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So, I'm looking (well) ahead on Taja the Urban Bloodrager (Arcane) 10 / Fractured Mind Spiritualist (Devotion) 1 and I see the following bloodrage power in the distant future:At 16th level, when entering a bloodrage you can choose one of the following spells and apply its effects to yourself: beast shape IV (choose a creature your size or larger only), form of the dragon I, or transformation. This is in addition to arcane bloodrage and greater arcane bloodrage, and otherwise works as those abilities.
Since I think 17th level (for me, at least) is a little late to shift to focusing on natural attacks, I've been assuming I'll be using Transformation when I get to this point, but it is a bit lackluster for a (nearly) full BAB Bloodrager, so now I'm looking at Beast Shape IV a little more closely.
Are there any Medium or Large forms for Beast Shape IV that are actually useful for inflicting damage at endgame? I'm a Greatsword + Power Attack + Step Up And Strike build with a bit of an emphasis on shutting down spellcasters (it is the theme of the Arcane bloodline). The Girallon did pop-out as an interesting choice, but that's mainly a flashback of watching a partymate get ripped apart by a pack of them in D&D3.0...
Since I get Tireless Rage the next level, I suppose I could change forms each round as needed (end rage, restart rage), but that's probably going to be troublesome on a Virtual Tabletop...
So, any suggestions???
A galvo is humanoidish and medium size (medium's probably best to use your greatsword, you'd need to drop it and pick it up again w/beast shape). You might like a secondary bite attack, the +4 size bonus to Str, blindsense 60', resist electricity 20 and being amphibious. Plus the reach 10 slams might be useful occasionally.
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Just noticed the Angazhani (High Girallon): Large magical beast that uses weapons and armor while retaining the Girallon's natural attack options (though without the natural reach somehow, despite being 'larger, more powerful versions of their lesser cousins'). They even seem capable of speech.
This form seems to have potential for dealing damage...
see if the GM would let you use giant form spell of equal level instead. as an urban bloodrager i think a humanoid form would fit better then a beast..
you know that dinosaur are animal, you can transforme in to a t-rex, triceratops, velociraptor. aditionaly you can change into magical beast like griffon, giant eagle, guirallon, manticore, owlbear
Since I think 17th level (for me, at least) is a little late to shift to focusing on natural attacks
If it's a flavor decision, I can understand that, but mechanically it should totally work. You don't seem to have anything weapon specific, so you'd basically just have to replace your sword with an Amulet of Mighty Fists.
Unfortunately there is no giant form spell of 6th level, the monstrous physique spells should work.
It's way more powerful, though. Turning into Deathsnatcher would grant flight, pounce, six primary attacks (four usuable alongside a greatsword), resist 20 vs. cold and fire, and a rather potent poison. All that in addition to being able to use armor, weapons, a shield, and to access equipment.
you know that dinosaur are animal, you can transforme in to a t-rex, triceratops, velociraptor. aditionaly you can change into magical beast like griffon, giant eagle, guirallon, manticore, owlbear
Apart from the Girallon Taja already mentioned in the opening post, none of those can use weapons. Also, a T-Rex is gargantuan, you can't turn into that.
It's probably not an every time thing. Catoblepas if you want to be inexplicably huge in size and reach despite being technically large, Chimera for a bunch of attacks and a good breath weapon, gorgon if you want to petrify a bunch of mooks.
There's a bunch of good options, but you aren't going to be using your sword or armor. polymorphamory
The giant white girallon is cool too.
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Since I think 17th level (for me, at least) is a little late to shift to focusing on natural attacksIf it's a flavor decision, I can understand that, but mechanically it should totally work. You don't seem to have anything weapon specific, so you'd basically just have to replace your sword with an Amulet of Mighty Fists.
I do have Weapon Focus (Greatsword) + Weapon Versatility, so I am somewhat invested in Greatsword usage (the other physical dps in my party is a knife master unchained rogue, an inspired blade swashbuckler, and a bard with a bow, so I feel it is important for me to have the option to do bludgeoning damage)...
Additionally, I've learned the Rags to Riches and Keen Edge spells (sadly, I only have one 3rd level spell slot at this point), which don't really work with Natural Attacks either.I could* get an Amulet of Mighty Fists but that is twice as expensive as the equivalent weapon and only really works when I am raging (I actually did run a couple of fights without raging recently after using 15 rounds of rage to get past an obstacle as the party did not have enough strength to do it without me raging the entire time). Additionally, the amulet does cap out at +5 instead of a weapon's +10, which might be very significant at levels 17+.
*So far, the settlements we've been in have been limited to items under 13k, so the amulet hasn't been a feasible option: I'm currently using a +1 Furious Greatsword that is effectively a +4 weapon while raging with the 'Rags to Riches' buff.
I don't know how much this will improve in the back half of Return of the Runelords...
01) Weapon Focus (Greatsword), Skill Focus(Perception)
02) Skill Focus(Diplomacy), Skill Focus(Sense Motive), Iron Will
03) Step Up
05) Power Attack, Eschew Materials
07) Following Step, Combat Reflexes
09) Weapon Versatility
10) Disruptive
11) Step Up and Strike
13) Teleport Tactician, Spellbreaker*
*We're not actually level 13 yet, but I'm pretty confident these will be the feats I will take at that point: Beyond that, I'm not really sure...
- 1) Long Arm, Shield, Protection from Evil, Blade Lash, Magic Missile (bloodline), Cheetah's Sprint
2) Bladed Dash (archetype), Ablative Barrier, Force Sword, Wild Instinct, Resist Energy, Invisiblity (bloodline)
3) Rags to Riches (archetype), Clay Skin, Keen Edge
- +2 Mithril Agile Breastplate
Belt of Mighty Constitution (+2)
Eyes of the Eagle
Feather Step Slippers
Shawl of the Lingering Phantom
Headband of Alluring Charisma (+2)
Amulet of Natural Armor (+1)
Lynx Eye Charm
Cloak of Resistance (+2)
Supernatural Causes (+1 Furious Silversheen Greatsword)
+1 Composite Shortbow (+5 Str)
Rod of Metamagic, Extend (lesser)
Wayfinder
Bag of Holding (Type I)
Ioun Stone (Pale Blue Rhomboid)
Ring of Protection (+1)
If your GM lets you use Bladed Dash with Greater Bloodrage, letting you move as part of activating bloodrage (which RAW doesn't work because you don't cast the spell but rather apply the effects, and the movement happens "When you cast this spell"), you should indeed stick to your guns sword. The math otherwise still works out even with a wasted feat and lower bonus from AoMF, and claws and bite do multiple damage types including bludgeoning, but the natural attack build based off BS4 only works out better when it has the advantage of pounce.
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If your GM lets you use Bladed Dash with Greater Bloodrage, letting you move as part of activating bloodrage (which RAW doesn't work because you don't cast the spell but rather apply the effects, and the movement happens "When you cast this spell"), you should indeed stick to yourgunssword. The math otherwise still works out even with a wasted feat and lower bonus from AoMF, and claws and bite do multiple damage types including bludgeoning, but the natural attack build based off BS4 only works out better when it has the advantage of pounce.
Yeah, my GM asked us not to pounce, so my plan with Bladed Dash is to cast another spell (like Dance of a Hundred Cuts), move to a charging position, then Rage/Dash to close in and still get a single attack off...
that polymorph is bloodragers pounce option if they didn't go for totems, without pounce it's a pretty complicated choice. You do have quite a few feats that would enjoy a longer reach. The standard girallon can probably use weapons, and it retains the 10ft reach that the Angazhani loses. That plus longarms is probably your best pounce replacement.
Honestly, if you really want to use your greatsword, casting monstrous physique from your spells to be a deathsnatcher and using the free rage polymorph for the transformation spell is probably fine. It looks like you don't currently have enhancement bonuses to strength or dex anyway.
With a DM outlawing pounce and limiting item availability, I'd expect they want fights to last a little longer so that everyone can get their chance. I bet if you tell them what you want and ask what they want, you could probably negotiate something interesting. Neither of you want a situation where you turn into a giant stinky cow because it's mathematically the best option.
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that polymorph is bloodragers pounce option if they didn't go for totems, without pounce it's a pretty complicated choice. You do have quite a few feats that would enjoy a longer reach. The standard girallon can probably use weapons, and it retains the 10ft reach that the Angazhani loses. That plus longarms is probably your best pounce replacement.
Reach is definitely nice, but my Step Up feats require me to be adjacent to my foe, so I don't value it quite as highly as I normally would...
Honestly, if you really want to use your greatsword, casting monstrous physique from your spells to be a deathsnatcher and using the free rage polymorph for the transformation spell is probably fine. It looks like you don't currently have enhancement bonuses to strength or dex anyway.
My Ioun Stone is +2 Strength, and I'm assuming I'll upgrade to at least +4 before 17th level (again, the communities have been just a little too small so far), and possibly boost my other physical stats as well...
With a DM outlawing pounce and limiting item availability, I'd expect they want fights to last a little longer so that everyone can get their chance. I bet if you tell them what you want and ask what they want, you could probably negotiate something interesting. Neither of you want a situation where you turn into a giant stinky cow because it's mathematically the best option.
Our GM wants to keep the game a little more interesting, so he'd like to avoid rocket tag if possible: We are officially a party of 6 but though we sometimes play with only 4, so the GM uses maximum HP foes when we have a full party to try to balance things out without adding extra foes that just slow things down...
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Arise, slumbering thread...
Well, it's been nearly a year, but we hit level 16 last week (we took a good portion of 2022 off as two of our players refused to let their newborn child learn to fend for itself) and I'll finally get True Arcane Bloodrage next level, so I've started looking at this again.
My GM has declined my request to have my equipment resize instead of merging if I shift into Girallon (high or otherwise) form, and to be fair we haven't actually found the AP threatening enough that we really need the additional damage output.
I have come up with a possible work-around for my sword by getting a couple of enchantments on it: Source
Ultimate Equipment pg. 137
Slot weapon quality; Price +1 bonus; Weight —
Description
A called weapon can be teleported to the wielder’s hand as a swift action that does not provoke attacks of opportunity, even if the weapon is in the possession of another creature. This ability has a maximum range of 100 feet, and effects that block teleportation prevent the return of a called weapon. A called weapon must be in a creature’s possession for at least 24 hours for this ability to function.
Construction
Source
Requirements Craft Magic Arms and Armor, teleport; Price —
Giant Hunter's Handbook pg. 33
Slot none; Price +4,000 gp; Weight —
Description
A resizing weapon instantly shrinks or grows to suit the size of any creature that picks it up unless it is currently wielded by another creature. It reverts to its original size 1 round after it leaves its wielder’s possession.
Construction
Requirements Craft Magic Arms and Armor, resize item; Price 2,000 gp
Basically, the idea is to drop the sword, start my bloodrage and shift into Girallon form, then summon the sword back as a swift action at which point it changes to large size for maximum carnage...
One thing that is kinda pushing me away from Beast Shape is that I picked up Infuse Self this level and Beast Shape IV will end that nice long buff: Assuming I am infused with a +2 Str bonus, this effectively reduces the Strength buffs of Beast Shape and Form of the Dragon by 2 and makes Transformation a little more attractive
- Transformation: Str 32 (Infused), Dex 20, Con 18, +4 Natural Armor, +5 Fort save, +1 BAB, Medium Size, keep +3 Mithril Breastplate (Net +6 AC, +3 attack, 2d6+20 base wpn dmg).
- Large Magical Beast: Str 34, Dex 14, Con 20, +6 Natural Armor, Large size, lose +3 Mithril Breastplate (Net -5 AC [before Mage Armor], +2 attack, 3d6+22 base wpn dmg).