Can we expect anything like this? In light of all the things in the errata threads (especially harridans and kuchrimas supposed to have SLAs) wouldn't this be a great product?
Rise of the Runelords: the Director's Cut. I'd shell out moolah for that.
I agree that it would be a nice product. I have the Shackled City Hardcover and am extremely happy with that purchase.
But I think the cost vs. revenue ratio along with the time involved on a project like this are the major limiting factors. I would think that something like this is years off, if ever.
I agree that it would be a nice product. I have the Shackled City Hardcover and am extremely happy with that purchase.
But I think the cost vs. revenue ratio along with the time involved on a project like this are the major limiting factors. I would think that something like this is years off, if ever.
Time and effort is one thing, but James has clearly stated that selling a hardcover book like this would compete with their "bread and butter" monthly product -- the adventure paths.
While this makes sense, it's a bit disappointing. Personally, I have little interest in buying six softcover books, but I would buy one edited hardcover omnibus volume in a heartbeat. I'm very happy with my Shackled City hardcover. :-)
Note: I don't think they've completely, 100% ruled out the possibility, though, so you can keep your fingers crossed. Maybe after they switch to using the Pathfinder RPG for adventure paths, they can re-issue the old 3.5 stuff.
There should really be a Paizo FAQ explaining this stuff...
Creative Director
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It's a possibility, sure; in the same way that WotC reprinted some of their older adventures a few times (Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil, for example). While we ARE a bit timid about competing against ourselves (which is what a Rise of the Runelords hardcover would do), it's also a matter of do we have the time and budget to do another huge hardcover book? We're already doing two next year, and that more or less taps us out. In 2010, though, who knows?
A RotRL hardcover's not out of the question, but it's not going to happen any time soon, either.
It's a possibility, sure; in the same way that WotC reprinted some of their older adventures a few times (Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil, for example). While we ARE a bit timid about competing against ourselves (which is what a Rise of the Runelords hardcover would do), it's also a matter of do we have the time and budget to do another huge hardcover book? We're already doing two next year, and that more or less taps us out. In 2010, though, who knows?
A RotRL hardcover's not out of the question, but it's not going to happen any time soon, either.
I've heard that some of the RotRL adventures are either already out of print or close to it. I would think that once this happens you wouldn't be competing with yourselves and something like a hardcover a'la Shackled City would be more appropriate and maybe financially rewarding.
But, yeah, not for a year or two I would think.
It's a possibility, sure; in the same way that WotC reprinted some of their older adventures a few times (Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil, for example). While we ARE a bit timid about competing against ourselves (which is what a Rise of the Runelords hardcover would do), it's also a matter of do we have the time and budget to do another huge hardcover book? We're already doing two next year, and that more or less taps us out. In 2010, though, who knows?
A RotRL hardcover's not out of the question, but it's not going to happen any time soon, either.
I'm willing to wait for a revised edition for Pathfinder RPG. Two three years is fine.
Maybe do that instead of re-re-releasing the Pathfinder RPG when the sales die down after 2 years.
Although, I'll be done runelords by then, perhaps Crimson Throne instead :)
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Chief Technical Officer
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I've heard that some of the RotRL adventures are either already out of print or close to it. I would think that once this happens you wouldn't be competing with yourselves...
When James talks about "competing with ourselves," there's actually two ways that happens. You're clearly thinking about hardcover sales reducing sales of the softcover editions—and you're right: that problem goes away if the softcovers sell out.
But the other way is that Rise of the Runelords hardcover sales would impact sales of whatever the current Adventure Path is; that's actually potentially worse for us, because we rely on strong sales of the current AP each month to keep us in business.
But the other way is that Rise of the Runelords hardcover sales would impact sales of whatever the current Adventure Path is; that's actually potentially worse for us, because we rely on strong sales of the current AP each month to keep us in business.
To add to what Vic is saying...
I love Runelords. I love it so much I'm running it twice.
But.. Runelords was also the first AP when the campaign setting started up. When the production schedule was initiated. This is strictly my opinion, but some of the later APs reflect the fact the Editorial Team has improved and revised the process of putting an AP together.
The art gets better. Player options improve. Scenarios and encounters become more diverse. Practice makes perfect, even for Paizo.
Sometimes I envy people who can jump into the Crimson Throne and Second Darkness. Heck, after Runelords I might jump right to Legacy of Fire.
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So, I get the competition with yourselves thing but do we really know that would happen? I say after publishing the two upcoming hardcover books take some time to update RotR to Pathfinder RPG and use it as a test case in 2010 or 2011 and see if it does have an impact. It certainly would not change what I buy. I am not going to forgo my monthly subscription to wait another two or three years for the hardcopy. I would just buy the hard copy too.
As a matter of fact I do not even really use the current Pathfinder APs to run my game but print everything out from the PDF and put it in a notebook organized how I want it. I love being able to do that. I have a big notebook for each adventure path.
Another thought is to update the PDFs to Pathfinder RPG... I know that is a lot of work but I would pay for the updated PDFs or Hardcover book or whatever is put out.
I am still waiting for the Pathfinder RPG subscription so I can get signed up for it.
I've heard that some of the RotRL adventures are either already out of print or close to it. I would think that once this happens you wouldn't be competing with yourselves...When James talks about "competing with ourselves," there's actually two ways that happens. You're clearly thinking about hardcover sales reducing sales of the softcover editions—and you're right: that problem goes away if the softcovers sell out.
But the other way is that Rise of the Runelords hardcover sales would impact sales of whatever the current Adventure Path is; that's actually potentially worse for us, because we rely on strong sales of the current AP each month to keep us in business.
That makes sense. Thanks for taking the time to give some more insight.
In any case, if it makes business sense it would be something to look forward to.
BUMP!
So... it seems the softcovers are gradually selling out. Unless you are willing to spend an INSANE amount on Amazon or Evilbay.
How about it, Paizo?
I'm REALLY interested in a RotRL HC! Make it a Director's Cut anthology andI will pre-order instantly.
It's one of the prereqs of becoming a full-fledged necromancer... and a lot safer than reviving corpses.
Although one has to stand guard for flaming and trolls! ;-)
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But the other way is that Rise of the Runelords hardcover sales would impact sales of whatever the current Adventure Path is; that's actually potentially worse for us, because we rely on strong sales of the current AP each month to keep us in business.
Question for Vic....was that the case for the Shackled City AP hardcover? Did it impact the Dungeon Mag issues that contained future AP modules? I'm curious because my initial reaction to this is, "Well, that's a poor excuse. Cusomer's want what customer's want". I feel though that my reaction is not well founded in the context of business.
I would be surprised if Paizo wouldn't even consider doing a reprint of RotRL as an alternative to publishing a hardcover conglomerate. If a reprint was an option, you all could consider the possibility of doing something else (vagueness intentional) for a month or two while such reprint was released. I understand this current "one AP per 6 months" system works for you all. But still....there must be SOME way to do it.
I guess I'm so interested in the answer because RotRL was THE most successful campaign I've ever run in my 21 years of gaming.
I hereby pledge my support for such a product with the purchasing power of the cash in my wallet.
Thank-you.
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Chief Technical Officer
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But the other way is that Rise of the Runelords hardcover sales would impact sales of whatever the current Adventure Path is; that's actually potentially worse for us, because we rely on strong sales of the current AP each month to keep us in business.Question for Vic....was that the case for the Shackled City AP hardcover? Did it impact the Dungeon Mag issues that contained future AP modules? I'm curious because my initial reaction to this is, "Well, that's a poor excuse. Cusomer's want what customer's want". I feel though that my reaction is not well founded in the context of business.
Keep in mind that Dungeon issues with AP installments also had two standalone adventures, so even if a big chunk of the potential AP audience were playing another AP, the current issue would still be selling to some of the AP people and all of the non-AP people.
Also, Dungeon magazine was designed to have an on-sale window of one month per issue, and that meant that the AP as a whole didn't have any actual shelf presence until the Shackled City hardcover existed. So for people who weren't buying magazines—or those who didn't have access to back issues—there was only one choice.
But, yes, I do think that if we were still putting out APs via Dungeon magazine, and we also had a dozen or so hardcover AP compilations in print, we'd probably have noticed a decline in magazine sales over that time as a result of training our customers to wait for a collected volume, or as a result of giving them many more options than "the current product."
Truth is, though, what you quoted above is actually becoming a less important reason for us. It was very important when the AP line and the Module line accounted for the vast majority of our business, but as we've been able to introduce other successful lines, we're less reliant on any single line to keep us afloat.
But it is nonetheless still very important that we don't do things that encourage customers to ignore our current products in favor of future products (and to some degree, past products).
I would buy an adventure compilation of RotRL.
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Ok everyone, I have the solution:
Everyone who wants to get an updated hardcover anthology of RotRL will put their name on a list and will pay a non-refundable* $30.00 pre-order payment, with the full understanding that it will be a few years before the final product is seen, and that in order to receive their copy, might need to pay more to cover the balance of the price once completed. Paizo, once enough pre-orders have been made to justify the expense of such an endeavor, will publish a director's cut (you know, all the extra good stuff that got cut out for space and sensibility reasons), fully updated to PF, extra copies of full sized maps as handouts, hardcover printing of the RotRL AP. BOOM. Problem solved. I'll even waive my consultation fee.
* a refund would be only made if, once the project was started, it was halted and was not going to be completed.
James