Characters that are smarter / wiser / more charming than their players.


Gamer Life General Discussion


I've seen a couple of threads talking about characters with the less-crunchy attributes as their weak stats. For me, it's not too hard (and even fun sometimes) to role-play a character with social/mental quirks or weaknesses.

But now I have this wizard, and she's so much smarter than me that it's not even funny. (I like to flatter myself that I sit around a 13-14 in the INT department, even though the amount of times I mess up spelling the word "weight" pretty much proves that I'm just kidding. My wizard has a 24 INT now. I'm imagining she's not having any problem figuring out the actual range of a dragon who is 120' away and 60' up. Le sigh.)

I know there are very set bonuses already in place for higher INT, WIS, and CHR scores. But outside of the pluses to skill checks, saves and attitude adjustments, how do you role-play a character who is a mensa candidate when you still count on your fingers when adding up your cone of cold? How do you role-play a convincingly silver-tongued bard when you can't even convince your 5 year old nephew about Santa?

And perhaps more to the point, as a DM, do you do anything outside of the mechanical to help your players feel like their characters actually possess these superhuman attributes?

Just curious.


Fake it, and hope your DM is one who actually uses the rules for skill checks and such instead of the multitude I see on these boards that let the player's intelligence/skill with words/etc. take the place of any skill check.

Also, you could ask your GM to allow stat checks for some thing.

I.e. "I make an Int check to calculate the effective range of the dragon 60' up with the 120' line of acid".

Also also, there probably won't ever be anything that YOU can't figure out with enough time. So take some time to figure things out, and play it off as being obvious and coming almost instantly to your character, even if it took you 15 minutes to put it all together.

Silver Crusade

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Rynjin and I don't always agree, but when we do, it's about skill checks!
Stay gamers, my friends.


I usually have them start out role-playing for awhile, then have them roll the necessary skill, adding or subtracting a de facto amount. For example, if they did a really good job, I'll add a +5 bonus. If they did terrible, up to a -5.
This is for crucial interactions, mind you, not run of the mill type stuff.


More hints from the GM. If we are looking at a dead body, Sherlock gets a more detailed description than Watson would.


It would probably require a GM and player input. If it was just the GM telling me things, after a while I think it wouldn't feel like playing a smart character, but more like I'm just another person average person having information given to him.

I suspect if you enjoy your roleplaying after a short amount of time with the GM sort of pushing you in the right direction, you would probably pick up that 'fake' intelligence aspect of your character in roleplay at least.

I think charisma could be a problem for some of the less socially inclined players. It's probably a lot harder to fake charisma than say int, if you have social anxiety, or are just a bit of a creeper (which I'm sure as we all know often results in 'that guy').

Liberty's Edge

You need GM help for some of this, but this is how you do it in my experience:

Intelligence: Think things through. Specifically and especially, make some solid contingency plans and quite a bit of effort into them, then pull them out when and if it comes up and IC have the character have not put nearly as much effort in. But really a lot of this is covered by Knowledge skills used properly and you having several minutes to think about your character's decisions while the character has only seconds. Also, keep notes, and have your character just remember that stuff.

Wisdom: This one really requires some GM help and intervention, but a god GM should tell the player of a high Wisdom character whenever they're about to do something reckless or foolish (based on what their character knows) If you're the player, asking the GM for such advice seems viable, as does simply playing more carefully and...not precisely conservatively, but with more concern for the consequences of your actions.

Charisma: Firstly, you can have your character be pretty. Have them be really attractive, and even with no better manners than you, your character will score some Charisma points from this alone. Secondly, be superficially both nice and polite. This is hard for some people, but totally a skill worth learning and a good call for making your character likable, and you can go back to being less friendly OOC if you really can't stand it.

Silver Crusade

No one expects me to demonstrate wall climbing, deadlifts, or juggling in real life. Why do my softer skill checks require me as a player to demonstrate IRL skills I might not have?


Nymian Harthing wrote:
No one expects me to demonstrate wall climbing, deadlifts, or juggling in real life. Why do my softer skill checks require me as a player to demonstrate IRL skills I might not have?

I don't think they should (and if anybody wants to sign a petition asking my DM to stop setting up a dungeon obstacle course in his back-yard and making us run it as we play, my knees and I would really appreciate it. Especially if we can stop him from filling it with his Orcs/pit bulls.)

But there are times when I'm sitting there, playing this crazy-smart wizard, and I just feel like a dunce (and that makes it sound like much more of a personal problem than it really is. :P).

When I'm playing my fighter who has finally managed to hit 24 on her STR, and I'm lifting stuff and climbing stuff and killing stuff like a sum-a-gun, there's a fun in-game feeling that I'm a fighter with a 24 STR.

Conversely, when I'm playing my Wiz with a commensurate INT, it's hard to get that same sense of accomplishment, because I'm still not that bright. :)

I'm guessing that that's just the nature of the beast, but I really like a lot of the suggestions that have been offered up thus far.

And I can see how important it is for a DM (and as a DM) to be actively trying to make this happen. I especially like Deadmanwalking's WIS advice. I think in my future DMing I might just keep a record of my players' characters' WIS and INT scores close at hand, and give them advice on a sliding scale.

Thanks for the great ideas, everyone!


If you (that is, your wizard) doesn't have a commensurate charisma score to go with that obnoxious intelligence... be obnoxious.

Wait, no, not really; what I mean is... ask your DM for a remedial/intensive on Things Wizards Know, and spend some time ratcheting up your "casual vocabulary." Practice long-winded speeches peppered with 50-cent words about enthusiasms your wizard has that nobody else cares about. Experts (those with specialized skills, not the NPC class) tend to think their expertise in their field grants them expertise in everything. The narrower the field, the more convinced they are...

This won't solve the "feeling smarter" aspect of your conundrum, I admit; I think getting your DM to expand intelligence checks is one of the better things I've seen thus far for THAT...

...but make yourself SOUND like an insanely-smart person who has spent decades studying. Remember the teacher/professor whose lectures you'd dread because they couldn't say "Looks like rain," when they could pontificate about "Ah, it seems that the weather may turn inclement on us..." Etc.

All the above assumes you enjoy a lot of IC chatter, want to come off sounding like an academic, and can get your DM to have the (lower-wisdom) NPCs stand in awe of your dizzying intellect...

Hope it's helpful!

That is, "Perhaps these little ploys may prove to be of some use, or assistance, in your pursuit of pedantic pontification!"


Those things require cooperation from the DM to be effective.

Ask your DM to give you some extra leeway when it comes to the smarts.

The way we do it in our group is that players can ask the DM for things their characters would know, such as "Do I know anything about structural integrity?". The DM (99% of the time your truly) determines if the knowledge falls within a general range that would be reasonable (a PC without any kind of related knowledge and/or very low INT is probably out of his field) and asks the player to roll for it.

In addition, smart characters usually get hints from the DM in relevant situations regardless of the player asking for it, such as "You remember hearing about a golden statue in the legend of the king" or "While you'd have to make more precise calculation, your experience tells you that roof will probably collapse under all that weight".

For highly charismatic characters, in addition to the checks I also usually alter the way NPCs react slightly to reflect that something's different (opposite genders may seem more helpful, random people will say hello more often, etc).

Very wise characters, on the other hand, get extra "gut feelings" when their senses/common sense is tingling.


Rynjin wrote:

Fake it, and hope your DM is one who actually uses the rules for skill checks and such instead of the multitude I see on these boards that let the player's intelligence/skill with words/etc. take the place of any skill check.

Also, you could ask your GM to allow stat checks for some thing.

I.e. "I make an Int check to calculate the effective range of the dragon 60' up with the 120' line of acid".

Also also, there probably won't ever be anything that YOU can't figure out with enough time. So take some time to figure things out, and play it off as being obvious and coming almost instantly to your character, even if it took you 15 minutes to put it all together.

My DM does both. If he is role playing the NPC and agree with what you are saying, he will role play the NPC accordingly. If he doesn't agree with what you are saying and you roll a high skill check, he will role play like you convinced him.

My group sees skill as the blunt force, simple way to solve problems and helps when the DM creates those no-win social encounters for you.

Community / Forums / Gamer Life / General Discussion / Characters that are smarter / wiser / more charming than their players. All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.
Recent threads in General Discussion