Richard Klostermane |
I love double weapons. Double swords, double axes, hook hammers, you name it. However, I'm really having a hard time justifying even using these weapons other than mere cosmetics. First, you have to spend two feats to use one effectively (Two weapon fighting and Exotic weapon proficency) compared to using two different weapons (Two weapon fighting is the only feat needed to be a long sword/short sword wielder). Double weapons tend to be much more expensive than just buying two weapons (You save 85 gold by getting a long sword and short sword over a double sword).
I just feel like double weapons are almost pointless and a huge waste of a feat. How can I improve them to make them stand up to other weapon fighting styles? (weapon and shield, two individual weapons, two handed weapons, ect)
Lara Cobb |
I love double weapons. Double swords, double axes, hook hammers, you name it. However, I'm really having a hard time justifying even using these weapons other than mere cosmetics. First, you have to spend two feats to use one effectively (Two weapon fighting and Exotic weapon proficency) compared to using two different weapons (Two weapon fighting is the only feat needed to be a long sword/short sword wielder). Double weapons tend to be much more expensive than just buying two weapons (You save 85 gold by getting a long sword and short sword over a double sword).
I just feel like double weapons are almost pointless and a huge waste of a feat. How can I improve them to make them stand up to other weapon fighting styles? (weapon and shield, two individual weapons, two handed weapons, ect)
I absolutely agree with Richard. Double weapons are a huge waste of time in the game considering their expense and sacrifices that have to be made in order to wield them as compared to other weapons.
KaeYoss |
85 bucks? A fortune. Well, it is, for a 0-level commoner. Just not for player characters. Those guys the whole game is all about ;-P
Seriously, though: By the time you hit level 2 (and usually before that), 85 gold pieces won't matter.
As for extra feats: Consider it a down payment, especially if you're a fighter: For the price of one feat at level 1, you get to save a ton of feats later, as you can just go and get weapon focus, weapon specialisation, improved critical, greater weapon focus, greater weapon specialisation, weapon supremacy, and so on - and all just once, for one weapon, instead of two different weapons. Same for weapon training and weapon mastery.
Richard Klostermane |
85 bucks? A fortune. Well, it is, for a 0-level commoner. Just not for player characters. Those guys the whole game is all about ;-P
Seriously, though: By the time you hit level 2 (and usually before that), 85 gold pieces won't matter.
As for extra feats: Consider it a down payment, especially if you're a fighter: For the price of one feat at level 1, you get to save a ton of feats later, as you can just go and get weapon focus, weapon specialisation, improved critical, greater weapon focus, greater weapon specialisation, weapon supremacy, and so on - and all just once, for one weapon, instead of two different weapons. Same for weapon training and weapon mastery.
Well, if I'm a fighter and the DM allowed me to max my starting gold, I guess I'm in the clear, as I'd be able to afford a double bladed sword, chain shirt, and still have 40 gold left over to spend (hope I don't need a horse for the adventure)
I did think about all the feats I'd be able to save on, and improved critical is a huge one...but meanwhile the guy using two weapons NOT ONLY has access to all those feats (if he wants them) but also feats that the double weapon just can't do: Two weapon rend, Double Strike, ect. Sorry to say, but IMO a +1 to hit (weapon focus) pales in comparison to hit a guy once, hit him again, get a third strike for free without even having to try to hit with it (two weapon rend). While weapon focus is ok for the first few low levels, it completely sucks at high levels, while two weapon rend gets better and better with each level.
I dunno though...you can save on feats...but...I dunno, "+1 hit, +2 damage" just sucks in the long run.
Abraham spalding |
You are forgetting one huge advantage of the double weapon.
It counts as a light weapon in the off hand. If you wield two long swords in combat you take a - 4 to hit with both of them even with two weapon fighting, if you use a two bladed sword you only take a - 2 to hit with it. That's a + 2 to hit and you still have the damage and crit range of the two long swords.
Quandary |
I also consider all Two Weapon Fighting Feats to apply to Double Weapons. (you're treated as wielding 2 separate weapons, one of which is "Finesse", and which must recieve separate Weapon Enchants: it IS 2 Weapons for all intensive purposes)
Something that's not so commonly recognized/taken advantage of is when you're using a Double Weapon you're 99% going to be using it 2-Handed, which increases your STR Bonus to Damage. NOTHING IN THE RULES indicates that "2 Handed" is a "Fighting Style" EXCLUSIVE or OPPOSED to "Dual Wielding": You must simply either be wielding a weapon in 2 Hands or wielding a weapon in your off-hand to qualify for them, BOTH OF WHICH a Double Weapon simultaneously enables. The off hand still is at 50% STR bonus, but with the 2Handed bonus that comes out to 75% (and 150% on main hand).
...If you still think it's so horrible, DON'T USE DOUBLE WEAPONS!
(there's plenty of other Feats that people feel are 'sub-par' to complain about:
what would you think of someone spending 3 Feats to get Light/Medium/Heavy Armor Proficiency?)