Does using a spring-loaded wrist sheath provoke?


Rules Questions


2 people marked this as FAQ candidate. 1 person marked this as a favorite.
d20pfsrd wrote:


Wrist Sheath, spring loaded

This item works like a standard wrist sheath, but releasing an item from it is an swift action. Preparing the sheath for this use requires cranking the sheath’s tiny gears and springs into place (a full-round action that provokes an attack of opportunity).

d20pfsrd wrote:


Wrist Sheath

This is a sheath designed to be strapped to your forearm and hidden under a long sleeve. The sheath can hold one forearm-length item such as a dagger, dart, or wand, or up to five arrows or crossbow bolts. Alternatively, you may store up to 1 pound of ammunition in a wrist sheath. As a move action, you can bend your wrist to cause some or all of these items to drop into your hand (provoking attacks of opportunity as normal). You have a +2 bonus on Sleight of Hand checks made to oppose the Perception check of someone observing or frisking you regarding items in the sheath. You can only wear one wrist sheath per arm.

Couldn't find adventurers armory on the official PRD so something might be wrong in the quotes. Has it been clarified if the spring-loaded wrist sheath provokes? On one hand by RAW it seems to do - on the other hand I know no other swift actions that provoke, and thematically it doesn't really make sense. It would mean it doesn't replace quick draw as easily I guess, which is good.

EDIT: Also, drawing weapons does not provoke normally, so the "provoking as normal" line doesn't really make sense either.


stringburka wrote:
on the other hand I know no other swift actions that provoke,

Quickened spells?

Silver Crusade

Casting a quickened spell does not provoke.


The RAW on it is unclear since it referenced 'as normal' and we do not know what the 'normal' for this action is. So, is it retrieving a stored item?

CRB p186 Draw or Sheathe a weapon wrote:
Drawing a weapon so that you can use it in combat, or putting it away so that you have a free hand, requires a move action. This action also applies to weapon-like objects carried in easy reach, such as wands. If your weapon or weapon-like object is stored in a pack or otherwise out of easy reach, treat this action as retrieving a stored item.

My opinion is this: They intended it to be a retrieving an item type action. However, when applied to weapons and weapon-like objects it (retrieving) does not stand up to scrutiny. It is not out of easy reach. In fact the wrist sheath has made it within easy reach.

In any case, I would rule that the Spring loaded version is certainly within easy reach and therefore it is not the retrieve action.

- Gauss


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Making a ranged touch attack as part of casting a quickened spell does provoke, however, so at least there are swift actions that provoke. But they are rare. And I agree Gauss, it doesn't seem like it should count as retrieving an item thematically.

EDIT:
It seems James Jacobs has the same idea as us on it:
"Retrieving an item should only provoke an attack of opportunity when it means your'e taking your eyes off the fight to dig through a bag or whatever to do so. A spring-loaded wrist sheath type thing is a swift action and doesn't require you to turn your attention away from defending yourself (it's not a move action) and as such should not provoke an attack of opportunity. "

James Jacobs may not be the rules guy, but it can still give a hint on intent.


Well I would say the default assumption is that inside a sheath is a weapon. So retrieving it is the "Draw a weapon" action, which does not provoke.
Doing it even faster and with less movement (flick of the wrist vs reaching for it) should provoke even less.

An argument could be made if you start storing other stuff there, that it be "Retrieving an Item" then, but that doesn't make too much sense either, it's still the same thing you do.


Like everyone else here, I fail to see how an item that makes it quicker and easier to draw a weapon or retrieve an item can provoke when the original action does not (assuming that you interpret the item to be a "weapon-like [object] carried in easy reach").


The whole point of a wrist sheath is the bonus to Sleight of Hand vs. Perception. Looking at pg. 105, "Drawing a hidden weapon is a standard action and doesn't provoke an attack of opportunity." Combined with Gauss's quote, it seems clear to me that it doesn't provoke.


Yeah, the issue is that the normal wrist sheath explicitly state that it DOES provoke ("as normal" which is weird).

It's ambiguous but I guess it shouldn't provoke.

Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder First Edition / Rules Questions / Does using a spring-loaded wrist sheath provoke? All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.