So, in my current game, I run a not-very-serious 'sucked into a fantasy world' game using players playing themselves and the pathfinder campaign setting. less intellectually satisfying than a normal campaign, but much funnier.
Anyway, my group is now interested in opening a Thai restaurant in the game world that the characters can also use as a base of operations. And, while hilarious, I'm not 100% sure what rules to use for this. I mean, I have and enjoy the stronghold builders' guidebook, but the 'sources of income' section isn't exactly business friendly. I could use profession: cook, but then my characters won't be free to travel and adventure.
I don't need complete realistic economic rules, just something to keep it from being a complete money sink.
Any thoughts?
Try the DMG II. It has rules for running businesses.
First and foremost: get rid of that nonsensical rule that states everything the PCs sell can only be sold at half price even if they created it themselves and it's brand new.
Second: Role-play versus roll-play. How do you and your players want to handle it? Should they prefer to do in game the active search for providers, permits, advertisement, and staff? Or should they keep it simple and just leave it to the dice (Profession: Management/Cook/etc) on game-time monthly rolls?
They play themselves? Tell me: How big a chance of survival does a bunch of 1st-level commoners with the standard array have ;-P
First and foremost: get rid of that nonsensical rule that states everything the PCs sell can only be sold at half price even if they created it themselves and it's brand new.
That's not really an all-encompassing rule, merely the standard guideline to handles the "we go into town and dump our loot onto the first shop we find" situation.
Characters who set up shop themselves can expect to sell the stuff for a better price (i.e. usually full price), but they have to content with other factors: Selling stuff takes time, and effort, and you ideally need a shop. Plus, you'll have to wait until someone wants that very item and is willing to pay full price for it.
In one game, we actually set up shop in a big city, where we brought our spoils of war to sell instead of getting half price in shops. We had to employ salesclerks, some hired muscle to guard the place, and so on, meaning we'd get something like 85% - 90% out of the stuff, if and when we sold something.
Sooner or later we found that the market for expensive magic items wasn't that big when we weren't part of the clientele. We ended up selling the expensive stuff in shops (for 50%) because we needed money now, and only sold cheaper stuff (everything up to 4000 or something like that) in our shop.
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So, in my current game, I run a not-very-serious 'sucked into a fantasy world' game using players playing themselves and the pathfinder campaign setting. less intellectually satisfying than a normal campaign, but much funnier.
Anyway, my group is now interested in opening a Thai restaurant in the game world that the characters can also use as a base of operations. And, while hilarious, I'm not 100% sure what rules to use for this. I mean, I have and enjoy the stronghold builders' guidebook, but the 'sources of income' section isn't exactly business friendly. I could use profession: cook, but then my characters won't be free to travel and adventure.
I don't need complete realistic economic rules, just something to keep it from being a complete money sink.
Any thoughts?
Second Darkness 1 and 2 have rules for running a business in a ncie neat abstract way, just in case PCs want to go that route.
Profession: Cook is a sensible option, nothing says they need to make the checks themselves though, employ some staff!
Culture shock!
Let them find out that they can't just get all those Tai spices and foodstuffs in the discounter around the corner. Make fotos on the looks of horror on their faces when the implications set in.
Let them invent the first delivery service on Golarion. Let them patent the concept and they're gonna be rich.
Just work out the calling part. Maybe conjuration (calling)? Call Pizza Delivery has always been my favourite spell.
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Let them invent the first delivery service on Golarion. Let them patent the concept and they're gonna be rich.
Just work out the calling part. Maybe conjuration (calling)? Call Pizza Delivery has always been my favourite spell.
Since Prestidigitation can flavor things, I suspect that spices wouldn't be too much of a stop-gap. Non-Golarions would be able to use Prestidigitation to whip up flavors not common (or even unknown) on Golarion, which could make for some popular dishes that will quickly be imitated by other eateries that have access to cantrip-level magic (and, eventually, some clever chef will come up with mundane means to mix Golarion flavorings to mimic these non-native tastes).
Creating a 1st level spell to deliver something from one place to another (under 5 lbs, some restrictions apply) could be a spiffy delivery mechanic.
Perhaps a 1st level Sorcerer with the spell has to travel around the city and 'conjure up dinner' by casting the spell to summon it hot from the kitchen.
Perhaps a small material token baked from clay (shaped like the Arcane Mark of the creator and proprietor, used as the the 'corporate logo' for Thai By Night or whatever) has to be delivered (by raven familiar) to those who send in an order (by messageboy), and the meal is prepared as the token is flown to the customers. The customers break the token to activate the spell, similar to a Succor spell, and the meal is transported to the customer.
The biggest cost for a delivery service would be in packaging. No styrofoam or cardboard for delivery containers, so the dishes would have to be cheap clay crockery.
I think the best idea is to use Profession checks (either they can make their own or they can hire a manager).
The DMG II rules are a bit weird (no offense, in case the author sees this...) -- you're better off building a business in the middle of the wilderness, for instance.
Since Prestidigitation can flavor things,
That's fast food, though: "Magic Tai: Eat it quickly before it tastes like crap again!"
But now that I think about it, I often had pizza that tasted simply awesome when I first got it, but when I tried the other half cold, it tasted awful. Damn hedge delivery boys.
Creating a 1st level spell to deliver something from one place to another (under 5 lbs, some restrictions apply) could be a spiffy delivery mechanic.
2nd-level spell with anchovies.
The biggest cost for a delivery service would be in packaging. No styrofoam or cardboard for delivery containers, so the dishes would have to be cheap clay crockery.
Magic! If you can keep a corpse from going bad, you can keep food warm. Lesser version of ball of flame.
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Since Prestidigitation can flavor things,That's fast food, though: "Magic Tai: Eat it quickly before it tastes like crap again!"
Yeah, but it would last *at least* an hour! That's like 55 minutes longer than Burger King french fries, which taste awesome for 5 minutes, and then turn straight to s**t.
On containers;
Magic! If you can keep a corpse from going bad, you can keep food warm. Lesser version of ball of flame.
No, no, not just warm, I just meant a container to *hold* the food. Wouldn't want it to just appear at the destination and splorch onto the floor in an unsightly mess.
Biggest problem with using Metamorphose Liquids back in 2e to make money was paying for all the cups!
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We did this a while back. My dwarf opened a jewelry store and hired two other dwarfs. He sold his items he worked on during down time. The two dwarfs kept it going while he was away.
As long as we didn't abuse it or anything the GM let it run fine and made a small profit. He didn't mess with it too hard except when the dragon attacked the town.
We didn't use rules or anything. We just played it. It was fun.
Prestidigitation's got containers covered: "Prestidigitation can create small objects, but they look crude and artificial." Sounds like fast food containers to me.
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Prestidigitation's got containers covered: "Prestidigitation can create small objects, but they look crude and artificial." Sounds like fast food containers to me.
Oh, and biodegradable! (Cause they vanish an hour later.)
Awesome. Prestidigitation, what can't it do? Especially in Golarion, where it's an at will type ability for many, meaning that the launderer down the block is guaranteed to have some bored-out-of-his-skull recruit from the Academy wage-slaving in the back using Prestidigitation to clean and freshen up colors for laundry, and Mending to repair small tears and snags.
"Yes, 'Maleki the Magnificent,' tell us again how you paid your way through Academy cleaning the shirts of your betters..."
The 2 best resources for rules/guidelines on running a business:
1) "Ill Gotten Gains" - Dragon #268. An excellent article, that includes rules for taverns and restaurants. My first go-to source for running a business, period. Can easily be adapted to make 3.x skills useful, too.
2) DMG II
Awesome. Prestidigitation, what can't it do?
Says so in the spell description: "It cannot deal damage or affect the concentration of spellcasters. ... The materials created by a prestidigitation spell are extremely fragile, and they cannot be used as tools, weapons, or spell components. Finally, a prestidigitation lacks the power to duplicate any other spell effects."
Especially in Golarion, where it's an at will type ability for many,
Well, actually, it's not a Golarion thing, but more a PF RPG thing, so it would work wherever those rules are used.
"Yes, 'Maleki the Magnificent,' tell us again how you paid your way through Academy cleaning the shirts of your betters..."
"I was young and needed the work? Could be worse. I did get such a job. Not so Hannah the Unsullied. She had to do other... work"
"Hannah the Unsullied?"
"You would know her as Hannah the Promiscuous. She had to change her name. 'twas written off as a work hazard..."
Set and KaeYoss, I approve of these non-combat utility spells, and would purchase them and others like them as an individual low-cost PDF or as part of something like a Kobold Quarterly article or back-of-the-book Pathfinder article.
Please develop these and more!
I don't really have the time or patience to publish something professional-like - and I'm not sure I could get it polished up enough - but I might find the time to whip up something and just put it onto the boards or my page.
Yeah, but it would last *at least* an hour! That's like 55 minutes longer than Burger King french fries, which taste awesome for 5 minutes, and then turn straight to s**t.Since Prestidigitation can flavor things,That's fast food, though: "Magic Tai: Eat it quickly before it tastes like crap again!"
*snorts, thinking slop flavored like spicy pepper steak w/ steamed rice wouldn't last 5 minutes, let alone 1 hour.*
They play themselves? Tell me: How big a chance of survival does a bunch of 1st-level commoners with the standard array have ;-P
They all went to magic school and stuff. They're still crappy compared to others, but not so crappy as to die constantly, LOL. Besides, they have ultrapowerful things like niquil and PDAs!
Seriously, I want to thank everyone for posting. I'm tracking down the various sources you all gave me as we speak to figure out how to run it.
On a sidenote, since teleportation spells don't work the same in my game as they normally do (I find them plot-killers), I'm using this as a springboard for numerous futurama-style delivery plots.
And behold, the Mighty Carton of Everfresh! Using gentle repose, my players shall craft an item that will keep a container of thai food fresh indefinitely! Muahahahah!
So they have PDAs? How do they power them? Infinite batteries? Or do they grow on trees, like those fuel fruits in Those Who Hunt Elves?
Speaking of futurama: I just watched the newest movie - Bender's Game. It's got D&D in it. And Futurama characters as D&D creatures. Wanna see Leegolas the Centaur? Amie the Water Nympho? Frydo and his dodecalicious? The Geysers of Gygax (to which the movie is dedicated to)?
Or a humorous spin on one of the most memorable lines in one of the most memorable Sci-Fi/Fantasy movies?