My kind of villain: uses the PCs for her own goals, then hangs them out to dry when she doesn't need them anymore. And she does it without doing anything obvious, like raising undead monsters, leading armies of humanoids, or opening gates to darker realms. A lot of the fun with Sharina will be when the PCs figure out what she's doing. How do you deal with someone who's been causing you grief but also increasing your fame?
Thumb's up.
Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4, Legendary Games
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I like this one a lot. Yes, there is a horrific potential for the entire character to fall flat if handled clumsily, or to become an annoying DM-PC, but that's a chance I'm willing to take. In fact, you may have given me an idea for something in my current campaign.
You get big points for originality, a bonus for cultural diversity (dusky skin, why not indeed) that fits with the Pathfinder ideal, and a motivation for a villain that isn't overtly evil (or doesn't have to be evil anyway; we'll see when the stat block comes around). Bonus points for low-level villain too, and for thinking ahead to what would or could happen when it all comes down. Also, even if the players start to smell a rat, it would be very hard for their characters to pin anything on Sharina until higher levels, and that's when your endgame begins.
So, a thumbs up from me. I haven't read more than about 10 so far so I'm not sure who I'll vote for, but you are certainly on the short list.
bards vs. sorcerers
You know, that's a good point. It makes little sense with sorcerers, but it makes a bit more sense with this specific villain. I'll think some more on this.
Even if I don't vote for this one, Carl owes Zombieneighbors a cookie for effective villain advocacy.
Please, don't turn this guy's villain entry thread into d7's Blog--the sequel.
I'm not strictly asking you rougerogue either; you said your bit and that's cool.We have this cheesecake: pro's and con's thread every three months or five covers anyway; don't do it to this guy's villain entry thread.
I agree: that's why I made clear that this one's on my short list of keepers, 'cause I didn't want to convince anyone not to vote for this one on those grounds. But you'll want to make that same plea over at the thread for Zelicia.
Actually, to heck with it. I'll make the case.
bards vs. sorcerersYou know, that's a good point. It makes little sense with sorcerers, but it makes a bit more sense with this specific villain. I'll think some more on this.
Even if I don't vote for this one, Carl owes Zombieneighbors a cookie for effective villain advocacy.
I hope you will vote for it, I really do think it is one of the better availible choices.
No, it's seconding Clark's comment re: "I get it. She's hot." and Steven Helt's comments about how he describes her. Others made a similar complaint about the villain Gale. And while I've yet to finish all the entries, I've yet to find an average-looking female NPC (who's not a severed ghast head).
Actually, on Gale's desc I was going "ooh, fan service" but here it sort of belongs to the character concept that we are definitely talking about a hot babe. The desc is a tad excessive but still, charisma=comeliness makes sense here, though she is obviously also a good performer.
About female characters otherwise, we have indeed hit pretty round this time. Well, last year we had two old lady villains...
Unique concept but too unreliable to execute.
To properly pull off this kind of villain over time requires above average rp'ing skills from the DM, and players who are naive enough to not notice that they are being led around with a carrot dangling in front of them.
RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32, 2011 Top 16
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Star Voter Season 6, Star Voter Season 7, Star Voter Season 8, Star Voter Season 9
aka JoelF847
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While I do like this NPC, and I think she'd be a lot of fun to use in a game, I'm having a hard time seeing her as a villain. I see her more as an annoying but entertaining NPC, which can add a lot of fun and twists to a campaign. In my experience, you'd really only be able to use her trick once, maybe twice. Too many players would simply kill her or turn her in for serious jail time if she's luring monsters into town.
That being said, she is novel, so she's in a maybe category for me.
4/10
An annoying paparazzi. More of a plot device than anything, as all the proposed schemes/plots require the DM to assume social engineering succeeds on a level way past a 6th level bard's capacity. "She starts a war!" Really?
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all the proposed schemes/plots require the DM to assume social engineering succeeds on a level way past a 6th level bard's capacity. "She starts a war!" Really?
Uh, sorry, level does not equal influence or political power. Kings aren't required to be 20th level fighters and political movers and shakers aren't required to be 20th level thrallherds or enchanters. And if you think a bard can't stir up a war, you should read up on your Norse history. Heck, for the inverse you can read up on your AMERICAN history - "bards" ie entertainers had a large role in making the Vietnam War so wildly unpopular, and its unpopularity played a large role in America's decision to get out of Vietnam. As for said entertainers' levels, you can re-create any person in the history of the world with an NPC of no more than 6th level.
So, yes, a wily and amoral bard of 6th level should indeed be quite capable of stirring up a war if she had enough time.
Hell, Bards might even equal Reporters. If so, then they can stir up all sorts of trouble for the PCs. ~WEG~
This is my favorite out of all of these. She'll work great early when the PCs have no idea what she's doing to them, and she'll work even better when the PCs know exactly what she's up to, but have no idea how to stop her. And she'll make for a truly memorable endgame, with morally ambiguous choices on the PCs' part: I imagine Sharina finally vanquished, and, with a tear in her eye, pleading, "all I wanted was to make you famous..."
So the posters would allow a 6th level PC bard to start a war that served their ends, just by deciding to do so?
Not all 6th level bards are created equal. In fact, that's the whole point of this contest, no? What separates Sharina Legendsinger from some 6th level bard that attacks the party as part of a random encounter is that she has the cunning, guile, and chutzpah to start a war that serves her ends. That's what makes her a scary villain.
I imagine that a 1st level commoner could start a war, if he had a good plan (and especially if he had 6th level wealth). Starting a war is much easier than ending it.
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So the posters would allow a 6th level PC bard to start a war that served their ends, just by deciding to do so?
Sauce for the goose...
Not "just by deciding to do so". They'd have to actually work at it, just like Sharina would. But it's not an impossibility, or even an improbability. It'd be fairly easy for a party of 6th level adventurers to start a war if they had a mind to. Massacre a couple villages and leave tracks pointing to the neighbouring country, for example, or kidnap a political figure and pin it on someone else. Sharina would presumably work more slowly and subtly, but no less effectively for that.
Ooh my little pretty one, my pretty one.
When you gonna give me some time, Sharina?
Ooh you make my motor run, my motor run.
Gun it comin´ offa the line Sharina.
Never gonna stop, give it up. Such a dirty mind.
I always get it up for the touch of the younger kind.
My my my i yi woo. M M M my Sharina.
Come a little closer huh, uh will ya huh?
Close enough to look in my eyes, Sharina.
Keeping it a mystery g-gets to me.
Runnin' down the length of my thighs, Sharina.
Never gonna stop, give it up. Such a dirty mind.
I always get it up for the touch of the younger kind.
My my my i yi woo.
M M M My Sharina, M M M My Sharina.
When you gonna give to me, g-give to me?
Is it just a matter of time, Sharina?
Is it d-d-destiny, d-destiny?
Or is it just a game in my mind, Sharina?
Never gonna stop, give it up. Such a dirty mind.
I always get it up for the touch of the younger kind.
My my my i yi woo, my my my i yi woo.
M M M My Sharina, M M M My Sharina, M M M My Sharina, M M M My Sharina.
Ooooooooooo-oh, my Sharina.
Ooooooooooo-oh, my Sharina.
Sorry. I couldn't resist. :) ~Svev
*sound of crickets chirping in the night*
OK, someone better recognize those song lyrics!
You guys are making me feel old. :)
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Sharina secretly composes derogatory songs about Puckett, hot-headed monarch of a nearby kingdom. No one knows their source, but they're hilarious and contagious. King Puckett even hears them in his sleep. When he's at the height of his ire, Sharina sends him an anonymous note to inform him that the songs were composed by the young son of the PCs' liege lord.
Wouldn't a king have the wealth and political clout to hire enough magic to ferret out the source of these songs? Once this note is sent he'd certainly have someone magically trace it back. Since this Puckett guy is a hothead I really don't think Sharina here will last long enough to become a pain for the PCs. :)
Don't think I can vote for this one.
Sam
4/10
An annoying paparazzi. More of a plot device than anything, as all the proposed schemes/plots require the DM to assume social engineering succeeds on a level way past a 6th level bard's capacity. "She starts a war!" Really?
In no way is starting a war beyond a sixth level bard.
Between charm person, suggestion, alter self, enthrall, eagles splendor, detect thoughts and plain old social skills turning a tension spot into a war is damned easy.
Just the plans which occered to me given about 20 minites to draw up a basic plan.
A step-by-step guide to starting a war as a 6th level bard.
1. Gather funds through performance, charm person, suggestion and daring do.
2. Research with Bardic knowledge a suitable location for you master plan. Ideally choose a location where tensions simmer along religious and ethnic lines in the case of the populous and along personal enmity in the case of nobles. Preferably, somewhere with a geographical feature (a river) separating them.
3. Develop several persona and us these to fund banditry, evil cults and monstrous humanoid clans some distance away form your target to distract adventures and the authorities.
4. Move into target area, using various persona, befriend, seduce, entrance and infiltrate both local noble families.
5. Stoke ethnic hatreds and religious bigotry through diplomacy, bluff and performance. Priests are very good at helping with this, use their vices and virtues against them through any number of means, have them singing the same tune.
6. Become patron to local bandit through finance, seduction, magic and oratory.
7. Start tit-for-tat murders between the two populations.
8. Encourage both noble families to start military build up because the other side is building up its troops.
9. Promote personal enmity between individuals in both noble families
10. Use bandits to prevent communication between the two sides.
11. Assassinate one of the nobles using a hired assassin.
12. Watch conflict ensue, and repeat elements of these steps along other sections of the boarder, flourish because of the increased instability.
*sound of crickets chirping in the night*
OK, someone better recognize those song lyrics!
You guys are making me feel old. :)
It's the first time I have seen the lyrics written, but yeah, I recognize the song :)
Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 6
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Dedicated Voter Season 6
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Wouldn't a king have the wealth and political clout to hire enough magic to ferret out the source of these songs? Once this note is sent he'd certainly have someone magically trace it back. Since this Puckett guy is a hothead I really don't think Sharina here will last long enough to become a pain for the PCs. :)
That's along the lines of why I think her ambitions outstrip her abilities: she's going to get caught, and she's going to die horribly. She's got mid-level ambitions with a fairly low character level. If it'd stopped short of "start a war", I might have gone along.
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A step-by-step guide to starting a war as a 6th level bard.
1. Gather funds through performance, charm person, suggestion and daring do.
2. Research with Bardic knowledge a suitable location for you master plan. Ideally choose a location where tensions simmer along religious and ethnic lines in the case of the populous and along personal enmity in the case of nobles. Preferably, somewhere with a geographical feature (a river) separating them.
3. Develop several persona and us these to fund banditry, evil cults and monstrous humanoid clans some distance away form your target to distract adventures and the authorities.
4. Move into target area, using various persona, befriend, seduce, entrance and infiltrate both local noble families.
5. Stoke ethnic hatreds and religious bigotry through diplomacy, bluff and performance. Priests are very good at helping with this, use their vices and virtues against them through any number of means, have them singing the same tune.
6. Become patron to local bandit through finance, seduction, magic and oratory.
7. Start tit-for-tat murders between the two populations.
8. Encourage both noble families to start military build up because the other side is building up its troops.
9. Promote personal enmity between individuals in both noble families
10. Use bandits to prevent communication between the two sides.
11. Assassinate one of the nobles using a hired assassin.
12. Watch conflict ensue,...
ohh I likethis plan VERY MUCH
it lacks just one thing...have the PCs in the middle to save the day... after all what she wants is that they triumph... because in that relies her victory... she doesn't wantthe PCs todie or lose.. (unless its epic and memorable) she want them tobecome heroes... so she can sing about them and receive the applause for such magnificent epic... that is why I still love her and will not change my vote :D
That's along the lines of why I think her ambitions outstrip her abilities: she's going to get caught, and she's going to die horribly. She's got mid-level ambitions with a fairly low character level. If it'd stopped short of "start a war", I might have gone along.Wouldn't a king have the wealth and political clout to hire enough magic to ferret out the source of these songs? Once this note is sent he'd certainly have someone magically trace it back. Since this Puckett guy is a hothead I really don't think Sharina here will last long enough to become a pain for the PCs. :)
ohh give her time.. see Queen Ileosa's stats in CotCT... they are not the same for the End Game, are they?
that is the beauty of Sharina... she is supposed to grew as the PCs grew... otherwise... how could she travel with them and see their actions in progress
she is indefinitive... something akin to a cohort...it was never truer the old saying already mentioned here "with friends like this..."
Well at the point the conflict is underway, she gets her self 'captured' by the 'bad guys from the neighbouring kingdom' and sends word that she needs to be rescured. After all they are old friends so why wouldn't the PCs come running.
4/10
An annoying paparazzi. More of a plot device than anything, as all the proposed schemes/plots require the DM to assume social engineering succeeds on a level way past a 6th level bard's capacity. "She starts a war!" Really?
In no way is starting a war beyond a sixth level bard.
Between charm person, suggestion, alter self, enthrall, eagles splendor, detect thoughts and plain old social skills turning a tension spot into a war is damned easy.
Just the plans which occered to me given about 20 minites to draw up a basic plan.
A step-by-step guide to starting a war as a 6th level bard.
1. Gather funds through performance, charm person, suggestion and daring do.
2. Research with Bardic knowledge a suitable location for you master plan. Ideally choose a location where tensions simmer along religious and ethnic lines in the case of the populous and along personal enmity in the case of nobles. Preferably, somewhere with a geographical feature (a river) separating them.
3. Develop several persona and us these to fund banditry, evil cults and monstrous humanoid clans some distance away form your target to distract adventures and the authorities.
4. Move into target area, using various persona, befriend, seduce, entrance and infiltrate both local noble families.
5. Stoke ethnic hatreds and religious bigotry through diplomacy, bluff and performance. Priests are very good at helping with this, use their vices and virtues against them through any number of means, have them singing the same tune.
6. Become patron to local bandit through finance, seduction, magic and oratory.
7. Start tit-for-tat murders between the two populations.
8. Encourage both noble families to start military build up because the other side is building up its troops.
9. Promote personal enmity between individuals in both noble families
10. Use bandits to prevent communication between the two sides.
11. Assassinate one of the nobles using a hired assassin.
12. Watch conflict ensue,...
Now you realize, of course, that had that been Carl Klutzke's original plan for his adventure submission, he would have a hard time using it now. :(
I like this one!
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Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4, Legendary Games
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*sound of crickets chirping in the night*
OK, someone better recognize those song lyrics!
You guys are making me feel old. :)
We do not acknowledge the existence of The Knack in polite company... :)
(but we secretly groove whenever we happen to randomly hear it even today)
Now you realize, of course, that had that been Carl Klutzke's original plan for his adventure submission, he would have a hard time using it now. :(
In the unlikely case that he planned to use that spcific plan, i am sure not only is it possible that he will be able to make another, that he would be able to make two or three others. The bards powers really are very versitile and he'll do fine. Not to mention that he will have plenty of time to plan it.
Contributor, RPG Superstar
aka Leandra Christine Schneider
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This entry has earned a spot among my votes because of the novel approach it takes towards the conception of a villain.
I don't know if it is necessarily a "good" approach in sense of playability and likelihood of success when confronted with a party (very, very important aspects), but it captured me more than many other submissions.
One thing I've learned is, that every player(or DM) plays the game a little different and I could see this working well with the right... audience (I know, this one was bad :P)
You have my vote.
One thing I've learned is, that every player(or DM) plays the game a little different and I could see this working well with the right... audience (I know, this one was bad :P)
Well, being able to target one's submission to the right audience can be a huge factor in success.
We do not acknowledge the existence of The Knack in polite company... :)
(but we secretly groove whenever we happen to randomly hear it even today)
Thanks, Jason. Someone finally validated my lame pop culture reference! ;)
ohh give her time.. see Queen Ileosa's stats in CotCT... they are not the same for the End Game, are they?
that is the beauty of Sharina... she is supposed to grew as the PCs grew... otherwise... how could she travel with them and see their actions in progress
This is something I hoped to see discussed a bit in some other villain concepts too.
If the villain is supposed to be a long-term threat it can be assumed that she will not stay exactly the same. It is likely she will get more levels, so in this sense ambitious low-level villain can be a bit better entry than ambitious high-level villain, because you can introduce her early on and keep on throwing in her machinations during several levels.
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Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 6
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Dedicated Voter Season 6
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If the villain is supposed to be a long-term threat it can be assumed that she will not stay exactly the same. It is likely she will get more levels, so in this sense ambitious low-level villain can be a bit better entry than ambitious high-level villain, because you can introduce her early on and keep on throwing in her machinations during several levels.
I actually pointed out that possibility in my first post in this thread. However, were I the author, I would have invested a sentence on just that topic - not all recurring villains advance, and it should be called out when they do. Doesn't take very many words, and it's an interesting point of information.
Either way, looks like this one will advance - as it should, it is clearly in the top quarter for the round.
Either way, looks like this one will advance - as it should, it is clearly in the top quarter for the round.
I wouldn't go by the exit polling in the general forum, actually: surely MANY more than 41 people plus four judges voted in last year's competition, right?
Either way, looks like this one will advance - as it should, it is clearly in the top quarter for the round.I wouldn't go by the exit polling in the general forum, actually: surely MANY more than 41 people plus four judges voted in last year's competition, right?
It gives direction, as do the comments in the threads. And if an entry does well in both, it is pretty safe bet to assume that entry will get in...however the fence-sitters better not believe those and Sharina might not be the third-most-popular entry though.
I LOVE this idea. I would have a lot of fun with it as a GM. Coincidentally, I was playing a bard character named Sharia in Pathfinder 1. She was hell-bent on getting the characters famous, too--but only because she wanted the play she was writing about their exploits to make lots of money. And she was wonderfully annoying. Had she been a bit more twisted, she would have been this character. It could be incorporated into the campaign well if you actually talked someone into playing her at the table, so the other players really wouldn't suspect anything (her devious stuff being handled by email or some means away from the table).
You've got one of my votes!
Christina
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Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 6
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Dedicated Voter Season 6
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I wouldn't go by the exit polling in the general forum, actually: surely MANY more than 41 people plus four judges voted in last year's competition, right?
The polls were very accurate last year, particularly for entries not on the cusp. But I did say "looks like", not "will definitely" :)
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Wouldn't a king have the wealth and political clout to hire enough magic to ferret out the source of these songs? Once this note is sent he'd certainly have someone magically trace it back. Since this Puckett guy is a hothead I really don't think Sharina here will last long enough to become a pain for the PCs. :)
Don't think I can vote for this one.
Sam
She could have planned for the possibility of getting caught. Say the adventure is set in Golarian. If I'm trying to provoke a war between Molthune and Druma, my best bet if I get caught is to tell the ruler of Molthune that Isger hired me to start the war between the other two. That way, I still end up getting my war.
I love this character, and want to see her advance to the next round. A friend that's worse than an enemy is a cool and interesting idea, and this is one of the more original entries we've had. I'm hoping you'll get through, but, with only four votes, there are others that slightly edge her out. But this is one I would seriously be considering for my fifth vote, if I had one. I hope it does well!
I really, really hate bards. I don't know why, but the loathing is there nonetheless. Bards are the only class that i've banned from my games. I gotta say no to this entry, sorry.
Director of Narrative
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Dedicated Voter Season 7, Dedicated Voter Season 8, Star Voter Season 9
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This one was one of my favorites.
I did a very similar thing to a group of PCs in my last homebrew campaign and it made me very happy to see it. I also gave you hardcore points for being among the lowest level baddies in this contest. I was actually surprised that more people didn't try to grab those low levels.
For the most part, I kept my votes away from the frontrunners this round, even though in most cases I found them more intersting or elegant than the entries that actually received my votes. Sharina claims the distinction of being the only frontrunner that I spent a vote on, because I really, really, really wanted to see you advance based on this entry.
First of all, I love bards, so she caught my eye right off. That's not enough, of course; there were a lot of bards this round and the rest of them didn't make it onto my short list. (Likewise, lots of druids, another favorite class, and only one of them caught my eye.)
So what was right about Sharina that made her click? First of all, major points for taking a class that's not traditionally very threatening to a PC party and making her a legitimate villain in a way that fits that class and maximizes her abilities in a sensible way. She doesn't waltz into town and start throwing enchantment spells around left and right or challenge the party to a duel; she doesn't stand on the sidelines and pull strings in a way that merely inconveniences the PCs; she directly puts their lives in danger on a regular basis for no reason but her own ego. If it ever came down to an actual fight between her and the party, well, I assume she has a decent escape planned, otherwise it would likely be quite brief. :-) But if she (and more importantly, the DM) can keep the party guessing for an indefinite period... man, the opportunities are limitless.
She has her flaws; as has been mentioned, she's one of those entries that falls under 'okay, she's hot, we get it already' I didn't take too hard a tack on that, because, hey, performers are supposed to be easy on the eyes. Likewise, there's the need for a really skillful DM to pull it off without the party figuring out 'hey, every time we're in a tavern with Sharina a brawl breaks out. what's up with that? Hey, why's she so excited about that dragon coming to town?' But didn't allow that to dissuade me because... well, why NOT assume that she'll be well played? When I'm voting, I vote based on the potential I can see in a character, not neccesarily the limits of a DM to maximize that potential.
All in all, my favorite entry of this round. I am very much looking forward to seeing her statted out.
Now that it's too late to influence the voting (for good or ill) I want to thank everyone who took the time to post comments, criticism, suggestions, approval, disapproval, and song parodies about Sharina. It's been wonderfully educational. Hearing so many of you say that you plan on using her in your own campaigns has been higher praise than I ever could have hoped for. Thank you very much.
Congratulations!