What I think WotC is going for here is what Marvel managed to pull off with their Ultimate line of comics: take the core of the IP and redefine it for a new generation.This is the problem: When you redefine a product for a new generation, you have to make sure the new generation is paying attention.
The "new generation" today just doesn't do pen and paper. That's not a 100% truism, of course, but in general the people 4e is marketed towards are far more interested in MySpace, YouTube, and World of Warcraft. They simply aren't going to be into lugging 20-lb. sacks of $40 rulebooks across town to game, the way our generation was.
If you want the new generation, you need to make an MMO. If you want to make a pen-and-paper game, it's the middle generation you need to market to.
Things are changing, and companies like WotC are going to miss the boat if they don't realize that. Past glories notwithstanding, the Kingston Trio and the Dave Brubeck Quartet simply aren't going to compete with the Beatles and the Stones once 1965 rolls along. Eventually, it's time to realize that and find your niche, where there is plenty of money still to be made. Tony Bennett still makes a ton of money, 40 years after his last hit record.
Everybody wants to be the New Hotness, but what the hell is wrong with the Old Coolness?
Well said my man, which they will learn in few more months...
If they made their own rules system, though, I would have to buy it. Because you know it would kick ass.
I'd love to see Pathfinder Core Rule Book outsell the 4E PHB. *Hopeful little Kobold*
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If they made their own rules system, though, I would have to buy it. Because you know it would kick ass.I'd love to see Pathfinder Core Rule Book outsell the 4E PHB. *Hopeful little Kobold*
Yes I'd love to see Paizo outsell WoTC so badly that Hasbro tries to buy them. Then an old copy of Dragon magazine is the only thing sent in reply.
Ha! WoTC created their own worst business enemy.
One can hope.
Staying with 3.5 would mean being a niche company...but it's a big niche (40-50% of existing D&D gamers)
I imagine this is an educated guess. I would actually pin it a bit lower . . .more gamers are likely to joine 4e, more are likely to change over in a few years.
I hereby motion that Paizo becomes the company (or one of the companies) that takes care of all the poor, orphaned gamers who want to keep playing the D&D they know and not that new game they call D&D.
Can I have a poor orphan child avatar please? Would make this post a lot more effective ;-)
I imagine this is an educated guess. I would actually pin it a bit lower . . .more gamers are likely to joine 4e, more are likely to change over in a few years.
Staying with 3.5 would mean being a niche company...but it's a big niche (40-50% of existing D&D gamers)
Unfortunately true. I don't know of anyone not changing over. Even at the local gaming store the people complaining about the system are going to change a few months after release (or, at least buy the rule books).
This, of course, in no way means that a Paizo book would not do well. They have their own reputation and that alone would help them. Even some people who are going to play 4E (like me) would buy it and play it, even if they didn't have any intentions of staying with 3.5.
Still, I'm sure they know more about this than we do. I would expect them to do their own research since we, here, are obviously biased. I wouldn't want the company to make a misstep at this juncture.
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I imagine this is an educated guess. I would actually pin it a bit lower . . .more gamers are likely to joine 4e, more are likely to change over in a few years.
Staying with 3.5 would mean being a niche company...but it's a big niche (40-50% of existing D&D gamers)
I don't know...I think a lot people get into the game by playing in a group of new players or joining an existing group. New groups will probably be 4e, but existing groups are a wild card. Anyone who joins my campaigns 5 years from now will play 3.x for example.
Don't take this the wrong way, I appreciate knowing that the owners of a company are paying attention to their customers. BUT...
Or making miniatures for a miniatures game that doesn't have the core rulebook in print.
Point Of Information - Reaper Miniatures.
Dark Heaven Legends is just a name change from Dark Heaven Apocalypse. That game hasn't been in print for a long time, but the Dark Heaven line is certainly doing well.
You could say the same about their Warlord rulebook. While technically still available, large parts of it (data cards and special abilities) has been changed by their Rage Chronicles online update. The updated rulebook will not be available for (at least) another year, but they continue to release new models and updates.
While I agree that having the core rulebook available is preferable, Reaper's experience shows that quality (and customer service) can overcome this. I see parallels between Paizo and Reaper on these counts.
I imagine this is an educated guess. I would actually pin it a bit lower . . .more gamers are likely to joine 4e, more are likely to change over in a few years.
Based on my trawling through numerous gaming sites over the past 6 months, I feel comfortable in predicting that *at least* 1/3 of all current gamers will refuse to convert. Some of them might buy the core books just to check them out, but many will go no further.
I haven't seen a lot of the initial "4e refuseniks" changing their minds recently... in fact, a lot of them are digging their heels in even deeper as the very different design philosophy of 4e becomes more apparent. It's a philosophy that is simply anathema to a large segment of gamers...mostly veterans, 35-40 years old and older...but that demographic is a main support beam for the D&D game.
My prediction has been that 4e will sell well out of the gate, but will tail off much sooner than 3.0/3.5 did...by the end of 2008, I predict alarm bells may already be going off at Hasbro. Remember, this is the first version of D&D to be released by a publicly-traded corporation. With today's corporate stockholder, "good enough" isn't good enough, and any decline in performance from 3.5 to 4e will be a big problem.
Some parts of 4e (e.g. Forgotten Realms) will, I predict, crash and burn entirely (to my sorrow). And that will cost WotC...and Hasbro...a lot of money.
You can view my 40-50% figure as more the total number of gamers who will still be open to buying 3.5 content, even if they don't play it exclusively.
Then an old copy of Dragon magazine is the only thing sent in reply.
I was drinking water when I read this. I almost spit it all over the monitor. I caught myself just before I did.
I still think the best way to go would be to put out both 3.5 and 4e product lines, BTW, unless the GSL idiotically forbids this.
I still think the best way to go would be to put out both 3.5 and 4e product lines, BTW, unless the GSL idiotically forbids this.
The Paizians have said they like to sleep every once in a while.
The Paizians have said they like to sleep every once in a while.
More work for hungry freelancers. Paizo would have to add an editor, maybe an extra layout person.
I'm sure people can assign convenient targets ('D&D 4e is like a MMO, some of your abilities just have 5 minute cooldowns and others 6 hour cooldowns and you hit the rest button and you get better' 'D&D 4e is like a card game, and you collect your powers on cards and tap them as they're used' 'D&D 4e is like an anime, with spiky armor and hair, dragon people and demon people, and teleports at 1st level' etc)...
Having had a chance to play it a couple times this weekend and read through a lot of extra pages of rules and stats, I can say that I will be switching to 4e and I will not be looking back. If Paizo doesn't switch to 4e within a reasonable amount of time (several months to a year), then I'll have to stop my subscriptions though I'll at least do some math on Pathfinder going for a little bit with the discount and just wanting to support the company and something interesting to read.
I found 4E to be a far better game than 3E. It's very different, I'll grant, but it honestly felt more like what I've wanted D&D to be, rather than what it was forced to be.
I earnestly hope Paizo switches and that I can continue my subscriptions ad infinitum.
Anyone who thinks D&D 4E won't sell well should look at amazon ranks and see that pre-order sales alone are tremendous.
Speculation that their sales will 'dry up' in 2008 also seem silly. Did people predict similarly that 3.0 would flop? I bet so... somehow that didn't work out...
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Anyone who thinks D&D 4E won't sell well should look at amazon ranks and see that pre-order sales alone are tremendous.
Speculation that their sales will 'dry up' in 2008 also seem silly. Did people predict similarly that 3.0 would flop? I bet so... somehow that didn't work out...
In all fairness, how many people on Paizo alone have stated they will purchase core books "just to mine for ideas" or "just to give it a fair shake?"
Everyone admits that initial core sales are the best for a new edition, but what if after that initial boom it does indeed dry up? Its not an impossibility, improbable maybe, ut not impossible.
FP
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And it's worth repeating that under the new GSL, you are in business because your chief competitor allows you to be. The more success you have, the more of a market threat you are to your own licensor.
I can't get past the alarm bells that situation sets off. Any licensee that wants to move beyond WotC's table scraps (putting out modules and stuff that WotC considers too unprofitable to bother with themselves), may have problems...especially if their products are perceived as being better than those WotC puts out...
I'd really like to know where you're getting this information. As far as I know, no one's seen the GSL yet, so saying what it allows and doesn't allow is a bit beyond the current knowledge. Or has it been released somewhere that I'm not aware of?
I still think the best way to go would be to put out both 3.5 and 4e product lines, BTW, unless the GSL idiotically forbids this.The Paizians have said they like to sleep every once in a while.
In addition to whether the GSL would allow a publisher to work on both 3.5 and 4E materials at the same time,
in addition to whether Paizo folks could manage to work on two lines while still getting a few hours of sleep now and then,
there's also the question of how feasible it is to do something both in 3.5 and in 4E. More precisely, what amount of work is involved in modifying a 3.5 module so that it plays well in 4? In modifying a 3.5 prestige class into a 4E paragon path?
For all we know, modules might have to be completely modified. Each Trap might have to be rebuilt from a completely different point of view; each encounter might have to be rebuilt so as to mix monster roles; modules themselves might have to be reworked to take into account the fact that 4E allows players to deal with more fighting challenges in a day than in 3.5.
It is actually possible that, in order to make a 3.5 module work in 4E, it has to be completely redesigned. That might not be as simple as just conversting monster stats.
So just so we look at the other side of the coin, IF a company like Paizo goes to 4e and supports the newest edition of Dungeons and Dragons, how do they get the attention of the new 4e converts? There is no Dragon or Dungeon magazines to advertise in.
This is one void I would love to see filled. I know how brutal the retail magazine business is, so likely no one will want to tilt against the overwhelming odds. Still, it just hurts the game in so many ways to not have something on the newsstands.
I'm sure people can assign convenient targets ('D&D 4e is like a MMO, some of your abilities just have 5 minute cooldowns and others 6 hour cooldowns and you hit the rest button and you get better' 'D&D 4e is like a card game, and you collect your powers on cards and tap them as they're used' 'D&D 4e is like an anime, with spiky armor and hair, dragon people and demon people, and teleports at 1st level' etc)...
Having had a chance to play it a couple times this weekend and read through a lot of extra pages of rules and stats, I can say that I will be switching to 4e and I will not be looking back. If Paizo doesn't switch to 4e within a reasonable amount of time (several months to a year), then I'll have to stop my subscriptions though I'll at least do some math on Pathfinder going for a little bit with the discount and just wanting to support the company and something interesting to read.
I found 4E to be a far better game than 3E. It's very different, I'll grant, but it honestly felt more like what I've wanted D&D to be, rather than what it was forced to be.
I earnestly hope Paizo switches and that I can continue my subscriptions ad infinitum.
Well, posts like this reassure me very much. You actually played the game and have more of an insight into how it flows, how the play feels, etc. If you're that for it, then I really know that I need to give it a look. Thanks for the post. :)
CEO
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You know, Lisa, there's something I wanted to tell or show you the other day. I don't want to do a disservice to the rest of the Editorial Team, but I think you're the one who might best understand this observation.
The other day I went over to EN World and was part of a conversation in the thread concerning Jason Bulmahn's interview. In that thread there was a discussion with a poster named "Buzz."
Buzz expressed that he couldn't understand why Paizo wasn't switching, and several posters tried to explain that the decision wasn't made, no one just had enough information. He said he felt like Paizo was negative towards 4th Edition, and some of us tried to explain that the customer community didn't necessarily reflect the Editorial Team.
Finally Buzz said he had to cancel his subscription just because if there might not be 4th Edition support he couldn't stay. I told him that I was sure that Paizo was sorry to see him go, and hoped maybe to have him back someday depending on how the decision played out.
Here's the important part.
Buzz then said he loved Pathfinder, and he loved Paizo, and he was sorry he had to go.
I'm not trying to depict the guy as a wuss, or disrespect him. Far from it. But that fellow had an emotional reaction. He was a little hurt and felt a little betrayed that he had to make a choice. And even though he made the best choice for him, he had some regrets even still.
What does this have to do with anything?
Paizo's marketing approach.
You're getting an emotional reaction, so that people are sorry they're not buying your products, and wish they still could. That's fascinating.
Whatever you're doing to engender the loyalty that you're gathering- you have to keep it up.
Hey Watcher:
I looked through that thread and had the same reaction that you did. I was shocked how absolutely hurt Buzz was that we hadn't committed to 4e already and that he felt so betrayed. Then when he talked about missing Pathfinder in his mailbox every month, it floored me even more.
As for creating loyalty, that is what we are hoping for. We just treat folks the way we would treat family. You can see the results. And we will keep on doing what we are doing, and hopefully, that will be enough, no matter our decision.
-Lisa
We just treat folks the way we would treat family.
Paizo, the Olive Garden of RPGs. "When you're here, you're family."
Everyone admits that initial core sales are the best for a new edition,
That was the design philosophy behind the OGL to begin with. The core book always sells best, even better then most supplements combined. Of course the 4E PHB. The real question is, "Will the PHBII sell anywhere nearly as well?" If those sales are 1/4 of the PHBI's sales, 4E is pretty much dead in the water.
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That was the design philosophy behind the OGL to begin with. The core book always sells best, even better then most supplements combined. Of course the 4E PHB. The real question is, "Will the PHBII sell anywhere nearly as well?" If those sales are 1/4 of the PHBI's sales, 4E is pretty much dead in the water.
I agree, that's why if Paizo decides to take a "wait and see" approach about 4E they will have be really careful in examining sales figures. I worry that even with a Jan 2009 start date they may not have accurate figures either because 1) 4E is not an instant success but will eventually avalanche everything else OR 2) 4E acceptance will be artificially inflated.
We just treat folks the way we would treat family.Paizo, the Olive Garden of RPGs. "When you're here, you're family."
Where the hell are my breadsticks????
Then an old copy of Dragon magazine is the only thing sent in reply.I was drinking water when I read this. I almost spit it all over the monitor. I caught myself just before I did.
Me too!!!! I haven't laughed that hard at a post in a while....
True 20 will be my 4th edition. I've never played CCGs and never will. No one in my gaming group has ever played CCGs. If that's what 4e is supposed to be, then there's another reason for not buying it.
Let me see....yeah, let's disenfranchise those stogey old 40 somethings who are now making more money than they ever have by turning their favorite childhood hobby into something totally alien to many of them.
Who needs the disposable hobby income of a family of gamers that makes more than $120,000 a year anyway?
Paizo? Yeah....
You know, I've heard alot about True 20 and have not yet touched it... I'm about tempted, how is it?
It's good. It's fast...it's story driven, not mechanics driven...it's a hell of a lot easier to referee and create adventures for.
I was shocked how absolutely hurt Buzz was that we hadn't committed to 4e already and that he felt so betrayed.
You know, I really don't want to be in your place right now, because you'll make people feel betrayed either way. If you stick to 3e, Buzz and others will feel betrayed and stop buying, but if you change to 4e, other people (me included) will stop buying, and many will feel betrayed (I'm not sure whether that includes me. I hope I never find out).
I'd really like to know where you're getting this information. As far as I know, no one's seen the GSL yet, so saying what it allows and doesn't allow is a bit beyond the current knowledge. Or has it been released somewhere that I'm not aware of?And it's worth repeating that under the new GSL, you are in business because your chief competitor allows you to be. The more success you have, the more of a market threat you are to your own licensor.
I can't get past the alarm bells that situation sets off. Any licensee that wants to move beyond WotC's table scraps (putting out modules and stuff that WotC considers too unprofitable to bother with themselves), may have problems...especially if their products are perceived as being better than those WotC puts out...
I don't know whether there's proof of that, but my gut tells me it will be so. As far as I know, this license will not be perpetual, and I guess it will be less open then the Open Game License in other ways, too.
Now look at how they yanked the carpet from under Paizo's feet just when they did a good job with Dungeon and Dragon.
I'd personally be very wary of any license that wasn't irrevocable and perpetual - and it seems that wizards doesn't want to hand out those any more. They took their toys back once, what would stop them from doing it again? I know that I wouldn't do anything where I'd have to fear too much success.
I'd really like to know where you're getting this information. As far as I know, no one's seen the GSL yet, so saying what it allows and doesn't allow is a bit beyond the current knowledge. Or has it been released somewhere that I'm not aware of?
It hasn't been released, but enough info has been released that we know it's not *open* like the OGL, which existed pretty much outside of WotC's control and could never be cancelled. We know that the GSL will permit some types of product and prohibit others. WotC staffers have said that it will work much like the d20 license, which gives WotC a say in what can be released under it (which caused almost all third party publishers to abandon it in favor of the OGL). You can look through the ENWorld news archive to see most of what's been revealed.
The big issues are whether the license will give WotC "life or death" power over licensees...the power to terminate the license at its discretion, or unilaterally change its terms, or deny/approve specific products a licensee wants to put out (or already has put out). The answers to those questions will determine whether the license provides reasonable security to licensees, or whether it's the equivalent of playing a game where all the referees are members of the opposing team.
Sudden burst of FLASH in my daydreaming head about seeing a 350 page hardcover called "Pathfinder RPG" on the shelf of my FLGS. Oh man, why does it feel like I'm daydreaming about winning the lottery? But man would that be an awesome day. :-)-DM Jeff
I'm with ya!!!! I'd buy that in a hearbeat!
Getting some Golarion fiction out there would help tremendously to attract potential new gamers to Paizo. (*cough*ElaineCunningham*cough)
Oh, yah, that would be MOST EXCELLENT. :)
I'm just waiting to see which of the rats leaves before the ship sinks. My money is on that Chris Tomasson character who now calls himself Chris Young.
Anyone know why the guy changed his name?
My understanding is that he did so for personal reasons.
Guys, I appreciate support and lord knows whatever we decide we're going to need a ton of it, but I respectfully ask you guys to draw the line at personal insults against WotC staffers, particularly ones that used to work at Paizo.
Chris Youngs is a good guy. Please don't insult him here.
Thanks.
QFT. (and emphasis mine)
Chris Youngs was a joy to work with as he and I went through the developmental aspects of getting Prisoner of the Castle Perilous to its final print version for Dungeon #153. He offered a lot of great ideas and suggestions, was very respectful and open to mine, and is just an all around nice guy. He works very hard, gets very little respect for it, and loves the game as much or even more than a lot of the Trolls talking smack about him.
Oh, and sorry this seems so page #1, but it is. The conversation has moved way beyond the above comments, but I felt like I needed to say something about it.
4E Test Drive
Short Review
It's an interesting system that didn't so much feel like D&D in play; nonetheless, the brand power of D&D all but ensures this will be a success and it may even redefine what D&D means for the next generation.
People tend to take from this sort of thing that which they want to find in the first place. I concede the reviewer was not particularly pro 4ED though I don't think he was really down on it either.
In particular I was thinking about the comments on combat and how the game seems to be mostly only supporting combat. When I really think about it I'm not really sure how much I think 3.5 supports role playing as opposed to roll playing. In fact I think the basic diplomacy for 4th will be better then 3.5 simply becuase I can't actually conceive of something that was worse then the reactions table in 3.5. I mean no rules at all would have been preferable to that so they can hardly make it worse.
He compares it to a CCG, now I don't really know anything about CCGs and maybe thats a good thing. If the mechanics work well then I'll be happy. It may be that the system will have to many choices for it to be a good game for the kiddies but thats not really an issue for me, I'm not personally playing with kiddies nor about to train any new ones. If I was I'd probably play with the old red book to start. So large number of options to choose from does not really scare me.
Still, I'm sure they know more about this than we do. I would expect them to do their own research since we, here, are obviously biased. I wouldn't want the company to make a misstep at this juncture.
Yeah - I'm not sure they now that much more then we do. I mean how are they supposed to do research? Polls? I mean they can do internet polls and they have becuase any information is useful. They can read comments and they can look at the game and the license to make product. Beyond that they can talk with each other and see how they feel and maybe they can try and draw on their experience in the industry. All of these are valid and I'm sure their going to do all of them but in the end this whole pile pretty much amounts to 'what is my gut feeling on how this whole thing will play out?'.
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I don't really understand why everyone thinks that IF a company stuck with 3.5, that it was like they were stuck in a hermetically sealed room or something.
Of all the pros and cons everyone mentions about 4e vs. 3.5e, this one drives me the most nuts. :) So, again, I ask, why would sticking with 3.5 mean entering a game of diminishing returns?
-Lisa
Frankly, its because the strongest argument not related to the merit of either edition that the Pro 4ed group can muster is to suggest that not choosing their favored edition would spell the doom of Paizo. Its only logical to assume that going along with WotC would allow paizo's survival. However, there is enough 4ed FUD to make the idea that Paizo would fold if they stayed 3.5 sound plausible.
We're all here because we are fans of your work. I accidentally found you when you took over Dungeon magazine from WotC. My initial response was "who the hell is Paizo? Sounds like a mob outfit to me." However, within a couple of issues I was a convert. Since then, you folks are the one company who i am guaranteed to purchase from. While I would love for you to stay 3.5, the idea that not switching to 4ed would shut you folks down distresses me (and others) quite a bit.
of course, this is just my interpretation of things. I could be wrong.
The 'Ling
Yes, I plan on picking up the new edition of True 20 and giving it a try as well. A friend of mine (who LOVES 3.5) threw Chris' interview at me and said, basically "See...it DOES suck", which was not what I read in the interview. Well, it will all work itself out soon :-)
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...take a look at Games Workshop. Their business model is to bring in young kids, around age 14 to 16, and basically they expect to lose them in 4 to 6 years.
I've only ever seen kids playing or modeling Warhammer in photos in White Dwarf magazine. I have never physically seen anyone younger than me in the GW section of my local store back home. GW stuff is pretty pricy, and building and painting the models is not easy or cheap to get into. But this is just my observation; I'm sure GW knows what they're talking about, and they're a pretty successful company.
...Companies like Privateer Press make their bucks taking the ex-GW players and making them into Warmachine or Hordes players...
This would be me. In fact, I still paint the occasional GW model (like Harry the Hammer, which is this weekend's project), but I work the PP models almost exclusively now. I even use their paints, which I find to be of a higher quality--and cheaper--than GW's. I should mention, I never gave PP a glance until Paizo put the Winter Troll Trollbloods model in a homepage blog. At any rate, I certainly agree that Pathfinder as v3.5 or a sequel of v3.5 with it's own rules will gather up the older crowd not interested with 4e, or the younger crowd looking for more.
I just have to jump in on this thought. IF we were to stay with 3.5, what makes you think that there wouldn't be an influx of new gamers? To wit, take a look at Games Workshop. Their business model is to bring in young kids, around age 14 to 16, and basically they expect to lose them in 4 to 6 years. Companies like Privateer Press make their bucks taking the ex-GW players and making them into Warmachine or Hordes players. Rackham does this also.
So why couldn't Paizo, IF we were to stay with 3.5, get a regular influx of younger gamers who got weaned into the industry by 4th edition, but got bored and started looking for a more complicated game, or perhaps heard about this amazing campaign setting called Pathfinder Chronicles? I don't really understand why everyone thinks that IF a company stuck with 3.5, that it was like they were stuck in a hermetically sealed room or something.
Of all the pros and cons everyone mentions about 4e vs. 3.5e, this one drives me the most nuts. :) So, again, I ask, why would sticking with 3.5 mean entering a game of diminishing returns?
-Lisa
DISCLAIMER: This post is entirely a thought exercise and shouldn't be construed as proof either for or against Paizo going to 4e or not. We haven't seen the GSL or the rules yet, so we have no decision to report. I just couldn't resist making this point though. :)
Well said and i partially agree. First off I am a huge Paizo fan and am going to support your pathfinder RPG as well as 4E.
But look at the products both Privateer Press and Rackham are putting out now. Prepainted minis and collectible minature games are games aimed at a much younger audience, and Rackham has spent a lot of time making their games more accesible to newer and younger players. But both companies still retain much for more experienced ones, in the Warmachine´/hordes games, and by the fact that Rackhams miniatures are of a very high standard and still paintable.
So you have to be able to attract both ends of the age and experience spectrum, or you will end up as Games Workshop with slowing sales and a frustated fan group tired of constant changes and rules revisions.
I looked through that thread and had the same reaction that you did. I was shocked how absolutely hurt Buzz was that we hadn't committed to 4e already and that he felt so betrayed. Then when he talked about missing Pathfinder in his mailbox every month, it...
Hey, I'm famous! :D
For the record, "hurt" and "betrayed" are probably putting a bit strong, at least as I look back now. Nonetheless, I was pretty bummed. Paizo makes some damn good products, and I thought the Pathfinder monthly adventure concept was pretty cool. I was happy to give them my money. And getting pretty RPG books in my mailbox each month? Bonus!
Still, I've cut *way* back on my RPG spending; I have no interest in repeating the splurging I did during the d20 boom. My group is really excited about 4e, so I know I'm not going to have much use for 3.5/Pathfinder product, no matter how pretty it is. :)
But, yeah, you guys do a bang-up job, and it made an impact with me. Good customer service is critical in this little hobby of ours.
Mind you, I still order stuff from you guys... and will definitely be checking out the 4e stuff Necromancer does via Paizo.