Talos Valcoran's page

Thought I might give a bit of an update. So after a few months of cat and mouse, throwing blows at each other by proxy a few things have happened. Last session we almost by accident found their treasure stash. So we looted all their treasure, and stole the evil artifact they were supposed to be protecting. Before we left (for various reasons the two paladins weren't there) the wizard trapped the living daylight out of the place.

Next session they triggered the trap, one of them was killed by phantasmal killer and another was taken out by baleful polymorph. So next session will be the big pvp fight, just currently trying to sort a time for it. As of now going to be the following classes and levels:

13 paladin, 13 paladin, 13 fighter, 13 ranger, 13 blood rager + some other stuff I'm not going to mention right now.
Vs 13 half fiend cleric, 13 half fiend fighter/alchemist/hell knight, 13 rogue/assassin, 12 hell knight and 12 not sure.

I'm not going to reveal some details in case they read this, but I'm fairly confident we're going to win. We have plans to deal with the Cleric, and my Paladin hits evil creatures like an absolute steam train. I'll post back after it's done with how it goes.

Since people asked I'll fill in the history of the game. It originally started as a party of 4, which was made up of the current evil party (minus the ranger) + my CN fighter. We were tasked with retrieving a book from a ruined fort which turned out to be an evil relic. I missed the second session for a reason I cant remember, when I came back there was a a trail of corpses, a dead dragon and a paladin sacrificed to Asmodeus. Now my character was not ok with this at all, and I didn't really want to play an evil character so my character left to pursue his own goals.
Tl;dr started out as a normal game and the cleric dragged the rest of a party down with promise of power.

Meanwhile a few other friends had expressed interest in playing again/starting, and I had a craving to play a paladin. So I suggested starting a second party of good/neutral characters in the same region. Technically the evil party shouldn't even know of our existence yet, but I guess its hard to keep the meta low when its competitive.

I agree with you BornofHate, I think he basically granted a request and didn't quite realize what he had done. I should note neither group has played since this thread started.

I'm not all that keen on getting outside help on battle tactics, although it is appreciated. For the fight itself I would personally rather have it best party wins. However I felt like I needed to get help to overcome the VAST power gap we currently have. I'll talk to the players when we have our next session, we might change our minds after that.

And Scott, I wont have access to everyones character details until after the next session. The offer is greatly apprecaited, and like I said before I may take you up on it in a few days.

Bacon666, on the flip side of that is they all have smite good.... having 2 paladins doesn't outweigh having a whole party that can smite good, cast have massive ability score boots, cast spells like unholy aura... all on top of having their class abilities. I don't think you have thought it through properly. And I agree half-celestial is an option which would essentially cancel the half-fiend, but as of now it really doesn't fit 3 of the characters, which again may change.

And yeah Cap'n that's basically what I think we're going to do. My character is a member of the Order of the Golden Lion. Next session I'm basically going to start preparations for as much of my order as possible to come down on them.

So far the plan is, recruit allies everywhere and anywhere we can. Hunt down the devil they made deals with and hopefully break the bond between them, reversing the template. As to the actual fight as many people have pointed out litany of righteousness is going to bring the pain. Causing +4x level damage on first hit is going to be BRUTAL.

Next session is 3 days from now, if people are interested I'll report in on how it goes.

My paladin uses his families ancestral longsword, Brightflame.

Oh also I completely forgot since it doesn't really apply for out party. But the gm is using a spell points system, so the cleric is essentially spontaneously casting, making him even more dangerous.

I think taking leadership is going to be the first step. I'm trying to stay away from cheesing it too badly because I'm not that sort of player, I'd prefer to even the fight than for us to just crush them. Another problem I think we will run into is that they are currently pretty much allowed to do what they want, where our party is bound by our moral compass. I was also originally going to play a wizard just to even out the party, but I wanted to play a paladin. So if I die then I'll change to a wizard.

I've talked to the gm since and he said he will make the fight 'fair when it comes to it'. That's all he said, even so far its got uncomfortably meta-gamey for me.

I have a strong suspicion they are getting these 'gifts' from a contract devil, as we know they have made other deals with one before. Maybe killing the devil would negate their gifts... Not sure I'm trying to think of more abstract solutions.

Thanks for some good advice on the fight itself, but what I'm more looking for is some solutions to level the playing field before combat even begins. I think it would be much more rewarding to even the odd by roleplaying and adventure, than super tight strategy alone. So far I know they have angered a clan of brass dragons, and have sacked a temple of Torm. So I would imagine if you start desecrating temples in NE Faerun you're bound to attract some negative attention.

And I'm not sure blood_kite, all I know is that xp wise we are both level 10 and they have the template.

One of the options we discussed was both the other paladin and I take leadership (the dm already give it the ok) and we get a wizard and a cleric. The main problem is going to be the template though, I'm not sure if leadership is going to lessen that massive gap enough.

The only thing I can thing of is either getting help from a good outsider, or getting the order of paladins my character is a member of to come down on them with us.

My party and I need some advice on our current situation.
Our current campaign is a dual party campaign where there is an evil party and a good party, which will culminate in a final pvp session. Party make up is, good (ranger, OoV paladin (me), paladin, fighter, blood rager) and evil (rogue/assassin, fighter, ranger, cleric (very experienced player)). Right now we are at level 10 and seems like the final fight will happen somewhere around level 13-15.

However, today the gm told me that 3/4 members of the evil party have acquired the half-fiend template. Which is no doubt due to the cleric of Asmodeus in the party and his dealing with devils.

Now I normally wouldn't ask for advice outside the game but right now its going to be an absolute curb stomping for our party. I've spoken to the gm and he said we need to 'lift our game' but I don't really know what to do.. So any advice would be appreciated.

As far as I can tell an angel blooded aasimar who uses their alter self racial ability can then be enlarged.

Well my advice would be sit down as a group and talk like the adults about what you all want out of the game. Secondly make a character that isn't vastly more powerful than the rest of the party, what you have created seriously sounds like something a 15 year old would do. You could have easily added wolf like attributes to your character by roleplaying and description alone without having make your character overpower the rest of the party.

From what you have said your group consists of people who want an immersive role playing experience, along side people who want to play a game with their buddies. Both of which are fine but they rarely work together in the long run.

Also I'm guessing you have never had to dig before, because as people above me have pointed the party would be ready to move at first light well before you had got any useful progress done.

I'm considering using the standard pre-4th edition pantheon war my upcoming wrath AP. Largely because my players are familiar with the gods, I don't dislike the Golarion pantheon. Since most of the deities have a fairly similar counterpart (ie Iomedae-Heironeous, Sarenrae-Pelor, Torag-Moradin ect).

I was wondering if this would cause any problems in the AP. The only thing I can think of that would cause a problem is the power difference. For example Iomedae and Heironeous have very similar portfolios but in the game worlds Iomedae has many more worshipers.

Instead of bring back my RotRL campaign from hiatus, I'm considering another AP.

Currently I'm tossing up between Shackled City and WotR, as at a glance they seem to both be a 'save the world campaign' involving demons/devils. I could be wrong as I have not had a chance to look at either one in-depth, as I'm coming close to exam times. Age of worms is out of the question as I am already a player in that.

Could anyone with experience with both the APs give their opinion to which is the 'better one'. I know WotR isn't finished yet and 'better' is a rather subjective thing so I'm no expecting a definitive answer.

Converting from 3.5 to PF isn't a concern as I don't mind doing it and I'll be on holidays by the time we start, so time isn't an issue.

If you're not afraid of a bit of 3.5-pf conversion then I'd highly recommend Age of Worms. For the difficulty factor Its hard as bloody nails.

I'll talk to the DM about what sort of game he wants. The Cullen situation btw was I was trying to convince him that he had gotten in over his head, and that I could help him if he helped me.

I think a hack and slash game is on the cards. A good example would be when we were trying to get Cullen to reveal who he was working for, I rolled a 26 for diplomacy but didn't get any results. I feel like its a case of the module doesn't specifically state diplomacy can be used so using diplomacy wont work.

Savage worlds might be what you are looking for.

Also this is probably the best time to ask. Apparently we 'screwed up' the temple of Hextor, heres how it went down. We walked though the doors and were attacked by a large group of armoured skeletons, then a dire boar joined the mix.

After dealing with that we entered the 'kill' room. Theldrick (not sure on the spelling) called out to us asking what we were doing there. Being a Paladin of Heironeous my character was not exactly up for negotating in a temple of Hextor, with a cleric of Hextor so he drew his sword and declaired here was here to deliver the justice of Heironeous. The dire ape was summoned and arrows started raining down on us from Tieflings.

After a long and bloody battle the result was one player dead(this was a 4th player who left because of this incident), everyone on very low health and resouces and two of the clerics committing suicide rather than being captured.

I don't see how we did this wrong or screwed it up. We had already been attacked twice before this. It was a temple of my deity's arch-foe. And diplomacy has literally never worked so far in this adventure path, even with rolls of mid-high 20's at level 2-3.

So the general consensus is unless the GM reevaluates how he is doing xp, as a 3 man, under leveled party we're boned?

Thanks Touc,
Just wondering are you getting those levels from personal experience, or from the actual adventure like the other paizo adventure paths. I asked the gm and be said there is no break down of what level you should be at each module. But I think he might be wrong, since every other adventure path has seems to have it.

Can someone help me out with what level my party should currently be. We are currently a 3 man, level 3 party in module 2 and have completed 2/3 of the temples. The gm says he leveled up to 3 prematurely and and no where close to level 4.

I don't want any spoilers so looking for an answer is kind of hard. A friend showed me a thread where James Jacobs said you should be almost level 4 by the end of module 1, which has confused me even more.

Going by other paizo adventure paths I've read I would have though it would be 2 levels per module. But the gm says we will barely hit level 8 by the end of module 5, and by my thinking we would be closer to 11.

Can someone give me a quick run down on how the levels are broken down for the campaign, or more specifically what level we should be currently.

Thanks,
- Ryan.

Kind of off topic but a cool way to think of your type of magic, could be similar to how Dr Manhattan's powers work in Watchman. If you are unfamilar with it, he manipulates matter at the quantum level. There's lot of cool things you could do if you don't want to go super 'sciency' with it. Such as an inflict spell bursting the cell wall (there are a number of ways that could be done), or the magic cancels the electromagnetic bonds that hold the atoms/molecules together.

That would be a good way to get around the whole elemental healing situation, although I cant thing how it would work for fire. But a water elemental it would work on. Just because its not made of cells it still made of up oxygen and hydrogen bonded together, if you break the bonds holding them together.

Like Drejk said if you want to thing of necromancy as manipulating biology on a cellular level, you could recreate a number of effects similar to spells that would be quasi scientific.

Really depends on how core the whole magic is essentially just people manipulating particles.

We usually play 11-5 with a one hour break for lunch in between. But since we're all good friends a substantial amount of time goes off track, between that and people showing up late its probably more like 3.5-4 hours of actual play.

Not meaning to derail the thread or anything, but since its kind of on topic does anyone have any tips of keeping the game going without a massive jarring halt because of jokes or breaking character?

Finished the skinsaw murders then asked one of the players if he could run a module (he chose Tomb of Horrors). After finishing the module I realized how burnt out I was and how much of a chore it turned into. Taking an extended break from RotRL, playing in Age of Worms right now and having much more fun. Will probably go back to RotRL some day though.

The reason the necromancer is in town is because the unofficial major called him to to help with a bigger problem. According to him there are powerful undead under one of the mines in the town, and the necromancer was brought in to help combat the situation. So the authorities were told it was a lesser evil by their higher-ups. As of now this story seems true, though he is still guilty of grave robbing, maybe murder and although necromancy isn't illegal in this setting what was in that lab definitely wasn't.

I think what I will do is after the current situation we're in is resolved , is I will try and bring him before a different source of authority. I believe there are a few men in the town that have influence and will have my back, namely the priest at the chapel of Heironeous who is a mentor to me(long story why that wasn't an option in the first place). If they are unwilling to serve justice I'll reluctantly put him to the sword.

@FallofCamelot it isn't an alignment thread I'm asking for advice on a delicate situation.

I'm also not a fan of 'burn the town to the ground'. The place is a rather miserable and its ran by rich corrupt mine managers. Everyone else is basically trying to make enough money to get out. I plan on fixing the corruption once I have the strength too, but as of now I'd be killed and thrown in a ditch, I'd rather live long enough to actually make a difference.

I'm currently playing in a campaign which at the moment is in a fairly corrupt town. My character is a 17 year old Paladin who is rather naive. The party encountered what they later found out was a necromancers lab, the place was filled with mutilated bodies and skeletons from grave that had been robbed. I smashed the necromancer down with non lethal and dragged him back to the town to throw into jail. However the corrupt unofficial major of the town had him released.

I am unsure how to proceed with this (the plot has advanced past this but is still in the same town) since he is clearly guilty of some serious crimes. But since the local sheriff has judged him to have done nothing wrong I'm not sure what I can do. I don't want to derail the campaign pursuing this minor plot point, but It's important to my character since this man is the first glimpse of real evil he has seen.

If anyone was wondering this is Age of Worms but if this plot point is later sorted out I don't want anyone to tell me.

Playing shadowrun, I'm playing a hacker.
Group is pinned down inside a store front by a well armed gang.
I hack into the computer of the car they left out the front and reverse it up. Just before the car slams through the front of the store and kills them I yell out "hey a**holes you left your lights on".

It would probably require a GM and player input. If it was just the GM telling me things, after a while I think it wouldn't feel like playing a smart character, but more like I'm just another person average person having information given to him.

I suspect if you enjoy your roleplaying after a short amount of time with the GM sort of pushing you in the right direction, you would probably pick up that 'fake' intelligence aspect of your character in roleplay at least.

I think charisma could be a problem for some of the less socially inclined players. It's probably a lot harder to fake charisma than say int, if you have social anxiety, or are just a bit of a creeper (which I'm sure as we all know often results in 'that guy').

I think its just completely dependent on what your culture exposes you to. tabletop gaming having a massive stigma doesn't exactly help either. Looking from it both ways you're just as unlikely to a group of people in the Projects playing an rpg or playing warhammer, as you are likely to find a rpg group blasting f- the police on a street corner (I'm over exaggerating of course).

So I think It's less a case of "oh no way that's for nerdy white dudes I'd be too intimidated" and more of "Why would I want to do that It's for nerds." I know the latter is exactly how I was about warhammer until I actually played it, now years later I have 2 quite large 40k armies.

A good way to bring the town to like (and the game in general) is to use audio. My group uses a program called syrinscape which is an ambient sound program for RPGs. It's a nice but subtle touch for when you are in the town. You can hear the hustle and bustle of people going about their business, dog barking and morning birds.

RAW I see no problem with it. However I agree with cripsy3d that I wouldn't allow it for the reasons he gave.

As people said It sounds like you have lots of small problems compounded with also having a large group. Having a large group is generally a bad idea, running two sessions is a much better idea if possible. It also opens up the whole dynamic of two parties can be in the same world simultaneously.

Having young players and older player often doesn't work too due to people wanting something different out of the games. You could possibly seperate the group in two and have a 'young' group and an 'old group. Where the younger group there's more sillyness and the older group is more plot of rp driven.

Do you mind saying what age you are and what ages are in your group?

As others have suggested you could play a good character that is sometimes overcome by evil urges sometimes. Maybe the interrogation left you with mental scars, that while you try to be a good person sometimes you may loose control. Although to me it sounds like a style of GMing I really don't link, some really good roleplay could come from this. Hell you could even end up with a character like Dexter who channels his evil urges.

And in the end playing a mentally damaged character who can be unpredictable could be used to balance out that you have had a template added to your character.

This is all if you want to go down that road of course, if you don't want to and your GM says you must. Do as the other suggested and hand them your sheet since the guy is writing a novel.

The dicestormers on youtube have video of their carrion crown session with a multi camera set up.

Not sure if this guy is a troll or he just never learned basic physics...

If they are killing innocents or even evil people without reason to do so bring the guards on them. When they inevitably start killing guards that's when you bring paladin back up in. See how well they do against 3 level 10 paladins all smiting evil on her. Basically show them that their behavior has repercussions. The rest of the party may either back off or join in.

But I would seriously before that tell them to show you exactly where it is next time they pull something like this.

^ what rkraus said. You need to talk to the group seriously and let them know your issues. You have to let them know you're serious and that you have concerns with the game. Sounds to me like you're not having fun with it. I would strongly suggest taking some time off getting one of them to run a few games. Players often change their tunes once they realize what its like to be on the receiving end of this type of behaviour.

So what would people recommend I'm thinking of going with Deathless spirit since the ability it replaces is only really good at low levels.

The only other one I'm looking at taking is Deathless Spirit but since its for Age of Worms I dont know if it will be overpowered.

From an rp perspective my character is basically human so I like him being a human for all intents and purposes. But mechanics wise I dont plan on choosing an human specific feats. I'm not sure about the pros and cons of being just a native outsider. I know spells like enlarge person and dominate person wont effect me (unless I choose scion).

Is Scion of Humanity worth taking for my paladin? It fits my character to be more human like, however I'm not really bothered the other way. I'm planning of putting a rank in linguistics anyway to get celestial at some point. So it comes down to is it better to be a Human or a native outsider?

I agree with Avatar but slightly alter his advice. I would strongly advice at least reading a module first to learn how to put together encounters and make them interesting. We've all been where you are at one point, just starting out. It takes a little while but you'll get it soon enough.

Sounds almost exactly like the situation I'm in, player is almost exactly the same and is a close friend. Your spidy senses are right to be tingling, thats probably your gut instinct telling you theres something wrong with it. He's of course just wanting again the be the most powerful character. If he is known for optimizing and powerful builds do not let him near the summoner whatsoever. Its tough but probably the only way to deal with it.

I have a strong feeling (I have a player similar to this in my group) that he is just trying to squeeze into having a character who turns into a power house with fast healing. I could be wrong but without more info its hard to tell.

I would suggest not using set boxed text or scripts for your own written adventures. It always just seems really forced. Instead have a focused idea on what you want the character to say and talk to the players like you are that character. It will feel more natural and less awkward.

You say he's a min-maxer? Does he have a history of just showing up and doing the most damage. Or does he also have interesting characters? This could just be his way of trying to sneak in to a synthesist even though you disallowed it. I would maybe give it a trial run and see how it goes, the problem with these things is that sometimes it might not be a problem until later on.

If his all about character flavor for him you could explain to him, that just because it isn't reflected in the characters stats doesn't mean he cant be a 'hellspawn'.

though I'm not sure how you need 15 hours for a session with an AP

I was including play time in that Kolokotroni.

RotRL will be more than likely shelved for the time being not thrown away. We're at a point where I could say a year has passed in the game time with just a few adjustments to the meta-plot. Which I think might be a cool idea.