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There is an inclination in D&D to give any divine class a warrior-mentality because divine casters can wear armor (see Paladin, Cleric, Favored Soul).
I would love a new Priest class that has stronger casting ability and less combat prowess. Something like:
HD: d6
BAB: Low
Good Saves: Will
Skill Points: 4+Int
Magic Bonus Feats (Similar to Wizard)
Spells Known: as Cleric
Spells/Day: more than Cleric (no domains)
I know Unearthed Arcana has the Cloistered Cleric variant, but I think a few other abilities are needed to fill this role (namely, a divine magic powerhouse).
I personally prefer less classes but each with much more flexibility.
I personally feel, the cleric is just to martially flavored to fit to every deity.
F.e. In FR, there is Sune Firehair, the Goddess of Love. Can you imagine a Cleric of Sune in Full Armor? Or a Cleric of Peace?
Clerics only work so far before feeling unappropriate.
Therefor I would like to see a Priest class too.
You could even think of making it combined with the Druid.
=> Cleric class (no neutral allignement). Combatant for the higher purpose
=> Priest class (only neutral allignements). Shepherds and prophets of their faith
Something like this.
(I am doing an own D&D3.75 and thinking about putting Paladin and Cleric together into one class!)
Stop giving clerics things. They already have as many spells/day as a wizard, a better HD, 3/4 BAB, two good saves, no ASF, and more versatility because of dual domains.
Who want's to give them things?!
I'd say it's more the other way round here.
The proposed changes make them like wizards, only better.
I would not mind seeing a cleric class that was closer to the wizard than it is to fighter. When it comes down to it they are conceptually closer to the wizard. The main difference is their source of power and their class skills. This would also bring the paladin more into his own in the church hierarchy as the warriors of the faith.
For the more martially minded clerics perhaps an intermediate (5-level prestige class) class. Could also include such for a war wizard type of character.
-Weylin Stormcrowe
F.e. In FR, there is Sune Firehair, the Goddess of Love. Can you imagine a Cleric of Sune in Full Armor? Or a Cleric of Peace?
Absolutely, I can see a Cleric of Sune, in full mithral plate w/ gold inlay and perhaps a gem or two, staring at himself in the polished surface of his shield, fixing his hair, and thinking "Damm, I'm good looking." ;).
Or a priestess of Eldath asking the warrior, with a look of disdain upon her features "Why would I wear such cumbersome equipment?" At which point the warrior answers "Because love, if ya don't want your pool to become an orc privy, you're gonna have to stand with the rest of us against the horde." :pSeriously though, priests wear the heaviest armor they can because unlike wizards, they are expected to be on the front lines providing succor and healing.
While the ability to provide healing in a radius, vice touch, allivates some of this responsibility to be next to your companions on the battlefield, it is a cerics duty to be able to provide timely aid to his companions. I am currently playing a cleric, and the ability to trust in my armor to protect me while I heal my companions, means to me at least, that I never hesitate to place myself in harms way for their sakes.
I really don't see a need for this.
I'll beat the drum I've been beating all along.
Don't change the cleric class (or any other base class).
(see my similar post about fighters.)
Instead, provide alternative class features. You want to be a less militant cleric? Great, provide an alternative class feature that strips away the armor and weapon proficiencies, and instead provides some casting benefit - perhaps all spells are at +1 caster level or their effective Wisdom is two higher for purposes of determining bonus spells.
That way, anyone who wants to use the base cleric can, nobody has to rewrite thousands of pages of existing material, and people who want a different cleric get what they want.
I know Paizo can't use any of the existing alternative class features out there because they're not in the SRD, but the concept itself has to be something they can use.
Priest Core Class
Priests are members of a clerical hierarchy, completely focused on service to their patron and community. Unlike regular clerics, priests are not fighting men. Still, they need not be peaceful - they work towards their goals by inspiring and influencing the faithful or invoking miracles rather than by physical action.
All priests have a patron deity, even in worlds where clerics can choose to draw power form an ideal or alignment. They are closely tied to the domains of their patron and have access to all domain spells and powers. Finally, they are masters of metamagic, item creation, and divine invocation, gaining bonus feats that let them manipulate divine power in unforeseen ways.
Alignment
A priests alignment must be within one step of his deity's (that is, it may be one step away on either the lawful-chaotic axis or the good-evil axis, but not both). A priest may not be neutral unless his deity's alignment is also neutral. Chaotic religions rarely have priests, but they are not impossible.
Hit Die
d6.
Class Skills
The priest's class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Appraise (Int), Bluff (Cha), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Decipher Script (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Forgery (Int), Gather Information (Cha), Heal (Wis), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (Arcana) (Int), Knowledge (History) (Int), Knowledge (Local) (Int), Knowledge (Religion) (Int), Knowledge (The Planes) (Int), Listen (Wis), Move Silently (Dex), Perform (Cha), Profession (Wis), Search (Int), Sense Motive (Wis), Sleight Of Hand (Dex), Speak Language, and Spellcraft (Int).
Skill Points at 1st Level: (4 + Int modifier) ×4.
Skill Points at Each Additional Level: 4 + Int modifier.
Domains and Class Skills
A priest who chooses the Animal or Plant domain adds Knowledge (nature) (Int) to the priest class skills listed above. A priest who chooses the Knowledge domain adds all Knowledge (Int) skills to the list. A priest who chooses the Travel domain adds Survival (Wis) to the list. A priest who chooses the Trickery domain adds Bluff (Cha), Disguise (Cha), and Hide (Dex) to the list. See Deity, Domains, and Domain Spells, for more information.
Table: The Priest
(Table did not translate well. Basically, good Will save, bad BAB, spell like an ordinary cleric, except they also get as many domain spells as an ordinary cleric gets regular spells, getting Wisdom bonus to both. Bonus feat every 4 levels, but not at lvl 1.)
In addition to the stated number of spells per day for 1st- through 9th-level spells, a priest gets an equal number of domain spells for each spell level, starting at 1st. The "X+X" in the entries on this table represents these extra spells. Bonus spells the priest may receive for having a high Wisdom score apply to both regular spells and domain spells separately.
Class Features
All of the following are class features of the priest.
Weapon and Armor Proficiency
Priests are proficient with simple weapons and with light armor, but not with any type of shield. Priests rarely wear armor openly, but may wear concealed armor under their robes in times of danger.
A priest who chooses the War domain receives proficiency in their deity's favored weapon and the Weapon Focus feat related to his deity's weapon as a bonus feat.
Aura (Ex)
A priest of a chaotic, evil, good, or lawful deity has a particularly powerful aura corresponding to the deity's alignment (see the detect evil spell for details). Priests who don't worship a specific deity but choose the Chaos, Evil, Good, or Law domain have a similarly powerful aura of the corresponding alignment.
Spells
A priest casts divine spells, which are drawn from the cleric spell list. However, his alignment may restrict him from casting certain spells opposed to his moral or ethical beliefs; see Chaotic, Evil, Good, and Lawful Spells, below. A priest must choose and prepare his spells in advance (see below).
To prepare or cast a spell, a priest must have a Wisdom score equal to at least 10 + the spell level. The Difficulty Class for a saving throw against a priest's spell is 10 + the spell level + the priest's Wisdom modifier.
Like other spellcasters, a priest can cast only a certain number of spells of each spell level per day. His base daily spell allotment is given on Table: The Priest. In addition, he receives bonus spells per day if he has a high Wisdom score. A priest prepares this many cleric spells each day and this many domain spells each day; in effect, the priest has two sets of spells and receives Wisdom bonuses to both.
Example: A third level priest with a Wisdom of 14 can prepare three first-level spells and two second-level spells from the cleric list, and the same number of spells from among those gained from his domains.
Priests meditate or pray for their spells. Each priest must choose a time at which he must spend 1 hour each day in quiet contemplation or supplication to regain his daily allotment of spells. Time spent resting has no effect on whether a priest can prepare spells. A priest may prepare and cast any spell on the priest spell list, provided that he can cast spells of that level, but he must choose which spells to prepare during his daily meditation.
Deity, Domains, and Domain Spells
A priest's deity influences his alignment, what magic he can perform, his values, and how others see him. A priest learns to use all the domains belonging to his deity. Some gods give more domains than others.
A priest who serves a monotheistic deity, a dualistic deity, or a pantheon can only receive five domains in this way, and the selection is not an individual matter; it is decided by the sect you are a part of or your position in the church. Decide upon which domains to take together with the DM.
Each domain gives the priest access to a domain spell at each spell level he can cast, from 1st on up, as well as a granted power. The priest gets the granted powers of all domains he knows.
Turn or Rebuke Undead (Su)
Any priest, regardless of alignment, has the power to affect undead creatures by channeling the power of his faith through his holy (or unholy) symbol (see Turn or Rebuke Undead).
A good priest (or a neutral priest who worships a good deity) can turn or destroy undead creatures. An evil priest (or a neutral priest who worships an evil deity) instead rebukes or commands such creatures. A neutral priest of a neutral deity must choose whether his turning ability functions as that of a good priest or an evil priest. Some neutral deities specify whether their neutral clerics turn or rebuke undead. Once this choice is made, it cannot be reversed except by changing deity and/or alignment.
A priest may attempt to turn undead a number of times per day equal to 3 + his Charisma modifier. As a synergy, a priest with 5 or more ranks in Knowledge (religion) gets a +2 bonus on turning checks against undead.
Bonus Feats
Every four levels (at 4th, 8th, 12th, 16th, and 20th level) a priest gains a bonus feat. At each such opportunity, she can choose a metamagic feat, an item creation feat, or a divine feat. The priest must still meet all prerequisites for a bonus feat, including caster level minimums.
These bonus feats are in addition to the feat that a character of any class gets from advancing levels. The priest is not limited to the categories of item creation feats, metamagic feats, or divine feats when choosing these feats.
Bonus Languages
A priest's bonus language options include Celestial, Abyssal, and Infernal (the languages of good, chaotic evil, and lawful evil outsiders, respectively). These choices are in addition to the bonus languages available to the character because of his race.
Ex-Priests
A priest who grossly violates the code of conduct required by his god loses all spells and class features, except for weapon and armor proficiency. He cannot thereafter gain levels as a priest of that god until he atones (see the atonement spell description).
Notes and Options
Druidic Priest Option [edit]
Certain druidic faiths in advanced societies might have priests. These would cast spells from the druid spell list rather than the cleric spell list. Domain spells are not affected. In order to use this option, the druidic priest must have a patron that grants domains.
Note on Prestige Classes
Many prestige classes geared for clerics become too powerful in the hands of priests. Prestige classes that grant +1 level of spell ability with divine spells only have only a limited effect on the priest's ability to cast domain spells. The spells per day for domain spells does not improve, except that when you gain a new level of spells, you also gain a single spell per day for domain spells of that level, with no bonus spells for high wisdom score. Prestige classes that advance spellcasting abilities of any kind work normally for priests.
I view priests as something for NPCs. There are tons of followers of a particular diety who administer to the laypeople, conduct services, and perform religious rites, but weren't blessed with the power or given the training to handle the more dangerous challenges that clerics face. Maybe they can work some divine magic, perform healings and such, but it is the clerics that were trained to battle the major threats. That includes training with certain weapons and armor. Maybe tweak Adept to create a Priest NPC class, but I don't see the need for a Priest PC class or to make clerics more like priests.
We'd like to propose a change, or the added versatility of the cleric to accommodate a d4 hit die, 4 + skill per level, low BAB priest that has the same amount of spells per day as the sorcerer. A change like that, I believe, is what the members on the boards are looking for. Not so much to "add" to the cleric so much as we are looking to strip away the armor and give them more options with skills and spells.
So you also propose to give the cleric unlimited Resurrection spells? Because if as a cleric I have a sad AC and a sad amount of HP, I am not going to save your sorry behind when you are laying there bleeding to death at the feet of whatever big, bad, creature has just ended your career as a living creature, least I become a victim (all too easily) myself. Of course I could be following a god who expects all his clerics to martyr themselves. Even so that's more like throwing your life away than martyrdom.
Clerics are armored because they are expected to go into harms way and they have a d8 hp because even though they are armored it is a reasonable expectation, that they will be hit while trying to save others.I understand many do not like to play the cleric, because all you get to do is heal. I personally enjoy the role of the guy who keeps the party going. Taking away the ability to do that seems ludicrous to me.
I guess some of you see the cleric as a hosptial staff member. Being in the military myself, I see them as more of a Corpsman.
It is already easy to do a more peaceful cleric. Just because the class HAS heavy armour proficency doesn't mean you HAVE to wear heavy armour. The cleric already has access to 9th level spells as well, so just doing one as a standard caster is pretty easy. Hell, I once played a game with a priest of Mystra, and for the most part, all the other players thought my character was actually a wizard.
You also need to remember that D'n'D is a team orientated game, so it may become a bit of a problem when you have a peaceful cleric who stands back and does nothing when the party have to hold off a handful of encounters.
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It is already easy to do a more peaceful cleric. Just because the class HAS heavy armour proficency doesn't mean you HAVE to wear heavy armour. The cleric already has access to 9th level spells as well, so just doing one as a standard caster is pretty easy. Hell, I once played a game with a priest of Mystra, and for the most part, all the other players thought my character was actually a wizard.
You also need to remember that D'n'D is a team orientated game, so it may become a bit of a problem when you have a peaceful cleric who stands back and does nothing when the party have to hold off a handful of encounters.
Not choosing to use class options is fine to create a character, but the problem is that clerics are "balanced" with wizards by giving them combat abilities in return for a less offensive spell list/less spells per day.
...Clerics have more spells/day than wizards.
...Clerics have more potent combat spells (they just work differently).
Another vote for not changing a thing about clerics or any other base class, save what pathfinder has already done. Sure, the fighter could use a little work, but I'd rather spend more time traveling down the road than reinventing the wheel.