Well, maybe some. It would be pretty silly to have a fire elemental not immune to fire. Or a golem not immune to poison. When Sean Reynolds started working at Paizo, I thought this would be an issue strongly considered in Pathfinder RPG. I have yet to see it mentioned.
One of the first things that really impacted my opinion of 3rd edition was the saving throw for the cloak of poisonousness. Sure the DC is very high but there is a chance. Isn't that what everyone wants from DnD, to have a fighting chance. Isn't that what makes it fun. If you go into a fight and it is too easy or too deadly is it fun?
Well I have a bold suggestion, have touch (ranged or melee) spell grant a save but at -4. Some touch spells do allow saves some do not. Many of these spells come into question quite often: ray of enfeeblement, enervation, orb of (fire, cold, acid, etc). Otherwise, what reason is there to take feats such as iron will, and great fortitude. Why have a character with good saves?
If you have any other ideas for absolutes that should could be changed before the RPG is finished, please throw them out there.
|
Protection from [Alignment]: Lose the total immunity to mental control.
Replace with SR of (caster level +11) vs mental control, or (better option) force all commands to pass a caster level check (different wording, same odds; the control spell/power stays in play, as now, but allows retry each round).
This makes the effect scale with caster level, giving some protection against the foes the PCs are actually likely to face, (up to a slim chance, even at caster level +9), but still allows the small possibility of something slipping through (from caster level minus 9 up).
You should not be immune to the Elder Brain Progenitor of the Illithid race, just because your 1st-level henchman cast a level 1 spell.
Freedom of Movement should not give automatic success on grapple checks. A +20 bonus to grapple CMB would be plenty, I think.
|
|
Freedom of Movement should not give automatic success on grapple checks. A +20 bonus to grapple CMB would be plenty, I think.
Seconded!
How do the subjects of Freedom of Movement keep their pants on?
By the spell description, any attempt to tie anything round the target will fail. No belts, no shoelaces, no buttons, no tucking in the ends of a sarong, no headbands, no phylacteries, no amulets, no brooches, no bracers, no girdles, no gloves, no boots, no cloaks, no vests,...all just fly off, into a heap on the floor.
You can't pick up any equipment, since it slides out of your greased-up grasp.
"OK, so I'll be a Vow of Poverty Monk, and not need equipment."
Sorry, you can't move.
You move by Newton's Second Law of Motion, pushing against a restraining force, to provide an equal and opposite force to yourself.
While this spell is running, any attempt to restrict your movement will fail.
So, no friction. No movement.
No swimming, since you can't push against water that moves to avoid you.
No gravity can pull you back to the surface of the planet.
Bye-Bye.
A lot of it has already been addressed - look at death ward and mind blank, for examples.
I disagree with saves for touch spells, though: There's already a roll involved (maybe two if we're talking about critters with SR), there shouldn't be a save on top of that, unless we're talking about deadly and devastating.
|
I disagree with saves for touch spells, though: There's already a roll involved (maybe two if we're talking about critters with SR), there shouldn't be a save on top of that, unless we're talking about deadly and devastating.
Agreed. Remember that the aim is for a spellcaster to be efficient at damage-dealing. If he is smart, he will adapt the spells he uses to the enemy he faces : spells allowing Will saves against "dumb" targets, touch spells against tanks ...
"OK, so I'll be a Vow of Poverty Monk, and not need equipment."
Sorry, you can't move.
You move by Newton's Second Law of Motion, pushing against a restraining force, to provide an equal and opposite force to yourself.
While this spell is running, any attempt to restrict your movement will fail.
So, no friction. No movement.
No swimming, since you can't push against water that moves to avoid you.No gravity can pull you back to the surface of the planet.
Bye-Bye.
Physics is a house rule. It doesn't exist in D&D.
How do the subjects of Freedom of Movement keep their pants on?
They just do. It's magic. It doesn't care about what some mundane thinks about reality and how it's supposed to work. Reality is for losers who cannot do magic (or other supernatural stuff).
There is no spoon!
A lot of it has already been addressed - look at death ward and mind blank, for examples.
I disagree with saves for touch spells, though: There's already a roll involved (maybe two if we're talking about critters with SR), there shouldn't be a save on top of that, unless we're talking about deadly and devastating.
Yep, I agree here too.
1 roll to affect the target. That roll can be an attack roll (i.e. ranged touch) or can be a saving throw.
SR can affect it either way, turning either of those 1-roll solutions into a two roll solution.
I don't think any spell needs a 2nd/3rd roll.
However, one balancing factor to a few spells is a 2nd roll for effect when the spell is overpowered for its level. If a touch spell is determined to be twoo powerful, there are three options.
1. Nerf the effect. Make it weaker so it's the right power for the level.
2. Raise the level.
3. Make it less reliable by giving a save in addition to the touch attack.
One possible example is Ray of Exhaustion. This requires a ranged touch attack and if it succeeds, the target is exhausted (loses -6 to STR and DEX and moves at half speed). That's a lot for a 3rd level spell. So the designers put in a partial fortitude save which, if made, reduces the effects to fatigue (-2 STR and DEX and cannot charge or run).
They could have made this a 4th level spell. Or they could have said it's a weak form of exhaustion that is only -4 STR and DEX. Or they could have made it last 1 round/level instead of 1 minute per level. But, instead, they gave it a partial save for a reduced effect.
But, when a spell is adequately powered for the level it becomes available, it should never require two rolls to affect the target.
An exhausted character moves at half speed and takes a –6 penalty to Strength and Dexterity. After 1 hour of complete rest, an exhausted character becomes fatigued. A fatigued character becomes exhausted by doing something else that would normally cause fatigue.
A fatigued character can neither run nor charge and takes a –2 penalty to Strength and Dexterity. Doing anything that would normally cause fatigue causes the fatigued character to become exhausted. After 8 hours of complete rest, fatigued characters are no longer fatigued.
How do the subjects of Freedom of Movement keep their pants on?
By the spell description
Ahem:
This spell enables you or a creature you touch to move and attack normally for the duration of the spell, even under the influence of magic that usually impedes movement, such as paralysis, solid fog, slow, and web. The subject automatically succeeds on any grapple check made to resist a grapple attempt, as well as on grapple checks or Escape Artist checks made to escape a grapple or a pin.
Shall we look at the rest of your post now? Bit by bit to make it extra hilarious:
..any attempt to tie anything round the target will fail. No belts, no shoelaces, no buttons, no tucking in the ends of a sarong, no headbands, no phylacteries, no amulets, no brooches, no bracers, no girdles, no gloves, no boots, no cloaks, no vests,...all just fly off, into a heap on the floor.
Nothing is said about any 'anti-tying' magic effect. RAW, manacles will still hold the character, as the auto escape artist check applies only to grapples or pins. Too many people think that it grants immunity to anything requiring a grapple check. It only affects checks for grappling or pinning. It's a subtle distinction, but an important one. Constriction, for instance, is not a grapple. The grab to to start the constriction is, however, as is Swallow Whole.
You can't pick up any equipment, since it slides out of your greased-up grasp.
There's no greasiness or slippiness involved - where is that from?
"OK, so I'll be a Vow of Poverty Monk, and not need equipment."
Sorry, you can't move.
You move by Newton's Second Law of Motion, pushing against a restraining force, to provide an equal and opposite force to yourself.
While this spell is running, any attempt to restrict your movement will fail.
So, no friction. No movement.
No swimming, since you can't push against water that moves to avoid you.No gravity can pull you back to the surface of the planet.
Bye-Bye.
Ok, a couple of things:
Freedom of movement is not zero frictional coefficient.
Friction is not a fundamental force, although it is derived from electromagnetic force, which is fundamental.
You're mistaking friction for gravitational force though, which is how we stay atteched to the earth and has nothing to do with friction.
And you've quoted Newton's Third Law there by the way :-)
Bye-bye! :-)
|
|
Oh, Matt.
You're no fun.
LOL
Incidentally, the above scenarios were subject of a 'Knights of the Dinner-Table' strip.
Bob is pissing off BA, with his Freedom of Movement effect, pwning the enemies, while Brian greases up the floor. BA rules that the enemies' treasure slides into a deep pool, which the players denounce as a fudge, and send Bob in, with a rope tied round his waist.
Whoops.
Result; one unattached rope, and one (more) dead dwarf.
By the way, thanks for giving me all the ammo I need to pwn you all, after you start getting your 4th-level spells...
:)
I won't be getting any. I'll be too busy tumbling :-)