I like to use tangible rewards for RP, like land, titles, loot, favors, clues, ect... I also give XP for RP but I just wanted to know how others encourage people to RP. When I give XP for Role Playing I give it even across the board. The reason for this being that if someone had something happen in their real life and don't feel like being that active, but still want to be with their friends, they should not fall behind the rest of the group. Also, sometimes RP is centered around one PC or one PC seems to hog a spotlight so this one person should not get ahead of the other players. This is why I give tangible rewards. When someone who is there just to roll sees the cool stuff their friends are getting they really get into the Role Playing. (works great for munchkins :) Just wondering what others did to push RP. Thoughts?
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I give equal XP for roleplaying to combat -- in fact, occassionally, more XP is given for roleplaying than combat.
At the end of each session I ask the Players what they did -- what cool combat stuff they did, what they learned about the NPCs or situations, what interesting, non-combat stuff they did, etc.
It serves as a good way to wrap up a session, tieing together loose ends and connecting the dots.
For the occassional Player who doesn't enjoy jumping into that kind of discussion, or if a Player has been distracted in-game for out-of-game, real-life problems, I'm fair and make sure it doesn't hurt the PC. (We all have an off night and some folks just aren't as assertive at the table as others, no problem.)
At the end of each session I ask the Players what they did -- what cool combat stuff they did, what they learned about the NPCs or situations, what interesting, non-combat stuff they did, etc.
It serves as a good way to wrap up a session, tieing together loose ends and connecting the dots.
Think I will start doing this I love the role playing side of this game and am willing to do alot to encourage it. Thanks for the idea.
For roleplaying I usually give an amount of XP that's usually half or more of what the party got that session. If everyone roleplayed well and we had a good time I tend to give out equal amounts for RP and combat.
Hyrum.
I use to give bonus XP for 'good role playing'. I began to feel it was unfair for players less comfortable trying to speak in character and such. I also want to keep a semblance of balance, which, admittedly, my system still fails at.
What I try to do is give in game rewards. NPCs respond to well played PCs, even if it does not appear to be to the character's advantage. I have found that people who really get into their character just enjoy the interaction. So if Mr. Snobby acts like a snob, the NPCs treat him like one.
Characters that act heroically and try to save innocents will find those innocents trying to help them later.
Another thing I believe is important is letting crazy schemes work. Even if they seem impractical, if you do not layer on all the penalties (which often discourages thinking outside the box), these are the moments that are remembered long after the game.
For me, and this is just my opinion, seeing the same tactic used over and over again (because it works) is just boring. If the players try to spice it up by doing something that is less tactically sound, I go with it and try not to shut it down with heavy penalties and harsh consequences.
Isn't roleplaying its own reward? </tongueincheek>
Yes, yes it is that is why I want to foster it where I can. :) I should have posted the question as such: How do you encourage non-combat Role Playing through a reward system? There are some players who seem to want combat, Alot of Combat, so that they can see their PC become more powerful. Just wanted to know how others encouraged this.
I do it by removing XP from the game. I rate their progress on the session as a whole, not individual events. So they don't have an incentive to kill every last rat to squeeze out that last bit of XP.
J
ust wanted to say that I have noticed that often your posts are thoughtful and helpfulI would just like to say thanks.
Since I don't use XP, I give Luck Points, of my own invention.
Luck points are worth 1d6 each that can be added or subtracted to any ally's roll, or subtracted from an enemy damage roll. They are usable ex post facto (unlike d20 action points) and once spent they are gone forever.
Players get one every time they level, and one for good role playing. I especially tend to award them when a player demonstrably avoids metagaming to their own detriment. Still, I only give them out occasionally compared to XP awards.
Since I keep a very tight rein on money and shopping in my campaign, careful roleplaying does end up being its own reward. Players get access to the equipment they want, sometimes at a discount, by cultivating relationships with NPCs.
I removed XP from my games a while ago so I've been having some issues with giving "direct" rewards for roleplaying. Playing in some games where roleplay was rewarded with xp always frustrated me personnally. It's quite hard to be fair when you hand out xp for roleplaying imo..
Playing a more quiet character actually made me level slower than the others and that got old pretty quick.
Roleplaying is really a group dependent thing. My current group doesn't need any incentive roleplay. Roleplaying advances the story, gives new clues, creates alliances..Basically, s!&# isn't getting done if they aren't interacting with npcs.
Some players are naturally more quiet than others and dangling a carrot on a stick doesn't actually work so it is more about adjusting the amount of roleplay to your group rather than trying to "force" roleplaying with rewards.
And great suggestion Evil Lincoln, I might just try that out.
Giving XP for "good roleplaying" is too arbitrary. I use the rules found in this PDF.
And great suggestion Evil Lincoln, I might just try that out.
The complete rule is here if you are interested. The exact wording has been pinned down over many sessions.
I would just like to say thanks.This is highly unusual. What is proper response? Ah, yes. *panics*
XD
It should not be. If we are to be a more civilized society then when someone does something good he should be thanked for that act of goodness. Sorry, studying Aristotle right now and I think he is bleeding into the rest of my life.
Giving XP for "good roleplaying" is too arbitrary. I use the rules found in this PDF.
Hmmm... this looks very similar to my method, I am curious what they have to say about it. There is no purchase button on the site you linked. Is this a free product? How might I go about perusing its contents?
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I have never understood giving a reward for good roleplaying...the player is doing as they're supposed to for the character as it was conceived. The character is gaining nothing from it, but the player is being "rewarded" with something that makes the character (who acted as they were supposed to) more powerful?
I used to give xp awards for good roleplaying. It encouraged players to roleplay. Now that isn't a concern anymore. They roleplay on a regular basis nowadays. The new players pick up on this soon enough and get into it too. So no more xp. Roleplaying does indeed seem to be its own reward. When players pipe up something like, "hey remember when you told the king… nah we don't need your magic gifts… and we beat the crap out of you afterward?" or "hey remember when you told the guard in Magepoint that you were Tenser and he said, 'Well, I know someone who has a few words for you'". …Memories.
Thanks Lincoln, I'll try to give it a go. I like the concept of it working on both PCs and NPCs rolls. It's a nice way to invalidate the out-of-the-blue crossbow critical hit from a random thug that terminates the group's squishies.
There's not too many dice rolling in my current game so I might have to be pretty conservative in handing them out.
Thanks Lincoln, I'll try to give it a go. I like the concept of it working on both PCs and NPCs rolls. It's a nice way to invalidate the out-of-the-blue crossbow critical hit from a random thug that terminates the group's squishies.
There's not too many dice rolling in my current game so I might have to be pretty conservative in handing them out.
My guideline is, if anybody has more than three luck points, my game isn't action-packed enough.
BTW, it doesn't stop player death, they just ratchet up the action as the player rolls each d6 individually to see if they live or die.
Hmmm... this looks very similar to my method, I am curious what they have to say about it. There is no purchase button on the site you linked. Is this a free product? How might I go about perusing its contents?
It's not for sale, but it's not free either. It is given to subscribers of Quid Novi?, the Spes Magna Games newsletter. Subscriptions cost an email address and the little bit of time needed to complete registration.
:)
It's not for sale, but it's not free either. It is given to subscribers of Quid Novi?, the Spes Magna Games newsletter. Subscriptions cost an email address and the little bit of time needed to complete registration.
Access to back issues?
Access to back issues?
They're archived. Subscribers receive the archive link.
Sold me.
Sold me.
Woo hoo!
:D
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You have to encourage roleplaying? J/k! ;)
Well, depending on the actions that a character takes they can gain access to more gold, equipment, and opportunities (such as the above mentioned titles, lands, and what-not). If someone decides that they don't really feel like roleplaying at the level of the rest of the group I won't punish them though. Positive reinforcement, ja noh.
You have to encourage roleplaying?
Yes with some of the newer players who only have experience with MMORPGS you need to encourage roleplaying. Not that these people are bad once they start it is just getting them going that seems to be a problem. I love the fact that so many new people are getting into the game it is just that I am very old school RP and want to show the joy of that to those who do not have that backgroud. Sometimes, espically with video game players they need a "reward" for doing something. Just wanted some new ways to reward people and help move the MMO/Final Fantasy/ Crono Trigger;Cross/ ECT... players into world of Role Playing.
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I like to use tangible rewards for RP, like land, titles, loot, favors, clues, ect... I also give XP for RP but I just wanted to know how others encourage people to RP. When I give XP for Role Playing I give it even across the board. The reason for this being that if someone had something happen in their real life and don't feel like being that active, but still want to be with their friends, they should not fall behind the rest of the group. Also, sometimes RP is centered around one PC or one PC seems to hog a spotlight so this one person should not get ahead of the other players. This is why I give tangible rewards. When someone who is there just to roll sees the cool stuff their friends are getting they really get into the Role Playing. (works great for munchkins :) Just wondering what others did to push RP. Thoughts?
Our DM has given extra XP via email for roleplaying, especially when its done off table.
That way know one knows who got what for what.
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Yes with some of the newer players who only have experience with MMORPGS you need to encourage roleplaying. Not that these people are bad once they start it is just getting them going that seems to be a problem. I love the fact that so many new people are getting into the game it is just that I am very old school RP and want to show the joy of that to those who do not have that backgroud. Sometimes, espically with video game players they need a "reward" for doing something. Just wanted some new ways to reward people and help move the MMO/Final Fantasy/ Crono Trigger;Cross/ ECT... players into world of Role Playing.You have to encourage roleplaying?
Oop, LOL, that was meant to be a joke. I'll edit the above.
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Besides the normal XP for roleplaying encounters, such as negotiating a truce, talking your way into the Baron's mansion by seducing his daughter/son, etc, etc. I use a mechanic I lifted from Shadowrun, the Player Award.
A (PA) is given by the Players to another Player for some significant action in the game. Now there are some basic categories that define the significant action and those keep players from just giving each other one every night.
The categories are:
- Overwhelming Bravery - showing uncharacteristic valor while risking dire peril.
- Extraordinary Drama/Comedy - Creating a scene that captivates the entire table or makes the whole group laugh so hard it hurts.
- Outrageous Luck - Not only attempting, but succeeding in a stunt so audacious it's deemed impossible.
- Fantastic Strategy/Tactic - coming up with the perfect plan, strategy, or tactic to win out a major encounter decisively.
- Impeccable Timing - using a the perfect skill, spell, item, or piece of in game knowledge in the right place at the right time.
This bonus is usually an XP award equal to an APL award, though in major storyline conclusions (final battle with major campaign arc villain) it could be twice that. These awards I've found are sufficient to encourage even my more passive players to push their boundaries in both RP and Combat encounters.
--Vrockefeller Center
Besides the normal XP for roleplaying encounters, such as negotiating a truce, talking your way into the Baron's mansion by seducing his daughter/son, etc, etc. I use a mechanic I lifted from Shadowrun, the Player Award.
A (PA) is given by the Players to another Player for some significant action in the game. Now there are some basic categories that define the significant action and those keep players from just giving each other one every night.
The categories are:[list]
Overwhelming Bravery - showing uncharacteristic valor while risking dire peril.
Extraordinary Drama/Comedy - Creating a scene that captivates the entire table or makes the whole group laugh so hard it hurts.
Outrageous Luck - Not only attempting, but succeeding in a stunt so audacious it's deemed impossible.
Fantastic Strategy/Tactic - coming up with the perfect plan, strategy, or tactic to win out a major encounter decisively.
Impeccable Timing - using a the perfect skill, spell, item, or piece of in game knowledge in the right place at the right time. This bonus is usually an XP award equal to an APL award, though in major storyline conclusions (final battle with major campaign arc villain) it could be twice that. These awards I've found are sufficient to encourage even my more passive players to push their boundaries in both RP and Combat encounters.
--Vrockefeller Center
Put it in the hands of the other players I like that. Going to use this in my next game thanks.
You could play Burning Wheel. :P
Though more seriously, adapting Burning Wheel's Artha system to Pathfinder. All characters are required to have three beliefs and three instincts, and when they play to those beliefs/instincts, they get action points or something. There's a thread on adapting it to 4e here.
Though more seriously, adapting Burning Wheel's Artha system to Pathfinder.
Great idea!
Gnome Stew’s Martin Ralya wrote regarding Rewarding Roleplaying, “Available for free by signing up for Spes Magna’s mailing list, I’ve read this PDF and found it quite enjoyable. It reminds me of Burning Wheel’s Artha system, which is a very good thing. In a nutshell: RR creates a system-neutral mechanic whereby players set their own roleplaying goals, and are rewarded for meeting them during play.”
:)
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It should not be. If we are to be a more civilized society then when someone does something good he should be thanked for that act of goodness. Sorry, studying Aristotle right now and I think he is bleeding into the rest of my life.
It occured to me I was rude in my first response despite the silliness of it. It is a wonderful thing to be complimented, and we really should see more of that.
So let me thank you for the kind words. I will strive to meet and exceed the standard of quality I have put forth so far. I'm not always serious, and I'm often abrasive, but I do try to only post when I have something worthwhile to say, facetious or not.
Thank you all for the opportunity to converse.
It occured to me I was rude in my first response despite the silliness of it. It is a wonderful thing to be complimented, and we really should see more of that.
I'm just here for the sodasnot and giggle fits.
…and to annoy Sebastian.
Sodasnot, giggle fits and annoying Sebastian, that is what I am here for.
…and to push Hero down everyone's throat.
Sodasnot, giggle fits, annoying Sebastian and pushing Hero. Yeah, that's pretty much what I am here for.
...and leg humping.
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Isn't roleplaying its own reward? </tongueincheek>
Kinda, yeah. I know that the players who get up to their elbows in plots and intrigues have the most fun in my Vampire games, and I don't have to give them squat. The ones who don't sit around waiting for me to hand them stuff, and don't have as much fun, because that particular game doesn't have combat-based XP rewards. (Although killin' folk is still an amazingly effective way to power up, as you scrabble to assimilate the resources, secure the properties, recruit the followers, snatch up the influences, etc. of the dearly departed.)
It's a different beast in D&D, but I still find that role-players don't need freebies, because that's not what they play for. Giving freebies just encourages the people who don't enjoy that sort of play a false incentive to pretend they like that sort of play, when it's not my job to dictate a playstyle to them, but to try and balance the sessions in such a way that the role-playing fans and everyone else has fun.
As a GM, I don't really see the benefit to bribing players to adopt a playstyle that doesn't already set fire to their imaginations.
That being said, there are times when the game is political, such as vampire (or some Eberron games), and there are times when it's a combat-fest of 'open door, kill monsters, rest, rinse, repeat' (World's Largest Orc and Pie, for instance). A player that wants to roleplay and interact with a vibrant community full of NPCs is going to be a sad panda in the latter case, and someone who is entirely focused on deepeearr is gonna actively disrupt the former sooner or later...
I borrow liberally from Exalted's stunt mechanics to encourage more descriptive storytelling during combats. Circumstance bonuses to hit and damage can be really nice for removing "I swing my mace at the Orc" from the game.
Out of combat roleplaying is rewarded by giving more spotlight time to the roleplayers. The more the player provides me with potential roleplaying hooks, the more I can incorporate the player's desires into the action of the story. Long term benefits could include romantic entanglements, cohorts (I tend to use organically acquired cohorts rather than leadership), increased secular/religious authority, favors, etc.
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I also tend to give small statistical bonuses for things that seem cool at the time. If someone decides that they want to move down the stairs and attack, that's fine. If they want to make an acrobatics check to slide down the banister as a charge... that's just awesome. If someone says "My character wants to meet girls/guys", that's fine. If they say "I attempt to woo the son/daughter of the overlord we enraged, very publically"... that's awesome. Anything that seems to add to description or the story is quite welcome.
I award action points for great roleplaying and even heroic actions. I use action point similar to those presented in Eberron. Except, I made it so that you gain a number of action points per gaming session (not per level) equal to your charisma modifier (minimum 1). But action points can only be used to influence any d20 roll you make.
I don't hand out too many, action points can greatly increase player survivability, but 1 or 2 per player over the course of the session is a good rule of thumb.
Beer.
I just fell a little bit in love with spamhammer. Go for single malt whiskey, and I'm yours for life.
:)
Kinda, yeah. I know that the players who get up to their elbows in plots and intrigues have the most fun in my Vampire games, and I don't have to give them squat. The ones who don't sit around waiting for me to hand them stuff, and don't have as much fun, because that particular game doesn't have combat-based XP rewards. (Although killin' folk is still an amazingly effective way to power up, as you scrabble to assimilate the resources, secure the properties, recruit the followers, snatch up the influences, etc. of the dearly departed.)
It's a different beast in D&D, but I still find that role-players don't need freebies, because that's not what they play for. Giving freebies just encourages the people who don't enjoy that sort of play a false incentive to pretend they like that sort of play, when it's not my job to dictate a playstyle to them, but to try and balance the sessions in such a way that the role-playing fans and everyone else has fun.
As a GM, I don't really see the benefit to bribing players to adopt a playstyle that doesn't already set fire to their imaginations.
That being said, there are times when the game is political, such as vampire (or some Eberron games), and there are times when it's a combat-fest of 'open door, kill monsters, rest, rinse, repeat' (World's Largest Orc and Pie, for instance). A player that wants to roleplay and interact with a vibrant community full of NPCs is going to be a sad panda in the latter case, and someone who is entirely focused on deepeearr is gonna actively disrupt the former sooner or later...
System matters.
A well-made system actively encourages the kind of play it's meant to support. D&D/PF? It's designed to encourage adventure. It's structured to reward adventuring with XP and swag. It doesn't say, "If you're playing D&D, you're supposed to want to adventure, so we won't even bother encouraging adventure."
So why in the world would it be a bad idea to do the same in a roleplaying game? What's so wrong about having a system that actually encourages roleplaying, rather than the traditional systems that often actually punish it? This is a roleplaying game after all, so what's wrong with the roleplaying actually being a part of the game?
This is one of the reasons Burning Wheel is such a fantastic game to pirate ideas from. It is a game designed to encourage roleplaying. It rewards roleplaying. It doesn't make the game and the roleplay enemies. It integrates them. The way to get ahead in the mechanical game is to roleplay your character.
Honestly, my "role-playing" rewards have always been on the "overly generous" side since way back in the AD&D days. I looked and initially found the tables of "bonus exp awards" and was fascinated. I ran the #'s however, and was less than inspired (ie: the rewards didn't quite scale well for my taste - a few hundred xp, or even only getting an extra 100 in many cases seemed insulting rather than rewarding).
So, in good out 'house rule' fashion, I whipped up some rewards that were more goal-oriented and those became major cap-stone awards (like quest completion) or something like that.
I've also gone with a lot of in-game consequences/rewards for play choices and the like.
Currently, I'm doing my best to just run everything off of a "marks" system with a 6 mark or so requirement to gain a level. Under that, I give out "marks" for role playing at about (at most) 1/2 of the total level cost. So ... of the 6 marks, fully 1/2 of that can come from just great role-playing, and I'm broad in how I award them:
*Creative/inventive plan or solution to a problem
*Playing in-appropriate manner and helping to progress game-plots
*Positive interactions (pc's or npc's)
*AMAZING contritbutions (map-making, journals, just a great set of lines or well-stated phrasing in-play).
For myself, I find that more direct challenges should be a part of the game (ie: really testing skills), but allowing 1/2 of the progression to be about the character and the story-progression is equally valid and so those that help and/or focus on that are always awarded for it in my games.