I'm in the first issue of the STAP and I had 3 PC's in negs on the Blue Nixie, and 2 PC deaths under Parrot Isle. I've read that this AP is a meatgrinder, so I'm thinking of upping the PC levels (with side treks) by one or maybe 2-- Has anyone else done this? Results?
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I'm in the first issue of the STAP and I had 3 PC's in negs on the Blue Nixie, and 2 PC deaths under Parrot Isle. I've read that this AP is a meatgrinder, so I'm thinking of upping the PC levels (with side treks) by one or maybe 2-- Has anyone else done this? Results?
Haven't started the path yet, but I plan on running some small (1-3 encounters each) introductory adventures to help bring the party together, to get them familiarized with Sasserine, and bring then up to 2nd level. Also it seems like a shame not to use Sasserine for a while longer than the path does...
FH
There's nothing wrong with padding the PCs levels a bit. In the end, if you want strong, heroic characters who prevail over the insidious plots of the wicked villians, you want characters to be a bit higher level, or at least a higher point buy. We play 32 point buy, and have some pretty solid tacticians, and my group has managed to avoid any true deaths, although there's been some close calls in the negatives. (Watch out for the flotsam ooze. Seriously.)
I'm in the first issue of the STAP and I had 3 PC's in negs on the Blue Nixie, and 2 PC deaths under Parrot Isle. I've read that this AP is a meatgrinder, so I'm thinking of upping the PC levels (with side treks) by one or maybe 2-- Has anyone else done this? Results?
I just started the AP last night. I had a four person group planned, but one of the players dropped out of the campaign at the last moment, so I ran with only 3 characters and finished off the Vandorboren vault encounter by the end of the evening.
The three characters were a Kalashtar monk, a half-elf ranger, and a half-elf rogue. The characters were built using a 32 point buy.
The fight on the Blue Nixie was tough for just three characters, with two of them in negative hp's by the end of the encounter. Fortunately the 3rd, with just 2 hp left, managed to make successful Heal checks on the two others before they died. The only adjustment I made to the Blue Nixie encounter was to reduce the number of smugglers by two. The monk was taken out at the start of the fight due to an unlucky critical hit. Fortunately, Soller Vark's questionable tactics made a big difference and he provoked an AoE every round making disarm and bullrush attempts. I was also rolling badly so he didn't do nearly as much damage as he could have.
The characters got through the Vandorboren vault encounter without difficulty and got enough xp for the session to level, so they'll be a bit tougher going into Parrot Island. I'm still worried about that encounter - some unlucky rolls could easily turn it into a TPK. I'm going to have to tone down the zombie pirates and Veldimar Krund a bit, I think. The rogue is planning on taking her second level as cleric, so that should help somewhat.
The characters all have detailed backgrounds with lots of personal subplots that I can use to introduce side-quests and get their levels a bit higher than recommended for a 4-player group. I'd rather do this since it draws the players even more into the campaign and may allow me not to mess too much with the adventures as written. After all, regular zombie pirates are nowhere near as fun or scary as ravenous zombie pirates - but I might just have to go that route.
There's nothing wrong with padding the PCs levels a bit. In the end, if you want strong, heroic characters who prevail over the insidious plots of the wicked villians, you want characters to be a bit higher level, or at least a higher point buy. We play 32 point buy, and have some pretty solid tacticians, and my group has managed to avoid any true deaths, although there's been some close calls in the negatives. (Watch out for the flotsam ooze. Seriously.)
32 Point buy...OMG! We had a 25 point buy. I'm jealous. Now mind you my character has come to several close calls. I am basicly the meat shield for the party as long has they keep on healing me with the cure wands we have been doing pretty good. Then again SOP is purchase wands of cure. But 32 point buy...wow! Good on you. As for the party we are approximately 5 in the group. There has been two character deaths thus far, in many cases could have been avoided. We have managed to get to I suspect the Bullywog gambit and still are making our way through the Vanderborens Manor. Wish your players luck. 32 Point buy. Wow!
My group of PCs are averaging 1.5 (they usually level to two up before the end of the adventure)levels higher than they recommended levels for each adventure and are managing to stay in the right "heroic" curve. The party consists of a Dwarf fighter, Human fighter, Halfling rogue, and a Grimlock Bard (which was just a Grimlock for most of this so far). I ran one preview adventure (A Box Full of Flumph, actually) that I staged as the port they were leaving from to go to Sasserine. It essentially made them level 2 in the first adventures.
Even with that,we had one death under Parrot Island and a near death from Ripclaw.
The Lotus Dragons were no problem for them, but I rolled like crap through the whole section.
Granted, they don't have a decent spellcaster, but I've been liberal with the potion shop's stock of healing potions. With the amount of gold lying around Sasserine, they haven't had any trouble keeping themselves in enough healing potions to make up for the lack of a cleric. Otherwise, the fighters are holding their own with everything else.
That all being said, this is a very unforgiving adventure so far. If you run the adventure at the recommended levels, there will be PC deaths unless your players are very good, very lucky, or both.
Hope this helps.
The extremely high mortality likelihood in the 1st adventure served to kick my group into high gear; tactical play improved drastically (as did a willingness to stop "saving" wands, potions, etc.), and they've been doing a LOT better since then... but they still know that a particularly boneheaded scheme will get them all wiped out. I kind of like that in an adventure path. (All this is at adventure-recommended levels.)
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The extremely high mortality likelihood in the 1st adventure served to kick my group into high gear; tactical play improved drastically (as did a willingness to stop "saving" wands, potions, etc.), and they've been doing a LOT better since then... but they still know that a particularly boneheaded scheme will get them all wiped out. I kind of like that in an adventure path. (All this is at adventure-recommended levels.)
To me, that attitude works well in a competitive gaming environment, like in an RPG event at a convention or something, but my group wants something a little more laid back.
Don't get me wrong, I want to punish them for doing something blatantly stupid, and PCs will and should occasionally die due to sheer bad luck, especially at low levels.
At the same time, though, I don't want my players to think they have zero margin for error, and every decision is life or death, either.
I'm sure when I start the AP, I'll be padding things a bit. For one thing, I suspect we'll have more than 4 players...probably more like 6 or 7. I'll probably leave the encounters as is despite the extra hands, at least at first, and see how that goes, and adjust as necessary till we find a balance that suits us.
I'll probably leave the encounters as is despite the extra hands, at least at first, and see how that goes, and adjust as necessary till we find a balance that suits us.
I speak from past expirence with larger groups. You'll want to increase the CR for the encounters, or your players will get bored... at least mine did. There has to be some level of threat involved in order to spur excitement.
I am starting this weekend, and my group consists of 5 newer players( playing for about 3months). I am allowing 32 point buy. Should I make it any easier? (I have yet to receive my magazines in the mail to know what to expect)
To me, that attitude works well in a competitive gaming environment, like in an RPG event at a convention or something, but my group wants something a little more laid back... I don't want my players to think they have zero margin for error, and every decision is life or death, either.
Well said, FDW. Player experience counts for a lot here, as do expectations going into things (let's face it, AoW was a meat grinder for the bashful). I also insert a lot of down-time role playing (denigrated as "fluff" elsewhere on these boards), describing the night out at Fort Blackwell drinking the Green Man, the interactions between PCs and NPCs on the ship, etc., so that the sudden-death parts don't actually dominate things. Seems to be working so far with this AP.
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Well said, FDW. Player experience counts for a lot here, as do expectations going into things (let's face it, AoW was a meat grinder for the bashful). I also insert a lot of down-time role playing (denigrated as "fluff" elsewhere on these boards), describing the night out at Fort Blackwell drinking the Green Man, the interactions between PCs and NPCs on the ship, etc., so that the sudden-death parts don't actually dominate things. Seems to be working so far with this AP.
Why thank you!
I also plan plenty of side quests in my campaign as well. Strangely enough, I've been mulling the idea of running a nautical based FR campaign since about May or so, and had been reading up and making notes of some fun adventure ideas, but I didn't really have a good way to tie them all together into a cohesive campaign.
Then Savage Tide came along, and it seems perfect for fitting that bill. But at the same time, I don't want to throw away all my other notes and so on, either, so they're going to be interspersed throughout the published AP as I see fit.
Of course, at the time I was originally planning on running in the Sea of Fallen Stars, so some of it was specific to that area and will either need to be adjusted or thrown out.
I also am a fan of the "fluff" and feel it's important for building up the sense of realism that is sometimes lacking when an adventure path is stuck to too strictly. I think the two of us are very much on the same page.
I think the two of us are very much on the same page.
Well, great minds, you know. :)
I was a bit worried about the difficulty in the first adventure so included 2 side quests before hand go earn the party 500 xp going into the blue nixie. They leveled after the crypts, and are closing on 3rd near the end of the adventure. So far everything has been a breeze with only a couple PC's hitting the negatives. The main reason for this has been two things: PC's having a little experience with their characters before the tough fight on the nixie and parrot cove, and due to a really powerful cleric feat in the PHB 2 that lets him do a mass cure light wounds(everyone) 4 or so times a day as a swift action. I have even tweaked some monsters up in power (bonus D8 of HP mainly) just to keep them around a bit longer and it hasn't slowed the party down much. I suggest pointing out this feat to your party if your worried about TPK's.
It's been a nice change for the group to cakewalk after our experiences with later Age of Worms adventures.
So far my group has been doing extremely well. We started with a 28 point buy for stats, and have had 4 players each session. The first we had a shifter monk, a half-elf ranger, a human druid, and a human warlock. They did the blue nixie and vault without many problems. The druid was dropped into the negs on the nixie, while the ranger went down against the iron cobra in the vault. But neither died.
For Parrot Island we had a human rogue joining the group, so I made him take the place of the Informant, and be double crossed by Vanthus. So this new human rogue, shifter monk, human druid, and human warlock are stuck down in the smuggler's tunnels. They wisely purchased a wand of CLW and a couple potions before heading here due to their lack of a cleric, and managed to take down 5 zombies using daggers and eldritch blasts. The poor druid was dropped into the negs again by a zombie bite. They are fighting the crabs now and still doing quite well.
And this has all taken place before 2nd level :)
I didn't think that my players were really doing that well, but it seems I was mistaken! I think that only one of the pc's have been seriously threatened with death and I have been steadily increasing the power of the incounters because I have been finding them too easy for the group.
The party consists of a Truenamer Aventi, a Druid, a Paladin, and a Scout/fighter (all human) and they roll up their stats.
My first Mag showed up a bit later than I wanted, so I ran them through the first part of Tammaret's Fate (I think is the name of it), had them get "rescued" by Lavinia and fall into her imploy after a few interesting encounters. They were all of second level before they truely started the AP.
At the beginning of tonight's gaming session they will be 3rd level and should still be challenged by the Lotus dragons in their hideout according to the adventure, but I have high doubts about that.
For instance, under Parrot Island (where they are currently "trapped") they encountered the Ravenous Zombies in flanking pairs of four (two in front and two behind) and still managed to fight through to victory without too much of a sweat. So, wanting to give them a good challenge, I sent in a Boneclaw undead from Libris Mortis instead of the "leader" undead whose name escapes me. It certainly did a number on them, dropping the paladin and scout into the single digits and running the druid out of spells, but in the end the PC's prevailed with a combination of Full Defense, a healing wand and the Truenamer's Word of wounding (or whatever the spell is called).
Right now I'm not even giving them XP; I'm just telling them when they are going to level based on what the adventure is giving them to accomplish, which seems fair to me. I don't find this adventure a meatgrinder at all, but maybe the Lotus Dragons will prove me wrong.