The.Vortex's page

Would it be possible for there to be a boon added to do retraining but no gear changes? The current retrain boons seem excessive, if not punitive, to a character who does not want to change gear. Alternatively, could the existing rebuild boons have language added that the wealth is not changed if no gear is being changed? I think that having easier access to these things would be beneficial both to players wanting to have old characters take advantage of new boosts, as well as old and new PC's who may just want to make non-gear changes that would take a long time to complete via retraining.

As someone who rarely sees ANY consumable items that were actually paid for with coins being used at all, I second something like this. Even better would be a much less severe reduction of funds.

The amped versions of the Oscillating Wave Psychic (https://2e.aonprd.com/ConsciousMinds.aspx?ID=3) spells both convert the damage to a d10. One of them lists (in parenthesis) that this conversion removes the attribute modifier from the damage. The other doesn't.

My impression would be that both remove it and that the text in parenthesis is just for clarification. But I have seen people that say it stays there for ray of frost.
Which interpretation is correct here?

I would even allow it to work if the only implement you're holding was the weapon itself.

Interesting. I would never have even doubted it worked with just the weapon implement until I saw your comment. After reading it again, I am pretty sure it works with just the weapon implement. It would be utterly weird if a weapon implement user had to wait for their second implement at level 5 to use one of the main offensive tools of the class. But yes, I can see the argument that with a thrown (returning) weapon implement, you are technically not holding at least one implement the moment the weapon strikes.

Spike, Cactus Leshy Barber (because of the horrible pun. Barbs! Harhar!)
Level 5 Dual Gate (Water / Earth) Kineticist. Flexible Blasts, Tidal Wave, Stone Shield, Water Dance, Return to the Sea

Attributes: 14/18/18/8/18/10

The character was specifically built for PFS2-06: The Crashing Wave

Since I know a lot of fights would be under water, I basically HAD to take the level 4 feat Return to the Sea if I wanted to use ranged attacks, since the underwater combat rules have no exception for attacks with the Water trait, so all ranged blasts, being bludgeoning, would have been impossible otherwise.

Due to Leshy Lore as an ancestry feat I had a decent amount of skills, despite having Int 8. Athletics and Nature both came in handy, as of course Medicine did.
The Spine attack of Cactus Heritage was meant as a way to fight in melee without any AoO and uses the same proficiency and items as the blasts, so it seemed a very good fit.

Overall I had a few moments to shine. Biggest ones were a Tidal Wave that was able to damage three enemies for a decent amount (about 80% of an attack of someone of comparable level) on two different occasions, as well as moving Seelah into position to flank the BBEG with Water Dance, which would have taken her more than 3 actions on her own.
In combat I tried to focus on smaller enemies since the to hit and damage were very much sub-par, and the horrible rules for creating playtest characters lead to me having the worst AC in the group (other than the level 3 character) due to not having an armor rune.

Saves and Perception were all very good at +13, HP pretty decent as well. So other than the missing rune, the character was very well of defensively and had some nice utility value. It just wasn't the thing I think of first when I think of the 1st Ed. Kinetcist: An amazing single target / burst damage dealer

Scroll Thaumaturgy: It allows you to use your class DC for the Spell DC. So far, so good. But what about spells with a spell attack roll? Since the Thaumaturge is not proficient in the magical schools, does that mean any spell with a spell attack roll is bascially useless since they won't ever hit anything? I think most likely, there is just a sentence missing, allowing to use the same proficiency for spell attacks as well.

I for one am quite glad that a lot of the options from the book will not be playable in the society. I like some black and white in fantasy, and undead have always been one of the last bastions of truly evil things that are universally abhored. It always irked me that we have people summoning undead in society play regularly, and many of my more good-aligned or pharasma adjacen characters have to be bent to play with those. A new wave of even more sinister undead type characters is something I can very much live without.

"Imma go munch the evil merc bodies y'all laid out rq, anyone want anything?"
"Okay, you eat your fill and are sated... For now'

I don't see how the above is much different than many neutral players' behavior in Society. Not that I have an issue with it, it's a breath of fresh air tbqh.

I have never witnessed anything from a neutral aligned character that even comes CLOSE to cannibalism (is it still cannibalism if it is a different species?). Yes, the society has some less than nice people in it, but eating sentient creatures is something I will never be comfortable with, so I am glad that we won't have that at our tables in the near future.

The Precog has a Temporal Anomalie called Future Training, which grants proficiency in weapon categories like Advanced Melee, Heavy, etc.
Unfortunately it doesn't say anything about Weapon Specialization. And, unlike for example the Nanocyte, who's Weapon Spec entry states

You gain the Weapon Specialization feat as a bonus feat for each weapon type this class grants you proficiency with, including any weapons for which you gained proficiency through a nanocyte knack.

the Precog's just reads

You gain the Weapon Specialization feat as a bonus feat for each weapon type with which this class grants you proficiency.

Is there a general rule somewhere that lets class abilities count for the class granting the proficiency or is the Precog out of luck here and doesn't gain the Weapon Specialization for those weapons?

Welp wasn't expecting an automaton :O

Guns & Gears just came out and is now society legal. So I expect the next couple of adventures to use stuff from there to increase people's awareness / interest in the new stuff. Basic marketing strategy :)

Since it is impossible to leave reviews for this until August 2022 (why?), I will leave my points here after having run it yesterday (and keeping spoilers out of it):

It is definitely worse than last year's special!

Parts 1+2 (which really could have been one part since there is no real distinction between the parts / missions): Nothing really interesting happens most of the time, there are not many missions that are anything but combat, no indication / handout that tells groups which ones to do other than randomly, etc.
Part 3: This is almost a complete waste of time - Talking to the new NPC is nice, but all the skill checks in the end don't really amount to anything - and they don't even matter! There are no consequences for not making the rolls at all.
Part 4 finally had some player agency, in the choices they made for the waves. But the fact that the final battle can be cut short but other teams being faster was kind of a bummer.

Overall, I think if a player doesn't know Starfinder and thus doesn't get any of the references, this is a VERY mediocre experience.

Rating: 3/5

Smart Guns as well, there are Manufacturers in the Armory Book that specifically makes guns that use either biometric or psionic safeties to prevent anyone other than the person coded to the gun from firing it. Given, those these are technically biotech and psitech, but some of the options do already exist in other sources.

Smartgun, at least in Cyberpunk and Shadowrun, is not a biometric lock but a targeting system with IFF capabilities and that compares where you are aiming and where you are looking to improve your gun / eye coordination.

I just realised that there is likely a mistakte in the types of damage for the low tier leaded skeletons. According to the adventure, the hammer does slashin damage, while the claws do bludgeoning.
It won't make much of a difference in most groups, so not a big issue overall.

The only pity is that it is a 1-4 scenario. Many characters that had extensive dealings with datch, and thus would be the ones where she would have the most interesting impact, are past that level range

That's a known issue. 8 is the max the system can handle right now :(

Exactly.

Plus, he is an elf wizard, so a few hit point may be all he has!
CON8, level 9 wizard 5+3*9 = 32hp.

So, he could easily take himself out with his own fireball!

That calculation seems off for both PF1 and PF2:

PF1:

(4-1)*8+(6-1) = 29 (without taking favored class into account)

PF2:

6 (Ancestry) + 9*(6-1) (class) = 51

I guess you counted level 1 twice for first edition? Seems like the most likely culprit here.
That would take his HP to an even more impressively low number, though.

I just DMed this one and encountered a few more things that were weird in this one:

The Swords Trial:

- What about spells? Are you allowed to use them, which still do lethal damage? Do you have to take the penalty for nonlethal? Do you have to just not use spells that don't have an attack roll but deal damage?

- One of the optional encounters is against animated objects - which are IMMUNE to nonlethal damage. How are the players intended to handle those whith weapons that automatically do nonlethal if the hit would kill an opponent?

The Scrolls Trial:

- This is ANOTHER adventure that has the characters make a deal with a devil. The adventure does not list a default way of getting the amulet from the imp without either making a deal or (pretending to) offer them something for later. Why does that keep happening?! Especially after the Dean specifically said that they serve "unwise spellcasters", making it clear that entering a deal with them is unwise

- ALL of the recall knowledge checks are Religion only. Why not vary a bit here?

The Spells Trial:

- We did the Pool of Pain and one player asked about the weight of the gold bar. 1 bulk, as written in the adventure. They then went on and just used telekinetic projectile on it, which, unlike mage hand, has a limit of 1 bulk instead of L bulk. Cudos to the player for finding that, but it seems like a cantrip should NOT be able to completely solve this puzzle (hence the specific mention of mage hand not working).

The Caryg Manor

- I totally agree that the betrayal at the end was really forced and felt unnecessary.

- With six players, a bodyguard is added to the encounter. Great choice, I loved the increase to AC without the Elite Template! please use that option more often :)
But: the encounter lacks any information about the morale of the bodyguard. Doe they keep fighting after Caryg goes down? Do they surrender / flee at some point?

Overall a great idea for an introductory adventure, just a feww too many issues exist, sometimes well hidden, within its pages.

For the level 7+ PF2 - if they're already down to 3 players of an expected 4, isn't that hardmode enough? Why penalize them further with the CP boost?

Because without that, two level 9 characters and on level 10 in a 7-10 adventure would only have 14 CP, which would be low tier. That probably would be more like easy mode instead of hard mode.

Hopefully we get some Tier 5-7s soon. My -2001 won't be able to play that Quest...

There is a 5-8 announced for may:

Mistress of the Maze

How about a gnome bard that wants to find the worst possible music in existence. And his buffs are due to his allies just wanting him to shut up faster?

Hi Endzeitgeist,

Thanks for the reply. Most of the information really helps to prepare the adventure. I would like to contest your answer to the mishaps a bit, though. Probably also something you didn't intend happened in editing it seems:

When using the infiltrate option, a player HAS TO roll for any of the remaining challenges when it is their turn. And the only way to get rid of a critical failure is by using an edge point, which you can gain (for the group) by doing another skill challenge before the dance starts. And that challenge ALSO has the mishaps on critical failure.
Also, there is no warning for the players that such drastic things might happen. And as I said: some of the results pretty much destroy certain characters abilities to participate in the final combat of the adventure.

PS: I just noticed a section that states that the mishap results last until the end of the adventure, right in the sidebar. So that point of mine has just been an oversight on my part.

Hello,

After having played multiple of the playtest adventures that contained locks to pick, I am wondering what the intent behind the new lockpicking is.

The DCs to pick a lock were, in many cases, so high that a maxed out Rogue had to roll a 13+. Three times. No only is the chance to do that in a single round only 6.4%, but there is also a chance of 38.6% that you critically fail at least once. That not only will increase the time to open the lock, but only require a spare lockpick. So, for every two locks you will be opening, you will on average need one additional pick. Not only is that pretty expensive at low levels, but also makes the rogue feel incompetent.
Please, at least change the critical failure to negate one success OR destroy your pick. And/Or lower the DCs of locks to be more in line with the new and much lower skill values of characters.

Yes, I am aware that the new language tries to be more exact then we are used to, and that is a good thing. At least up to a point. If you cross that point, though, it makes rules quite hard to read and understand. To illustrate my point of view, I want to have a closer look at Furious Focus:

(1 Action), Attack, Fighter, Press
Requirements You are wielding a melee weapon without the agile trait.
Make a Strike. The Strike gains the following failure effect.
Failure This attack does not count toward your multiple attack penalty.

On first glance, this sounds pretty straight forward. But then you notice that this level 1 feat of the fighter, which used to be the go to class for new players, since it was the easiest to play, references a whole slew of other things:

Press Actions with this trait allow you to follow up earlier attacks. An action with the press trait can be used only if you are currently affected by a multiple attack penalty. Some actions with the press trait also grant an effect on a failure. Effects on a failure can be gained only if the action took a –4 multiple attack penalty or worse. The effects that are added on a failure don’t apply on a critical failure.
If your press action succeeds or critically succeeds, but it deals no damage and causes no other effects (typically due to
resistance), you can choose to apply the failure effect instead.

non-agile Your weapon has to be one that DOESN'T have a specific trait. Which is weird, since weapon traits tend to be a good thing that allow you to do more things

Multiple Attack Penalty and the Strike Action play a role as well.

So, to fully understand that simple level 1 feat, you have to know a whole bunch of stuff. And most of it is just limiting a feat that, at first glance, seemed nice. But once you put it all down in writing, it becomes:

All of strikes with a non-agile melee weapon, that suffer at least a -4 penalty from earlier attacks, do not increase your multiple attack for subsequent attacks if they miss, or miss and don't inflict damage, but not if they critically miss. This is incompatible with anything other then basic attacks.

Quite a lot of stuff to consider, and overall the whole feat just sounds way less interesting if you include all the caveats that are otherwise a bit obscured.

Please, make the rules more accessible to people that don't enjoy reading legal documents :)

I know that one of the goals of PF2 is to be more streamlined and less complicated then PF1. But on some fronts I think things went a bit too far. One of those is the flat-footed condition.

I like that it now is a static penalty, and not depending on stats and gear of the penalized creature. Especially for GMs that is a huge boon.

But why does basically everything make you flat-footed? Prone, Flanked, Stunning Fist and Daze are all low level options of controlling the enemy. And now they are all incompatible with one another. It is of no use to flank an enemy if that enemy was already knocked down by an ally or dazed by the mage. That sometimes doesn't leave too much room for any tactics.

A related topic is the utter lack of more types of bonuses and penalties. I concur that 10 or more types like in PF1 was overkill. But just three? That is just not enough to be interesting anymore.

Hello,

After playing PF Playtest a couple of times, as well as discussing it with multiple people, I noticed one thing that bothered a lot of them. All of them are quite familiar with Pathfinder in its current incarnation, and so they well know which feat or spell does what, and when it is usefull or not.
The problem now is that the Playtest reused a lot of the old names for things, but made their use vastly different. To name just a few examples:

Power Attack - In PF1 this was a must have basically for melee characters, and the lower the enemies AC was, the more useful Power Attack became.
Now in PF Playtest, it is Fighter only, and is more usefull if you opponent has a HIGHER AC, since the additional attack at -5 you are forfeiting would have a better chance of still hitting and inflicting more damage then the bonus PA is giving you.

Furious Focus - In PF1 this helped you on your first attack when using Power Attack and a Two-Heanded Weapon.
In PF Playtest, FF CANNOT be used on your first attack, is mostly incompatible with Power Attack, and works with any non-agile weapon

Can you please find new names for those new abilities, so that we can avoid confusion with the earlier stuff?

Name: Ebonephas, The Iolite Sage (Gemstone Properties)
Alignment: Chaotic Good
Race: Wayang
Class: Alchemist (Crypt Breaker) 8, Investigator (Psychic Detective) 1
Description: Unlike most of his people, Ebonephas has always been equaly curious and good-natured. Due to his upbringing near a valley full of Kobolds, he was fascinated by the pranks of his neighbours, as well as the traps they crafted. Dealing with those traps regularly, as well as his ability to operate well in the darkness brought him to the attention of another Cryptbreaker from the Pathfinder Society, and that human took him under his wing and introduced him into the Pathfinder Society.
While travelling for them from one tomb or dungeon to the next, with occasional trips to more well lit regions, he came into contact with the recently rediscovered Sage Jewels of the Scarab Sages.
Fascinated by the stories and knowledge contained in those, he made it his personal mission to find out everything he could. And so he set out to find more jewels. He met Tahonikepsu when rediscovering the Sanctum of the Sages, and although he voted to his friend Amenopheus to become leader of the newly evolving faction, he accepted her as leader and helped her gain access to the library of the sanctum. Over the following years, he met most of the other prominent members of the Scarab Sages, and so he was a natural fit when a team of Pathfinders had to be found to cleanse the jewels from an ancient evil burried within.
After succeeding at that milestone for his faction and himself, he was honored to use the flawed jewel he had once helped create in the Sanctum of the Sages to create an new Sage Jewel. Like himself, his jewel is of a grayish coloration, and is of a stone best known for revealing what is hard to see, and to find solutions that noone else would think of.
Still young, Ebonephas is eager to prove the other sages right for chosing him to become a member of their honored ranks, and has vowed to acquire as much knowledge as possible to fill his newly created jewel.

The section about returning that starts on page 21 ends on page 22 with "granting each PC the Seasoned Explorer boon" - Yet there is no boon of that name on the chronicle sheet. Instead there is the Remnant of the First World boon there, but that doesn't seem to have anything to do with the shards mentioned in the section.
Is there a boon missing from the sheet or was it just renamed at some point and the connection between the shards and the effect on your items just isn't clearly stated?

Damn, all this because Paizo removed one line which they probably thought was common sense.

What is the "common sense" you are talking about? I have heard rumors about something like that, but never found it anywhere NEAR an RPG Rulebook ;)

Hello everyone,

For reference a few links first:

Constrict
Trample
Rend
Natural Attacks
Amulet of Mighty Fists - This amulet grants an enhancement bonus of +1 to +5 on attack and damage rolls with unarmed attacks and natural weapons.
(Greater) Magic Fang - "Alternatively, you may imbue all of the creature's natural weapons with a +1 enhancement bonus (regardless of your caster level)."
Damage Reduction - "A creature with this special quality ignores damage from most weapons and natural attacks."

Constrict, Trample and Rend are Special Attacks, and each of them has their damage based on a natural attack of the creature. The AoMF and GMF increase Damage to all natural weapons. Does that increase increase the damage of Constrict, Trample or Rend?
And if not (because they are special attacks, not natural weapons), does damage reduction apply since they are, as per the previous statement, NOT natural attacks?
Or is there a distinction between natural attacks and natural weapons? If you look for natural attacks, you find the natural weapons listed, while natural weapon is not explained anywhere and the list of natural attacks does not list the special attacks either.

If the AoMF/GMF do not count and Damage Reduction does apply, is there any way to get through even the simplest damage reductions like magic with those special attacks?

Hello everyone. My char in Wrath of the Rigtheous has passed away recently (and I didn't want to revive him), so I am building a replacement which is going to be a druid. Now I have found some things in the wild shape rules that I am not 100% certain about. Of course I have sent those questions to the DM / group as well, but want to check if there are any FAQs or clear rulings that I can present to them as well, so I have come here, to the gods of rules lawyering, to ask for your help :P

Here you go:

1. Quick Shape and returning to normal
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/quick-wild-shape
Does this feat change the time it needs to change back to youe basic form? If so, is the base form always a swift action since it is available at all levels or does it depend on the form you are changing out of?

2. Polymorph and "Abilities of the same type"
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic#TOC-Transmutation-Polymorph
"In addition, each polymorph spell can grant you a number of other benefits, including movement types, resistances, and senses. If the form you choose grants these benefits, or a greater ability of the same type, you gain the listed benefit. If the form grants a lesser ability of the same type, you gain the lesser ability instead."
Is Blind Sense a lesser version of Blind Sight? Is Darkvision a lesser version of Blind Sight? Or a lesser version of Blind Sense?

3. Plants and Movement Modes
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/p/plant-shape-i
"If the form you assume does not possess the ability to move, your speed is reduced to 5 feet and you lose all other forms of movement." - What happenes if you get a fly speed from a spell someone cast on you prior the wildshaping into an immobile plant? What happens if the fly spell is applied after you already changed?

4. Attacks with special rules attached to them
From the polymorph rules (see 2): "In addition, each polymorph spell can grant you a number of other benefits, including movement types, resistances, and senses. If the form you choose grants these benefits, or a greater ability of the same type, you gain the listed benefit. If the form grants a lesser ability of the same type, you gain the lesser ability instead."
Do you just get the basic version of the attacks or special rules attached to them as well (for example the Corpse Lotus (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/plants/corpse-lotus, which has some special rules listed under the name of the attacks, which you get)? How about variants of things that you get and that have the same name like the improved version of grab the Sargassum Fiend has? (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/plants/sargassum-fiend)

5. DCs of special attacks (poison, trample, etc.)
The polymorph rules (see 2) state "The DC for any of these abilities equals your DC for the polymorph spell used to change you into that form."
Since you are not using spells for wild shape (it is SU not SLA), what is the DC of those abilities? Do you use the spells that are referenced and your wisdom modifier? Or half your level and wisdom since you are not using any spell? Or the normal rules for said abilities (ususally half your HD + Con or Strength)?

6. (Greater) Magic Fang + Bane vs. Silver / Cold Iron
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/m/magic-fang
Greater Magic Fang has a section stating that you cannot use the enchantment bonus to beat any DR except for magic. But that statement is only in the section for one attack that gets a higher enhancement bonus. Neither the "all attacks get +1" nor the normal magic fang has it. So if you combine either the normal MF or GMF to all attacks with an Amulet of Mighty Fists with Bane against your current enemy, you have an enhancement bonus of +3. Do you beat silver and cold iron DR with that as per the usual rules or does the exception from GMF still hold true here?

7. Amulet of Mighty Fists und Constrict / Trample
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/wondrous-items/wondrous-items/a-b/amule t-of-mighty-fists , http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/rules-for-monsters/universal-monster-rules #TOC-Trample-Ex- und http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/rules-for-monsters/universal-monster-rules #TOC-Constrict-Ex-
"This amulet grants an enhancement bonus of +1 to +5 on attack and damage rolls with unarmed attacks and natural weapons."
"Targets of a trample take an amount of damage equal to the trampling creature’s slam damage + 1-1/2 times its Str modifier."
"The amount of damage is given in the creature's entry and is typically equal to the amount of damage caused by the creature's melee attack."
Is your damage of trample and constrict enhanced by your AoMF (Holy, Bane, Enhancement, etc.)? Both are not natural attacks, but they refer to them for their damage.

And now for the mythic stuff:

M1. Mythic Powerful Shape
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/mythic/mythic-feats/powerful-shape-mythic
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/templates/simple-template -giant-cr-1
Is the damage roll a strength based roll? And is your AC a dex based roll? I'd say yes to the first (damage is rolled and is based on str) and no to the second (AC is not a roll), just want to make sure I got it right.

M2. Dimensional Grappler
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/mythic/mythic-heroes/mythic-paths---paizo-inc/guard ian#TOC-Dimensional-Grappler-Su-
The part about the quickened dimensional anchor confuses me. It suggests that you are using a swift action, which you wouldn't be able to do in most cases. Also it requires a ranged touch attack, so you are provoking AoOs from enemies other then the grappled one? And actually have to hit him despiste already grappling?

M3. Legendary Item / Legendary Fortification
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/mythic/mythic-magic-items/legendary-items
"Legendary Fortification: When a critical hit or sneak attack is scored against a creature wearing an item with this ability, the wearer can expend one use of legendary power to negate the critical hit or sneak attack and instead take normal damage. Only armor, shields, and worn items can have this ability."
Is using this ability an activation of the item or does the item give you the constant ability to negate crits and sneaks by expending Mythic Power? What kind of action is it to use that ability? Fortification (the normal one from armor) would be constant and doesn't require an action, but also has no cost.