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what you can do is just to let the whole haunt happen with no ill effects. Like if there was a paladin in the party. like a scene unfolding for the character. I was bothered by the fact that a haunt can't effect a paladin but J. Jacobs said don't punnish the paladin for having a benefit. just unfold the scene for them like they are having a vision.
Does the door lock when it closes? If you feel good about your CMB you could reposition/ toss one guard into the cell. That would leave only one guard to deal with. Does the ninja get sneak attack damage? It would all be non lethel. It would be a awesome picture to see one guard locked up and one drooling on the floor. Also the uniform from the one guard would help with the escape attempt. Unless you think the running naked lady wouldn't raise too much curiosity. If they are mooks then they are most likely low on hp.
Don't sunder valuable objects; players hate that. sunder the bow string. IF they have a spare on their sheet, move to retrieve it and move to restring it.
I see, so then monster attacks are basically use 'as is'. Wow, that makes for some rather powerful monsters. Some could down a caster with their full attacks! It is the Squishy that has to make sure it doesn't give you the chance to get that full attack. They learn.
High fantasy is purely about the players having fun. It has to do with the way you are running the game. Is it important that you challenge them for every fight? You are running the game for the players not against the players. It is all right to let them be bad asses, and weld the +5 sword wading through the waves of monsters. The guys would love it and the night and comraderie at the table will be at an all time high. That is what epic is about. I am tired of all the 'fair and balance'. Sometimes you want to be Elric with a sword that kills everyone.
I think I just fell to a sucubus who dominated me while in this abysmal plane. So We shoud have come up with that arguement. I think the thing that bothers me is the Staff was just introduced before we took this trip to the abyss (makes you think it might have been meant for this part of the ap)and now it is next to worthless. If it didn't have the blessed quality to give the good discriptor for damage reduction it would be just extra baggage.
An outsider is an outsider, your characters did not stop being humanoids, and the demons did not stop being outsiders. Your weapon should work, if not, then your characters cannot be treated as humanoid for the purposes of spells and effect, for fair play. I think I will start with this arguement.
The subtype is (evil)outsiders. So would you still have ruled that the weapon does not function as a bane weapon if we are now in the abyss fighting demons?,
The staff is the one that Elven_blades posted a spoiler to. It is a + 1/1 staff of evil outsider bane. The DM say's it has lost the bane vrs. outsiders because we are now in the abyss, and they are no longer outsiders. So one person pointed out that they are now native yet remain outsiders.
Obscuring mist is a good way to get sneaky, if you get blind fight even better. The bluring weapon enhancement from 3.5 magic item comp. can give a few sneaks a day. Blur gives concealment/miss chance. I don't know if that qualify's. Improved darkness/blind fighting.
Me too please, Sins, and Spires! Joecoolives@comcast.net Thanks, every time saving option helps. Bryan
Flee forgot to mention Micky was wearing a robe and carrying a staff when we saw him at the park.
In one adventure we all played Gnoll's even fought for the right to be leader. Running wild over the countryside sacking farms, robbing caravans, till the adventures came to put a stop to us! epic! I have played a goblin, saved from death. A sprite, snerfneblin, and a good black dragon.(I was 12).
I don't think you can withdraw if your surounded.
Or do you have to get a masterwork silvered plus 1 Stake?
I just thought I would post saying that Hastur's comics has a copy of Skinsaw' and Sin's if you want to get in touch with them. http://hasturgames.com/index.php
BIG PLUS 1
I am in Blake's group and I think there were a few things that made it in our favor. Realistically all of us are long time players and DMs. We are playing with very optimized characters. We have been trained well on battlefield tactics, by fire. Blake's wizard/trans muter is a powerful battlefield controller. My rogue is a flanker who is also a dwarf so he had a big bonus against giants to AC plus mistweave armor and swiftstep boots that allow a concealment and 20' ft teleport. Not to mention a bluff and improved feint. (I think 4 hits including a Crit were negated by the mist.) I could flank and do average of 30 points damage. hasted with a possible 3 hits with all the buffs wasn't to hard. The wizard is doing multiple damage with summons and spells, not to mention a fire ball that killed a few giants. The barbarian having no problem hitting into the 30 AC'. The cleric had a bevy of things happening. Holy smites, with a spiritual weapon and zombie giants. While we plugged up the halls. We were mowing through the giants. I think there could have been some things the giants could have done different, bull rushes, throwing rocks, picking us up to squish. But with attacks of opportunity and dishing out some damage I don't know if those things would have had a impact. I have had some of the same problems making what I think is going to be a challenging encounter, only to feel that the party hardly worked up a sweat. I know our DM is shaking his head demoralized when his giant chief goes down in three rounds. I know it isn't supposed to be DM/Players but when you put hours into your dungeon thinking it is going to be cool, only to have it be a cake walk, it is discouraging. We also have a house rule that all save DC's are increased by 2. Trying to make spells more effective. I think that some of the high saves also had a part to play in the battle. When a giant has to make a 24 DC will save or become blinded by a holy smite, Not much chance of making that. I think it was a good thing when we were low level but might be a bit too much at high level now that we have attribute scores at mid 20's. I am not sure every problem we have can be attributed to the Channel energy. Our Cleric was optimized also to be able to heal major damage with the healing domain, and a none combat stance. I think our ability to dish out major damage, control the battlemap, support each other, cover the bases with high DC's all make our group hard to handle. I have seen a major trend towards power-gaming/ optimization in the group. We tend to plan our characters with ability's and feats in mind, from 1st lvl. Multi classing has proven to be a liability/less powerful so no one really does that. If there is something that might be flavorful or a interesting choice it isn't picked if it might detract from having a higher armor class or better ability. I am not saying it is a bad thing but it is certainly had a impact on the style of our game, and the ability to run/DM a challenging campaign. I think these are all reasons for us steam rolling over the giants, and not any one problem.
I keep a notebook by my bed for names I come up with or read in books. Then I can mix and match names for first and last names. Alot of the names I use are from secondary characters in the books. That way you only write down the ones you like.
We take a 3 by 5 card with the bonus writen on the card. It is placed on the board by the mini's so it is in the picture when your moving the figure. It also works well with bless, haste, and any other spell or ability that add bonuses. You just keep the card with your character and throw it out when you cast the spell. Write down what kind of bonus it is, like circumstance, or luck, so you can add the ones that stack if there are more than one spell or ability going.
Or are you assumed to have let go of the rope? If you are climbing with a rope, and a wall to brace against you cant fall. DC of climbing with a rope against a wall, even one that is not knoted is only 5. you can only fall if you fail by 5 or more. The lowest you can roll is a 1. You just make no progress. Because with skill checks even a one doesn't meen you fail, because you can't fumble a skill check. Lame... If they are smart and knot the rope don't even make them roll. Edit; unless they have a very poor str. Then there is a slim chance they can fall
If you read further into that paragraph you will read this; 'Whileunder the effects of this spell, the target is immune to any new attempts to possess or exercise mental control over the target.' This means you would not have been susceptible to the charm if you were already covered by the PfE spell. You would have gotten to make a save vrs. the charm at a plus two if you were already charmed and someone cast PfE on you. Also the plus 2 resistance bonus of the spell, and the plus 2 morale bonus should stack on your save
the player tried to take the evidence about the skinsaw murders(after the Snake Lady). to the Secretary of the Mayor. I played him as a snobbish self important fop.(being as he does more to run the city than the Mayor). They didn't want to let him have the evidence to look at, just flashing the list of names to him. He told them that if they wanted to see the Mayor they had to prove to him that their case was strong enough. Not just any one can see the Mayor. They said it is for the Mayors eyes only and I replied 'I am the mayors secretary and no one sees him just because they say so'. They gave him a hard time, pulled some attitude and I had them thrown out. Then they tried to convince the guardsman that they had important info for the Mayor, and now tried to be diplomatic with the guards. Who said 'Weren't you just talking to the Secretary? He's in charge, out you go!' They acted like they were untitled to preferred treatment. The Secretary didn't care who they thought they were, he was the one with the power. They had to return later (leaving the disruptive ones at home). After selling Xenesha's stuff. With tails between their legs to be more respectful. When the mayor gave them his gratitude and a write of preference, so they could sell their stuff for a greater profit. They lost out on 5000 gp by being confrontational
I had AF tumble out of the small room so that he had some room to maneuver in the cavern, spoiler: with his jump and balence he had no chance to fall, and the ability to move about by jumping made His lordship almost too much to handle. I even made a 36 foot jump from one end of the room to the other. You could even retreat into the room that has the piles of ghoul garbage, to jump down into the cavern again maybe for some sneak attack. My group was falling and sliding to the bottom of the ramp. They were having a real hard time moving around in there. One thing I did add was add quick heal/5 to Aldern, Even claiming that the mansion wouldn't let him die. Because with 6 hero's he would not have lasted inside Vorrels study, The paladin would have torn him to shreds. The look on their face when I said he tumbles out of the room with a 28 was awesome. With the Goblin ghouls a well placed channel Pos. energy and I failed every save, took care of them real quick. I had them at the bottom by the pool. They had scrambled up the walls right up to the party, climbing at a 30', they get to the top, and the cleric unleashed the goodness and they fell to the power of the gods. I had Aldern escape into the caverns to regain some HP and hide for some sneaksy atacks, I hid under the spiral stairs till I had a good opportunity to suprise. Then went after the Mage who was the object and drew them into a cloud of yellow mold. I could not paralizeee anyone much to my chagrin, but it was a fun fight for me. I could not make another good tumble check out when they boxed me in, and perished at that point.
Just having a place to go to look at reaper mini's to thumb through my favorite gaming books and decide if it fits in my collection. See the paints and decide if I want this master series paint, or citadel color. Talk to like minded people about the games is all the inspiration I need to buy the books from my local FLGS. I stop by once a week and nearly always find something I like. I bought my Beta, and core book from there and so did others from my group. Just to make sure it is there(the store) next week.(By the way they had 40 core rule books that sold out in a week. The Pathfinder selection is growing and now has its own section.) Sometimes it can be fustrating, they still havn't gotten the Dwarves companion. It is worth the wait The guys at the store always stear people to Pathfinder, they say if you want to play the best Miniature game ever writen try 4.0. I see people always thumbing through the Pathfinder books or buying a map pack. I hardly ever notice anyone looking at 4.0 edition. I am just saying to Nate, that I for one would rather pay retail for my gear, than save a few dollars, just to have the local game store around. Now if you have a pathfinder #5 I will buy it from you!
I ran a fun for me encounter with a evil halfling cleric riding a ogre, with custom made basket. It was fun.
We house ruled Full at first plus 6, as per beta, to be more harty at first level. Then the luck of the dice for everything later.
Yes, if you don't make the roll you dont' make it through. That is how we play it at least. If you don't make the DC roll you dont automaticly get to move through the space, and just provoke . Going back to 3.5, I supose. What brought this question up is I had a certain ghast aristocrat who got surrounded by the party and tried to tumble out of the middle. of 4 players I had a good skill role at 26 which just made it through the paladins CMD. but once we added all the 2's to the role it would have been 32. So I decided to just take the lesser damage from the other characters because I wasn't to concerned with thier damage, but the paladin hurt, and I had to get around him to have any hope of escaping for another round or two. So I was wondering if you can ignore others to take the AoO, thus reducing the DC check being that I was only worried by one of the players. Or if you don't have that option, and the DC would stay 32 because of all those threatening. Meaning that the monster would not move at all, or making the 26 to end up on the other side of the paladin.
What about silvered magic brass knuckles?
So if you choose to trust your in your armor class and take the AoO all you have to add is the CMD plus 5 to move through the space, or add plus two to the DC for any enemy's you choose to avoid. Correct? First of all, if you miss your first roll to tumble/acrobaticly through the first opponent, you end in the first open
Second, do you get to make a acrobatics roll against every one of them to decide if they get a AoO
what if the subject is surrounded on all sides by opponents in all squares. And you want to tumble out of the middle of them do you have to count every one of them against the tumble DC Rules state that you raise the DC by 2 for each additional opponent avoided. So does that mean that every one either gets an attack of opportunity, or you have to add 5 plus 16 to the difficulty of the acrobatics role for moving through an occupied space? If you have to count all enemy's, can you choose to exclude them and take AoO? Or choose which/some opponents to defend against? x_x_x X/0/X x_x_x Or... do you only count the one the actual tumble attempt is against.
I believe the PCs earn xp for surviving the haunt and/or destroying it, similar to earning xp for surviving/disarming a trap. Thanks Rodger, I see you got back to me twice.
Do you give Exp for surviving the haunt or only for destroying it?
How do you score exp. from a haunt? Do you have to destroy it? Or can you get exp. for resisting the efects? My players never keyed into the channel positive energy yet or even tried to do a Knowledge religion check. So they are facing the haunts, and doing rather well with the saves. But, I was thinking that I would give Full exp for destruction. Half for a positive save. Nothing for failure. How is it suposed to be?
While that ruling has been clearly expressed before, why should all haunts be automatically lumped together as fear effects? Moods and images invoked by haunts involve a dozen different emotions: If a haunt's actual effect has nothing to do with fear or terror, I'd rather not give blanket immunity to the effect. I wish I had been able to read this part befor I ran it on Sunday. I now see the importance of letting the Palidin shine, But I think it went extreamly well the way I played it, though. The Palidin was immune to all universal haunts, and was the one to activate them. I had also given the Burning haunt to him so he was able to exspirience the Manticore. They made it all the way through the second level with hardly a scratch as it was. But they did have the visions and the only haunt they didn't trigger was the insane haunt in the office. Made virtualy every save as it was. The female cleric did try to off herself but the Palidin grappled her and pinned her easily. The druid did fall victim to the festering haunt and tried to claw of his face, but he healed himself and restored himself. But we did have a good time. They stood and watched the fighter dance because it looked like he was doing Ok, 5 rounds later after failed saves he wasn't so fine. He wouldn't have danced for 1 round with the paladins bonus vrs. fear. The rogue nearly strangled himself in the library being alone and sneaky, but he made the important save, lucky. Everyone else was on the second floor.
Our Gm said they were mind affecting effects, which a paladin shouldn't have immunity to in that section. That is what I wanted to do because I don't want it to be so easy on them. I want it to be a challenge. So I might be ignoring that aspect. Also there are 6 players, so I could let it ride. I want the saves to be a challenge but not to be too easy.
How would Aura of courage work in the manor? Would you just give everyone within ten feet of the palidin the Bonus to fear affects against the haunts? It says in the AP that all haunts are fear affects. Or only saves that are are specifically saves vrs. fear? Thanks for the help. Well darn it, that takes half the fun out of it.
I miss Firefly. Re-elect FireFly!
How would Aura of courage work in the manor? Would you just give everyone within ten feet of the palidin the Bonus to fear affects against the haunts? It says in the AP that all haunts are fear affects. Or only saves that are are specifically saves vrs. fear? Thanks for the help.
I might be late to the party, but personally for my homebrew I gave monks freedom of movement and dimmension door as additional uses of their ki pool (in the setting monks are parkour free style runner like trainers). Gave them a better speed progression and incorporated ¨improved natural attack¨ I would like to see a weapon that deals a die 8 that they could use with flurry, and do decent damage. To be used to bypass DR. Like a polearm. I would also like to see a free feat like Shorten Haft. I love spinning polearms.
Anytime you attack a rust monster with a metal weapon, the rust efect is aplied. So I think thier carapice also has the effect.
It also has alot to do with the group you play with. My old groups style of play was more relaxed, where you played more of your character concept. So there was more multi classing and characters that were picked for more of thier style over substance. The group I play in now has evolved into a more optimized group so to speak. A DM we play with now is an optimizer. Who has his sites set on high level play, and turnes most fights into dangerous encounters. By the logic that if you lived in this super deadly world, you would want to be as deadly in your own right. So, we now have become a group where multi classing is hard to do because you never become as powerful as you could if you stick to one class. You might dip into a class for an ability or two, but true multi classing would mean your true potential would never be reached. I am not saying that we are the group of vorpol welding, full plate mail wearing, magiced to the hilt players, but it takes some careful planning to become a real threat. We have some players who havn't gotten the hang of it and I feal they are often overshaddowed. But I feal a character who played a monk3 /fighter 3 /thief 2 would have a bunch of things they could do, but could not do any of them well. they would not survive in my group. It kind of reminds me of chess in a way, that you have to plan ahead. I like both ways of play. But the first way is the one I am more used too.
I personaly think Devils can be lots of fun. They can be most pleasantly two faced! Promise you your grandest desires, be pleasant and understanding as they worm thier way into your confidence. Even fulfill your 'Contracts' in exchange for that small inconcequintial thing you call a soul. "Your hardly using it as it is!" I love Dudley Moore in the original Bedazzled.(movie) Always think of them as goal oriented. Let your sneakiness out. Remember, The thing they grant in exchange for that 'contract' is easily twisted like a wish gone wrong. Serves you right for dealing with Devils! Do you think that the Rulers of Cheliax thought they were going to be tied to Asmodias as tightly as they are now. They probably thought they were too smart to get cought in that trap. Demons are easier. Their goals more base. They can easily be as sneaky though.
My Players threw me a curve ball. They took a ship from Sandpoint to Magnamar, a short boat trip instead of a long trip around overland. So you might want to think of some water encounters. I was caught with my mouth hanging open.
Hey eveyone, I am sure glad to read all your helpful thoughts. I am glad I posted this because it has helped me work through my stuff. where before I was just stuffing it. I realize my feelings were brused and the players in my group probably didn't even know. It was also helpful to hear from DM_Blake too. So all your feedback has helped alot. It might of just been hard to DM with a Terresqe in the room...:-)
I agree that they probably thought it wasn't a big deal. One even said exactly that. I am playing in a Path DM'd by the other. We have finnished the first part, I don't think I need to be told not to read it. I would also agree that when the path is finnished if they were interested I would loan it to them to read. But, at least wait till it is finnished
My deeper issue is I started reading some non-ROTRL posts where I was reading things concerning my game that wern't very pleasing, and not altogether true. There were complaints that I needed to hear maybe, but reading them on these posts wasn't the ideal way. I just didn't want to start a slam fest on the posts(so what do I do? Start a whole thread).
Wow, were you watching from behind the bushes, that was a great Stealth role you made. I never saw you! That was almost exactly how I found out.
I didn't fudge the roles with the barghest, and they did finnaly bring him down, the problem was the paladin was down, healed, got up, AoO, down again. I offered the option of a reincarnate, but wasn't taken up on it. I could have offered some advice, but was hoping they would flee. I still play with these guys and am playing with them now as a player, and I do enjoy it for the most part, we are all happy with the pathfinder rules. I was just having a hard time figuring out how I felt. Getting over the fealings and so forth. I just wanted to know if other people would feel the same way I did. I thought maybe I am making a big deal of nothing. I never said "don't read BO", never thought I needed too. I did say stay off the ROTRL posts.
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