The first thing that comes to my mind: does Kirth live in his Mom's basement?
Kirth got booted out of the house 3 days after graduating from High School.
Bella Sara Charter Superscriber
|
I think we need to add the phrase "to be dingo'd" to the Paizo lexicon. I'd go with something like:
"To take a post from yellow dingo seriously and respond with the amount of anger and vitriol which might otherwise be appropriate if the OP was someone other than yellow dingo."
Then, whenever someone is dingo'd, we can all jump out and shout "you been dingo'd!"
I ran screaming out the door.
|
Regarding this Boskop man thing. Smells fishy to me. I call BS. You been had, dingo. 214 IQ. LOL. And I'm Bill Gates.Dude, you recycled my link.Black Holes expand forward and Backward through time from point of origin.
Damn right 214 IQ. If I'm the only one who can solve that, you are in a lot of poop.
I know, coz you got flim flam scammed by the Piltdown Man.
|
|
In reading this thread, I recalled something I once read about Anatole France, a prominent writer:
The most we can say about brain size and intelligence is that by and large, all other things being equal, people who have larger brains tend to have slightly higher I.Q.'s than people with smaller brains. (I.Q. stands for intelligence quotient; it's a standard measure of intellectual ability.) But a lot of things have to be taken into account. For example, when you compare brain size, you really have to compare brain size relative to body mass. It's not reasonable to expect a 5'1", 100-pound woman to have the same size brain as a 6'6", 280-pound man. You have to ask the question: Is this person's brain larger or smaller than you might expect, given his or her body mass?
Even then, the relationship between brain size and intelligence is pretty weak, and there are lots of exceptions. Anatole France, a French author, had one of the tiniest "normal" brains on record, but he was certainly no dummy. On the other extreme, Jonathan Swift (the author of Gulliver's Travels) had a big honkin' brain, at the top end of all the brains ever measured (though still only twice the size of Anatole France's). Does that mean Swift was the smartest man who ever lived? He was certainly a bright guy, but it's hard to get behind any statement so extreme.
Here is another link on brain size, particularly in regards to Anatole France and Jonathan Swift:
Brain WeightThen there’s the celebrated French intellectual Anatole France. He was obviously very intelligent. But we have it on the authority of Scientific American (SciAm.com) that his brain was but 2/3rds the normal size – about equal to Homo erectus (who we’ve yet to come on to). Another website claims that the author Jonathan Swift (of Gulliver fame) had a huge brain; twice the size of Anatole’s. Swift was clearly very intelligent too, but I’ve seen no suggestion that he was significantly brighter than Anatole.
Another reference I found came up with a list of brain sizes for a few people -- several of whom had brains of the same size or smaller than Boskop Man. (I found this referenced at Tom McMahon: The Relationship Between Brain Size And Intelligence but had to hunt for the current relevant link.
Illustrated Encyclopedia of Human Anatomic Variation: Opus III: Nervous System : Brain
It has been reported that the brain of Anatole France (French writer and Nobel Laureate) weighed 1040 gms. The brain weights (in grams) of some other notable individuals are: Ivan Turgenieff, (Russian novelist, dramatist, and short story writer) 2012; Georges Léopold Chrétien Cuvier (French zoologist and geologist) 1830; John Abercrombie, 1786; William Makepeace Thackeray (English novelist) 1658; Immanuel Kant (German metaphysician, philosopher) 1600; Spurzheim, 1559; Dirichlet, 1520; Daniel Webster, (American statesman, lawyer, and orator) 1518; Leonhard Fuchs (German physician and botanist) 1500; Alex Agassiz (Swiss-American zoologist and geologist) 1495; Karl Friedrich Gauss (German mathmatician and Astronomer) 1491; Hermann Ludwig Helmholz (German scientist, physicist, biologist, physician and philosopher) 1440; Baron Guillaume Dupuytren (French surgeon) 1437; Dante Alighieri (Italian poet) 1420; Freiherr von der Colmar Goltz (Prussian general and military historian) 1395; Baron von Justus Liebig (German Chemist) 1352; Friedrich Tiedemann (German physician and anatomist) 1253; Albert Einstein (Physicist) 1230; Baron George Eugène Hausmann (French civil official and city planner) 1225; and - Gall (Scientist) 1198.
From what I have read, most human brains weigh between 1200 and 1400 grams.
As a courtesy, I added links on Anatole France and Jonathan Swift. (Gulliver's Travels would be a great source for a campaign. It is also a great example of a work that can be read on multiple levels -- which is how I often peruse religious works. As a person who believes in a particular faith and science as well, I have no problem reconciling my beliefs. Literalism is only one approach to reading a religious work. The same literal approach would miss much of the significance of Swift's work, particularly the social satire. I think we can give the writers of Scripture, let alone the Eternal if we chose to believe in divinity, at least the same degree of sophistication as Jonathan Swift.) I think that you could probably glean some ideas from Anatole France as well, particularly The Rebellion of the Angels.
So, in regards to the original topic, I see very little evidence based on some preliminary research that "Boskop Man" was smarter than other humans. The people cited in the article on brain size made use of their gifts for the betterment of the world -- whether through the arts, sciences or in other ways. What matters, I believe, is the good use that we make of our intelligence, creativity, and other gifts. I think that is the measure of greatness.
(Sorry for such a rambling post, but I have a love for research.)
RPG Superstar 2009 Top 8
|
You've been talking about this for two days and no one has even asked whether Boskops will be a playable race. Shame on you.THAT'S cause
for my game
** spoiler omitted **
Okay, I won't tell.
Are you give them yellowdingo-level adjustments to Int (with a Charisma penalty?) or giving them some kind of psionic powers? What did they do with those big brains? Maybe they're just exceptionally wise.
Kirth I then ask your help for a world design Idea I have, I would rather not thread jack so we can either use email or another thread. That is if you don't mind.
No; I'm happy to help. Go ahead and start a thread, maybe under Community Content - Suggestions/Houserules/Homebrew. I'll keep an eye out for it.
I wonder if an illithid would react to some of these posts as follows?
"All those delicious brains, wasted!!"
Well, since we're not sure just why they became extinct, maybe the comment would be more on the lines of "Yum. They were delicious!" or maybe "I tried, but I couldn't eat just one!"
|
|
Kirth I then ask your help for a world design Idea I have, I would rather not thread jack so we can either use email or another thread. That is if you don't mind.No; I'm happy to help. Go ahead and start a thread, maybe under Community Content - Suggestions/Houserules/Homebrew. I'll keep an eye out for it.
I have done so.
|
|
Well, since we're not sure just why they became extinct, maybe the comment would be more on the lines of "Yum. They were delicious!" or maybe "I tried, but I couldn't eat just one!"I wonder if an illithid would react to some of these posts as follows?
"All those delicious brains, wasted!!"
I was referring more to the brain weights of scientists and authors -- an illithid would consider weighing brains to be a waste. (Of course, as a player I came up with a few creative insults for illithids to use in combat -- such as stating that their brains would make good dog food. Never actually tried it, but it might be considered cruel -- to the dog. That and cleaning up the mess afterwards might be a nuisance.)
Based on the evidence, it seems that Bokop Man never truly existed as a distinct species or subspecies. Mind you, I think the concept might be useful for games.
What is remarkable is what early humans were able to accomplish in terms of tools and technologies and in how like us they were. (One article I came across on early humans showed evidence that a child with disabilities was taken care of for some 10 years -- some 530,000 years ago.)
Also, I don't think dingo typifies atheists.
I don't think dingo typifies any group he happens to belong too.
For the record, the IQ scale only goes up to 200 and the higest ever recorded adult IQ was 186.
Dang. I was off by one.
Betcha it's a woman that holds the title.
For the record, the IQ scale only goes up to 200 and the higest ever recorded adult IQ was 186.
Nice.
|
RPG Superstar 2009 Top 8
|
For the record, the IQ scale only goes up to 200 and the higest ever recorded adult IQ was 186.
Also, IQ tests have to be rejigged every couple of decades. Boskop would probably have bombed on our IQ tests unless he played a lot of Grand Theft Auto. Secondly, without knowing how Boskop's brain was wired, it's hard to predict how he would have done on that limited range of intelligence measured by IQ tests. Maybe he had a great sense of movement and could blow us all away with his interpretive dance routines but really bit at that whole 'remember where you left your nuts' and 'guess what the weather will be like tomorrow' stuff. Maybe that's why he died.
Any thoughts on why we dont like to talk about the Human Species that was smarter than our own?
|
|
The Highest IQs On Record
People Still Alive
Physicist / Engineer Kim Ung-yong has a verified IQ of 210
Bouncer Christopher Michael Langan has a verified IQ of 195
Engineer Philip Emeagwali is alleged to have an IQ of 190
World Chess Champion Garry Kasparov is alleged to have an IQ of 190
Author Marilyn Vos Savant has a verified IQ of 186
Actor James Woods is alleged to have an IQ of 180
Politician John H. Sununu is alleged to have an IQ of 180
Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu is alleged to have an IQ of 180
Mathematician Andrew Wiles is alleged to have an IQ of 170
World Chess Champion Judith Polgar is alleged to have an IQ of 170
Chess Grandmaster Robert Byrne is alleged to have an IQ of 170
World Chess Champion Bobby Fischer is alleged to have an IQ of 167
Mathematician / Physicist Stephen W. Hawking is alleged to have an IQ of over 160
Microsoft Founder Paul Allen is alleged to have an IQ of over 160
Actress Sharon Stone is alleged to have an IQ of 154
and for perspective:
190 – Sir Isaac Newton
190 – Franscois-Marie Arouet (Voltaire)
180 – Leonardo da Vinci
171 – Blaise Pascal
170 – Martin Luther
165 – Galileo Galilei
165 – Johann Sebastian Bach
165 – Ludwig van Beethoven
162 – Renae Descartes
160 – Albert Einstein
160 – Benjamin Franklin
159 – Immanuel Kant
153 – Charles Darwin
153 – Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart
150 – Nicolaus Copernicus
150 – Abraham Lincoln
145 – Napoleon Bonaparte
140 – George Washington
130 – Ulysses S. Grant
130 – Sir Francis Drake
|
Any thoughts on why we dont like to talk about the Human Species that was smarter than our own? Is there a surpression of Truth because our religious philosophies have told us we are number one? I realize now that being one of the few people with a 214 IQ probably doesnt rate highly against the other Human with a Brain fifty percent larger than mine.
My agnostic nagging questioning insists that Andre the Giant was NOT the smartest man alive...
and for perspective:190 – Sir Isaac Newton
190 – Franscois-Marie Arouet (Voltaire)
180 – Leonardo da Vinci
171 – Blaise Pascal
170 – Martin Luther
165 – Galileo Galilei
165 – Johann Sebastian Bach
165 – Ludwig van Beethoven
162 – Renae Descartes
160 – Albert Einstein
160 – Benjamin Franklin
159 – Immanuel Kant
153 – Charles Darwin
153 – Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart
150 – Nicolaus Copernicus
150 – Abraham Lincoln
145 – Napoleon Bonaparte
140 – George Washington
130 – Ulysses S. Grant
130 – Sir Francis Drake
How in the world is it possible to assign an IQ score to people that were dead before the concept was even invented?
Any thoughts on why we dont like to talk about the Human Species that was smarter than our own?Google search.
... And that's link number three for that page on this thread!
Heh wedged in between Kant and Darwin. Good company I guess...
Heh wedged in between Kant and Darwin. Good company I guess...
That's where I'm at as well.
|
RPG Superstar 2009 Top 8
|
Woohoo! I'm smarter than Sir Francis Drake130 – Sir Francis Drake
Do you trust online results? This one says I've got 144. I've taken online tests that pegged me much lower and some that pegged me about this. Anyone have a favourite? Anyone have a more trustworthy one?
I honestly don't think I've ever taken an IQ test.
Do you trust online results?
Nope! And not books, either -- I took two different tests from one, one before and one after my coffee. The scores came back 100 and 180, respectively. Gimme a break. "Potion of Fox's Cunning: Upon drinking a cup of coffee, the drinker gains a +8 enhancement bonus to Intelligence lasting 1d3+3 hours!"
|
|
Woohoo! I'm smarter than Sir Francis Drake130 – Sir Francis Drake
Do you trust online results? This one says I've got 144. I've taken online tests that pegged me much lower and some that pegged me about this. Anyone have a favourite? Anyone have a more trustworthy one?
Same here. I don't trust them. I've got a 145 on an online one; I got told I had a 129 when I was 12 yo or whatever.
I think the ones with "pattern recognitions" are more in line with reality than ones that, say would ask a question like "Davy Crockett was at a The little Bighorn b the Alamo c the battle of the bulge" so a guy who grew up in China with a phd in microbiology who doesn't know who Davy Crockett is could pass it. Or a U.S. resident who doesn't know who the president of Canada is. That sorta thing.
Google search.... And that's link number three for that page on this thread!
And yet the discussion goes on.
|
|
Do you trust online results?Nope! And not books, either -- I took two different tests from one, one before and one after my coffee. The scores came back 100 and 180, respectively. Gimme a break. "Potion of Fox's Cunning: Upon drinking a cup of coffee, the drinker gains a +8 enhancement bonus to Intelligence lasting 1d3+3 hours!"
I think it's a lot like working out your muscles.
I find that you take a month and play a buttload of chess and then take one and you're pushing your maximum brainload.If you're lax and haven't had your coffee, or you've been working 50 hour weeks for three months, chasing 3 kids at the house, and had two colds and a week-long sinus infection, you're brain's gonna be kinda mooshy.
For the record, the IQ scale only goes up to 200 and the higest ever recorded adult IQ was 186.
The IQ test is a placement test created for French school children. The creator of the test arbitrarily took his own daughter as an example of "normal" intelligence, and placed her at a 100 rating. By the original method, if someone was more than twice as smart as this french girl, they could have an IQ higher than 200.
Now, I have a big problem with how the test has borne out over time. The original creator (Binet) was emphatic that the test not be used as a general measure of intelligence, and it was only adapted to such use after his death.
There is a huge volume of research showing the variability in the IQ test, owing to important systemic factors such as cultural background. But the most important point to remember is that there are real types of "intelligence" which are not tested, because defining intelligence is something that can't be properly done. An IQ test, therefore, tests one's ability to take IQ tests. Whether that correlates to anything useful is a subject of great doubt in my mind.
Do you trust online results?Nope! And not books, either -- I took two different tests from one, one before and one after my coffee. The scores came back 100 and 180, respectively. Gimme a break. "Potion of Fox's Cunning: Upon drinking a cup of coffee, the drinker gains a +8 enhancement bonus to Intelligence lasting 1d3+3 hours!"
LOL! Also, you can be assured that the 100 is incorrect. I don't think it's possible for a person with an average IQ to earn a doctorate.
Do you trust online results?Nope! And not books, either -- I took two different tests from one, one before and one after my coffee. The scores came back 100 and 180, respectively. Gimme a break. "Potion of Fox's Cunning: Upon drinking a cup of coffee, the drinker gains a +8 enhancement bonus to Intelligence lasting 1d3+3 hours!"
I know I'm pretty dull on the run until I've had my soda and breakfast.
Do you trust online results? This one says I've got 144. I've taken online tests that pegged me much lower and some that pegged me about this. Anyone have a favourite? Anyone have a more trustworthy one?
My dad worked as a school counselor for many years, so I got to take a lot of them as a kind of 'guinea pig'. My scores were all over the map, from 129 to 155. I take the highest one, since, you know, I roll like that. The Interwebz ones I've taken fall in the same area, so I figure I'm right in that comfy niche of too smart to make a good worker drone and not smart enough to actually capitialize on my dazzling brilliance ..
LOL! Also, you can be assured that the 100 is incorrect. I don't think it's possible for a person with an average IQ to earn a doctorate.Do you trust online results?Nope! And not books, either -- I took two different tests from one, one before and one after my coffee. The scores came back 100 and 180, respectively. Gimme a break. "Potion of Fox's Cunning: Upon drinking a cup of coffee, the drinker gains a +8 enhancement bonus to Intelligence lasting 1d3+3 hours!"
Garydee, see my above rant.
IQ is a convenient lie.
There are, in fact, Doctors who have scored thusly on IQ tests.
I'd also like to point out that until one has a reliable definition of intelligence, any such score that aims to measure it is pretty silly. Mainly a number for people to bandy about in an attempt to improve their self worth.
smart guys vanish
From the picture it is quite obvious that the big-brained guy is ugly, and the female would not reproduce with him. And, even though he was demonstrating the use of his penis-pump, she is still not interested.
Over time his species simply died out.
|
|
IQ is a convenient lie.
There are, in fact, Doctors who have scored thusly on IQ tests.
I don't know if it's that or the ability to quantify such an ethereal quality is just so meager. I guess that proferring the result as an honest quantification is insencere at worst, perhaps naive at best.
There's people I know that can do magical things with their brains I have no earthly clue how to do, or how to figure out how to do....people who I know wouldn't be able to pick the right a-b-c-d on a pattern of triangles and grey-colored circles as many times as I could. In their expertise area, though, I am the padawan.
Their expert areas cannot possibly be quantified by such a primitive ruler as an a-b-c-d test.
(edit) which doesn't necessarily explain the Doctors you mentioned...
I don't think it's possible for a person with an average IQ to earn a doctorate.
Should I admit then that I decided a doctorate would make it too hard to get hired for a field consultant position, so I went with a master's instead? (Not to mention the fact that I couldn't stand that much more school!)