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alright, I'm sure its not optimized, but I always liked the idea of in combat theft. Which is why the halfling rogue I'm making is a cutpurse.
with the two abilities therein
measure the mark: Target makes perception check first, Cutpurse can choose to not use Sleight of Hand, instead use bluff vs sense motive to pass off the incident.
stab and grab(Ex): Full Round action: Cutpurse may attack, and Sleight of Hand to steal from target. Attack must have sneak attack added to be able to do this. If the attack is successful, target gets -5 perception vs Sleight of Hand to notice the theft.
What confuses me is that the cutpurse seems to use sleight of hand to grab items, but the steal command is a CMD action! So which is it?
The steal command says that the target is instantly aware that you grabbed the item, but why, then, does Cutpurse allow you to give them a -5 to their perception on the steal?
Perhaps the steal ability itself is for the .....less refined pursesnatchers and Cutpurse gets something better.?
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You can just use sleight of hand in combat (provokes AoO if they notice you I believe) and succeed on a DC 20 for any small object that isn't tied down.
Only thing I can figure Steal does is let you take bigger items, or steal without sleight of hand.
If you try to take something from a creature, you must make a DC 20 Sleight of Hand check. The opponent makes a Perception check to detect the attempt, opposed by the Sleight of Hand check result you achieved when you tried to grab the item. An opponent who succeeds on this check notices the attempt, regardless of whether you got the item. You cannot use this skill to take an object from another creature during combat if the creature is aware of your presence.
Emphasis mine. You can't use it in combat if they know you are there.
Your confusion stems from the fact that the Steal combat maneuver is poorly named. It has nothing to do with pickpocketing, it exists for blatantly grabbing something that is in the possession of your opponent.
Stab and Grab is not referring to the Steal maneuver, it's referring to regular theft. You attack someone and use that attack as cover to pick their pockets with Sleight of Hand, which you would not normally be able to do since they are aware of you.
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If you try to take something from a creature, you must make a DC 20 Sleight of Hand check. The opponent makes a Perception check to detect the attempt, opposed by the Sleight of Hand check result you achieved when you tried to grab the item. An opponent who succeeds on this check notices the attempt, regardless of whether you got the item. You cannot use this skill to take an object from another creature during combat if the creature is aware of your presence.Emphasis mine. You can't use it in combat if they know you are there.
alright, so.....the cutpurse hits with a melee attack before they steal...so the enemy obviously knows you're there...you're the one who made that nasty kidney pain after all.
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Your confusion stems from the fact that the Steal combat maneuver is poorly named. It has nothing to do with pickpocketing, it exists for blatantly grabbing something that is in the possession of your opponent.
Stab and Grab is not referring to the Steal maneuver, it's referring to regular theft. You attack someone and use that attack as cover to pick their pockets with Sleight of Hand, which you would not normally be able to do since they are aware of you.
this helps clear things up, much obliged.
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The Advanced Rogue Talent Weapon Snatch specifically uses Sleight of Hand for Disarms. I don't see one for items but that's what Combat Steal and Agile Maneuvers are designed for.
Rules expressly state Sleight of Hand doesn't work if y9u are notices. Once initiative is rolled its a Combat Maneuver.
You only need agile maneuvers if you're using a weapon that can't normally be finessed, otherwise weapon finesse works with any combat maneuver that uses a weapon you can finesse