Ok I like to put my self though mental anguish so I thought I would like to try a discussion on a topic I only just learned about.
From Wikipedia
American exceptionalism refers to the theory that the United States occupies a special niche among the nations of the world in terms of its national credo, historical evolution, political and religious institutions and unique origins. The roots of the belief are attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville, who claimed that the then-50-year-old United States held a special place among nations, because it was a country of immigrants and the first modern democracy.
The theory of American exceptionalism has a number of opponents, especially from the Left. Left-wing pundits argue that the belief is "self-serving and jingoistic" (see slavery, civil rights and social welfare issues, Western betrayal, and the failure to aid Jews fleeing the Nazis), that it is based on a myth, and that "[t]here is a growing refusal to accept" the idea of exceptionalism both nationally and internationally.
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Personally as far as I can see the only thing that makes the US different from the rest of the world is (or was) its financial & military power. Morally, culturally, Historically the US is no better or worse than any other country.
The questions I pose:
1. Is American exceptionalism a myth?
What makes America special or more important than the rest of the world?
Is exceptionalism relevant in this day and age?
2. America's status overseas was severely tarnished in the last few years, with public sentiment among its closest allies at low point. Is this terminal, what can be done to improve this - or should you care that there is a lack of trust?
3. United Europe, China, and India are on the rise. Will the competition from these countries, re-fire the engines of the American economy and innovation or will the US shuffle on to a lower less important tier of world power.
4. The Atomic Bomb, the Moon landings and so on were all in response to an external force. Does the US need a "big bad", or "Evil Empire" to focus, as the greatest achievements have all come from competition against a belligerent or enemy?
Is Muslim extremism the wrong focus, is there something more substantial for the US to focus its abilities on?
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1. Hard Call. It is somewhere between Myth and Mythos.
Myth: One of the fictions or half truths forming part of the ideology of a society.
Mythos: The Pattern of Basic Values and historical experiences of a people, characteristically transmitted through the Arts.
The illusion of American Eceptionalism gave rise to undue respect that had to be earned, It was considered the Modern Utopia (a Republic of New Citizens assumedly freed of the inequalities of the old world) and being a false Utopia it quickly squandered all share of respect. To draw on a biblical definition, It is a False Messiah in an Age of Revelations.
Perhaps Canada - and the Commonwealth built by Canadians who went on to become Australians and New Zealanders is the inheritor of American Exceptionalism, rather than the USA.
Yes American Exceptionalism is important. Important to the USA enough to provoke it into latching on to the Commonwealth that has inherited that American Exceptionalism in some monstrous vanity that it retains the qualities on which that Exceptioonalism depends. Perhaps there is also a Jealousy that we (the Commonwealth) have abandoned the USA to its own fate because it bears the mark of Cain and stolen that American Exceptionalism.
It can still make a new Exceptionalism for itself. It has many enemies within who will oppose the actions it must undertake as a consensus to achieve that outcome, but it is possible.
Ok I like to put my self though mental anguish so I thought I would like to try a discussion on a topic I only just learned about.
I'll focus on your fourth point since I just read a great article about it. I wish I could remember where I read it. If I do, I'll link.
EDIT: Found it! First item on OpinionJournal.com for Monday.
I'm spoilerfying my stuff, since James Taranto does a better job than I. But don't go there if you can't handle other people's opinions.
Ever since the Cold War ended, there has been a slow decay entering our political life.
At the end of the Vietnam war, the public mistrusted Democrats with national security issues. With Watergate firmly on their minds, they elected a Democrat in 1976 . . . and remembered why they didn't trust Democrats on national security.
Meanwhile, Republicans lost the confidence of the people on social issues. For much of the period between the end of the Vietnam war and end of the Cold War, the unspoken rule was "Democrats in charge of the Congress, Republicans in charge of the Presidency."
Then, in 1990, as the Cold War wound down and a new recession loomed, there was no national security issue to cling to. Thus, President Clinton was elected. And upon showing the people that he wanted to institute a massive health care overhaul, the people said "Maybe the Republicans aren't so bad on social issues."
Of course, power corrupts, and it wasn't long before Republicans thought they'd have a permanent majority. And then they started doing things like Democrats - namely lots of spending on social issues.
Meanwhile, on the national security front, there wasn't a real threat. The Bush/Gore election was one of the few times when the electoral vote didn't match the popular vote. As a nation, we had turned inwards. Neither candidate had really captured the public's imagination.
But then, September 11 happened. With a Republican as President, people remembered why they liked having a Republican as President. But, and this is a big but, they also realized that Republicans were a lot like Democrats on the social side of things, and gave the Congress back to the Dems.
See where this is getting confusing?
That confusion kinda continued, as Barak Obama campaigned on "hope" and "change." He never really specified what those might entail, but they sure sounded good. After all, he wasn't George Bush, who got hammered on social issues.
So, yes, America does kinda need a big project to focus on. We seem to do well when we're up against the ropes. A quick example is WW2. A surprise attack left our Pacific fleet in shambles, but in a very short time we had modernized our military, beat back aggressors on two fronts, and became an industrial powerhouse. The Cold War meant we (as a people) focused on the Space Race (beating Russia to the moon, despite their success with early space travel), and as we saw the world beginning to accept that Communism was an inevitable partner in the world, we elected a man who completely rejected that view.
Muslim extremism is hard to focus on, because we don't really see it. Sure, we hear stories, but I think people tend to shrug off some of the real horrors that are inflicted on people who lived under Taliban rule, or who are punished under Sharia law. Right now, there are good numbers of people in the country who sympathize with the extremists. That's not good for the country pulling together and picking ourselves up to win the day, ya know? Our government has done a fantastic job on disrupting terrorist attacks, so there hasn't been another September 11. That success means a good number of people think the problem went away.
Is American exceptionalism a myth? No, I don't think so.
De Tocqueville visited America and was surprised to find "private associations formed for public purpose." As I understand it, this was illegal in Revolutionary France, and rare in Europe.
Now, this spontaneous creation of groups formed a natural network, of individuals from varying walks of life. In America, a great 'commercial democracy,' created in an expansive territory, could have a citizenry with a civic zeal . . . this was quite amazing to him. The people were citizens, not subjects of the government. Democracy, from his point of view, usually ended up in despotism. Remember, he was coming out of the Revolution. "All in favor of the foxes eating the chicken, raise your paws" and all that.
This is the essence of American Exceptionalism, and I think you can see that same trend today. Like them or not, the Tea Party movement is not one political group. They are many individuals, coming together to bring their message to our Congress. With the recent health care bill, lots of people became suspicious that it was going to be rammed through without any debate, and we saw a huge surge of people getting involved to inform their Congresspersons of their displeasure. People challenged their representatives, demanding that their voices be heard. Citizens treated their representatives as if the representatives were equals, not as if they were the ruling class of America.
Will it continue? Who knows. Another de Tocqueville quote comes to mind. "The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money."
America is unique among all the nations of the world.
I'm arfaid of Americans!
The people make a country the country does not make the people.
I'm not sure I would agree with that. While people influence their society, their society also influences the way those people think. Surely someone raised in Somalia is going to have a very different way of thinking than if that same person had been raised in France.
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The people make a country the country does not make the people.I'm not sure I would agree with that. While people influence their society, their society also influences the way those people think. Surely someone raised in Somalia is going to have a very different way of thinking than if that same person had been raised in France.
Maybe I should amend it to say within westernized cultures.
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The people make a country the country does not make the people.I'm not sure I would agree with that. While people influence their society, their society also influences the way those people think. Surely someone raised in Somalia is going to have a very different way of thinking than if that same person had been raised in France. [/QUOTE} maybe I should amend it to say within westernized cultures.I think, regardless of where you are, it's a give and take.
weird
American Exceptionalism usually comes over as American arrogance..I'm sorry guys but that's how the majority of world sees you..me I like Americans and hope to return there someday.
I think a strong arguement can be made that American exceptionalism did exist in the period between the beginning of US involvement in the Second World War through the end of the Cold War.
Prior to that, the US was overshadowed by European colonial powers.
After that, democratization of former Warsaw pack states, accompanied by massive, rapid adoption capitalist ideals in China, India and Eastern Europe have done much to diminish America's brand in the modern era.
Imo, exceptionalism isn't in itself a bad thing, especially if it creates an aspirational goal that leads to a more egalitarian society. The problem emerges when exceptionalism is used as justification for totalitarian or unilateral actions.
America!
f%%! YEAH!!!!
Comin' again to save the mothaf%%!in day yeah!!!
YAAAAH!!
KILL 'EM ALL AND LET GOD SORT 'EM OUT!!!!
HEALL YAH!
AMEEERRRRRRICAAAA!
w0000000000T!
*cough*
*cough*
America!
f%%! YEAH!!!!
Comin' again to save the mothaf%%!in day yeah!!!YAAAAH!!
KILL 'EM ALL AND LET GOD SORT 'EM OUT!!!!
HEALL YAH!
AMEEERRRRRRICAAAA!
w0000000000T!
*cough*
*cough*
hoser.
Ok....
*cough*
Honestly speaking, I think there are a lot of exceptional things about America--meaning they really have got a lot of things right.
It's the things they got wrong that make it hard for me to see them as generally exceptional.
hoser.America!
f%%! YEAH!!!!
Comin' again to save the mothaf%%!in day yeah!!!YAAAAH!!
KILL 'EM ALL AND LET GOD SORT 'EM OUT!!!!
HEALL YAH!
AMEEERRRRRRICAAAA!
w0000000000T!
*cough*
*cough*
Let's fry up some back bacon, eh.
I blame Canada.
I blame Canada.
Nice toque you got there, eh.
American Exceptionalism usually comes over as American arrogance..I'm sorry guys but that's how the majority of world sees you..me I like Americans and hope to return there someday.
And yet when things go badly, who is it the rest of the world turns to for help?
Godzilla.
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Like all great empires, the US is exceptional. The Roman Empire, the Islamic Empire, the British Empire, they all had exceptional characteristics that were necessary to achieve the levels of power they reached. They all had one thing in common, of course. They all collapsed eventually. If America avoids the fate that all great powers have faced in the past, then it can truly be called exceptional.
I blame Canada.Nice toque you got there, eh.
Beauty way, eh?
Godzilla.
Haha... smart a**. ;-)
Who has the best looking babes is what I care about.
That would be Brazil. ;)
Who has the best looking babes is what I care about.That would be Brazil. ;)
+1
Yes, American Exceptionalism (This has a name? Why does this have a name?) is a myth. It's just another spin on the the same nationalistic crap spouted by every country. I disapointed, though not surprised, that so many people can't seem to figure that one out.
The day we wake up and realize that the human tendency to categorize people into "us" and "them" has outlived its usefulness, the better off we'll all be.
"Look around, we're all people, who needs countries anyway?"
Who has the best looking babes is what I care about.Ah, now we’re getting into the important stuff.
I tried....
Who has the best looking babes is what I care about.That would be Brazil. ;)
and when she passes,
each one she passes goes,"aaaaaaaaaaah..."
Yes, American Exceptionalism (This has a name? Why does this have a name?) is a myth. It's just another spin on the the same nationalistic crap spouted by every country. I disapointed, though not surprised, that so many people can't seem to figure that one out.
The day we wake up and realize that the human tendency to categorize people into "us" and "them" has outlived its usefulness, the better off we'll all be.
"Look around, we're all people, who needs countries anyway?"
When we realize that mediocrity is all we can shoot for, then the better off we all will be.
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Perhaps Canada - and the Commonwealth built by Canadians who went on to become Australians and New Zealanders is the inheritor of American Exceptionalism, rather than the USA.Yes American Exceptionalism is important. Important to the USA enough to provoke it into latching on to the Commonwealth that has inherited that American Exceptionalism in some monstrous vanity that it retains the qualities on which that Exceptioonalism depends. Perhaps there is also a Jealousy that we (the Commonwealth) have abandoned the USA to its own fate because it bears the mark of Cain and stolen that American Exceptionalism.
It's like an insanity virus has infected all of these nonsensical threads.
I blame Canada.
Times have changed
Our kids are getting worseThey won't obey their parents
They just want to fart and curse!
Should we blame the government?
Or blame society?
Or should we blame the images on TV?
NO!
Blame Canada!
Blame Canada!
With all their beady little eyes and flapping heads so full of lies!
Blame Canada!
Blame Canada!
We need to form a full assault!
It's Canada's fault!
Don't blame me for my son, Stan.
He saw the darn cartoon and now he's off to join the Klan.
And my boy, Eric, once had my picture on his shelf.
But now when I see him he tells me to f%#~ myself.
WELL...
Blame Canada!
Blame Canada!
It seems that everything's gone wrong since Canada came along.
Blame Canada!
Blame Canada!
They're not even a real country anway.
My son could have been a doctor or a lawyer, it's true.
Instead he burned up like a piggy on a barbecue.
Should we blame the matches?
Should we blame the fire?
Or the doctors who allowed him to expire?
HECK NO!
Blame Canada!
Blame Canada!
With all their hockey-hullabaloo,
And that b+**! Anne Murray too,
Blame Canada!
Shame on Canada, foooor...
The smut we must cut,
The trash we must bash,
The laughter and fun must all be undone!
We must blame them and cause a fuss before somebody thinks of blaming uuuuuuuuuuus
I blame Canada.Times have changed
Our kids are getting worse
They won't obey their parents
They just want to fart and curse!Should we blame the government?
Or blame society?
Or should we blame the images on TV?NO!
Blame Canada!
Blame Canada!
With all their beady little eyes and flapping heads so full of lies!
Blame Canada!
Blame Canada!
We need to form a full assault!
It's Canada's fault!Don't blame me for my son, Stan.
He saw the darn cartoon and now he's off to join the Klan.And my boy, Eric, once had my picture on his shelf.
But now when I see him he tells me to f#!& myself.WELL...
Blame Canada!
Blame Canada!
It seems that everything's gone wrong since Canada came along.
Blame Canada!
Blame Canada!
They're not even a real country anway.My son could have been a doctor or a lawyer, it's true.
Instead he burned up like a piggy on a barbecue.
Should we blame the matches?
Should we blame the fire?
Or the doctors who allowed him to expire?HECK NO!
Blame Canada!
Blame Canada!
With all their hockey-hullabaloo,
And that b*##* Anne Murray too,
Blame Canada!
Shame on Canada, foooor...
The smut we must cut,
The trash we must bash,
The laughter and fun must all be undone!
We must blame them and cause a fuss before somebody thinks of blaming uuuuuuuuuuus
As an American, there is only one way I can respond to this.
If he was here right now,
He'd make a plan
And he'd follow through,
That's what Brian Boitano'd do.
When Brian Boitano was in the olympics,
Skating for the gold,
He did two sow cows and a triple lutz,
While wearing a blind fold.
When Brian Boitano was in the alps,
Fighting grizzly bears,
He used his magical fire breath,
And saved the maidens fair.
So what would Brian Boitano do
If he were here today,
I'm sure he'd kick an ass or two,
That's what Brian Boitano'd do.
I want this V-chip out of me,
It has stunted my vo-ca-bu-lar-y.
And I just want my mom
To stop fighting everyone
For Wendy I'll be an activist, too,
Cos that's what Brian Boitano would do.
And what would Brian Boitano do,
He'd call all the kids in town,
And tell them to unite for true
That's what Brian Boitano would do.
When Brian Boitano travelled through time
To the year 3010,
He fought the evil robot kings
and saved the human race again
And when Brian Boitano built the pyramids,
He beat up Kubela Kong.
Cos Brian Boitano doesn't take s@~~ from an-e-y-body
So lets all get together,
And unite to stop our mom's
And we'll save Terrance and Phillip too,
Cos that's what Brian Boitano do.
And we'll save Terrance and Phillip too,
Cos that's what Brian Boitano dooooo,
That's what Brian Boitano do.
Who has the best looking babes is what I care about.That would be Brazil. ;)
I can't say your wrong per sey BUT from my personal experiance ISRAEL has the hottest women on the planet.
Now mind you I am 100% gay but even I was struck by the beauty of the women when I was in haifa, israel for two weeks.I didn't see any that were overweight,ugly, overly made-up or anything like that. I went pretty much all over the country visiting, rideing 4-wheelers,horseback rideing,hanging out at the malls and country clubs. as a FYI don't go swimming in their swimming pools and expect clorine they use formaldahyde as a cleaning agent. Not bad and very effective but a definate shock from what we as americans are used to.
I made two med cruises (I LOVE THE NAVY!!) and have been all over there from spain,croatia,malorca,italy,vatican city,etc etc and the women of isreal simply stand out as the most beatuiful. IMO.
3. It is, more so than any other nation, a melting pot of different cultures and traditions,...
My view, the US is not a melting pot, but instead is a stew. In a stew, each ingrediate flavors the others. Yet you can clearly identify most of the ingrediates.
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And yet when things go badly, who is it the rest of the world turns to for help?
I dunno, who did the Bosnians turn to when the Serbs were slaughtering and raping their way across the country?
Oh yeah, those cheese-eating surrender monkeys in France, who got censured and criticized for violating the gentleman's agreement to sit back and let it happen, passing the popcorn, because the aggressors were white Christians and the victims swarthy Moslems (political suicide to get involved, for us, anyway).
We sent aid to the victims of the Indonesian tsunami. Dozens of countries sent *us* aid during the aftermath of Katrina. It comes around, it goes around. My grandfather lived within 'have-to-shovel-ash-off-the-roof-before-it-collapses-from-the-weight' range of Mt. St. Helens, and he said the Canadians coming down to help with the cleanup were much appreciated in his area.
There are good people, and strong countries, all over this planet. There are obnoxious holier-than-thou 'my country, right or wrong' types in every nation as well, the vast majority of them being proud no-nothings who have never *chosen* to be residents of the country they inhabit, only being citizens because that's where their mother popped them out, and who would be just as mindlessly 'patriotic' had their mother been living in some country they claim to hate. Vladamir Putin and Kim Jong Il and Dick Cheney are the exact same person, spouting the exact same 'I am always right! Criticism of El Jefe is treason! Anyone who disagrees with me is not just wrong, but evil!' rhetoric, they just happen to have been born in different countries.
Immigrants, who have given up the only lives they knew and said goodbye to loved ones and left behind everything familiar and comforting, to take a chance to come to America, are the ones who have the most right to brag about how awesome America is, because they have perspective, and because they've sacrificed to be here. I was born here. I didn't sacrifice anything to be an American. I didn't make any hard anguished choices. It would be hollow (and untruthful) if I said that this country is automatically better than a bunch of places I've never even been to, and only seen on TV or read about in books.
It's just as pointless to mindlessly praise American 'specialness' as it is to blame America for everything, and yet there are people that do both (and, in some cases, do both at the same time, like Rush Limbaugh, proclaiming American as the great white hope in one sentence, and denouncing it as a cesspit that he can't wait to leave in the next).
I can't say that America is *best,* 'cause I don't have enough (or, any!) experience living in other countries to know that, but I can say that it can be a pretty f'ing awesome place to live.
New Hampshire, land of 'good fences make good neighbors' (which can be loosely translated as 'stay the hell out of my business, you nosy freak') is particularly cool.
like Rush Limbaugh, proclaiming American as the great white hope in one sentence, and denouncing it as a cesspit that he can't wait to leave in the next).
*sigh* Limbaugh said neither of those things. No offense Set but if you're going to keep typing these soapboxes based on taking cheap shots at conservatives, at least get the facts right.
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Ok I know I may not have the right to comment but. My dads family are all landed immigrants from Germany. They landed in the States in the 60's my grandfather served in the US military as did my grandmother did in the medical corps. My father served in the US military for a time and then met my mother while across border in Canada. The rest is history I was born and raised in Canada, but unlike some of the Canadian kids I was instilled with an exetremely healthy respect for america. I only lived in the US for 4 short years, and it just so happened I graduated in June of 2001 and moved to NYC to stay with an uncle while I was going to school. I witnessed some of the bravest people imaginable at that time. I saw a people that could pull together when it mattered. They may have stupid petty divided political b!$$+*+& between them, but when nothing else mattered they would step up anddo what needed to be done. So yeah I think the US is great. IMHO there are some social issues that need straightening out, but nothing that can't be fixed.I also don't belittle my home country of Canada for which I am also very proud of. Canada has a reputation for being peacekeepers, sending troops where they are needed, helping out the less fortunate and war torn despite the price, canadians are polite, and welcoming. But I also think given the same opportunity to be great they would and have in the past look at Canada's accomplishments in the World Wars. So no I don't think the US is better than every other country, but only because deep down I hope that when nothing else matters and your fellow man is in real desperation other people will stand up and do the right thing.
Who has the best looking babes is what I care about.That would be Brazil. ;)and when she passes,
each one she passes goes,
"aaaaaaaaaaah..."
Did you know that the Girl from Ipanema, the teenager named Helô Pinheiro that the song was based on, is now a 66 year old businesswoman living in Rio de Janeiro? She was featured in the Brazilian edition of Playboy in 1987 and 2003.
Fact of the day brought to you by Wikipedia.