Alternate Fighter (Yeah, I Know . . . )


Classes: Barbarian, Fighter, and Ranger


The Feat Boost and bonus abilities from fighter bonus feats are lifted directly from the Book of Experimental Might II. While I have liked a lot of the additions to the fighter, I'm starting to feel like it isn't as "smooth" as it could be, and if the feats are redefined, there is less of a backward compatibility issue because the feats themselves are redefined in the rules.

Also, the AC and Damage bonus are quick to figure out, since they are essentially 1/2 of the fighter's level. I also was concerned that the fighter was becoming more and more specialized, so these abilities focus on them being good at combat in general.

FIGHTER
Alignment: Any.
Hit Die: d10.

Class Skills
The fighter’s class skills are Climb (Str), Craft (Int), Handle Animal (Cha), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (dungeoneering)
(Int), Knowledge (engineering) (Int), Profession (Wis), Ride (Dex), Survival (Wis), and Swim (Str).

Skill Ranks at 1st Level: 2 + Int modifier

Table: The Fighter

Level

1st (note, BAB and saves stay the same as per the regular class)
Bonus feat, Bravery (+1)

2nd

Bonus feat, Weapon Training (+1), Armor Training (+1), Armor Mobility

3rd

Feat Boost

4th

Bonus feat, Weapon Training (+2), Armor Training (+2), Bravery (+2)

5th

Feat Boost

6th

Bonus feat, Weapon Training (+3), Armor Training (+3)

7th

Feat Boost

8th

Bonus feat, Weapon Training (+4), Armor Training (+4), Bravery (+3)

9th

Feat Boost

10th

Bonus feat, Weapon Training (+5), Armor Training (+5)

11th

Feat Boost

12th

Bonus feat, Weapon Training (+6), Armor Training (+6), Bravery (+4)

13th

Feat Boost

14th

Bonus feat, Weapon Training (+7), Armor Training (+7)

15th

Feat Boost

16th

Bonus feat, Weapon Training (+8), Armor Training (+8), Bravery (+5)

17th

Feat Boost

18th

Bonus feat, Weapon Training (+9), Armor Training (+9), Armor Mastery

19th

Feat Boost

20th

Bonus feat, Weapon Training (+10), Armor Training (+10), Fearless, Weapon Mastery

Class Features

All of the following are class features of the fighter.

Weapon and Armor Proficiency: A fighter is proficient with all simple and martial weapons and with all armor (heavy, medium, and light) and shields (including tower shields).

Bonus Feats: At 1st level, a fighter gets a bonus combat-oriented feat in addition to the feat that any 1st-level character gets and the bonus feat granted to a human character. The fighter gains an additional bonus feat at 2nd level and every two fighter levels thereafter (4th, 6th, 8th, 10th, 12th, 14th, 16th, 18th, and 20th). These bonus feats must be drawn from the feats noted as fighter bonus feats. A fighter must still meet all prerequisites for a bonus feat, including ability score and base attack bonus minimums.

If a fighter takes a feat with his fighter bonus feat, he gains a special function of that feat that is only available when a fighter takes that feat using his fighter bonus feat. Even a fighter using other feats to gain access to these feats does not gain the benefits of these extra effects.

These bonus feats are in addition to the feat that a character of any class gets from advancing levels. A fighter is not limited to the list of fighter bonus feats when choosing these feats.

Bravery (Ex): A fighter is trained to not loose his nerve in combat, the these steely nerves allow him a bonus on his saving throws against any fear effects that he would normally be subject to.

Weapon Training (Ex): The fighter trains with weapons in a manner that no other class does. They learn how to best do damage with these implements of combat, and they gain the listed bonus whenever using a weapon to be applied to the damage of the weapon if it hits successfully.

This bonus also applies to unarmed damage if the fighter takes Improved Unarmed Strike.

Armor Training (Ex): A fighter learns how best to wear his armor and to move to take advantage of its protection in combat, and gains the listed bonus to his armor class so long a he is wearing armor in combat. If he has no armor on, he does not get the listed bonus.

Armor Mobility (Ex): A fighter with this ability never suffers a loss of movement rate due to the armor he is wearing. His movement rate might still be lowered due to encumbrance, but never due to the type of armor he is wearing.

Feat Boost: At every level that a fighter does not gain a bonus feat, he gains a feat boost which can be used once per day per feat boost that the fighter has. For example, at fifth level, the fighter has two feat boosts available to him per day. These boosts are replenished after 8 hours of rest, but these hours do not need to be consecutive.

Each fighter bonus feat has a listed effect that is triggered when a Feat Boost is used. Feat Boosts can be triggered as a swift action.

Armor Mastery (Ex): When a fighter with this ability wears armor of any sort, he gains DR 5/- against any attacks made against him that would be subject to damage reduction.

Fearless (Ex): The fighter is now immune to any fear affects that he might be subject to.

Weapon Mastery (Ex): The fighter add one additional multiplier to all of his critical hits with any weapon he uses (for example, a x3 weapon becomes a x4 weapon), and adds one half his fighter level to his confirmation roll to confirm a critical hit.


I'm wondering if the fighter's bonus damage should only apply to weapons he is proficient with, and I'm still kind of going back and forth between if the fighter knows how to hurt someone regardless of weapon, or if its based on a knowledge of the weapon.

I don't think its a big problem either way.


Examples of feat boost ?


MScam wrote:
Examples of feat boost ?

Using a feat boost for for Weapon Focus, for example, allows you to reroll your attack roll. Using a feat boost on Weapon Specialization, for example, gives you a reroll on your weapon damage.

A feat boost on improved critical allows you to auto confirm a critical.


The initial feat boost ability in the BOXM doesn't list it as a swift action, but does limit you to boosting the feat only once per day, so you might have 5 feat boosts, but you could only boost weapon specialization once, for example.

I think this might work better than using them as a swift action, because when I thought about it, you couldn't boost improved initiative (if it was reworked the BOXM way), under this system.


Just as a quick explanation, a lot of feat boosts for anything that adds to your chance to hit gives you a reroll on the attack roll, and if it modifies you damage, you get a reroll on your damage. If it boosts your AC, it usually makes your opponent reroll against you.

Also, the following should be added to the Armor Training ability:

Your bonus to armor class from this ability offsets penalties to anything that is affected by an armor check penalty. It also acts as a bonus to your maximum dexterity bonus for that armor.

You can never gain a bonus from an offset penalty, or gain a dexterity bonus greater than you are allowed for your ability score.


I have to say I like it! It does not fix all of the fighter problems but it helps in a lot of other ways. Good job.


Why can he only do feat boosts a limited number of times per day? What's the justification?


KnightErrantJR wrote:

Just as a quick explanation, a lot of feat boosts for anything that adds to your chance to hit gives you a reroll on the attack roll, and if it modifies you damage, you get a reroll on your damage. If it boosts your AC, it usually makes your opponent reroll against you.

In general I am opposed to abilities that grant re-rolls. I prefer having to declare before rolling you are using the ability and taking the better of the two rolls if any type of re-roll is offered.


BlaineTog wrote:
Why can he only do feat boosts a limited number of times per day? What's the justification?

Well, feat boost represent having "perfect form" with a given feat, so I would guess that "in game" you aren't going to perform a certain feat perfectly every time you use a given talent.

Metagame wise, its just like any other ability you have to limit. It wouldn't be either an effective use of time or probably balanced to let a fighter reroll every attack roll with a weapon that he has weapon focus in.


Freesword wrote:


In general I am opposed to abilities that grant re-rolls. I prefer having to declare before rolling you are using the ability and taking the better of the two rolls if any type of re-roll is offered.

Well, as I said, I kind of imported the feat boosts and expanded feat abilities for fighter bonus feats wholesale from the BOXM II, and that's how many of the feat boosts work there, but not of all them do work in that way (as I said, a feat boost for improved critical just auto confirms the critical).


KnightErrantJR wrote:


Well, as I said, I kind of imported the feat boosts and expanded feat abilities for fighter bonus feats wholesale from the BOXM II, and that's how many of the feat boosts work there, but not of all them do work in that way (as I said, a feat boost for improved critical just auto confirms the critical).

I'm generally supportive of the concepts feat boosts and extra bonuses for fighters who take them as bonus feats presented in BOXM II. The implementations, especially the re-roll mechanic, could in my opinion use some adjustment. Was less thrilled with the uberfeats I believe they were called which took up multiple feat slots. As for boosts, I could accept an x/day mechanic, but would prefer a resource pool to spend for the ability. Most of this is just personal preference.


Freesword wrote:


I'm generally supportive of the concepts feat boosts and extra bonuses for fighters who take them as bonus feats presented in BOXM II. The implementations, especially the re-roll mechanic, could in my opinion use some adjustment. Was less thrilled with the uberfeats I believe they were called which took up multiple feat slots. As for boosts, I could accept an x/day mechanic, but would prefer a resource pool to spend for the ability. Most of this is just personal preference.

Yeah, I felt that the double feats, uberfeats, and fighting domains just made the fighter class way too complicated, and wouldn't work in the Pathfinder backwards compatible paradigm either.


KnightErrantJR wrote:
Well, feat boost represent having "perfect form" with a given feat, so I would guess that "in game" you aren't going to perform a certain feat perfectly every time you use a given talent.

That would be modeled by a skill (or other type of) check, not a per-day limit. Possibly, the use could be tiring, and might require a fort save to avoid fatigue But per-day limits on mundane/Ex. abilities really just make no darn sense.


BlaineTog wrote:
KnightErrantJR wrote:
Well, feat boost represent having "perfect form" with a given feat, so I would guess that "in game" you aren't going to perform a certain feat perfectly every time you use a given talent.
That would be modeled by a skill (or other type of) check, not a per-day limit. Possibly, the use could be tiring, and might require a fort save to avoid fatigue But per-day limits on mundane/Ex. abilities really just make no darn sense.

A resource pool (points or tokens) would be the ideal mechanic, but adding that tends to be an uphill fight. Personally I could see this as a great use of Action/Hero points if you used such a thing. A fatigue penalty for use is too harsh (especially in the middle of combat) and adding in a check to avoid it adds complexity (an additional roll) and runs the risk of reaching the auto success point where the boost becomes a constant.

If boosts are looked at as an extra ordinary use of the feat, going above and beyond what is normal, then it makes sense for the limit to exist even if it does seem a bit forced. It makes no less sense than the old x/day rage of the 3.x Barbarian (an Ex. ability). Going with x/day is more of a compromise than anything else, a short cut. It's assigning an arbitrary limit instead of adding a (or re-using an existing) subsystem to handle the limitation. Considering the fight over rage points, as much as I hate x/day abilities (despise them) I don't see any other option that works as smoothly that would be accepted.


Freesword wrote:
If boosts are looked at as an extra ordinary use of the feat, going above and beyond what is normal, then it makes sense for the limit to exist even if it does seem a bit forced.

Sure, but there's no reason for it to be forced. There are plenty of resources to draw from: action points you mentioned (and I might even agree with), but it could also fatigue the fighter, or possibly deal strength or nonlethal damage, or maybe he takes a penalty to saves for a period of time, or any of a number of reasons to not use it all that often, all of which would make sense than. It's hard enough to roleplay all of the random abilities D&D characters get without them not making any sense.

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