|
Last night we had a PC death in our SCAP campaign, and the player was in tears about it. Apparently she had misunderstood when I told her if the adventure continued, she would not get any XP for it, since her character was dead. She thought I meant she could no longer gain XP, period. And while she does have some other things on her mind (her husband is leaving for Army Basic Training in a couple weeks), it concerns me that she would cry about this. Has anyone else had a similar situation? Any thoughts on how, or if, I need to deal with this?
|
Oh,
tread carefully.
If the tears are a result from real life situations then don't worry about it. At all. These things happen. A spouse getting ready for Basic in this country right now is enough to make one's emotional state a trifle thin. It's inappropriate for the DM to jump in -- that is, assuming "DM/ Player" is the only relationship y'all have (if there's more, of course, it depends on y'all's relationship).
Keep a DM's eye on your Players the next couple sessions.
If you see that it is the character death that made her cry, sheesh, playfully let her know that these things happen sometimes. And maybe tone down the color of the following sessions a bit. But it shouldn't be too lasting a problem.
Where are you guys in SCAP?
-W. E. Ray
|
I've never seen a player cry, but my little brother (as DM) killed a new girl's barbarian in the first game and she ended up crying.
I made a student cry in class when I caught him plagiarizing on an essay in a section of college freshman comp I taught a few years ago. Never had a player cry though (not from a lack of trying, I'm sure some would say), but the depths of depravity that Aberzombie, his little brother, and my little brother showed playing demons in an In Nomine game I ran used to leave me on the brink of tears as I'd try to sleep at night.
|
|
Oh,
tread carefully.If the tears are a result from real life situations then don't worry about it. At all. These things happen. A spouse getting ready for Basic in this country right now is enough to make one's emotional state a trifle thin. It's inappropriate for the DM to jump in -- that is, assuming "DM/ Player" is the only relationship y'all have (if there's more, of course, it depends on y'all's relationship).
Keep a DM's eye on your Players the next couple sessions.
If you see that it is the character death that made her cry, sheesh, playfully let her know that these things happen sometimes. And maybe tone down the color of the following sessions a bit. But it shouldn't be too lasting a problem.
Where are you guys in SCAP?
-W. E. Ray
The player is the wife of my wife's godson. Almost need a picture to map out that relationship. So, yeah, talking to her about her husband going away might or might not be appropriate. But I will certainly be keeping an eye on her for other signs she's taking it too seriously. I try to keep it pretty light anyway, as one of the players is my 7 year old son.
We just started Zenith Trajectory, and she died fighting the Cryohydra. The party actually had enough money to pay the 5000gp donation for raise dead, so she came back, and they will hit the temple next week.
|
Most of my players are cool with dying - in fact, when I suggest weaseling them out of it they say "nah, it's cool, it is way more dramatic to die."
One player gets pretty vindictive about dying, which just encourages me to not care when he gets brutalized. Another player just gets ticked when things don't go his way - dice fickleness or not.
I made a student cry in class when I caught him plagiarizing on an essay in a section of college freshman comp I taught a few years ago.
WTF? Boo hoo, I was caught committing fraud and I could get disbarred or expelled. Take some bloody responsibility. They better have cried. And begged, too.
Sorry. I really have it in for plagiarists.
I made a student cry in class when I caught him plagiarizing on an essay in a section of college freshman comp I taught a few years ago.
I don't even have to catch them to make them cry; my mind control is that good. :) I gave an exam where I offered students who forgot the formulae needed a chance to get half credit by coming up to me and I would write the formula (in red ink) on their exam. One girl decided to try to cover up the fact that I had written the formula for her by writing over the red ink in black ink. She wasn;t out the door more than two minutes before she was back in tears, confessing and begging for mercy.
As for the OP, I might make a point of taking a couple of minutes to sit down with your crying player and reassuring her about how XP works and how death "works" in a fantasy world. Talk to her as well as you know her, and let her know she should be free to ask about any confusing parts of the game, or that she can take a little time to digest what has occurred if she wants. Ultimately, you're the best judge of how serious an issue this is, and keeping an eye is good idea.
|
|
WTF? Boo hoo, I was caught committing fraud and I could get disbarred or expelled. Take some bloody responsibility. They better have cried. And begged, too.
Sorry. I really have it in for plagiarists.
Notice I didn't say I felt bad about it. The kid was a foreign student on a study visa, his first semester in the country. He nearly got kicked out of the school, and that would have meant he was on his way back to Sri Lanka. I tried warning the kids I'd catch them if they tried cheating. So, no sympathy for him.
I still use that story to scare my students. It works.
No crying gamers in my experience since the 8th grade. I had a friend who was running a home-brewed space campaign that he'd cobbled together from Gamma World, Star Frontiers, and various things of his own design. He was a Monty Hall sort of GM and let things get out of hand. He asked me to roleplay a bounty hunter sent out to take down the leader of the PC band. I figured it would be fun, so I agreed.
I made an AI robot, outfitted him, and told him my plans on how to track down the PCs and their ship. I blasted my way in, fought through their automated defenses and the other PCs, cornering the offending player's character on the command deck. He shot everything he had at me, which didn't make a dent, and came to the realization that his character was about to die. At which point he threw down his dice and proceeded to bawl like a baby.
At that point I took my character sheet, handed it to the GM and said "Do what you like. I'm done," and left. That was the last time I ever gamed with that guy. It really freaked me out. Granted, he was only 13 years old at the time, but still...a little too weird for me.
He was a Monty Hall sort of GM and let things get out of hand...
...cornering the offending player's character...
???
At that point I took my character sheet, handed it to the GM and said "Do what you like. I'm done," and left. That was the last time I ever gamed with that guy.
Which guy? The "offending player," or the DM who created the problem and then had you come in and execute a player's character?
Which guy? The "offending player," or the DM who created the problem and then had you come in and execute a player's character?
The guy who cried. The reason I called him the "offending player" is because he was the one who was running roughshod over the GM, causing him to want to put the character he was playing out of commission.
Yes, it was the GM who let things get out of hand, but the fact that the guy started crying like a baby when his character was in a losing situation just creeped me out. I'd seen people cry like that when they lose family members, or perhaps even a family pet, but not an imaginary person on a sheet of paper.
|
|
I had a female gamer cry twice during one campaign! The first tears were shed when her character's "boyfriend/lover" died, and the other tears came about with the death of her character (thus ending the campaign, as it was solo)...
I was 28/29 at the time, and she was a little younger (I think she was like 25, but this was 10 years ago at least). She just REALLY got into the story and the characters/NPCs involved...
I'd seen people cry like that when they lose family members, or perhaps even a family pet, but not an imaginary person on a sheet of paper.
I realize you were talking about a male gamer (whom you describe as being a tad immature to boot), but have you never seen a woman cry while reading a book, or perhaps watching a movie (my wife for example, cried while reading the original Dragonlance Trilogy whenever one of the main characters died)?
I guess to her (the player, not my wife), it was just that, like a good sad book or sad movie (some women can get all mushy like that)...
Hehehe... Some men too...
Anyway...
I took it as a complement to my DMing ;-)
-That One Digitalelf Fellow-
|
I only remember one campaign where a player cried over the death of his character. We were teens back then and played a lot in those days. The group was pretty high in levels (around 17th or 18th) and the campaign was, at that point, going for nearly a year. The death of this character was very dramatic as he was holding the ground against a bunch of drow killers so his comrades could flee. We were all pretty shocked to see his tears running as he handed me his character sheet. I was very surprised to see him cry, because he always behaved really tough-minded and hard boiled. He later explained that he couldn't help it, because he was so involved in this character and the story and to him it felt, like if a friend had died. He didn't cry because he felt the death was unfair or something; it was his choice to defend his seriously wounded fellows so they could get away. It was just the dramatic scene and the sadness of the event, that moved him to tears.
I too took this as a compliment for my DMing. :)
I had a female gamer cry twice during one campaign! The first tears were shed when her character's "boyfriend/lover" died,
I had this too. In her defence she was 11 and I'm pretty sure I killed her first boyfriend, even if he was imaginary.
|
|
My players don't cry over dead characters. In fact, one of the regular side-conversations around the table is about the characters they have "in the hopper" waiting to be called into action when their current character buys it.
I've never really considered myself a Killer DM, but the Age of Worms is doing its best to give me that rep.
It did happen a few times in my games, having players sheding tears.
But if most of them were sad tears, sometimes it was tears of joy, which is great.
However, once a player lost his character in my game. He went to the bathroom where i found him, burning his character sheet, in tears. Now this is not the degree of involvement i wish to my players. I gave him a hug and took the group out for diner.
I always try to put some emotion in the game, such as in lyric descriptions (for immersion), exposition of situations (for better involvement), and interactions with NPCs (for relations of love/hate), working on appropriate vocabulary, tone and pace.
I must say it often works, and i am proud of it.
Up to a certain limit, of course. I consider this is my responsability, as a DM, to be vigilant about emotionally fragile players.
|
|
Damnnnnn.....
Well, let's see, I think I've had my daughter in tears at least 3 times at the table due to character deaths. This is over about 8 years of play, mind you, and she was maybe 8 or 9 the first time her character was killed. Now, she's almost 15 and she laughed when her character died last week at Foxglove Manor.
Mostly, when she was younger, I'd let her cry, help her to realize death was part of the game, that it was ok to be sad, and help her create the new character.
Except Lifin, a 3.0 Elven Ranger who got Reincarnated as a wolverine. If the 3.0 reincarnation charts had been kept for 3.5 I think she might have gone around looking for ways to off her characters so they could come back as something cooler.
Crying? There is no crying in D&D!!
Yeah, no kidding. It is just a game. That would be like someone hating WotC just because they changed the game.
Crying? There is no crying in D&D!!Yeah, no kidding. It is just a game. That would be like someone hating WotC just because they changed the game.
Not at all.
Were you to make an industry-wide radical change to something I hold dear (Chicago Style Hot-Dogs) just because you legally *can* (no argument with that - it's your right to do so), and **then** proceed to tell me that I was rather dim and that my taste in Hot Dogs (and that of my friends) was without merit because you've decided that the thing we hold dear (Chicago Style Hot-Dogs) were not "tasty", I might well expend the effort to "hate" you for your ill-conceived and foolish actions in denigrating my preferences and choices in public with other Hot dog fans.
Sure, I might hate ya, and I might think that putting tofu and used motor oil on a Hot Dog and calling it a Chicago Dog is self-defeating for your company. . .
. . . but I ain't gonna cry. :)
. . . but I ain't gonna cry. :)
Glad to hear it.
|
|
One girl decided to try to cover up the fact that I had written the formula for her by writing over the red ink in black ink.
You know, this NEVER gets old for me. I just laugh for hours on end. Not even just every semester but almost every CLASS a student does something like this. It makes me laugh every time. Out loud. And hopefully in front the rest of the kiddies.
Come on folks, I've written thousands of MLA pages over the years. Graded tens of thousands. Do you really think your prof can't tell the difference between 12 point font and 13?!? Instantly. Or Times New Roman from Courier New?!? I like to walk up to the dry-erase board and write in huge letters, so it can hardly fit on the whole board, "Do Not Resort to Blatently Obvious Attempts to Make Your Paper Seem Longer!"
-----------------
Oh, and one of the girls that did cry for me was a guilty plagiarist. I wrote "SEE ME" at the top of her paper without any grade or marks and she came to me knowing, knowing she was busted. It was so pitiful. She came into my office, her little, lower lip was justa quivering; she looked like she was 12 years old instead of 19. I just gave her the "James Dickey" stare-down for a few moments before looking at the paper and failing her.
To finish the story, though, she retook the course -- with me, even, the next semester and did well, a semester B.
-W. E. Ray
|
Except Lifin, a 3.0 Elven Ranger who got Reincarnated as a wolverine.ROTFLAUGHING!!
This is awesome.
Speaking of which, anyone have a file of the old reincarnate list that let you come back as weird stuff from like 2E or so? I would love to get that, the new reincarnate list is just so damn boring.
|
You know, this NEVER gets old for me. I just laugh for hours on end. Not even just every semester but almost every CLASS a student does something like this. It makes me laugh every time. Out loud. And hopefully in front the rest of the kiddies.
My father-in-law always laughs about some of the folks he deals with. Every time a paper gets handed in by the class, he just does some Google searches on certain suspicious sentences and sure enough, he always gets a few and most show little remorse, they're almost mad they got caught.
Only time I had a kid cry was when he joined my campaign later than the others and didn't reach level 4 at the same time as everyone else... It was pretty pathetic... Everyone was stunned, and the game stopped for about 10 minutes while he pulled himself together.
... most show little remorse, they're almost mad they got caught.
From a student's perspective, I have never understood this. I have seen it since gradeschool right through to the present in my junior year. You know the rules. You know you broke them. You got caught. How in the world is this the professor's fault?
I'm also always amused by the way my peers evaluate good and bad intructors. Good ones are the people who never ask you to do anything; i.e., don't actually teach. The ones that give assignments and commit the horrid sin of trying to shove some knowledge into said peers' thick skulls are mean, nasty people out for blood!
As to the topic at hand, no, no-one's ever cried at my games.
|
|
The player is the wife of my wife's godson. Almost need a picture to map out that relationship.
No, I got it, Your wife's godson's wife.
See what talking in active voice does?
We just started Zenith Trajectory, and she died fighting the Cryohydra.
Ah man, I wish I could help more here but I fell SO in love with "Zenith Trajectory" by David Noonan -- it's my favorite module ever probably -- I, of course, rewrote it completely.
For me the cryohydra wasn't a combat encounter but a comic relief one. She was a little flighty; each of her heads had a different personality -- very like Zsh'Pzora (or whatever) from Daughter of the Drow by Elaine Cunningham. Except there's 6 heads instead of two.
And I made Bhal Hamatugn FAR more like Apocalypse Now and Zenith far more like Marlon Brando. There were Kuo-Toa children fondling the mutilated corpse of an aboleth, Kuo-Toa hanging from their feet with just their heads in water, drow, kuo-toa & mind flayers floating belly up in pools, Blipdoolpoolp's statue was disturbingly desecrated -- Zenith locked up all the PCs in a prison with no real prison door and the mummy guarding their equipment just stood there and guarded the equipment. Of course, they could walk out of their cells but where were they gonna go? We segued about 30 days of imprisonment where I could describe all kinds of horrible "vile-rated" experiences they endured. Sometimes Zenith would "befriend" a PC and take him away, whispering all kinds of crazy stuff (much of which were clues to the campaign). All in all the funest session I've run in any campaign in years -- maybe ever.
As such, my experience is likely to be quite different than the one you're preparing. And mine was so dark anyway, well, your wife's godson's wife may not be the only one to cry after a session like mine.
-W. E. Ray
You're a teacher Molech?
I wonder if any of my teachers play DnD?
Or can catch cheaters as well as you? :(
|
|
From a student's perspective, I have never understood this. I have seen it since gradeschool
Dude, you've seen plagiarism in grade school?
You know the rules. You know you broke them. You got caught. How in the world is this the professor's fault?
Ah ha, see, it's not my fault; It's not my fault!
(psst, Saern, can I quote this?)I'm also always amused by the way my peers evaluate good and bad intructors. Good ones are the people who never ask you to do anything; i.e., don't actually teach. The ones that give assignments and commit the horrid sin of trying to shove some knowledge into said peers' thick skulls are mean, nasty people out for blood!
I always give a brief plagiarism lecture at the beginning of each course. As such none of my students (anymore) really act surprised when they get caught -- and I'm really good at catching them. Of course, I adopted this policy the semester after the incident I described earlier, mostly because of the incident. Haven't had a problem with a student since: when they get caught they suck it up (at least in front of me) and accept that they just failed the course and have to retake.
Oh, and for the record, it's generally safe to say I'm one of those profs that students either "Hate the Most" or "Love Forever"; I'm either your favorite or your worst nightmare.
As to the topic at hand, no, no-one's ever cried at my games.
Um, well, thanks for contributing.
-W. E. Ray
|
|
I wonder if any of my teachers play DnD?
I believe it was Doug Niles (99%) that was a fifth grade teacher in MN when one of his students had to be absent from school one day 'cause her dad was going to be on TV promoting a game he just invented, D&D or something.
And ole Doug was curious.
And watched the tv program.
And became the Doug Niles instead of just "Doug Niles."
-W. E. Ray
|
|
Oh, and for the record, it's generally safe to say I'm one of those profs that students either "Hate the Most" or "Love Forever"; I'm either your favorite or your worst nightmare.
Check yourself out on RateMyProfessors.com or profrater.com. My father-in-law did and was actually surprised by mostly decent results.
|
RPG Superstar 2009 Top 8
|
Last year I found one essay with a blatant example of plagiarism. Instead of failing the student I announced in class "I've found an essay that was plagiarized. I won't say anything more about it. If you think it was yours, you have until midnight to resubmit by email."
Half the class was pissing themselves in fear. The other half were pissing themselves laughing.
10 out of 30 students resubmitted.
From a student's perspective, I have never understood this. I have seen it since gradeschoolDude, you've seen plagiarism in grade school?
Yes, and lots of it.
You know the rules. You know you broke them. You got caught. How in the world is this the professor's fault?Ah ha, see, it's not my fault; It's not my fault!
(psst, Saern, can I quote this?)
Only if you give me a proper citation!
As to the topic at hand, no, no-one's ever cried at my games.Um, well, thanks for contributing.
I'm here to help! :)
I realize you were talking about a male gamer (whom you describe as being a tad immature to boot), but have you never seen a woman cry while reading a book, or perhaps watching a movie (my wife for example, cried while reading the original Dragonlance Trilogy whenever one of the main characters died)?
I guess to her (the player, not my wife), it was just that, like a good sad book or sad movie (some women can get all mushy like that)...
Hehehe... Some men too...
Anyway...
I took it as a complement to my DMing ;-)
-That One Digitalelf Fellow-
Well, I'd say more than just a "tad" immature...
Although now that you mention it, I had an NPC give his life for one of the PCs and his final breaths got a few of the gamers choked up, but no tears that I could see. Who knew a goblin could grow to be so endearing?
I've never seen a player cry, but my little brother (as DM) killed a new girl's barbarian in the first game and she ended up crying.
Yikes.
Rone's first rule of DMing people new to the game: Their first time out, everyone lives.
|
|
For the record, I earned my degree fair and square. I applaud the professors out here keep their students honest. As far as players are concerned, getting choked up over in-game events is kind of cool. Poor sportsmanship is not. Being sensitive because of out of game circumstances is touchy. Be a little aloof. Maybe run a less lethal side quest, perhaps RP focused, for a session or two to let things cool down.
Check yourself out on RateMyProfessors.com or profrater.com. My father-in-law did and was actually surprised by mostly decent results.
*checks*
Well what do you know? I'm actually listed on ratemyprofessors.com. Granted I only have one rating, but it's a good one. Not bad for my first year...now if I could just get a little chili pepper in my listing, then we're talking.
Speaking of which, anyone have a file of the old reincarnate list that let you come back as weird stuff from like 2E or so? I would love to get that, the new reincarnate list is just so damn boring.
If you're really, really interested, I have a (nearly) comprehensive list of all possible reincarnation bodies. The 3.0 version that I made is very detailed, with sub-charts adn sub-sub-sharts and possibly even sub-sub-sub-charts, and includes nearly every WOTC-presented humanoid race (and possibly a few others). I played with bringing it up to 3.5, but it's still a work in progress. And yes, I long for groups with frequent players deaths and ties to druids... Sadly, I only ever got to use it twice.
Statistically, it stays true to the type of creature one can be reincarnated into (humanoid, animal, etc.) and simply expands on the option. It also includes vermin and fey, and a few oddballs I just like. And there's roughly a 0.1% chance of coming back as something terribly innocuous (like a caterpillar or a hummingbird) and an equal percentage chance of coming back as something a little more powerful.
Let me know your email, and I can mail you the files (in Word format).
|
|
Speaking of which, anyone have a file of the old reincarnate list that let you come back as weird stuff from like 2E or so? I would love to get that, the new reincarnate list is just so damn boring.
Ask Aberzombie some time how much fun I had with his wizard and that list. Sometimes I think I used to kill him just to be able to make that roll to see what he'd come back as next.
Come on folks, I've written thousands of MLA pages over the years. Graded tens of thousands. Do you really think your prof can't tell the difference between 12 point font and 13?!? Instantly. Or Times New Roman from Courier New?!? I like to walk up to the dry-erase board and write in huge letters, so it can hardly fit on the whole board, "Do Not Resort to Blatently Obvious Attempts to Make Your Paper Seem Longer!"
Just impose a word count minimum rather than a page count minimum. Works like a charm.
Last year I found one essay with a blatant example of plagiarism. Instead of failing the student I announced in class "I've found an essay that was plagiarized. I won't say anything more about it. If you think it was yours, you have until midnight to resubmit by email."
Half the class was pissing themselves in fear. The other half were pissing themselves laughing.
10 out of 30 students resubmitted.
I just about died laughing when I read that!
On a more serious note, it reminded me of a saddening experience. I was in a classroom situation as a student less than 5 years ago. It was at the post-graduate level, with an international student body being taught in English. Our Marketing instructor had given us an assignment: look up a particular franchise on the internet, and write a report about it, answering certain questions which she had posed us.
When our instructor returned our assignments, she said: "These reports were done in one of three ways. Most of them were cut and paste jobs. A few paraphrased the original website content. Only one person did the assignment which I gave you."
Ouch. Out of a class of about 25, that hurts.
(By the way, 'twas I who did the assignment correctly.)