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I started gaming with a game named "Imperials and Rebels". Title heavily influenced by Star Wars? Probably. The impetus for this game? My oldest brother coming home and talking briefly about his experience with D&D.
My younger brother and I had to play this kind of game once we heard about it. So, we grabbed a pinochle deck, the rogues gallery from a Batman digest and borrowed some ideas from Thundarr the Barbarian, and created our own game. This probably lasted for six or seven months until Christmas or a birthday came around and we finally got our hands on the boxed set of D&D Basic.
[Edit: removed reference to Contest of Champions, because the dates don't jive with the math from my school years. I played for a few years in Vermont and moved to New York in 1982. Boy the tricks the mind plays on a 40 year old.)
I ran for my younger brother, my best friend, and whoever else I could wrangle into playing. We played every chance we got. One of my fondest memories was the time I got all 5 siblings to play The Isle of Dread.
This was in a small town in Vermont, there weren't many candidates. My cousins were into heavy metal at the time, but I couldn't stand them, and avoided metal by association. Mostly, we listened to whatever pop was on the radio and 8 tracks of country singers like John Denver, Johnny Cash, etc.
We alternated between I&R, D&D, and two other games we made up, a [diceless before ADRPG] Superhero one and a post-apocalyptical madmaxian affair my second oldest brother worked the hardest on.
The 80's saw a move to upstate New York and more games, a move away from D&D. Gamma World, Villians and Vigilantes, Champions,etc. AD&D was an occasional fallback game, with a few scattered campaigns. Once I met the woman who created the interdimensional game "Ancient Future" that was most of what I played in the mid 80s.
I returned to D&D just before 3e came out, to introduce gaming to my daughter.
'78
My mom was the DM.
My brother, a friend and I each had a character.
Keep on the Borderlands. We chopped our way through the kobold warren, and of course my mother had baby kobolds which she guilted us into adopting. After that my brother DMed.
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I remember DMing Keep of the Borderlands while camping with six friends up in the mountains. Playing by an open fire was amazing. I still have the original module complete with a few burn marks on the cover from sparks that shot my way.
Another great memory from the early rules was how hard it was to become a paladin. I had a friend whose greatest desire was to finally achieve all the prerequisites and become a paladin. Just as she got close, I would bait her with some helpless monster pleading for mercy and she would lop his head off. "Oops."
My western mind cannot grasp the concepts of honor and serving a group instead of an individual. But a fantastic read non the less and I still enjoy it over the 3E Rokugan setting (as well as Dragonlance Adventures over the Dragonlance 3E setting).
I had this issue as well - my solution was to write into the history of my homebrew that some part of the oriental civilization emigrated across the ocean on great ships and pretty much set up shop by founding their own nation in the main western style high fantasy play area...now everyone could play the Samurai class - but killing monsters and taking their stuff remained the core theme of the campaign.
'course in 1E Oriental Adventures was broken - My players used to use Eagle Claw to blast through the dungeon walls in order to tunnel to the deeper parts of the adventure.
Did anyones 1st Ed. Oriental Adventures book not fall apart after opening it a few times? I bought a second copy a few years back that apparently had not been opened more than once, so it is still in one piece.
Stefan
Here's the story on Judges Guild, as I understand it.
...
Bob Bledsaw died of cancer, less than a month after Gary Gygax passed away.
Hi Chris, great story. Bob and the other luminaries at Judges Guild were just fantastic people as well as life long devotees of the gaming world. The whole Palladium press crowd started with Judges Guild. There are just so many greats that started at JG.
In service,
Rich
www.drgames.org
Generational transitions, my friend, the youth of the current age always rebel against the amusements of the preceding generation.
I had high hopes for my nephew. He's 12 now. When he was a little bit younger, he loved playing the "Dark Tower" board game and "HeroQuest" with me. I tried showing him some D&D books but it was an "epic fail." It's all Halo and Call of Duty for him.So what are other people's experiences with D&D in the 70s?
My other half's son, Chris, is addicted to Black Ops 3. He and his baseball buddies play it more than 12 hours per day, all networked together on the weekends.
In service,
Rich
www.drgames.org
Although this thread is supposed to be about D&D in the '70s, there seems to be alot of us who didn't start playing really until the early '80s, and maybe it's a can of worms best left unmentioned, but those who survived gaming in the '80s can't help but recall the infamously ignorant Chick Tracts, and BADD (Bothered About Dungeons & Dragons LOL).
The stigma came about due to a few troubled individuals that did disturbing things (suicide, devil worship, listening to Ozzy Osbourne) and ALSO played D&D, and is a great example of a classic if-then logical fallacy that I can't think of the latin name for atm. It was a dicey (no pun intended) time to be a gamer, as you were either branded a nerd (which you probably kind of were) or a devil-worshipper who summoned demons to grandma's basement (which you probably were not).
It was mentioned earlier on the thread Gary Gygax's recommended reading at the end of the AD&D DMG. I went back to investigate and interestingly enough, after his lists his recommended readings, Gary lists the biggest influences on the game. Vance shows up as well as Howard and Lovecraft but surprisingly, not Tolkien. One usually equates the two but I felt the only thing Tolkien really influenced was the races of dwarves, elves, and halflings. The spirit of the game wasn't usually so epic or noble. What were you reading in the 70s when you delved into your first dungeon?
There was actually a lawsuit against GEG and the TSR denizens by the JRRT estate. Originally D&D included balrogs, ents, and hobbits.
This was back in the day when some of the hard-core Christian community felt strongly that D&D was Satanic.
Fortunately, we can all chuckle about that now.
In service,
Rich
Although this thread is supposed to be about D&D in the '70s, there seems to be alot of us who didn't start playing really until the early '80s, and maybe it's a can of worms best left unmentioned, but those who survived gaming in the '80s can't help but recall the infamously ignorant Chick Tracts, and BADD (Bothered About Dungeons & Dragons LOL).
The stigma came about due to a few troubled individuals that did disturbing things (suicide, devil worship, listening to Ozzy Osbourne) and ALSO played D&D, and is a great example of a classic if-then logical fallacy that I can't think of the latin name for atm. It was a dicey (no pun intended) time to be a gamer, as you were either branded a nerd (which you probably kind of were) or a devil-worshipper who summoned demons to grandma's basement (which you probably were not).
I started playing the mid-70s. I sat on panels with Gary Gygax, Mike Stackpole, Greg Stafford, etc.
I remember those days.
A lot of us just wanted to get RPGs recognized as a legitimate form of entertainment.
Massive success!
In service,
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It's good that you brought up the art. It definitely had its own style back then and it's one of the reasons I feel drawn to those good old early days. Like I mentioned early in the post, I have an old DM's screen that I still use even though the information on it is obsolete. How do other people feel about the early art from D&D? Did it draw you into the game or was it just something you had to tolerate to play?I started sometimes in the late seventies... I remember saving up for quite a while to buy the AD&D DM guide...
Remember how illustrations of gamers (as opposed to characters) had awesome feathered mullets? :) Thank you Errol Otis!
And Jeff Dee's figures always had bell bottoms on. The pic in the basic rulebook with the thief being held upside-down, with the loot falling out. Awesome...
-Uriel
Oriental Adventures was, is, and always WILL BE my favourite 1st Ed book.
I still have it...in fact I have TWO copies.
I bought the Ninja book in 2nd Ed.
I am still gutted that in decades of play I have yet to participate in one OA (or similar style) campaign.
Oriental Adventures was, is, and always WILL BE my favourite 1st Ed book.
I still have it...in fact I have TWO copies.
I bought the Ninja book in 2nd Ed.I am still gutted that in decades of play I have yet to participate in one OA (or similar style) campaign.
Someone earlier in the thread mentioned his OA kept falling apart. For me, it has been my most durable 1e book. I college, my friend ran a short OA campaign. I ran "Spirit of the Ochimo" once.
To keep this thread moving, here's a new question. For those of you who played D&D in the 70s, how much of an influence do you think the first "Star Wars" movie was? Did it's blend of sci-fi and fantasy elements attract new players to the game? Did your current players now all want jedi powers and lightsabers?
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To keep this thread moving, here's a new question. For those of you who played D&D in the 70s, how much of an influence do you think the first "Star Wars" movie was?
I, like many back then, became a frenzied Star Wars fan in 1977 when the first movie came out.
I played my first D&D game in 1980; between those to years I discovered The Hobbit and The Lord of the Rings.
Professor Tolkien's magnum opus as well as the the works of the many authors in Appendix N of First Edition's DMG were far more influential than George Lucas on our D&D games.
Expedition to Barrier Peaks aside, I can keep my love for both operatic genres apart while keeping true to my frenzied fandom.
Darth Vader was THE Anti Paladin.
... but I was a bit late finding Traveller, somewhere 1980-81, during the first year of doctoral studies: new university, new set of gamers, different interests... the same if not more fun :)
Traveller was awesome, what an epic game!
... but I was a bit late finding Traveller, somewhere 1980-81, during the first year of doctoral studies: new university, new set of gamers, different interests... the same if not more fun :)Traveller was awesome, what an epic game!
I've heard people speak of this "Traveller" on the boards, but I am not familiar with it, much like Judge's Guild was new to me as well.
I've heard people speak of this "Traveller" on the boards, but I am not familiar with it, much like Judge's Guild was new to me as well.... but I was a bit late finding Traveller, somewhere 1980-81, during the first year of doctoral studies: new university, new set of gamers, different interests... the same if not more fun :)Traveller was awesome, what an epic game!
Well, for a start, your character could die in the creation process, requiring you to start over... (there were background tables, many characters had a military background and there were results that the character died in action. While somewhat realistic, it was an awful idea.)
Stefan
Well, for a start, your character could die in the creation process, requiring you to start over... (there were background tables, many characters had a military background and there were results that the character died in action. While somewhat realistic, it was an awful idea.)
That was my favorite part of the game.
RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16
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Well, for a start, your character could die in the creation process, requiring you to start over... (there were background tables, many characters had a military background and there were results that the character died in action. While somewhat realistic, it was an awful idea.)
The TRAVELLER Character Generation system was sort of like playing Blackjack: if you kept re-enlisting at the end of each tour of duty, you gained skills and pension cash. And sometimes your character would die / get injured during that new tour of duty. If you wanted to keep a character alive, then stand pat on a good First Lieutenant, and don't keep trying for the retired Admiral.
The best TRAVELLER death I remember happened in the first game session. Imagine Firefly manned by a bunch of 50-something retired military officers. The team gets caught smuggling something vaguely illegal, and the current Space Navy vessel is closing in to intercept. So, we hit the Jump engines and try to escape into Jump space. Hey, do you know what happens when you try to jump within a couple of planetary diameters of a gravity well? Our pilot failed his roll, and the ship exploded with all crew aboard.
One of my favorite failings of the Traveller combat system was that it was all mapped out on college-ruled lined paper. There were ample rules for advancing and retreating along that paper - but none for moving left or right.
It resulted in some very... interesting... discussions and home-brewed rules until they fixed it.
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Well, for a start, your character could die in the creation process, requiring you to start over... (there were background tables, many characters had a military background and there were results that the character died in action. While somewhat realistic, it was an awful idea.)That was my favorite part of the game.
I got stabbed in prison once, during a riot...Character dead during creation! Hehehe...
On the note about Star Wars and influence. Not really...However, when I found Star Frontiers, ours was a very Star Wars like game.
W also made our own D&D variants for the Micronauts and Road Warrior, using bastardized Gamma World and a bunch of stuff that we just threw together...
-Uriel
For those of you who played in the 70s or even basic D&D in the 80s, do you ever go back and play those "original" versions of the game? Also, have you played what are called the "retroclones" like OSRIC and Swords&Wizardry? Are these games that you feel stand the test of time or do they seem horribly outdated compared to newer games like 4e and Pathfinder. I know that I told myself after 3e that I wasn't going to buy anymore editions of the game, figuring three editions of the same game was enough, but then I saw Pathfinder and fumbled my Will save. But I have been looking at my old 1e and 2e books sitting on the book shelve and wondering if there still is magic in them.
I still have all my old stuff, from the white box, to the Basic D&D Sets (Purple set with the green dragon on the cover, and the 'red box') all the AD&D stuff, my 2nd Ed gear... and now Pathfinder.
I occasionally pick up the old stuff and flip through it for old times sake (They do have magic, in their simplicity!), but haven't played an 'earlier edition' in ages. Think the last 'basic' game was a retro day I did about 15 years ago.
I haven't touched any of the clones.
Not quite 70ies but…
The year was 1983 (I think), and I was already a huge fan of the new arcade game Dragon’s Lair. We had a ‘Game Day’ in our class since it was one of the last days at school before the summer break. I had brought a chess board, and some other kids brought other games like Connect 4, Chinese Checkers… But a foursome of kids in the back of the class were playing something strange that caught my ear. I distinctly heard the word sword, and maybe magic somewhere in there. Whatever it was, it just SOUNDED so damn cool. After finishing my game, I went in for a closer look.
There, around a student’s desk, in a classroom in Sarnia Ontario, a great adventure took place. I asked if I could watch for a while. They said sure. One had a cool map; the others had sheets with stats written all over them. They all had weird-looking dice. Even cooler, it made me think of the various scenarios in Dragon’s Lair… And these guys went even further, by actually making up their own situations and playing them out afterwards (I had only done that before with Star Wars action figures, lol). I immediately fell in love with the game.
The next week, I went over to a store where one of the PLAYERS told me they sold this stuff. And there they were; on a small rack in the middle of the store: D&D MODULES!!! I purchased D&D Modules B1: In Search of the Unknown (as it was labelled for beginners) and also bought a d10 and a d4. I took all of that home and read through the whole thing in a matter of minutes. A whole new world opened up before me.
Although I had NO idea how to play, I got some kids from around my house and asked them to come play at my house. Only by imitating the guys in my class, I managed to DM my very first session of D&D right there. It wasn’t perfect, but it was enough for me. It sparked something that still burns bright even today. Needless to say, that that single afternoon in my classroom in 1983 changed my life forever. What I would have given for the internet and access to all of you guys way back in 1983. I would have had SO MANY questions…
Another funny thing though, speaking of internet… As much as I like D&D (roleplaying in general), and really liked adventure games on my Commodore 64 (and even later, the Baldur’s Gate series on the PC), I never really liked the huge on-line fantasy games. Maybe there’s the human factor missing in it… Or maybe because I could NEVER become a top player (as I could never be able to play 24/7 as many maniacs do). Maybe for me roleplaying is still synonym for friends coming over, gathering around a table, eating snacks, drinking pop and beer, and sharing a good story together.
Ultradan
I still own that first module I bought!! And even use it from time to time...
:)
Ultradan
Did anyones 1st Ed. Oriental Adventures book not fall apart after opening it a few times? I bought a second copy a few years back that apparently had not been opened more than once, so it is still in one piece.
Stefan
We didn't have OA at our house, but that sure happened to our copy of (AD&D) Unearthed Arcana.
When I moved out of my parents' house in 1995, my brother sold our "Tickle Trunk" full of games. The only ones I kept were (most of) my Champions books, Car Wars and a 2E PHB. Everything else got cashed in -- AD&D, V&V, Stormbringer, Ringworld RPG, Paranoia, Toon, etc.
Well, for a start, your character could die in the creation process, requiring you to start over... (there were background tables, many characters had a military background and there were results that the character died in action. While somewhat realistic, it was an awful idea.)That was my favorite part of the game.
I played Traveller a few times with my buddy as GM. Somehow our games always ended up resembling "Grand Theft Auto 3" more than "Firefly"!
Actually,
My daughter has shown an increasing desire to jump in and try out D&D so I am on the verge of indulging her interest and maybe cracking out the old Basic set so she can see what it is all about.
She came in and watched the adults game and was fascinated - once I answered her bajillion questions on how the whole thing works she was even more keen.
The problem is that:
We are all adults
She doesn't know any other kids that play.
So its a bit limited.
She's 10.
Have all of you roleplay the merry band of men to her Robin Hood?
I forsee...disaster. And ponies.
What, she doesn't have Wagnerian battles with her My Little Ponies? :p
No she's more inclined to come tearing out of the darkness on a fly by Nerf gun ambush screaming her latest 'die n00b' type internet meme, then go back to dollies and dress-ups.
It's like the son I never had.
Wow this is a pretty spiffy thread :). Wish i could say i started in the 70's-80's but i wasn't born until 86 so... anyway, i started playing in about 93-94 my brothers friend had the 2nd printing 1st edition books and the art kind of got me. Didn't actually have anything DnD related for myself till i saw the Black Box Starter set at a local flee market i was checking out in Seattle with my dad.
Wrote up a character with some friends been playing ever since.
(You always manage to find something interesting at those things)
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Actually,
My daughter has shown an increasing desire to jump in and try out D&D so I am on the verge of indulging her interest and maybe cracking out the old Basic set so she can see what it is all about.
She came in and watched the adults game and was fascinated - once I answered her bajillion questions on how the whole thing works she was even more keen.
The problem is that:
We are all adults
She doesn't know any other kids that play.So its a bit limited.
She's 10.
My recommendation: Don't limit her with your own expectations. My daughter started when she was 7. All of the other players were adults. She had a blast, and is still playing at the age of 16, albeit with kids her own age and me as the DM.
Don't sugarcoat it, make her do the math, have her write her character's backstories. She'll surprise and delight you a thousand times.
And when your adult friends have gone their separate ways and gotten too busy with families of their own, maybe she'll bring over a few friends from school and you'll have a whole group of miscreants eating all your food and killing all your monsters, all up in your base....
Don't sugarcoat it, make her do the math, have her write her character's backstories. She'll surprise and delight you a thousand times.
Well thats kinda surprisingly true...
Once I described the various classes and races she took it all on board, thought about it a while and then came back to me with an idea for a Bard.
For a second I froze, as if an icy cold hand was gripping my innards - I thought I was about to be asked to GM a version of 'Hannah Montanna:RPG'
But her idea for an Elven bard in a purple jester suit with a silver flute that they also used as a weapon (think Tai Chi forms) was quite novel.
For those of you who played in the 70s or even basic D&D in the 80s, do you ever go back and play those "original" versions of the game? Also, have you played what are called the "retroclones" like OSRIC and Swords&Wizardry? Are these games that you feel stand the test of time or do they seem horribly outdated compared to newer games like 4e and Pathfinder. I know that I told myself after 3e that I wasn't going to buy anymore editions of the game, figuring three editions of the same game was enough, but then I saw Pathfinder and fumbled my Will save. But I have been looking at my old 1e and 2e books sitting on the book shelve and wondering if there still is magic in them.
I get my fix for the old stuff mainly by doing conversions of older adventures to the newer editions.
Don't sugarcoat it, make her do the math, have her write her character's backstories. She'll surprise and delight you a thousand times.Well thats kinda surprisingly true...
Once I described the various classes and races she took it all on board, thought about it a while and then came back to me with an idea for a Bard.
For a second I froze, as if an icy cold hand was gripping my innards - I thought I was about to be asked to GM a version of 'Hannah Montanna:RPG'
But her idea for an Elven bard in a purple jester suit with a silver flute that they also used as a weapon (think Tai Chi forms) was quite novel.
Another vote for Let her play! :)
My 6-year-old has a 5th-level elf cleric. Her adventures are less adult, obviously, but she kills her share of monsters and loots their corpses like any good adventurer. I don't pull punches with any game, so she knows to be cautious, and sometimes (unsuccessfully) tries to influence my impartiality as DM during a tense combat. :PShe is learning about morality and ethics, managing resources (spells, potions, etc.), expanding her vocabulary, learning classic fantasy and mythology tropes that will aid her in future literary studies, improving her math skills (I make her add up her own roll results, calculate hp, etc.), and generally using alot of brainpower. She is also learning a bit about loss (of NPC companions fallen in battle, and perhaps of her own PC eventually), and how to cope with it. And that it is okay to lose, and how to be a gracious loser.
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Make her do the math, have her write her character's backstories. She'll surprise and delight you a thousand times.
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Once I described the various classes and races she took it all on board, thought about it a while and then came back to me with an idea for a Bard.
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The few times I've introduced kids to the game I've given them a very simplified PC sheet. Then made them write one out on their own (not just fill in the blanks on mine). When they see a simplified PC sheet it's easier to learn it. When they have to copy the the whole simplified sheet -- not just fill in the blanks -- they learn it faster.
And yes, absolutely make them do their own math, etc., asking you for help only when they need it (and you making sure they're not using you as a crutch).
. . . . I played for a while with some firefighter brothers whose 10 and 11 year old sons played. The boys "used" published PC sheets and never knew anything about the mechanics for their PCs.
Don't get me wrong, that's no big deal -- these boys were spending awesome quality time with their dads -- but it did suck watching them play with no game knowledge. Especially knowing they were way old enough to really get into the game.
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I get my fix for the old stuff mainly by doing conversions of older adventures to the newer editions.
A-MEN
This is me.
I love going through the old 1E and 2E adventures and redesigning/ rewriting them for today's game.
About a year ago I joined a group that was doing this with the old A series. I entered about 3/4 through A2 and it was really fun going all the way to A4. (The DM didn't use the Scourge compilation or Reynold's Slavers -- just the original A series.)