
And the counter next door does not, in fact they encourage, trade, manufacture, and provide incentives for magic item creation. Were adventures ready have magic items.
.....
Which country will be better prepared to repeal an invasion.
Which country will more likely have adventure fully armed with magic items, as special force troops.
Which country will have the knowledge to make and manufacturer the magic items they will need for war.
.....
For the most part, a country banning magic items, would be shooting itself in the foot.
Also why would they want to? We don't actually stop people from buying guns -- even fully automatic guns or man portable heavy ordinance (I should know I have friends with both).
Yes but most of the rest of the world do have laws to restrict access to these things. The USA (i assume that's where you are) is VERY unusual in allowing unrestricted access them.
Also why would they want to? We don't actually stop people from buying guns -- even fully automatic guns or man portable heavy ordinance (I should know I have friends with both).Yes but most of the rest of the world do have laws to restrict access to these things. The USA (i assume that's where you are) is VERY unusual in allowing unrestricted access them.
To be fair it isn't completely unrestricted -- there is paperwork and fees and such, but it is possible.
As to other countries -- alright it is generally illegal -- but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Especially in poor countries that are unable to control their borders never mind their citizenry.
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Also why would they want to? We don't actually stop people from buying guns -- even fully automatic guns or man portable heavy ordinance (I should know I have friends with both).Yes but most of the rest of the world do have laws to restrict access to these things. The USA (i assume that's where you are) is VERY unusual in allowing unrestricted access them.To be fair it isn't completely unrestricted -- there is paperwork and fees and such, but it is possible.
As to other countries -- alright it is generally illegal -- but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Especially in poor countries that are unable to control their borders never mind their citizenry.
True, Mexico has some of the strictest gun laws and harshest penalties in the world (they gave a guy who drove over from Texas ten years for three shotgun shells he forgot were in his glove box). Fat lot of good a line in a law book does them, considering they had 45,000* murders last year, most of them by firearm.
Iraq, on the other hand, which has almost zero gun laws and is being occupied by an unpopular army, had far fewer homicides, and they're a real war zone, not a metaphorical one.
*Edit: ok, the 45,000 figure in since they started cracking down on the cartels, so it's over the last six years. Sorry. Mexico has a murder rate of 13 per 100k, Iraq had 7.3 per. I don't know if the Iraq number would be higher or lower if we weren't there (assuming no sectarian civil war, that is), I just think it's a decent indication that, while availability of legal firearms is one factor, it isn't the only factor, and sometimes isn't even a factor (in the case of Mexico).
Iraq, on the other hand, which has almost zero gun laws and is being occupied by an unpopular army, had far fewer homicides, and they're a real war zone, not a metaphorical one.
Iraq has the dubious benefit of social structures designed to control the citizenry even if the government stops functioning to help this though (which ironically has help lead to some of the homicides/ war issues they've had in the pass several years). However that is neither here nor there for the conversation at hand.
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No, for the most part.
I will usually provide NPC's who are willing and able to make low-utility stuff. Healing salves, thrown attack items, and other consumables. Each specific NPC will have an area of specialty, such as healing and restoration. Typically, the PC's take one or two such NPC's on as retainers. These NPC's gain levels and gain mastery in their craft, and one who specializes in weapons will be able to make good weapons. One who specializes in scrolls will make good scrolls.
But I don't usually allow any PC to buy all the spells they want of the highest level they can cast. I don't let them buy weapons and armor more powerful than the stuff they already have. They know that the best way to get epic gear in my games is to quest for it. I think giving loot is part of the DM's job, and part of that means keeping items out of the game that will be disruptive to the flow and play of the game.
A good DM will give the characters what they need. Perhaps not exactly what they want, but certainly enough to do well.
A good player will figure out how to use whatever the DM gives them. I'm not impressed by people who can choose the right trinkets from a list to make the most powerful individual character possible. I'm more impressed by people who can make clever use of whatever they've got.
Kinda... but in my games, the players 90% of the time have to place orders for items to be made, not making them immediately available. They are also limited by who is making the item. If the crafter is a 6th level wizard that means cl6 items, +2 weapons and armors and ecetra. Magic items are just too expensive to make without a purchaser already established. For example, Michelangelo did not make sculptures and then tried to sell them, patrons paid him to make them a sculpture.
On the other hand, super minor items are a different story. I like to throw in less adventuring magic items in my game sometimes. Magical photos using silent image and craft wondrous items and "care bears," children's stuffed toys that act as an emergency first aid kit, healing 1 hp a week and stuff like that is very cheep but also have a much larger target, and less useful to adventurers.
I will usually provide NPC's who are willing and able to make low-utility stuff. Healing salves, thrown attack items, and other consumables. Each specific NPC will have an area of specialty, such as healing and restoration. Typically, the PC's take one or two such NPC's on as retainers. These NPC's gain levels and gain mastery in their craft, and one who specializes in weapons will be able to make good weapons. One who specializes in scrolls will make good scrolls.
This is actually similar to what I do, except I don't have them taken on as retainers.
If you run an AP or a game in Golarion, there are only four ways to do magical items really:
1) You let people trade in magical items, and run the game as it is written, following the rules for cities and trade.
2) You make sure all the items are somehow appropriate for the players, and evenly distributed, since they cannot get their items otherwise.
3) As 1, only casters in party makes stuff instead of buying it, using wealth obtained through adventure to enchant, more or less evens out.
4) None of the above, and game balance breaks like a osteoporosis patient being hit by a truck, making the caster classes the only viable option to meet level-appropriate power.
I guess I can add potential solutions:
5) Plethora of house-rules, GM fiat and fudging to compensate.
6) Make martial classes gestalt by default (Rogue gets all the bard class abilities, Fighter + Paladin, Ranger + Barbarian, Monk + ... yeah)
7) 30+ point buy. Won't really solve it, but make it a viable e6 game.
Figure I'd stop lurking and chime in.
Generally in the campaigns I DM magic is some what limited. I'm talking at Lv 6-8 players come to appreciate masterwork cold iron weapons, and +1 magic bonuses. So going out and buying most permanent magic items is out of the question.
In major cities consumable items like healing potions and scrolls, maybe even a wand can be had. This gives players a chance to stock up while milking some cash off them. A bigger ticket item (say +2 or better) would be a RP opportunity. Befriending the spell caster by doing a few tasks, assembling needed materials, and ultimately paying handsomely for it.
I'd rather the players get their main magic items from their quests and adventurers. Prying a +2 weapon from the cold dead hands of major villain's henchman, +3 cloak taken from the crypt of undead menace, or stealing a ring right of the hand of a corrupt priest.
Since players aren't literally tingling with a load of magic items primed and ready, as a DM I can get more bang for the buck on lesser mobs. There is still the tension and risks in many encounters and the players still control their destiny.
but they dont want to/cant learn so they feel "threatened". in real life they passed laws restricting the weapons, and access to materials for ammo to make it "more difficult" for these things to exist, which actually backfired, because they "lawful citizens" have less access to the weapons now than the criminals.
This is getting stupid to the point I have to believe you are just trolling.
Handwavium?What I want to know is how are these governments going to stop them?
Everyone is assuming they would want to -- but how will they do it?
True -- that is powerful stuff.
If you dont track spell components then, essentially everyone gets a free "eschew materials" feat.
for players that think material components are tedious, then they can simply take that feat!
dont give it away for free!
maybe by taking that it will delay them getting the item creation feats, at least for a time.adversarial? bah, imagine that, i made them buy spell components oh no, they might actually have to pay for a room at the inn next!
That's not really true. If you have a spell component pouch then there is no need to track non-costly spell components (the rules specifically say this).
The feat still comes in mighty dandy for when you are unable to get to your components (such as when pinned), or when you have them taken away from you (such as from being captured).
You're just over thinking things, which is causing you to want to over complicate the game with needless bookkeeping due to a misconception.
its not a misconception, it is exactly how the game USED to run, in previous editions. "its been part of the game for a while" ohhh ahhh so has item creation feats, power creep and the Christmas tree effect.
Where did it start?
why does everyone say spell casters rule the game.
because they were all handed too many freebies which "have been part of the game for a while"
You dont have to track every pinch of bat dung. But you might want to keep your spell casters thinking about it, when they come to cities, towns, villages, spend some time looking for the stuff.
"Roland the great, you have been casting cat's grace alot lately, now would be a good time to get some more cat's fur" etc etc.
Roland could chase down a stray cat if he wanted. Or if he so chose the last time they killed a tiger or something its fur could suffice, all he has to say is "im collecting some fur (or whatever) for spell components"
A few gold at level one doesn't give you spell components forever.
IF you do that, THEN it won't be such a big deal when you actually make a player WORK a little to find 500gp worth of crushed black pearl for his big death spell, or even prevent him from casting it for a while because he's had to go through some effort to actually get the component.
Or are you saying it's reasonable to just hand wave crushed black pearl too?
Once you've taken the step in your game to make roland the great appreciate the rare-ity of his crushed black pearl, and even spend some in game time procuring such.
then it's not such a big step to do some adventuring to get materials for his staff of a goggle good spelly-stuff.
Where did the spell caster power creep come from? Yes it came from hand waving spell components.
Like it or not.
It also took some fun out of being a spell caster, Or Dming for spell casters, they should be slightly crazed and always looking for stuff to cast their spells.
"roland would you hurry up!"
"wait i just need a little more bat dung!"
It also took some fun out of being a spell caster, Or Dming for spell casters, they should be slightly crazed and always looking for stuff to cast their spells.
If you think the accounting of tracking bat dung was fun, I question whether you know what "fun" means.
Actually I'm going to upgrade that from questioning to flat-out saying that you don't know what "fun" means.
If you run an AP or a game in Golarion, there are only four ways to do magical items really:
1) You let people trade in magical items, and run the game as it is written, following the rules for cities and trade.
2) You make sure all the items are somehow appropriate for the players, and evenly distributed, since they cannot get their items otherwise.
3) As 1, only casters in party makes stuff instead of buying it, using wealth obtained through adventure to enchant, more or less evens out.
4) None of the above, and game balance breaks like a osteoporosis patient being hit by a truck, making the caster classes the only viable option to meet level-appropriate power.
I guess I can add potential solutions:
5) Plethora of house-rules, GM fiat and fudging to compensate.
6) Make martial classes gestalt by default (Rogue gets all the bard class abilities, Fighter + Paladin, Ranger + Barbarian, Monk + ... yeah)
7) 30+ point buy. Won't really solve it, but make it a viable e6 game.
I generally prefer to give out magic items in treasure.
Trouble is, if magic items exist, HOW do they exist?
SOmeone made them.
Bingo item Creation feats.
Trouble with the item creation feats is the players eventually get too much control over exactly what they have, instead of it being long lost treasure its tailor made gear.
That being said, I think it is better to have the right treasure out there to be rumored about and found.Pcs will be less likely to take item creation feats.
But you dont always have to make the item the longsword that FighterX has already taken three feats i the feat tree for.
Maybe it's a falchion? DANG. it's such a good sword, but.
what to do?
fighter could just switch to it when needed (lets say its an undead bane weapon) so he doesn't min max with his feats and the power of the magic item.
Or the Party could seek to trade it in?
Well trade it to whom?
Depends on the world, you've made.
If you stick your foot in your mouth and made a place to just go sell magic items, then by default you must be able to BUY magic items.
Poof Magi-marts are born. you might has well have made it a longsword to begin with and saved yourself the trouble.
I'd say rather more interesting is to make them travel to wizards towers or "hey the great King Targ One-eye is renown for wielding a falchion, i wonder if we can interest him in this item"
That way they can sell it, but there isnt a third party. Sure they can sell a magic item to the king because he has the money but, he doesnt necessarily have anything to sell back to them.
But he could be persuaded to commission something to built for them in trade, but alas, his crafters lack the dragon feathers to make such an item.
Or whatever.
Thats why I like curio shops, why do they exist? To sell focuses, fetishes, material components, non magical lucky charms, hocus pocus elixirs, and occasionally real potions, or other minor items (scrolls wands etc) but not often enough to be counted on.
But without requiring your spell casters to at least think about renewing their supply of spell components regularly, there is no feasible reason to search out these places, and perhaps stumble on a few minor magical trinkets they may want to pick up.
Do enough of this and the PCs wont feel the need to pick up item creation feats (for the most part, unless of course its 'part of the character')
either way as long as you have better control of the magic item economy than what the pure rules of the game allow.
I prefer adventuring parties with "open slots" i.e. not everyone has a magic weapon, not everyone has two rings, a cloak and amulet etc.
It also took some fun out of being a spell caster, Or Dming for spell casters, they should be slightly crazed and always looking for stuff to cast their spells.
If you think the accounting of tracking bat dung was fun, I question whether you know what "fun" means.
Actually I'm going to upgrade that from questioning to flat-out saying that you don't know what "fun" means.
He has to be trolling. It's not even funny trolling; it's just bad.