Help with feats for a Conjuring wizard


Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion


I am new to RPG and pathfinder so I am learning the basics
like a typical newb I chose a wizard instead of something easier but I love it so far
I am at lvl 3 and need help with picking feat
my DM told me to plan on reaching lvl15 by the end

my plan so far is this
1 scribe scroll spell; focus conjur, tough
3 improve init
5 augment summon conj, craft wand
7 extend spell
9 craft womderous item
10 quicken spell
11 empower spell
13 spell penetration
15 greater spell pen


Peter Montgomery wrote:

I am new to RPG and pathfinder so I am learning the basics

like a typical newb I chose a wizard instead of something easier but I love it so far
I am at lvl 3 and need help with picking feat
my DM told me to plan on reaching lvl15 by the end

my plan so far is this
1 scribe scroll spell; focus conjur, tough
3 improve init
5 augment summon conj, craft wand
7 extend spell
9 craft womderous item
10 quicken spell
11 empower spell
13 spell penetration
15 greater spell pen

Check out Treantmonk's Guide to Wizards. It's the best advice I can give and lets you review your options in a comprehensive manner. I'm no go good with links but just use the search function 'guide to wizards'. Good luck!

Shadow Lodge

Treantmonk's Guide to Wizards

Grand Lodge

Is it Pathfinder only, or can you draw feats, spells, and the like from 3.5 sourcebooks?

If so, I believe in Unearthed Arcana there's a character option that allows conjurers to cast summoning spells as a standard action instead of a full round action. Alternately, there's the Rapid Spell feat. Another useful feat is Imbue Summoning, which lets you apply one of your memorized buffs to creatures you summon.

As mentioned above, Treantmonk's Guide to Wizards is an excellent resource as well, and I also recommend checking it out.

Silver Crusade

First, Treant's guide rocks. I'll give you my thoughts up to 7th level, but from there, I suggest you read his (for optimization purposes). Further, I'm never convinced folks will live to 15th...

1st: Spell Focus: Conj, Improved Initiative, (mage bonus feat).

Get rid of Toughness and go with Improved Initiative. I know Treat endorses Toughness, but imo your goal is to stay off the front lines. Short term, it seems good, but long term, its usefulness scales down dramatically. If you need extra hit points, put the point from your favored class (wizard) each level to hit points. However, if you're determined to take it, make sure you take it by 3rd level as you lose out on some hit points taking it later.

Improved Initiative is a must as he who goes first will usually dictate how the battle goes. Hold off on Augment Summoning as (right now) durations won't be long enough to make it worth a whole lot. In any case, take Spell Focus Conj. to set yourself up to get Augment Summoning.

3rd: Augment Summoning.

A must for a conjurer, and your durations will be good enough now to make it necessary.

5th: Combat Casting, Extend Spell.

I used to think Combat Casting sucked, but in Pathfinder, defensive casting is tougher than older editions (15 + x2 spell level). If you have an enemy in front of you, you can't afford to get hit casting, and you may not be able to take that 5' step. +4 helps a lot.

For your mage bonus feat, I'm NOT a fan of Craft Wands because you can just buy them. Extend spell will make quite a few of your buff spells last longer, and that is a good one to take since it takes up 1 slot higher.

7th: Improved Familiar.

The critters on this list (espeically mephits) rock. They do. They can use magic items, cast some spells.

From thereon out, I wouldn't worry about Crafting stuff (maybe Wondrous Items as they form the largest group and have so many purposes). Depending on your spells, you may or may not take Spell Penetration (if you don't use spells that target your enemies, such as Summon Monsters, etc., then don't worry about it).


Peter Montgomery wrote:

I am new to RPG and pathfinder so I am learning the basics

like a typical newb I chose a wizard instead of something easier but I love it so far
I am at lvl 3 and need help with picking feat
my DM told me to plan on reaching lvl15 by the end

my plan so far is this
1 scribe scroll spell; focus conjur, tough
3 improve init
5 augment summon conj, craft wand
7 extend spell
9 craft womderous item
10 quicken spell
11 empower spell
13 spell penetration
15 greater spell pen

I think it looks pretty solid.

You'd have another 15th level wizard feat available unless you are taking a PRC.

Personally I'd probably try to squeeze in Defensive Combat Training and/or Combat Casting, but thats just me. I probably wouldn't worry with spell penetration as a conjurer since most conjuration and summoning spells don't need to worry about SR. Same reason why Spell focus isn't too big a deal for conjurers (except as a prereq for Augment Summoning) Not that penetration isn't a good feat, I just don't think you would get much mileage out of it if you do what conjurers typically do.

Oh be sure to put at least a few ranks into linguistics and pick up some of the planar languages so you can communicate better with your summons, especially elemental languages for the elementals.

Oh something else to consider, that I guess all spellcasters need to think about now. Since the item crafting rules allow you to create things that you don't meet all the prereqs for, this makes metamagic rods much more viable. And the low level ones are really inexpensive as far as magic items go. The reason I'm pointing this out here is that I'm not sure what all empower is going to do for you as a conjurer. What spells are you planning on using it with? If they aren't really high level spells then taking Craft Rod instead and making a rod of empower might be a better idea. The Rod also makes empowered summons feasible; doing it without a rod isn't worth the lost levels on the spell.


A lot depends on how many meatshields are between you and the enemies. I think some conjurer builds could be successful with Spell Focus (Conjuration), Augment Summon and a Toad Familiar (functionally equivalent to toughness until 3rd level) at 1st level but I think the general consensus is that toughness and improved init are good initial choices for a human.

I know it's tempting to get quicken as soon as you can but a quickened 1st level spell is not that great of an action for a 10th level wizard (who probably only has a three 5th level slots). In general I'd rather have a Summon Monster V, Wall of Force or Teleport prepared than a quickened 1st level spell. It's incredibly expensive but a lesser quicken metamagic rod is somewhat reasonable at this level.

Really investing to much in metamagic and item creation beyond the 4 bonus feat slots isn't that useful. Extend is useful early on and Quicken is really nice at end game. Wondrous Item is definitely worthwhile and Craft wand can be useful if purchasing wands is out of the question. If wands are going to be commercial available it's worthwhile saving that feat and going for craft staff or craft armor/weapons instead.


M P 433 wrote:

Get rid of Toughness and go with Improved Initiative. I know Treat endorses Toughness,

I like both feats. Can he fit both in? I think with a bit of maneuvering I think he can.

If he skips craft wand at level 5 - then he can take SF and Augment at level 5, and can fit in toughness at level 1 or 3 (and improved init in the other)

I agree with Improved familiar...nice feat.


Peter Montgomery wrote:


my plan so far is this
1 scribe scroll spell; focus conjur, tough
3 improve init
5 augment summon conj, craft wand
7 extend spell
9 craft womderous item
10 quicken spell
11 empower spell
13 spell penetration
15 greater spell pen

Find out what your DM plans in the way of access to magical items.

Extend spell is something better found via metamagic rods than using up higher level slots.

Craft wand is alright, but staves are much better than wands.

You should also ask what, if any, PrC (prestige classes) are available to you as many have feat requirements should you choose to look at them.

If you are going with craft wondrous then I would get it earlier and use it earlier. But in general craft feats should be party shared (there's little need for say both you AND the party cleric to have craft wondrous for example).

I forget, does quickdraw no longer apply to wands in pathfinder?

-James


Thank you for the great advice
my group has 2 meat sheilds a rogue and a cleric
plus a halfling bard whose idea of role playing reality is to run and hide during every fight
very funny actually

so I am going to focus on conjur and battlefield control and some rebuffing
I will let the cleric craft and save crafting feats for staves


Please tell me more about up grade on the familiar
can they wear a wear wonderous items that hep the wizard and the group?

Liberty's Edge

Improved Familiar lets you choose a new, more powerful familiar.

look at the options listed in the feat and check out the bestiary for what they can do.

In summary, you can get a Mephit (elemental critter), Imp (devil), or quasit (demon). There are other options, but these are the reason the feat is good. All of these, while being outsiders, are humanoid in shape, capable of speech, and have arms and hands. This lets them use wands and staves. Do yourself a favor, pick up the Use Magic Device skill, and let him double your actions every single round.

Grand Lodge

Peter Montgomery wrote:

Please tell me more about up grade on the familiar

can they wear a wear wonderous items that hep the wizard and the group?

The use of spell trigger and spell completion items (like wands and scrolls) will require you to have Use Magic Device, since they are not actual arcane casters themselves. On the other hand, because quasits/imps/mephits are basically humanoid in shape, they can wear pretty much all of the body slot items that other creatures cannot (boots, gauntlets, bracers, amulets, shirts, cloaks, etc.). So rather than selling that amulet that no one else is using, give it to your familiar! You can also craft or acquire items that would specifically benefit your familiar and its role in your party.

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