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I completely disagree. The only reason that mind flayers have the recognition you talk about is because WotC and TSR before them spent a LOT of energy BUILDING that level of recognition. In the 1st edition era, both mind flayers and intellect devourers had about hte same level of recognition, but since the poor intellect devourers always got secondary status as monsters, it seems, after 1st edition while Mind Flayers regularly got books and adventures about them, and continued to do so into 3rd edition while the intellect devourer got regulated to the psionics ghetto. I'm sure that given an equal amount of time (15 years or more) intellect devourers can be developed into an equally major role.
I'd love to see a good illustration of an Intellect Devourer trying to pry open a victim's mouth like the Alien Face-Hugger.
I'd love to see a good illustration of an Intellect Devourer trying to pry open a victim's mouth like the Alien Face-Hugger.
Aye.
I wouldn't call "Into the Darklands" a "secondary" Chronicles book... ... In any event, as with all of our books, all of the crunch (including the stats for the seugathi) are completely open content.
My phrasing was poor, I admit. It seems like it will be one of the primary Chronicles books to me, actually. What I meant was, for people who are not running in Golarion, it's a secondary, Chronicles book, as opposed to a primary, core book ... and if there's going to be a "Pathfinder iconic" creature, it should be in the core books.
As for intellect devourers ... they're creepy, but there's no way to put one into an adventure and evoke the response a mind flayer would. It's like trying to replace beholders (which we've also lost) with retrievers ... the recognition isn't there.
I completely disagree. The only reason that mind flayers have the recognition you talk about is because WotC and TSR before them spent a LOT of energy BUILDING that level of recognition ...
But that's exactly my point. That recognition is there. I'd be pleased as punch to help create the same recognition for a Pathfinder creature, as I'm no fan of WoTC, but it's going to take time and effort.
I think what we need is some kick-ass Wayne K. Reynolds pictures of intellect devourers and seugathi ... and a catchy common name for seugathi like ... well .. I have no idea like what, because I don't know anything about them :)
I also assume it's not OGL since I can't find it on either of the PRD sites, which makes it a non-ideal candidate.
Paizo is actually very good about making content open in their products. For Into the Darklands:
Product Identity, as defined in the Open Game License version 1.0a, Section 1(e), and are not Open Content: All trademarks, registered trademarks, proper names (characters, deities, artifacts, places, etc.), dialogue, plots, storylines, language, incidents, locations, characters, artwork, and trade dress.
and
Except for material designated as Product Identity (see above), the stat blocks, hazards, Bestiary, and other game mechanics of this Paizo Publishing game product is Open Game Content, as
defined in the Open Gaming License version 1.0a Section 1(d).
So, the seugathi (which is not a proper name as defined for Product Identity) are good to go as OGC. The reason you don't find them in the PRD is because Into the Darklands was released prior to PRPG and so the stats are for 3.5 and no official conversion to PRPG has been released as yet...
I think what we need is some kick-ass Wayne K. Reynolds pictures of intellect devourers and seugathi ... and a catchy common name for seugathi like ... well .. I have no idea like what, because I don't know anything about them :)
"Mind worms" perhaps, since they look like this...
There was a conversation on how to make the Intellect Devourer more creepy the Intellect Devourer Workshop
I've always thought that Reaper had a cool idea with the Bathalians.
Creative Director
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My phrasing was poor, I admit. It seems like it will be one of the primary Chronicles books to me, actually. What I meant was, for people who are not running in Golarion, it's a secondary, Chronicles book, as opposed to a primary, core book ... and if there's going to be a "Pathfinder iconic" creature, it should be in the core books.
I agree. Which is why the intellect devourer is in the Bestiary.
As for intellect devourers ... they're creepy, but there's no way to put one into an adventure and evoke the response a mind flayer would.
Have you ever played Half-Life? Think of intellect devourers as headcrabs -- darn creepy and very deadly to an unprepared party.
Or like CJ suggested, the Facehuggers from the Aliens movie.
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As for intellect devourers ... they're creepy, but there's no way to put one into an adventure and evoke the response a mind flayer would.
Oh god, I so disagree. Can you imagine the horror people would feel if they fought an assailant (preferably someone previous known to them, who is now suddenly aggressive for no good reason?), and defeated it...
...only to then see the corpse split open with a wet squishy sound as the Intellect Devourer leaves its "shell"? I wouldn't play up the "Aliens" facehugger as much I would the "Aliens" egg 'hatching'. The party is going to be overwhelmed with so many sensations -- freaking out at the sudden gory appearance of this very strange creature, freaking out at the revelation that their friend got hollowed out for this thing to wear as a skin...
Oh no, I think these things can be very scary indeed. It's "Invasion of the Body Snatchers", totally. I mean, these things shrink down and eat your brain from the inside
*shivers*
Anyway, we'll see. I've decided to introduce an Intellect Devourer scenario just like that into my game soon.
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Creative Director
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As for intellect devourers ... they're creepy, but there's no way to put one into an adventure and evoke the response a mind flayer would.Have you ever played Half-Life? Think of intellect devourers as headcrabs -- darn creepy and very deadly to an unprepared party.
Or like CJ suggested, the Facehuggers from the Aliens movie.
Both great examples. There's more, though; check out the old movie "Fiend Without a Face." It's a REALY creepy movie about an experiment that generates brain-shaped monsters that have their own mobility and agenda.
All of the Body Snatcher movies are great examples too; in fact, using "Invasion of the Body Snatchers" as a campaign inspiration makes for a REALLY cool idea for using intellect devourers. In fact... that may or may not be an idea I'm already using in a campaign I'm running, but I'm kinda being hush-hush about that because I don't want the players to catch on too soon...
I think to give these two creatures more reconition maybe Paizo could do a module with them as the main villains
I think to give these two creatures more reconition maybe Paizo could do a module with them as the main villains
Soooo ......
Any of those top 32 RPG Superstar folks listening out there? :-)
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Creative Director
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I think to give these two creatures more reconition maybe Paizo could do a module with them as the main villainsSoooo ......
Any of those top 32 RPG Superstar folks listening out there? :-)
It's worth keeping in mind that if you pick a monster to write an adventure about and that monster HAPPENS to be the pet monster of a Paizo employee... it can actually be MORE difficult to get your adventure or whatever accepted since we're not above being protective and precious with our favorites. :)
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The Iconic Bestiary has the Phrenic Scourge. Of course it will need to be Pathfinderized as it was written for 3.5
Hit Dice: 8d8+8 (44 hp)
Initiative: +3
Speed: 30 ft. (6 squares), burrow 15 ft., climb 30 ft.
Armor Class: 16 (+3 Dex, +3 natural), touch 13, flat-footed 13
Base Attack/Grapple: +6/+6
Attack: Tendril cluster +9 melee (1d8 plus implant)
Full Attack: 2 tendril clusters +9 melee (1d8 plus implant)
Space/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft.
Special Attacks: Implant, psionics, sap will
Special Qualities: Compress, damage reduction
5/bludgeoning or slashing, spell resistance 25, telepathy 100 ft.
Saves: Fort +3, Ref +5, Will +9
Abilities: Str 10,Dex 16,Con 12, Int 19,Wis 17, Cha 15
Skills: Bluff +10, Climb +8, Concentration +14, Diplomacy +6, Disguise +2 (+4 acting), Hide +11, Intimidate +8, Knowledge (any) +12, Listen +11, Move Silently +11, Sense Motive +7, Spot +11
Feats: Iron Will, Skill Focus (Concentration), Weapon Finesse
Environment: Underground or temperate plains
Organization: Solitary, pair, brood (3–5), or hoard (3–5 plus servants, in any combination of duergar, gnolls, troglodytes, or similar humanoids)
Challenge Rating: 8
Treasure: Double standard
Alignment: Usually lawful evil
Advancement: By character class
Level Adjustment: +8
The so-called phrenic scourge is a walking nightmare, a writhing horror with an inhuman appearance and alien thought-patterns utterly incomprehensible to humans. They view other sentient creature as nothing more than slaves and breeding chambers, and they have assimilated entire communities in the distant wilds, and deep beneath the earth. They maintain order with their psionic abilities, turning even the most rebellious subjects into loyal thralls.
Even the race’s true name — the ochthichthuruch — is almost unpronounceable by humans. The phrenic scourge is made up entirely of thin tendrils, ranging in length from six inches to four feet, clustered around a tiny core that serves as the creature’s nerve center. They prefer to hold themselves upright, maintaining a vaguely humanoid shape through muscular control. Whether this is simply a cultural tradition on their part, or actually a physiological imperative, is unclear. Most scourges prefer to garb themselves in dark robes. With the hoods and sleeves pulled low, it’s possible for a scourge to briefly pass itself off as human, at least from a distance.
A phrenic scourge usually stands anywhere from 5 to 6 feet in height, though it’s capable of changing its overall dimensions. It weighs roughly three-quarters as much as a human of the same height. Phrenic scourges speak their own language, Common, and Undercommon, but they prefer to communicate telepathically. A phrenic scourge can communicate telepathically with any creature within 100 feet that has a language.
Combat
Phrenic scourges prefer to hang back out of melee, battering foes with their psionic abilities, or sending thralls to fight in their stead. When facing weaker or lone foes, however, they close and attempt to lash the victim with their tendrils, in hopes of implanting him with larvae and breeding a new scourge.
Compress (Ex): Although they normal stand as humanoid, phrenic scourges are not bound to that form. By shifting and relaxing their tendrils, they can thin themselves out, or flatten themselves into a mass of writhing limbs no thicker than a snake. As a full-round action, a phrenic scourge can pass through a space as narrow as two or three inches in one dimension, as long as it’s at least a foot or more in the other dimension. For instance, a scourge could fit through a hole that was two inches by 14 inches, but not one two inches by four inches.
Implant (Ex): The tips of a phrenic scourge’s tendrils constantly die and regrow, much like a human’s fingernails. In any round in which the scourge successfully strikes the same victim with both tendril attacks, the tip of a tendril breaks off in the flesh and begins to burrow, unless the victim succeeds on a DC 15 Fortitude save. The larva burrows through the host, following its nervous system until it reaches the brain. This takes 1d4+1 rounds, causing 2d4 points of damage per round. When the larvae reaches the brain, the subject dies instantly. At any point in this process, the larvae can be destroyed with remove disease or heal.This power does not function against constructs, elementals, oozes, plants, or undead, and is not instantly fatal to foes with multiple heads.
Note that any creature with natural regeneration or fast healing resists the effects of the implanted larva. The larva is not expelled, but neither can it proceed to the brain. It does continue to cause damage every round, however, as it tries to burrow (assuming the damage it causes exceeds the fast healing or regeneration, of course).This continues until the larva is destroyed, as above, or until 2d10+1 rounds have passed, at which point they die on their own.
Psionics (Sp): At will—charm monster (DC 17), deep slumber (DC 16), detect thoughts (DC 15), suggestion (DC 16), teleport. Effective caster level 9th. The save DCs are Intelligencebased, due to the scourge’s psionic nature.
Sap Will (Sp): This psionic attack manifests as a 20-ft.-radius sphere, which the scourge can center anywhere within 30 ft. (A common tactic is to center the ability on itself, as a scourge is immune to its own sap will ability.) Anyone caught in this sphere must succeed on a DC 18 Will save or lose the will to act for 3d4 rounds. They may defend themselves if attacked, but may not initiate any action. They lose any Dexterity-bonus to Armor Class. Phrenic scourges often use this power to take out groups of enemies at once, or to hunt for victims they can make into slaves or breeding chambers. This ability is the equivalent of a 4thlevel spell. The save DC is Intelligence-based.
Phrenic Scourge Society
Phrenic scourges do not form cities of their own race. Rather, they insinuate themselves into existing communities, both underground and on the surface. They begin by making the community’s leaders into thralls, and then spread out among the populace. More than a few communities have been conquered by the ochthichthuruch, without any outsiders the wiser. Once they have assimilated a community, the scourges often direct them to war against other communities, in hopes of expanding their territories.
In the center of any conquered community, the phrenic scourges maintain a literal stable of humanoids intended entirely for breeding purposes. The scourges mentally enslave every one of the community’s inhabitants, as soon as they exist in sufficient numbers to do so.
The ochthichthuruch’s breeding cycle is simple and invasive. The larvae formed by their tendril tips burrow through the host to the brain. The brain is instantly slain, and then slowly consumed as the larva grows. Once the brain is entirely digested, the growing scourge starts to feed on the rest of the host’s body.This entire process requires roughly a month; after this time, the (presumably rotting) body suddenly erupts with tendrils, bursting open. The new scourge crawls from the shattered body and stands upright, fully intelligent and in possession of all its racial abilities. Sages postulate that the scourges actually consume the memories and intelligence of the subject, as well as the physical aspects of the brain. Because their thought processes are so alien, the scourge cannot access the victim’s specific memories, such as identity or class abilities, but it does obtain general knowledge, such as the basic facts of the world. This allows the young scourge to function until it first makes telepathic contact with another member of its species; doing so instantly transfers the remainder of the knowledge it needs.
Although they have an innate desire to dominate other creatures, phrenic scourges do not normally struggle with one another. They are very cooperative amongst themselves, and seem to possess the first rudiments of a hive mind.
Phrenic Scourges as Characters
Phrenic scourges almost always advance as psions, sorcerers or wizards. Phrenic scourge characters possess the following racial traits.
• +6 Dexterity, +2 Constitution, +8 Intelligence, +6 Wisdom, +4 Charisma.
• A phrenic scourge has a base land speed of 30 feet, a burrow speed of 15 feet, and a climb speed of 30 feet.
• Darkvision out to 60 feet.
• Racial Hit Dice: A phrenic scourge begins with eight levels of aberration, which provide 8d8 Hit Dice, a base attack bonus of +6, and base saving throw bonuses of Fort +2, Ref +2, and Will +6.
• Racial Skills: A phrenic scourge’s aberration levels give it skill points equal to 11 x (2 + Int modifier). Its class skills are Bluff, Concentration, Hide, Intimidate, Knowledge (any), Listen, Move Silently, and Spot.
• Racial Feats: A phrenic scourge’s aberration levels give it three feats.
• +3 natural armor bonus.
• Special Attacks (see above): Implant, psionics, sap will.
• Special Qualities (see above): Compress, damage reduction 5/bludgeoning or slashing, spell resistance equal to 25 + class levels, telepathy 100 ft.
• Automatic Languages: Common, Ochthichthuruch, Undercommon. Bonus Languages: Abyssal, Draconic, Dwarven, Gnome, Goblin, Infernal, Terran.
• Favored Class: Psion (or wizard, if the psionics rules are not being used).
• Level Adjustment: +8.
Okay, I did my conversion anyway, and it's a bit different than the above, so I'm posting it anyway. 8^)
I started out by just converting the 3.5 epic version. (If just 'cause I'm probably going to eventually anyway.)
Then I reduced its hit dice, size, ability scores, special abilities, etc. until it looked pretty good for a non-epic challenge. (Taking inspiration from its historic [BECMI] presentation. Hence no incorporeal, etc.) I estimated the CR using the Bestiary guidelines, but it could probably use some playtesting to make sure...
I also added in some flavor of my own. Please let me know what you think.
I like this critter, but with the 12th level sorcerer spell-casting ability, it seems like it might be a bit tougher than a CR8 monster. Maybe, possibly.
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I like this critter, but with the 12th level sorcerer spell-casting ability, it seems like it might be a bit tougher than a CR8 monster. Maybe, possibly.I estimated the CR using the Bestiary guidelines, but it could probably use some playtesting to make sure...
I also added in some flavor of my own. Please let me know what you think.
I could easily see that, though I'd like to have some actual playtest evidence before changing it. (I was trying to keep the mechanic in line with the epic version, but using the number from the original game's version.)
I could switch it to something even more like the original: One SLA per brain. Would that be better?
Edit: P.S. Thanks for the praise, and the constructive criticism! 8^)
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I could easily see that, though I'd like to have some actual playtest evidence before changing it. (I was trying to keep the mechanic in line with the epic version, but using the number from the original game's version.)
Options could include;
1) Gaining a level of Sorcerer equal to the biggest brain stored, plus a smaller percentage for lesser brains (+1 level for every 4 or 5 levels of other Sorcerer / Wizard brains stored).
2) Gaining a level of Sorcerer equal to the biggest brain stored, plus some extra spell slots (and a ton of extra spells known!) for extra brains.
3) Having one's own effective Sorcerer (or Wizard?) level, unaffected by brains held, but gaining bonus spells known from the 'backup brains' and perhaps some bonus spell slots, at the cost of *permanantly* expending slots known by the stored brains (warranting occasional shopping trips for replacements, as one is forced to expend energy stolen from unwilling donors). Stored brains don't regenerate spells expended, in other words. Perhaps also a caster level bonus based on a fraction of the levels of brains available, that doesn't grant access to higher level spells, but does allow for longer durations, etc.
I think I like 3 best.