Spectromancer—Basic Version (Windows Download)

Is anybody else playing this? I downloaded the free demo, then ordered the full game as I enjoyed the demo a lot. I really like it, but I see a few spots where it could use a few tweaks.

Is anybody else playing this? I downloaded the free demo, then ordered the full game as I enjoyed the demo a lot. I really like it, but I see a few spots where it could use a few tweaks.

I got it off Greenhouse, don't buy it if you have to be somewhere within the next eight hours or so... ;-)

I loved the demo and plan to pick up the full version soon.

The demo was really fun. I'm buying the full version for sure.

I didn't even bother with the demo, I picked up the full version just from what little I heard about it. I generally trust Paizo's judgment in this kind of thing, and Richard Garfield didn't go wrong when he first made Magic.

I posted my review (4/5) for it, and my only quibble is the randomness of what you get to use for any given duel. If this game allowed 'deck building', I'd have given it a 5/5. I'd have been pleased as punch if you were given the option of making a 'deck' of 4 cards for each Element, and could go into each duel with that 'deck'. Once you get a new card you like, swap out an old one for a new one.

I see cards I use consistently, and a few I ignore completely because they don't fit my style of play. Keeping this completely random makes some encounters in Campaign mode especially annoying, and you have to 'shuffle' to get a combination you can use. That, I think, detracts from the game.

Online play, I think, would fall into the same boat (admittedly, I've not tried this yet). Player versus Player becomes a combination of skill, and a huge bit of luck when it comes to the draw. Did you get cards which play off each other well? Did you get things which actually hinder each other?

So far, I'm okay with the game, but I'll like it much more if a future version allows 'deck design'. Beyond that (okay, I admit, there's also a few typo and gender-pronoun mix-ups in campaign mode), good game.

Okay, I've tried online duelling, and I've even tried the one-on-one against the AI. I'm definitely going to have to back my earlier assessment, which is to say: random cards doesn't work. I've gone into a few games, staring at my cards, and not finding any synergy (such as, for example, a complete lack of 'heal creature' or 'heal self' cards).

Seriously, the idea behind the game works, but the randomness of what you get to use doesn't. If a used card 'vanished' to be replaced by another card of that element type, that might be something, because then you could cycle to get what you want (hell, even toss in a 'dump card', which could be used once per turn to replace it with something else), but I still prefer the idea of 'build your own', which allows you to select what cards you'll be using in a duel.

Hi, I am one of the designers of Spectromancer and wanted to post a few words on this game.

Spectromancer is in an area of game design I am very interested in, which lies in the vast gulf between a paper game and a "normal" computer game. Most of the time, to get the experience that Spectromancer gives you on the computer you need to play a transliteration of a paper game, like online Magic or online Poker. There are very few games that are designed for the computer that give players the time to make strategic decisions, deductions and bluffs in a short enough time frame that you can play many times in a sitting, and enough luck to keep the outcome unpredictable.

I would also like to mention, since it is a topic in this thread and one on other forums I have been involved with - there is no deck construction. I like deck construction (I am kind of obligated to), but I also like games that don't have deck construction - like Sealed deck Magic, or Bridge. In these games players must sometimes play out of their comfort zone to do well - they must figure out how to use what they have been given to the fullest. Spectromancer is designed to be fast enough, that like Bridge, you can always play another hand, so it won't be long till you get a deal you do like. I sympathise with players that want deck construction in this game, I think a similar game with deck construction would be great - and I hope to work on one in the future. However, there is something liberating for me and I think some players of similar mindset, to games without that investment being necessary.

Also, there is a touch of deck construction. Players do choose what type of wizard they wish to duel with, and that determines which of 6 special pools of the most powerful spells their hand will be drawn from. For example, if you play the Necromancer, you have about a 50% chance of being dealt the powerful Drain Souls spell which clears the creatures from the play area - friend and foe alike, giving you extra life to boot!

If any of this sounds interesting give the demo version of Spectromancer a shot. In it you can play the first third of the solo campaign with the cleric, and you can play online an unlimited amount (at least for now) with the cleric. When you play against someone who is running another class, Necromancer, Mechanician, Dominator, Insanian, or Illusionist - you know they have liked it enough to purchase.

keep gaming!

Richard Garfield

Hi, I am one of the designers of Spectromancer and wanted to post a few words on this game.

I would also like to mention, since it is a topic in this thread and one on other forums I have been involved with - there is no deck construction. I like deck construction (I am kind of obligated to), but I also like games that don't have deck construction - like Sealed deck Magic, or Bridge. In these games players must sometimes play out of their comfort zone to do well - they must figure out how to use what they have been given to the fullest.

Wow. :) Nice to finally get a chance to talk to you. I'm honoured.

Fair enough, and I can understand where you're coming from - but for some of my friends (and admittedly, myself), deck-construction is a big part of the draw for us. Perhaps, somewhere down the line, Spectromancer could have 'constructive' play, and the normal 'sealed' play, giving people an opportunity to try the game in either style, as per their preferences.

I've tried 'normal' difficulty, and... gah, that's actually pretty hard with the normal style of play. Going up against the archmage in duel mode is frighteningly hard, and while I do like a challenge, I don't like the 'odds' that spring up when I'm trying to play. I like a sense that my tactics and the decisions I made going in play a lot more into my chances of victory than a random draw and what I can do with what I have.

Don't get me wrong, I've been able to beat my opponents with cards which I'd normally overlook, but I notice that I've got a few 'standard' tactics that I use (phoenix + fire 10+ being a staple, or meditating to speed up to getting elementals, then buffing said elementals).

In campaign mode, deck construction isn't a big factor until the middle/end game, when there's enough variety that the cards you're accustomed to start to 'disappear', replaced with other cards you've collected. That is where the frustration sets in -- I'll get Armageddon in Fire - when I have no interest in it. Or my Air Elemental vanishes to be replaced with that 'nuke one creature' spell. Yes, these spells are nifty, but the benefits from the elementals interests me much more (increased mana gain is awesome).

I can see stepping away from Magic (and such) by limiting the randomness and deck design, but that intellectual aspect of the game was a big draw for it, and the play was just icing on that cake. Admittedly, Spectromancer doesn't have a huge amount of cards for design, but there's enough to make personal styles of play, I think. Some people like the 'big boom' of Fire, while others like the increase damage / mana gain of the elementals, orcs, and minotaurs (as an example). Personal tastes, I guess.

Still. Nice game, and I think it was worth the money I put into it. Once my friends can get over (we're in a bus strike right now, zero transportation in this city... :p), I'm looking forward to showing them the game and playing hot-seat to actually play against one another.

Kudos. :)

Oh, one last thing while I remember it: Those undead dudes should probably not sacrifice their jar first turn. Really. They shouldn't do it at all. ;) I was really shocked when it happened, and was like 'err, sure, give me the easy win'. ;)

After playing the game in Normal mode (as a Necromancer), I found that the game is quite brutal. Many duels are very hard, almost frustratingly so....having to play through 5-6 of the same duel to get a decent deck through luck can be difficult. The Easy mode is just that...too easy. I haven't dared tried the Hard mode.

After playing the game in Normal mode (as a Necromancer), I found that the game is quite brutal. Many duels are very hard, almost frustratingly so....having to play through 5-6 of the same duel to get a decent deck through luck can be difficult. The Easy mode is just that...too easy. I haven't dared tried the Hard mode.

In Hard mode, the opponents have a really irritating way of rallying back from behind around the 6th-8th round, wiping out your line and blasting you in a couple of quick plays.

I am considering buying the full version. However I use two computers, my desktop for internet/downloads and my laptop for games, work, everything else. I have a 2 GB thumb drive. Will the download file/folder fit on the drive?

I won't bother downloading it if I have to play it on my desktop (its almost 7 years old, and so isn't the greatests).

I am considering buying the full version. However I use two computers, my desktop for internet/downloads and my laptop for games, work, everything else. I have a 2 GB thumb drive. Will the download file/folder fit on the drive?

I won't bother downloading it if I have to play it on my desktop (its almost 7 years old, and so isn't the greatests).

The demo and the full version are both the same size: 19.5MB.

Glad to hear you tried it Chris & Rithralas -

I wanted to add a note on difficulty. The campaign on can be very difficult, but it can be approached in two ways, the first is wait till you get a deal you like, and work with that. This can be frustrating. The second is to try and figure out how to use the deals you have in different ways. It is amazing what adding some tactics to your bag of tricks can do! It may be a weakness in the campaign you can get by without them because you aren't forced to learn them.

So, 10 tips for the beginner - which you may know but you may not, and it will make the campaign easier and be useful in online play:

1) Kill the opponents mana generators.
2) Consider 'rushing' if you have the right hand. In this case you can even let the generators go sometimes. Put lots of creatures in unopposed slots, sweep with mass damage, fiinish with damage to the head (lightning bolt, armageddon). This can be surprisingly effective, but many players only play for the BIG cards.
3) Golems (ice & steel) are really effective for making sure your opponent's sweeps less effective. If you put out a golem and then they do stone rain to get your generators, the smoke clears and you have an offense already! Also, golems LOOK tough, but try not to fight with them, the only way they take damage is from creatures, so keep them unopposed or fighting wimps and they will be doing good work for a long time. Also, healing them is often quite exciting & demoralizing for enemy.
4) phantom warriors are a lot like golems.
5) all else being equal, force you opponent to put creatures in front of YOUR creatures. Then you get the first blow, which is important often. If you do put a creature opposite your opponents make sure it makes sense, don't put your expensive generators infront of high power things, or weak attack things infront of his generators, for example. Play the combat out in your head - does your creature win? Then you know you are forcing him to cast something to change that which is good.
6) Pay attention to economics - if you spend 10 mana on a tornado try to use it on something that costs more than 10, and ideally has little or no come into play effect. For example, Dragon & Astral Guard are excellent targets. Titan is soso, it costs 12 but a lot of its value is the 15 damage when it comes in. lightning cloud is often good taget but you are ending up down. Roughly count the special mana as twice as good, so if I play a flame wave (6) and take out a 3 cost special thing (say the generator for mech), and another small creature or two, I am making a profit. If I play it and take out two air sprites (total cost 2), I am taking a loss. It may be a good move, but I am not happy about it.
7) Be prepared for things you are scared of. Worried about astral guard? Then think twice about using the tornado or stone rain if that is your only way to handle it. Armageddon gonna knock your socks off? Drop an ice guard and keep your cool.
8) Speaking of iceguardian don't forget about it - if your opponent is rushing you drop it down and you are in MUCH better shape. It is really hard to do a lot of damage with that in play.
9) Be patient with your big spells. Don't drop astral guard if you think your opponent can get rid of it immediately. Same for your dragon. See if you can make him drop his stone rain before playing the card you really care about. Wait a turn or two before dropping your elementals, a fire elemental that comes in with 0 power can be good for pumping your fire, but wait a few turns, drop it with 3 or 4 attack and he can be a lot harder to deal with.
10) keep the pressure on. If you have a bunch of creatures unopposed you can make your opponent very uncomfortable by hitting him with lightning, if he is put low enough he may have to choose between clearing the board and doing healing, and either way he is left with a problem (low life or unopposed creatures.)

There you go - hope that makes you enjoy the campaign more and crush people online! Feel free to post your own beginner tips as well.

richard garfield

I'm really enjoying this game. I bought the full version after checking out the demo and it's a great time-burning alternative to Solitare.

I have beaten the campaign as the Necromancer (on Easy) and have started again (on Normal) as the Chaosmaster. Both are a lot of fun and I look forward to really trying out the other mages in time.

A question: During the last few matches, you play as the "Spectromancer," having access to all 5 'special' manas but none of the conventional mana types. Is there any way to play a campaign or single duels as Spectromancer, perhaps as a reward for completing the campaign on Hard or something of the sort? That would be really cool.

I've gone through everything in the campaign mode on Easy, and I've developed a number of strategies, but I won't be able to really say much about them until I'm in Normal mode. We'll see. :) Besides that, I still stand by my review (4/5 stars), and still think this is a good time-killing game.

I keep hoping something will unlock if I go far enough. ;)

The only thing that will unlock at this point is the scenarios further in the campaign. For more game play play with a different character, or a higher difficulty (the difficulties get quite high, just on AI performance), or try to win some of the rewards playing the Archmage (Can you summon 10 water sprites in a single game? iIt is tough!) And, of course, the premiere place for extra content is online, playing a human is a very different thing. And the folk online, at this point at least, are pleasant folk!

In the future I hope we can provide some of the additional classes of mage and scenarios we have drafted, (instecto-mancer, timelord, etc.), but for now that is the content we offer.

BTW, if you see "Shmoo" online, that is me, feel free to chat with me, or challenge me to a duel, or training. I am not the best player online, but I am good enough to give some tips!

richard

the randomness of the cards and the randomness of the starting points; the 2 points that make me think twice about buying the full version.

i've played the full demo and tried online and networked. my complaint about online play is you lose xp when you lose a match..

also i can no longer get anything other than a cleric/holy deck. dunno if it's a bug, or in the design; since i've played thru the 1st part of the campaign. [as far as i can play with the demo version.]

the randomness of the cards and the randomness of the starting points; the 2 points that make me think twice about buying the full version.

i've played the full demo and tried online and networked. my complaint about online play is you lose xp when you lose a match..

also i can no longer get anything other than a cleric/holy deck. dunno if it's a bug, or in the design; since i've played thru the 1st part of the campaign. [as far as i can play with the demo version.]

The demo version limits you to the cleric in online play—the full version lets you play other decks.

Any plans for an iphone version?

Is this a collectable game? Where you have the option to buy more cards, trade, and so forth?

I hope not.

I respect that kind of game, but I'm not interested.

If not, I'd be inclined to try this. Because I like games that have the Magic: the Gathering feel but I don't care for the collectability aspect.

So I would appreciate that clarification..?

(On the other hand, I don't object to Expansions that are not collectable, and I don't object to Unlockables!)

Is this a collectable game? Where you have the option to buy more cards, trade, and so forth?

I hope not.

I respect that kind of game, but I'm not interested.

If not, I'd be inclined to try this. Because I like games that have the Magic: the Gathering feel but I don't care for the collectability aspect.

So I would appreciate that clarification..?

(On the other hand, I don't object to Expansions that are not collectable, and I don't object to Unlockables!)

It's not collectible.

Well, it is sort of, in that you gain cards, or other benefits, by defeating opponents within the game, but all the cards are included in this game so there's no "buy a deck online" situation, which seems to be what you're worried about.

I can't stand CCGs for the collectible aspect either, and I enjoy this game, I'd recommend it. But play the demo first. It gives you a good idea of the flavour and game play.

It's not collectible.

Well, it is sort of, in that you gain cards, or other benefits, by defeating opponents within the game, but all the cards are included in this game so there's no "buy a deck online" situation, which seems to be what you're worried about.

I can't stand CCGs for the collectible aspect either, and I enjoy this game, I'd recommend it. But play the demo first. It gives you a good idea of the flavour and game play.

Thanks Paul, that's exactly what I wanted to know. Your reply is appreciated.

Okay, played the Demo.. addictive as crack alright..

It is not a bug that you can only play holy online, it is a restriction for the trial version. It is a very generous restriction, many players have played hundreds of games with the cleric. The cleric is a flexible class to play, so while you won't have all the tools available to someone who has purchased - your disadvantage is not too great either.

As far as losing XP when you lose online - it is a rating system, similar to chess. You win more for beating a higher level player than lower, and you lose less for losing to a higher level player. If you didn't lose xp, then the levels would only measure how much you play - as it is - when you play a 7th level player you can be pretty sure it will be tougher than a 3rd level, and pretty sure it is not the challenge of a 10th level player. There are no other advantages or disadvantages for level - so higher level players are not playing with more HP or better spells - they are simply better players.

So, after reviewing this board, I downloaded the full version of Spectromancer. I gotta tell you, this game is a blast!

Mr. Garfield is spot on when he says the randomness of the cards you get each duel adds an additional element of strategy to the game. I've played the Cleric Campaign all the way through, and am beginning a new campaign as a Necromancer.

I cannot recommend this game highly enough! For about $20, you'll get more enjoyment and replayability than you would with some games at twice the price!

(And, no, I do not work for Richard Garfield).

I like deck construction (I am kind of obligated to), but I also like games that don't have deck construction - like Sealed deck Magic, or Bridge.

I must be crazy, as I'm just about to disagree with Richard Garfield about Magic! Nonetheless, I feel that Sealed Deck Magic has a strong element of deck construction in it - which is one of the main reasons I like it so much. I love the fact that there are two phases of skill and strategy: constructing a deck from your limited card pool, and then playing that deck against your opponents. Seemingly minor decisions in the deck construction phase can have significant consequences in the duelling phase. Sealed Deck has the feel of the early days of Magic - when everyone had a limited card pool - and that's why it's the form of Magic I enjoy the most.

Yeah - you are right, sealed deck DOES have deck construction the way most people play it, I almost retracted my example when I wrote it but thought no one would notice :-)

However, the point is still the same, you CAN play straight from a deck or booster (mini grand master), and it is fun, even if it is done less often - or play from a big public deck. And in a small way getting a sealed deck and stripping out red is similar to never playing water sprites in spectromancer? Maybe a bit.

Anyway - I promise my next game with alexey will have some form of construction for real.

Best regards -

So, finished Easy with all the magic types, I'm finished Cleric on normal, and going through Necromancer on Normal. Oh, the swearing my wife heard when I was playing the Cleric though... that was incredibly frustrating!

I noticed that when you win a card, you automatically have that card assigned to your next game. And you keep that card, I think, until you've won a game with it in your pool. I might be wrong however, but I noticed that I wasn't getting my Fire Elemental when I was going up against myself... again, and again, and again, and...

I had Duels of the Planeswalkers (and the other expansions for the Magic computer game), and while Sealed Deck was interesting, I was more of a deck-builder. I loved designing decks, handing them to the computer, then playing against them with other self-designed decks, trying different themes and strategies. (Oh, how I wish that game line was still supported!)

Different people, different preferences... I can respect that. :)

Three Donkeys just released their next expansion for this game: "Truth and Beauty". Will it be carried here in the Paizo store ?

Three Donkeys just released their next expansion for this game: "Truth and Beauty". Will it be carried here in the Paizo store ?

Hmm. We'll poke them and find out.

Any update on this?

Any update on this?

Truth and Beauty can now be purchased here!

The latest expansion for this game has been released. Will Paizo be carrying it soon, or should I just buy it straight from Three Donkeys?

If they upload it here, I'd be happy to sell it! :)

sooo... I should go bug them then?