Skeleton

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having never played RPG's in an "Official" setting but looking into it, I can say from my own experiences there really is no easy answer to questions like these, but how wide spread are the complaints? someone somewhere will always get offended somehow. Personally i treat everyone as an equal and i treat everyone with the same respect given to me regardless of gender, race, orientation whatever, but even that can land you in hot water in this day and age. It all depends on who you are dealing with.

Some EXPECT special treatment, and that is simply something i am not willing to do.

EDIT: what i am trying to say is, if men are chasing off women due to being rude, or intimidating them, or just plain being creepy that is a problem, and needs to be dealt with those specific cases, and i view it no different if a woman is being rude, intimidating, or creepy to a male player.

I just view it as there should not be any special rules going on to make women more comfortable at the tables, I view it as how we make EVERYONE more comfortable at the tables.


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Pretty much what Bruunwald and ross Byers said, I think it is a FANTASTIC and brilliant concept! but the pally is right, definitely evil.

For the record i also think using charm person to be all "hey buddy tell me all your secrets :-D" *runs to sell secrets to an information broker*" would be evil as well.


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Eli Hammerlock wrote:


Oh nooooo, our GM is terrible at following rules so for crafting. Lets say that it takes 30 days to craft an item, our GM would just be like "30 days passed and he finishes crafting" allowing the crafter to be in combat and claim loot, exp, ect...

Well yeah i think it is well within his right to charge that ten percent mark up, to play devil's advocate...

If that is the problem you and the other members of your group have with him, have you tried saying "well we want to play those thirty days so while he is off crafting we want to go on an adventure, and possibly recruit a temporary while he is busy" Which while if he is playing his character and crafting it does not mean you have to stop yours being adventurers.


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I like the alignment system, but what i do not like are alignment restrictions. I could very easily see the Lawful Good barbarian, whose "rage" is an extra surge of strength that he can summon from within himself when the chips are truly down like is so common in books, movies, etc. Or a True Neutral paladin of balance who fights for it as hard as any religious zealot. Or a Chaotic Evil monk who is out to simply gain ultimate power and riches so he can ultimately fulfill any desire he has.


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DrDeth wrote:

Making every option yield the same DPR = homogenity which is boring.

Not to put words in anyone's mouth but i dont think thats what folk are asking for, they simply would like a broader range of more effective options.

As an example i have played a half orc fighter who specialized in the great club and had a lot of fun! while lower DPR then the standard axe or great sword I still felt like i could contribute just fine and even had some unique options only i could do ( three mountains and brutal strike in 3.5, Bludgeoner which came in handy when we switched to PF)

While when i tried to do a sniping crossbow character i just felt irrelevant at high levels while i still had to spend more feats just to feel i could contribute a tiny bit, while i have never tried to make a sling specialist i assume they go through the same deal.


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I have always liked slings as the ranged option for my fighters, easy to conceal, alot easier to carry then a bow especially for someone who doesnt anticipate using ranged weaponry, Sling and a few bullets can all fit in a single pouch! decent ranged increment, decent damage type, just a good option for the melee specialist in my opinion.

If interested in slings this guy has a few videos on them that are pretty informative on there general effectiveness and use in the olden days.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=covH4voKukw


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MrSin wrote:

Ditto, but there's this weird thing where you need to balance your role play and mechanics to stay effective sometimes. Varies from game to game, so YMMV. I much prefer the approach where I never have to meta game, and I can focus on characters, but that's something I reserve for my own home games/house rules more than anything.(luckily, you can always just pick someone you don't like roleplay and another for your favored enemy, even if it isn't perfect it works for roleplay!)

So... where'd all the fighters go? Are they extinct?

i actually agree, why i always took humans as my favored enemy at level one if nothing else sprung out to me for the character, it would always be effective, and can always be rationalized as anyone who has grown up in arduous times most likely has come into conflict with humans at one point or another

What i never particularly liked is the ranger who takes favored enemy: undead, even though his backstory never has him coming intoo conflict with one before in his life, but even then i have never been one to tell anyone else how to play there character so the point is moot.


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Kirth Gersen wrote:

Here's a good example of a reasonably level-appropriate effect that would work as we want:

DAZING STRIKE [COMBAT]
Prerequisite: Fighter level 6th.
Benefit: As a standard action or attack of opportunity, make a single melee attack. Any opponent damaged by this attack must save vs. Fortitude (DC 13 + your Strength modifier) or be dazed one round. The duration is multiplied on a confirmed critical.

Note that it occupies one (1) bonus feat slot; it allows reasonably level-appropriate effects (Cf. hold person) and allows for limited battlefield control (thus usable as an AoO); and it isn't a spell, although it still comes with a similar built-in use limitation (you can use it more than once per day, but it eats into your action economy if you use it proactively, by preventing you from getting in a full attack, starting as soon as you get it).

I just want to say when i first read "fighter spells" i hated it, i play a fighter to be the mundane hero, but when you put it like this i love it brother! I would love to see some kind of system that does that, as long as there within the realm of possibility like that idea.


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im not trying to stir the pot here simply clarifying, from what i read this player built a caster focused cleric with a high INT for RP purposes but with an 18 in wisdom, so he kind of dumped the physical side to be a more powerful spellcaster right? Then the gm said he was using spells in creative ways helping the party like with the animate rope trick for example?

which honestly that seems him playing to his stats, but one encounter of him trying to melee something makes him a bad player? it might have been a bad choice for sure but mistakes are made in the heat of the moment, and he might have been doing the only thing he figured he could to help the party in that specific instance, Now thats how i read it at first if its not i apologize.

But if that is how it happened you sound like your being a tad harsh with the guy, im sure we have all made less then perfect choices in our gaming career


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also it would not be any different then a group who only has a cleric with negative channeling, simply he would be able to gain a benefit from his burst damage, he can still use wands of CLW and above for free AFAIK.

but i would hope he does take selective channel as a feat


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Am i the only who read Pendagast comment as a joke? 0.o

anyway nothing new to add, my biggest gripe is the whole full attack vs move dichotomy as well, honestly for me i liked star wars saga editions way of handling extra attacks the most out of the d20 systems ive played.


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ill second the "standard adventuring kit" a simple group of items for a set price that most level 1 characters should have access to instead of buying everything separately.

now these are just personal things i would like, a higher base damage martial crossbow, different and unique ammo types, such as a bolt that acts as a grappling hook, a sort of "flare" like bolt that would be neat. some kind of expensive bolt that functions similar to a modern flashbang grenade.


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if you really want to do that combo it would be better with a monk sorceror, theres a bloodline for sorc empyreal i think? that allows you to use wisdom as your primary casting stat, that would help with the MAD


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W E Ray wrote:

That's me, biased and immature.

Never said otherwise.

. . . . Honestly, my vitriol against the Gunslinger here is as much to illustrate my point about "best Class" being hard to judge based on fun as it is to reveal my immaturity. There are lots of gamers, myself included, who just won't play with Gunslingers.

dont get me wrong, disliking it is perfectly valid, it doesnt rock your boat thats perfectly fine, insinuating anyone who actually finds the class fun is mentally inferior is uncalled for and snobbish


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W E Ray wrote:


Fun -- well, that is 100% biased. Many of us consider the Gun-Dork in the UC so not fun we won't sit at the same table as a Player who loves the Gun-Dork with all two of his brain cells. All any one gamer can say is what's most for for himor her personally.

nice jab at people who find the gunslinger fun, that's mature.

Anywho he does have a point in alot of personal bias is involved, personally i find ranger and if not for the alignment restriction i would have to say Paladin as well. They just have alot of inherent versatility that lets them be useful in almost any group (caveat being an evil group for the paladin obviously)


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Hey yall, let me add some background on this, a character concept i have always wanted to try is a fighter who specializes in daggers. now most people have said play a rogue but im just not a fan of sneak attack, i prefer more in your face characters.

Anywho after being let down that daggers are not in the close weapon group (otherwise brawler fighter definately would have worked fine for my concept) i decided to try my hand at making my own archetype for it, it probably sucks as its my first creation but before bringing it to my DM i was hoping some of you could critique it for me? im not trying to make something broken, just take an underrated weapon and make it viable for fighter characters.

Movie plot spoiler:

Dagger Fighter (Fighter Archetype)

Weapon and armor Profiency
A dagger fighter does not gain proficency in heavy armor, shields, or martial weapons

skills
A dagger fighter gains 4 +int mod skills a level
add acrobatics (dex), perception (wis), stealth (dex), sleight of hand (dex) to the skill list

Dirty fighter
Starting at 2nd level, a dagger fighter gains a +2 bonus on dirty trick manuevers. this bonus increases by +2 for every four levels beyond 2nd. this replaces bravery

Dagger Defense
Starting at 3rd level, a dagger fighter learns how to use a dagger for defense as well as offense. whenever he is wielding a dagger in his main hand and his offhand is empty, or holding a second dagger, he gains a +1 shield bonus to AC. Every four levels thereafter (7th, 11th, 15th, and 19th), these bonuses increase by +1 each time to a maximum of +5 AC. This replaces armor training 1

Dagger training
At 5th level, weapon training only works with Daggers. At 5th level, The dagger fighter's weapon training bonus with daggers improves by +1 on attack rolls and +2 on damage rolls for every four levels beyond 5th (to a maximum of +4 on attack rolls and +8 on damage rolls at 17th level).

Uncanny dodge
at 7th level a dagger fighter gains uncanny dodge as a barbarian. this replaces armor training 2

Dirty critical
at 9th level, whenever a dagger fighter confirms a critical hit with daggers, he may make a dirty trick combat manuever as an immediate action without provoking an attack fo oppurtunity. this replaces weapon training 2

Improved uncanny dodge
At 11th level a dagger fighter gains improved uncanny dodge as a barbarian. This replaces armor training 3

Dagger style
At 13th level a dagger fighter can choose to master one of two styles of dagger fighting, a precision based style which doubles the threat range, or a powerful style which adds one to the critical modifier. This choice is permanent and cannot be changed. This replaces weapon training 3

Parrying Stance
At 15th level the dagger fighter masters the art of parrying a single enemy's attacks. he gains a +2 dodge bonus to ac against the last enemy he attacked. This replaces armor training 4

Riposte
At 17th level the dagger fighter can make a single attack against any enemy who attacks him and misses within range. This replaces weapon training 4

Dagger mastery
At 20th level a dagger fighter must choose a dagger for weapon mastery

some of the abilities do seem rather powerful but that's why i limited it to daggers and not other knife type weapons, i could definately see dagger style being broken with a kukri. and i did take alot of the mechanics from other fighter archetypes so hopefully it doesnt come across as broken.

Anywho id love to hear some feedback guys, thanks alot in advance.